Theres eight. Two teams have been funded in the mayors budget. Thank you, supervisor mandelman. Four are in the mayors budget and were working with dph to add two additional ones. And so, first question about these additional teams. Do the firefighters have the ability to 5150 someone if they believe it is necessary . At this time, we do not. However, simon p arang, in chare of community paramedicine, is here, and hes done outreach with dph and thinking about this and talking about this for a long time. So simon, can you please chief pang, can you please speak to that . Hi. How do you feel about us expanding ems six by six . Well, ive very grateful, but also, you know, anxious because i want to make sure that we dont oversell what we can possibly do. Although, its full steam ahead for us and we want to help the city in nr any way we can. If we wer would to get extra mo, it would start with hiring and training and we would get that done right away. I want to make sure i dont make any unilateral statements without conferring with the Health Department who is going to be collaborating with us. And so, you know, i think that four units is not going to be enough to cover the approximately 20,000 Crisis Response calls that the police ran in 2019. But i want to make sure that we proceed in a very thought datadriven manner, especially because were coordinating with the Health Department that i dont feel we can guarantee a timeline. So i have many questions for you about this. Lets start with the 5150 question wha. What would it take to give you the authority to 5150 someone if it is appropriate . So from what i know about that, i believe that it is a county health officer, which particular administrator that is, because im a little bit unclear on whether its thomas erogon or who exactly it is, but i believe that individual has the ability to grant the privilege of being trained to right the wholes. Im in the process of one know, just getting information and getting stakeholders in agreement so that we can do it. I think that having the Community Paramedics be able to right wholes is the right thing to do because it will minimize the contact that people in crisis have with Law Enforcement. I think this could be a trigger for people in crisis is escalating. I have a lot of personal faint h in the San FranciscoPolice Department is i believe they have a lot of high standards but the fact remains that they are Law Enforcement and i think that another asset should be the one doing that. And so, one thing i want to make sure is the street Crisis Response team, it is designed to have a social worker on board and the social worker would be able to right holds if they were necessary. They will be inheriting calls that Emergency Medical Services dont typically go on, right . Were taking a slice out of the police. Thats right. Workload, right . Yes. So i feel that, you know, we have First Response emergency medical providers on scene, paramedics, emts, firefighters who are the first on scene in most cases and they can identify people that are a harm to themselves or are greatly disabled. Currently, what we have to do is make a request for a police unit to come to our screen just to put someone on a hold. Thats what im trying to eliminate. And im trying to figure out how we get that done. I do know that ive heard some commentary about whether there is one concern ive heard, think theres an incorrect assumption if the Community Paramedics have that ability, it will result in an increase in the number of 5150s and that the behavioral Health Department of the Health Department doesnt have the resources to handle this increase. But i want to make it really, really clear that is not what would happen. We want to went people are put on 5150s because of medical and psychiatric need, right, so what we want to do is instead of having Law Enforcement right them, we want to right them and i do not anticipate any net increase or decrease in the number of 5150s that would be written. So i dont think it would negatively impact the resources of the Behavioral Health division. And just to underscore that point, because i agree with you. But, you know, what percentage of the calls that you respond to do you call a Police Officer to issue a 5150 hold . I dont have a reliable number for you. There would be two circumstances and one is when our ems on six units are in the field and we know people so well that no one is a deviation from the baseline and we know when theyre confabulating and they may tell a doctor in the hospital a story that the psychiatrist may believe and we know its pure falsehood, its just a false narrative. So ems6 has more occasion, i think, that the regular paramedic units when we realize someone is greatly disabled, they cannot take care of themselves on the street and entirelily dependent on the Emergency Medical Services for survival. And then, our paramedic units, you know, they frequently will have similar occasions with people they dont know, as well. Its not only someone on streets. Someone might be in the house and they cant care for them and they can tell by the way the house looks. And so i wish i had a hard number for us, bu you, but i do. In trying to get that data, it would be difficult to get a solid number. I apologize for that. No problem, no problem. And so, my understanding, and raphael sorry, supervisor mandelman, feel free to chime in if you have any additional information. But my understanding of the street Crisis Response under Mental Health sf is that the units will have a ems Six Fire Department employee like yourself, a Behavioral Health special from dph and thats who youre saying is the social workers . Yes. I didnt realize it was a social worker, necessarily. Sorry, through the chair, if i can ask raphael if he understood that. Not necessarily, but i dont know weve drilled down to the level of the life insurer kind of qualifications that the nonparamedic professional has. Do you know . From my understanding, it would either be a licensed clinical social worker, or a marriage and family counselor or psychiatrist that the behavioral clinician could be one of those three categories. I see. And then just for the public, there will be a peer advocate in every group. Correct. So in that second category of either a social worker, licensed mayorage and family counselor or psychologist, which of the three entities, do you know, if they have the ability under theirly sense toutheirlicensure to issu . I believe they all do. We will work on that with you, but we have it covered anyway. That is super helpful information. Second question, so we were just talking about the training necessary to get these new units up and running. Let me ask you this first. You said four new units or ems six teams would not be enough to re 20,000 call. Would six units beo cover those calls, in your opinion . [ laughter ] if we work our butts off. We would have to have nine to ten encounters every 12hour shift and thats the assumption that an encounter would take about one hour. I think thats a reasonable assumption, one hour, physically. For example, an ambulance call and a 911 call is about one hour. Ok. And some will be less and some will be more. Got it. And then, how long do you think it would take you to train up and put into work six new units . So what we would have to do, we would need to have a months Long Community paramedic training course. We would want to train 20 individuals and we would have to take 20 people so what we want to do, in the shortterm, were going to start off with our captains in the seats, right, because we want our best people there because we want to make sure we do a good job and we start off on our best foot forward. But its more sustainable if we have h3l2. The paramedics that are trained as Community Paramedics to be doing the work on the street Crisis Response team. please stand by . We dont want rookie paramedics out there doing this very important job. We want to do it by fall of this year. We want four units up by the fall of this year. Extra units is going to require extra training and hiring. Please let me know if im saying anything that is amiss. No, youre not. First i saw no getting the six units by februaryfor is that a yes, not . Im sorry, are you speaking to me . I think the question was if you could get the units up by february. I think that he said he could get four units up by the fall; is that correct . Ive known chief nicholson for a long time. She wanted to know that we could get started in the fall of this year. Extra units takes more time. Two additional would be february march of next year. This is all crucial information for the budget. Were figuring out how to cover this cost with the current budget. When we start its crucial to figuring out how were going to be doing that. This is crucial to figuring it out. Im sorry, supersizor. I want to make sure that i dont speak unilaterally. Ive been talking to everyone and they have their ends to work to get ramped up too. I dont want to make unilateral statements without them. Of course, were working with them constantly on this. Theres the uth side and Fire Department side. I want to understand from the Fire Departments side what the time line would be. Youre saying its february march of next year. Thats very helpful. Beautiful. The two command vehicles we were just discussing be used and necessary for this purpose . Yeah. I spoke to the services folks sm they will be in use by ems. Krts it its not a maybe, it. When we ramped up ems6 last year. We got the personnel but not the equipment. We were really scrambling what they could drive around in and it wasnt pretty. Thank you. Those are all my questions. Thank you. Your very welcome. Supervisor walton. What is the amount truck is proposing to reduce . Was that your only question. On both the dph side and the fire side, are we seeing any money for vehicles for these additional four or 16 . Or are we recreating the problem you had last year that didnt give you trucks to put them in . Supervisor, we need a van with a wheelchair lift, we need several of those. They would be able to help everyone. Your 2 million would include funding for all four of those . Mark, could you speak to this . At this time, it includes funding for two of those van units. Okay. Is that because its going to be out in shifts . I believe its because of the schedule that will be rotated amongst the team for all coverage. Thats exactly right. It will be hot swap vehicles. Community response euns within n the van. About the fire truck source one point four million, the question i have would be would the prototype change or were testing one prototype and ready to good in . Are you changing specs or what . Ill let chief fellow answer. Normally swre a set of specs. We have minor modification dollars sm i miss spoke earlier. The stakes would be pretty much the same. Once we start off with everything we do in the city, we make the order and nothing changes from that. The changes had with the search order that we get. All the changes we identify are approved, way deal with that specs. So i guess my question, ill ask it another way. If we were to allow this to go through, would you just order another truck that come pretty quickly. Im getting a better understanding of why it was delayed. Could it be from the same company that out weighed the rest of them. If i may speak to that to the chair. We havent had funding for so long on the trucks. We were starting from scratch. That really took quite a while. Right we dont have to to that again. Yes, we are under under contract with them the recommendation is to deny the purchase because over last five years the city has funded six trucks through last year. This would be a seventh truck. Got it. For me im probably not going to agree with that. I heard the reasons why it was delayed. The question, a wil a lot of the trucks in the red i have a question about the command vehicles. As part of the budget was[indiscernible]. You were budgeted for five last year and purchased all five. Was there any money left in the budget left i have one last question. Yes. Absurd this aerial slide. We have old trucks that i have no way of knowing if thats a prb or how big of a problem it is. Were in a budgest the chart of old is not of itself enough for me to know that were way out of line where a Fire Department should be or if theres some sort of objective way of measuring according toll steps, fire, or sms we shouldnt be using those at all. I think thati just wanted to say that i think what supervisor said is really true for our time. Were in a deficit. Ive been meeting with homeless folks and people who have been hit hard. 200 ho200,000 people have been t hard in San Francisco. If its so absolutely necessary that we couldnt actuallywhen we find out about our budget for the next year to do a supplement appropriation at that time to add to your fleet versus now when so much is unknown. Ize think thati dont think anyone is saying that another aerial ladder truck is not needed for our Fire Department p. I dont think anyone is saying that another aerial ladder truck is an unnecessary expense. I think what were saying here is that is it an expense that can be delayed a year or two years. That is the question thats before us today. Also, i would say the same thing for the command vehicles. I understand we have 19 command vehicles and youre looking for two more. Could you allocate two vehicles for the command six. And could this be delayed for another two years. Im asking you Fire Department. I remember when you said we need some of the ambulances. You might remember this conversation. We havent had ambulances for a long time. They are small, maneuver better. We didnt give her all but we gave some. When people are hungry, things are slammed. We look at inefis efficiencies d allocate it to the poor. Thats where the bulk of our money goes. Thats the question today, Fire Department. Could you do without one command vehicle instead of two . Those are the kind of questions. I know we have some other thipg it ponder also about the Fire Department. Look at where you could cut savings of the aim amount but from a different pot. I think we should hold off on this decision until you stand firmlywhat you see on this boardits a deep appreciation for everything that the Fire Department does. Were not disrespecting or diminishing everything that you do. What were asking is that is it a necessary expenditure at this time. We ask that the Fire Department come back after they work the bla to look at the reallocation. I see that you are on the screen. Following this item. Related to travel and training. I didnt mean to interrupt you. Is there anything that we need to finalize this particular budget . Its a smaller point that i can certainly come back and given you are are suggesting to raise the travel to training. Its an interesting one that i had not considered until now. I believe theres an administrative provision change to bring to the board. Well plan to do that next week for your consideration. Okay. Fire department were go to go see you next week any way. Lets finish this deliberation. We understand that you are fighting hard. I just wanted to reiterate your thanks to the Fire Department. Ive seen your work firsthand. Fire services, we have Fire Fighters in other counties. These things are close to home as well. Par pa. We know that they noty depend on the Fire Fighters of San Francisco. We keep that in mind when reconsidering your budget. If we have consensus well ask the Fire Department to come back and take a final vote on it. Thank you for coming today and gave younow were entering our discussion with the San FranciscoPolice Department. Chief scott. Are you joining us . Hi. Can you hear me . Yes, we can hear and see you chief. Welcome. I think you heard earlier in the day. My opening remarks. I think the process of us is set up to be somewhat advers adver s is our commitment actually to ensure that the budget really reflects the needs of the hard working people who actually feed this budget. We agree with number four. We dont agree with one, two, or three. The poddy worn pham ra cut. Three thBody Worn Cameras. He. As far as the Body Worn Camera cut. It amounts to the difference of understanding how the City Accounting system functions. It speaks specifically to the Carry Forward that we dont believe provide means to determine those cuts. Because theres a lot that goes into that that i dont think was could haved by the cuts i do have direc directorthey will ah the end of their useful life by the end of this year. It will decrease normally. The battery is considered to reach the end of its useful life. The risk would be very high that the camera wont be able to record useful footage because its unpredictable and worn out. It will not be able to capture sm we believe in the bla analysis explain forth. I want to explain the differences between what our figures show and what the bla recommendationwhat the bla is base pg theibasing their recomm. The slide that were sharing presents what our budget has been for the last three years and what we expended. Starting 15, 17, 18 are fiscal year we expended tw poin one, there were thrais in the seven year program. What you see is 2020. We had a five thousand dollar. This money was scheduled to the Body Worn Camera. To have a p pi want to next spheek the bla recommendation number two on the materials and supply ses. The bla materials and supplies. The way that the Accounting System calculates what you yourtheres 83 terp 83if you r smenspend in one category and dt exceed your appropriation authority youre still okay, your balanced. What i want to show is that the two items that the bla had identified, the other Office Supplies and uniform. Thats two items in the material and plies of fifing we spent two the party budget. What i want to mention is for the uniform line item, the bla stated that the department saving of six hundred thousand dollars. We spent about half of that. Thrdz several mps about ththey. The new contract was not finalized until may 1, 2020. A period of four months where departments could not encumber any additional line iet ems for requests sm the other itereques. The other item i wanted to address is the six hundred thousand dollars in savings. Theres approximately five number a large part of that bnsz is related to Airport Academy classes. In terms of the other items if i some manytheres about 55 account codes that also roll up into were thoughtful for the food and the shelter for any of the personnel that was responding during their deployment period. For the uniform contract after the city issued the Term Contract at the beginning of may. Were not able to encumber or fulfill requests for items because we exhausted our appropriation authority. For those reasons. That is why there is that elicit stating for uniforms. If you look at what we had actually september for fiscal year 2020. The savings dont actually exist. The last item that i want to make is that covid 19 is still going to persist through the end of fiscal year 21. With the deferredwere really offering at a position of a deficit starting out. For the next item im going to pass it back off to chief scott. Poor lart item i wanted to pin out is our uniform budget is about one percent. In comparison to other budgets ware curious to know what other r cities. The department doesnt agree with that recommended cut. I want to speak to thea q two step one rate. The second point is the cuts to the a cat my classes, i believe, we believe are able to pre void. The matrix staffing using in praying woar ow of that p 65f. These occur by more personet if we go it mofepersonnel. We feel e understanding and the like are operating at a deficit. Those jobs and that work still needs to be done. The current maybors budget. These are diversity goals. As you see the slide on the screen this is the diversity of our incoming recruits or the last ten years. As you can see fromback up one slide. You can see from 2007 to 2019 its shifted to almost the seven percent rate for people of color. A forty six percent rate just 12 years ago. If we are faced by the cuts of attritionif the scenario equated to layoffs of two hundred of the people with least evenority in the department. Using the last in, first out. You see the demographic currently. White, had as panic, asian. If we were to have to cut two hundred officers, you see what that demographic on the right hand side looks like. You see how many officers we would actually be using. Forty two asian officers gone. Twentyone brak off everybody s board asking you to grow the Police Department. Were asking you to stay with the reenvisioning how we deliver Public Safety seven ises to our city. This slide is just as you can see our full time equivalent comparison this is where we lie to be if we reduce our a damny. Theres a couple of unknowns in there that like. We home thats our ask for this committee is to really consider our desire to keep our department at at least city levels. The impact would be devastating in terms of our ability to deliver Public Safety and handle the public work load. This slide is in terms of Public Safety report. The other thing eye like to high height of rerm sthshes administrative oversight and systems and those types of innings foinningreform. It takes staffing. Sworn and unsworn staffing. They are constantly telling us that not only Getting Better at but need to get better at. In order to sustain these efforts, its hard it implement rea rm praik sm wheimplementsth. We are not top heavy. We are the right size for our Police Department. Ill stop there and answer any questions you have. Could you please have a brief report from the c la because i think that the chief has brought up many issues about the bl resmtions. I want them to opinioned to what they are saying. , with it have tw one at the chief sides is the police dujet and Body Worn Camera budget. When that happens, the unspent money gets rolled into the following year. This accounts for that airy forward amount and reduce the budget based on their actual spending which accounts for the total available budget that they are getting in the proposed budget and also carrying it forward. They are not getting to 900,000 in spending. The materials and design budget is not changing in the design budget the Police Department had three Police Academies in 2020. They are only budgeted for two. Each academy at 250,000 we had information reported to us that the material cost was as much as 500,000. These two cuts amount to one point five eight Million Dollars out of a total budget of the police dujet. We do think they are reasonable. We dont think they are going to impact services. They are based on information that was provided to us by the Police Department. Ill say finally the policy recommendation that were recommendingtheres two. One is the library which the department agrees with. The other is consider canceling the march 21 academy. Theres already commitment to evaluate the work load of the Police Department and move some of that work load. We dont know what the staffing needs are. The study that they are siting assumes calls for service. Move that work load out of the dep. I think its important to consider that report. We worked with the Controllers Office for what the joint academy would cost. I stand behind what is reflected in our report. Im not sure what the Police Department is referring to. They are based on a joint analysis. Thats basically it. You can see the two point nine Million Dollars because most of the academy is occurring in that year. They become in that airy. Im going to go to the queue. First i just wanted to say chief, i know you have a tough job. Members of the department have led to extremelyhow many recommendations have complete logos from the 272 . We havelet me be very careful. The way this works and does work. We have Compliance Standards that were a dpreed upon all part partners. They california d r o sixty nine has been completed. Thirteen will be completed no the next many months. The prk wri dont want to givey the recommendationother work is being done out side of those 58. Thrdz a lowere doing a lot of r things. Many of the work is foundational there is several that are applied on that. I just want to be clear that we are imetting there. From work load perspective we have a lot ofi am having issues with wrk load. As as i have overtim overgivinga hos never be content with average because its just as close to the bottom as it is to the top. I believe that the overtime quut should equalwe should pe cutting oot least invest something that is in good no i truly believe its unacceptable particularly with the urgency that weve seen with Law Enforcement. This is no sec receipt to you that i hope my colleague i dont think think this what is yr thn between the cost of 21 and 22. I dont think bla is going far enough particularl particularlye have a charrer. Coming up witcharter. We should h bigger cut from the academy cost. Thats 23 almost 24 million. If we go percentage on performance if we talk about work loads. We need most of that. I believe 90 percent of that to be somewhere else. If we had had to layoff, why cant we layoff racist, prejudice, murderous cops that are on the force. Cops with complaints of racism that never should have been on the streets in the force place. To answer your question, we have racism that go through a process. They are fired if they are found to be racist. They are remanufactur removed we comes. If somebody is believed to be a racist or said to be a racist without disciplinary investigation to review that. Weve seen this play out with our own eyes. Those officers that you speak of. Tr like all that plea ant mple i know woar preintellect and care communities. I woan i can hear the care and pr care for big p p leave frm they have commune is have tp different areas across the city. This conversation about safety and police this does not indicate that you are safer. Be b smnlt bz p p p they are not even getting over fen between 5 vment i he the sefswe dent want in aal rf love doctor o teach thez oamp toim eis sthtd thlt. I dont a dpree with that sm i want twe have a situationwherer situation where part of the problem foundationally there are enough officers in the bay view. In terms of Response Time we do pretty well with high priority calls in your district in bay view. It really hurts in the low priority calls thats where it really hurs. I learn through foim i totally agree those things have to happen. Based on the form completion rate, it will be the right thing for the city to do in terms of policing the city and i think that would take us backwards to provide Public Safety and our ability to do what weve been asked to do with reform. I think we will go backwards and i dont think thats what we want under any scenario. I have two more questions and then more of a statement, but one im glad you mentioned investigations being a major part of overtime. How many shootings are we talking about in the department in. Right now we have an 84 clearance rate for our murders this year. In 2018, we had a 100 clearance rate and last year, we had a 73 clearance rate. When you look at national averages, and these numbers are out there, thats good. We like to be at 100 that hasnt happened anybody that i know of, maybe small cities with two or two homicides a year but anything above 70 is respectable. We have solved many of the most recent murders, including a couple in your district where we made arrests and a lot of that overtype goes towards that. As we look at you said something i agree with 100 , theyre the Community Response that addresses violence and thats why we need more resources to invest in making sure that we can support the community in a way to keep us safe. But i just have to ask this question because you said people feel safer with Police Presence in my district and i always have conversations because that is true to some degree. But we have a dedicated police force with Public Housing across the city and i mentioned the fact we had four murders in bayview alone in july. All four were in Public Housing. So where were the police after murder number one . Where were the dedicated police after murder number two . Where were the dedicated police after murder number three . Where were the dedicated police after murder number four . How many of my people have to die before these dedicated police that you say the community has to have shows up . Yes, sir. So i definitely understand that frustration. We would like to prevent those murders, as well. We have 36 officers assigned to housing that work all of the Public Housing over the city. Now, there are Public Housing that theyre assigned to patrol. Even in your district in the bayview, we dont have another officers to assign to be in the Public Housing development at all times and they have to go from we have dedicated housing officers for the larger ones, sunnydale. They are not there 24 seven. They are not there all of the time and i wish that were the case. But we have the reality of a workload to spread across many different areas and we just dont have those officers to increase that deployment is. Where were they . They are calling what they were called to do. I dont know of any scenario where a murder is committed either walking a foot beat or present. Most of the time, we are in the morning or overnight, the officers are assigned to work those shifts. We can only be in one place at a time and this is just the reality of it. In the night, it sounds like is where that foot Patrol Community opportunity of having officers present would be imperative. Mind, yoi mean, if this is whers are happening, particularly in certain places of the city, if we were to believe that presence was a crime deterrent, why dont we have these officers in the wee hours of the night or the times you say we need them . Youre asking for more resources to do the same from what im getting from this conversation and more of the same is unacceptable. And i wont ask any more questions right now, but thats problematic. We shift the resources to address shootings and crime and we talked about that, where we deploy from other parts of the city. Evacuee done it on both overtime and onduty resources and so the proposal to cut the overtime by 75 , that takes that totally away from us. And i will say simply but i wasnt happening. When you look at our homicide rate look, any homicide is too many. Lets talk about the reality of where we were ten years ago and where we are now in terms of homicide. We have cut homicide dramatically over the last ten to 12 years. Weve cut shootings dramatically over the last ten to 12 years. Thats not by accident. And i appreciate what youre saying and i am not trying to argumentative or disrespectful to your analysis here, but we have to look at the reality of where we were compared to where we are. Last year, 2019, had the lowest number of homicides that weve had since the 1960s. To say were not making progress is a gross undercharacter saturdays as whats happening. Im just as frustrated with you about the homicides happening and thats why were working to make the situation better. The progress has been made and its been real. When you track, even though this is antidotal, in the five years ago, 2015, 2014, when our key deployment was at the lowest, you look at the Violent Crime and how high it was. As we started our accelerated hirinhiring programs and got moe officers in the field and im not saying this is the only reason we were able to handle the response to homicides. Thats a direct reflection of deployment and thats why were advocating and asking this board to please reconsider reducing the size of this Police Department. Because thats only one part of what were faced with. Property crime, we were the number one in nation, embarrassingly so with property crime. Weve cut that in the last three years. Some is prevention and some putting the cops in the right places. We know this to be true. I want to highlight these things and ask for your consideration or reconsideration on that proposal because, look, we know were going to have cuts, we accept that. But were asking to balance that with the reality of what we have to do to try to keep Public Safety, from a police perspective. I know Public Safety means for things, but Public Safety from going backwards and reform. Thank you, chief. Thank you. Chair fewer. When theres a person in crisis in the middle of the streets, that the sheer number of officers that respond is unbelievably excessive. So, for example, you know, ive seen protests of a dozen people and, like, four times the amount of officers show up to surround them. Or there was an individual in Mental Health crisis in the mission a month or so ago, and the number of officers there, you know, to address one person in crisis was substantial. And i think its hard for me to justify the amount of overtime when i feel like the response and the number of officers that show up for protests or to respond to individuals is so over the top. And i was wondering if you could address that. Yes, supervisor ronen, thank you, and hello. I think the latter question, ill start with, about response to the events such as protests or even somebody in a psychological crisis where you see a number of officers showing up. Every situation is different and let me start there and when youre handling a protest, there are many, many different ways to handle it, depending on the tenor of the crowd, what we believe is happening or about to happen based on what we know, based on what we see. Recently, its been based on kind of what weve seen in other cities across the United States and the spread across the country and all of those things come into play. The ideal situation in a protest is to use the least amount of resources and the least amount of people necessary with the goal in mind not to escalate what is going on by a presence that might serve to escalate. If theres acts of violence happening you can have a situation, and weve had this, where theres largely overwhelming peaceful protests and you might have a handful of people doing violent acts or vandalizing property or those types of things. And we have to decide how best to please that small group while allowing the others exercising their First Amendment rights peacely to do so. Thats kind of an on the scene call. We try to promote not to overdeploy to the protests unless theres a reason to be present and visible and sometimes there is. What you dont see oftentimes, we hav have squads that you dont see a protests because theyre not on the line and facilitating move the. Theyre either in a hideaway location or theyve been we call it a virtual scenario where theyve been notified that they will be called, if needed. So thats another part of the deployment that you never see and you wont see unless theres a possible. Problem. A lot of what needs to happen and does happen is planning, worworking with the facilitateo. On an individual incident where you say a person is in psychological crisis, officers will call for assistance, backup when they need it and oftentimes that presence, although you think it will agitate that situation, oftentimes that prevents things from escalating because people see theyre outnumbered. And sometimes that works and sometimes it doesnt. The idea for us is to deescalate as much as possible. One thing that the city and county of San Francisco does not have that sometimes can be a disadvantage is that most major cities have is the use of air units, helicopters. We dont have them here and were not asking for one. But having worked in a Police Department that had one, i understand the value of it because it gives you a perspective you can notify based on what youre seeing overhead and oftentimes that leads to efficiencies and that leads to things that you cant do if you dont have that resource because you actually have to be there. And so, we have to keep in mind that when we are on a perimeter, when somebody is running, were pursuing people, we dont is the advantage that the majority of major city Police Departments have with having a helicopter overhead. Theres an efficiency that comes with that. Im not asking but im pointing out why we do things the way we do. So, in other words, you say you have a foot chase situation, foot pursuit, person is hiding, we have to set up a large perimeter with cops on the ground to take care of the situation. The department that has helicopters, that can be done from the air efficiently and its a lot more resource intensive. We dont have the ability to have that overhead view. Getting back to your question, and just to sum this up, its casebycase, momentbymoment far and people with say why do you need five cops when you have one person . Sometimes its to contain a situation and whats often not thought of, oftentimes theres crowd consideration and particularly in agitated situations where crowds are around, you actually have to assign officers to make sure that theres management of the crowd, to make sure that doesnt turn into a situation where the crowd gets involved in an incident and its escalated higher and it becomes more risky or more subjected to people getting hurt. So all those things have to be tactilely consider. Ed. I know its a long answer but i want you to get as much of an understanding of how we make our decisions. So the School District voted to no longer have School Resource officers in the schools and the schools are closed now anyway. And, you know, sadly, it might be for quite some time. So what are the former resource officers doing right now . Right now, theyre employed to Community Engagement division. Part of what theyre doing right now is working on the next phase of the recent School Board Decision to take the School Resource officers out of the schools. One of the issues were faced with, there still will likely be concerns at schools and so were work wig dr. Matthews and school board on what that will look like, our response protocol. There needs to be a set of officers, regardless of whether theyre in the schools or not, to have the training to deal with schoolrelated issues. There needs to be a relationship. The board has spoken and they dont want our resource officers in the schools, but there are still things happening on school campuses. Its violence that has to be reported to the police, sexual assaults that have to be reported to Police Officers. Weve had a gun that went off a couple years in one of our schools. Those are calls that we need to respond to and were working out the protocols of what that needs to look like, being respectful to the boards recent decision and the current environment in policing and those are details theyre working on right now. Typically what they do in the summer when school is out, those officers that are not assigned to the school and had summer school, we redeploy them anyway to theyve been deployed to foot beat and other types of police needs and we typically do that the summer anyway. And so, when we get to our protocols of how well work with the School District, then well make a decision on how much time we have to dedicate to things like training and response to school calls and we can decide how they need to be redeployed. Why do you have between 198 and 300 sworn officers working on civilian work . Well, if youre talking about the bla analysis from a couple of years ago, we work with the bla and some of those positions, if you read through that analysis carefully, we dont agree with in terms of positions that can be civilianized. We worked with this board a couple of years ago and the blas office in identifying 50 positions that we were in the position of trying to civilianized and we got the budget for it. But we didnt agree with all i think it was 265. Can i rephrase my question . How many worn officers d sworn u have working in positions that could be done by a civilian, according to you . We identified 50 and i believe there were a few others. There was probably about 30 or so left that we were in the process making that transition and i think that was something that president yee was very vocal about and we identified 50 and thats what we asked for in the last budget. Thats what was approved and 30 of those still yet to remain be to converted. And when will they be converted . Thats paused right now because of the budget. Theres no funding to hire those individuals. So weve identified them and when the budget allows, well continue the process. Can you remind me what the positions are . I can send you the list. Its the same list weve had. Ill resend that to the committee. But i dont know all of them off the top of my head. Ok. That would be great, if you could resend me the list. And so, i dont know how much you followed the efforts around Mental Health assess, the piece of legislation that i wrote together with supervisor ha irky and many frontline workers who, you know, serve and provide medical services to people with Mental Health and illnesses and severe addiction in the city. But this board unanimously passed the legislation at the end of last year and the mayor has funded the bulk of the program in this years budget, and we are on the verge, is well talk to dph tomorrow, but we are on the verge of implementing it completely in this years budget. So we got confirmation from the Fire Department in the hearing right before yours that if we created six street Crisis Response teams that are sort of an expanded version of the ems, that will be teams including a community paramedic, a Behavioral Health specialist and we did confirm that Behavioral Health specialist does have the licensed ability to issue a 5150 fold and a peer outreach worker, so someone who has dealt with drug addiction or Mental Health illness or both, which is often the case, and knows what its like to have a crisis and this team of three will be responding to most of the calls for service for people in Mental Health crisis. We heard from simon pang, who is the lead of ems, right now, that he believes if they work hard, they could respond to all 20,000 calls in the city each year for this type of service. These are called the police, finally, will no longer have to respond to, not all of them, but the vast majority of them. Because it never should have been your responsibility in the first place and we are finally fixing this. In addition, and we havent talked about this as much, but its a very important it will have a very important impact on your job and your department in a positive way. Because Mental Health says will create a 24hour, sevendaya week Service Center where people in crisis can go is we know emergency Psych Services is often on diversion and now there is another place that people can go where there are psychiatrists and psych nurses on staff 24 seven that can properly treat individuals. It creates a drug sobering center. It creates an urgent care clinic for people in severe distress that need a higher level of attention. It expands the number of beds in the city, both locked and unlocked so that we have flow through the system. That means that people dont cycle in and out from the street into emergency Psych Services, back on the street, where your officers spend so much of the time going with the same person and that goes nowhere. Sure, it will take a few years to get the whole thing up and running, but im extremely excited to say that that work starts now and were going to see improvement, increasing improvement over the years and we know that ems six has plans in the works to create the crisis teams by four teams this fall and an additional two teams, hopefully, if all goes well in the budget process, in february and march of next year. And so given that theres go to be a substantial reduction in the calls for service to the Police Department because of Mental Health sf, because of the street crisis teams, because theres a whole system in place to carry people through so theyre not cycling in and out from program to the streets welcome back to program to the streets, back to Emergency Services back to the street and i dont want to speak too long, so i wont explain all details of that. But lets say we have a functioning system finally and that if it works as designed and intended will significantly reduce the number of calls for service to the police. Were going to decrease substantially by an amount of number of fro officers you need in the school and i understood your response about why you decided to deploy in a certain area. It doesnt move me from what i see not when theres five officers surrounding one individual, but often 15 to 20 officers surrounding one individual. Thats not an unusual thing to see over and over again. I believe that we are right now significantly reducing the amount of calls tor service to the Police Department. So i wanted to put before this committee a suggestion and im happy to hear your response, chief scott, to reduce the number of officers in the sfpd department, significantly the number of officers that are assigned to sros and i want to further look at the 30 positions remaining that should be civilianized. In addition to that, i really believe we need to be having conversation, actually, you know, with the fro officers and the officers at Public Housing that we need to be having publio consider reducing the number of officers that year that are assigned to hstock and then having some additional discussion with the School District and with schools about, you know, whether or not we take all the officers from the sro program or just a portion of them and put the rest of those officers in reserve, the money that would be equivalent to them in reserve for the second year. I also think we who put in the second year of the budget the number of officers that are assigned to Public Housing in reserve so that we can start having really thoughtful discussions with residents in Public Housing about what kind of setup do they want to feel and be safer. I dont understand why we have a horse unit in the city of San Francisco and why in 2020 we have this unit . So if i can address the first question about the deployment of officers or reducing the size of the Police Department and some of this i wont restate what ive said to supervisor waltons question, but specifically for districts like a large part of your district, which is the Mission District, theres a shortage of officers. If you read the matrix report about the Mission District in terms of the call loads and workloads and volume and not talking about foot beats or the response to the quality of life type of calls. Were talking about highpriority calls. They are econom and they coud job because of Response Time but everybody below that drops off because there are not enough officers deployed to the Mission District and we have to deal with in terms of spreading that across the city. Here is the point im trying to make here. If we create a situation in which we applaud with the ems, weve always been in favour of that and continue to be in favour of that and thats a great thing. Youre talking about 20,000 or socalled what you just stated. Weve put up a slide in fridays presentation with over three thousand calls to service a year and theres another 280,000 calls to service and all of other things we have to do. So i just want to reiterate when you say were going to freeze the housing officers, what that means to your district is the Housing Development in your district wont be policed by those officers. When you say, you know, freeze those officers, giving us the ability to redeploy them to where theyre needed, those are decisions that we have to live with and those decisions comes with consequences. The consequences to Public Safety are devastating. Because we already know that we dont have enough officers. I cant imagine a scenario wher, as we make this transition, we also have to transition, you know, the whole dispatch system, as well as staff ems. So we have to transition this. This speaks to your question and also to nicks presentation from the bla. It seems like were going to bammablgamble and do all these t things down the line, which we want to see them happen, but we have to have a transitional plan. And i think i would like to just keep putting that out there as a reminder. These things wont happen by the flick of a switch. There has to be a plan to transition into what we envision to provide Public Safety to the Police Department. And if we say that were going to freeze those officers, take that money out of the budget, not give the Police Department the ability now to redeploy to other needs, were doing a disservice to the people in the city. Thats my opinion as a person thats been in this business for 31 years, we are doing a disservice to the city. It will affect everybody and not in a good way. So, first of all, i will respond to that in a quebec sect i forgot to ask about the mounted unit. So the mounted unit is a unit for those that dont know this, we have a mounted unit and the officers ride on horseback. Primarily their areas are golden gate park, mcclaren park. When theyre not doing that, they are working other hot spots, union square, Safe Shopper Programs and the downtown area and weve put them at fishermans wharf, high foot traffic, not accessible by patrol officers. Theyre visible because officers are sitting on horses almost six feet tall and great for that type of response. And they help with our response to the car breakins, particularly in the parks where we tend to have car breakins. They help with the response with the Safe Shopper Program this year for the last few yearses, we have received overtime funding by an anonymous donor and this year we didnt have those funds. We had to have a plan b. They were deployed on duty, not overtime, for the most part, to the downtown area where we know we have volumesch peoples of pee shopping during the holiday season. Theyre great for Community Relations at a time right now where we need Community Relations in every aspect and as much as we can get it. People tend to like the horses. The way we deploy them is not intimidating and its a nice way to do patrol and not have as presence that is as intimidating that youve mentioned in your questioning. So they are primarily in the park and they do a Great Service there. But we do use them in other parts of the city regularly. Theres only, i think, right noe six in the mounted unit. Theres nine horses, six individuals and we have a couple of other officers deployed but theyre not fullduty officers, but theyre six. I thought there was 15. Thats what ive been told. Thats not correct . No, no, ha is not. That is not. We deploy people there with light duty and that includes civilians and that might include the stable hands and the people that work and care for the horses. That might include that, but the number is six. How many horses do we have . I believe we still have nine because some of the officers we havent replaced an any offis in the mounted unit in the last couple of years. Ill verify that. So i want to pass this on to another one of my colleagues, but here is what i would request of you, chief scott, and the b la. I would request that you have a discussion about officers assigned to the hstock unit. My understanding is that theres 33. This will significantly reduce the number of calls and the need for Police Responding to people having the Mental Health crises i would like to find how that will reduce the requirements of your workforce. This is the year to do it. And so, if you could do that, because im interested in reducing your workload in that area and in those jobs being handled by professionals that are trained to do so. I do not see the need for the mounted unit. I would love for you to work with the bla and find out what the cost of not only the horses are but of caring for the horses and the staff that cares for them, et cetera. In terms of the sros, given that school is closed and given the school board doesnt want officers in the schools any more and on a permanent basis, how the officers can be reduced given those work responsibilities are reduced. And and i understand maybe it wont be completely because there are officers still work on coming up with different types of plans or having a different type of relationship from school. But if you could have that conversation with the bla and if the bla could come back to us with the recommendations on that. And then, in terms of the Public Housing, i agree with you, chief, were not ready this year in any way, shape or form. We need a transition plan. If there is to be one, we need to hear from residents of Public Housing that need to be at the front of making decisions for themselves. But if you could give us a sense of the amount spent on officers that are assigned to Public Housing just so we can put that money in reserve on the second year of the budget so that we can be on top of having those types of conversations, that would be something that i would be interesting in presenting to the committee tor our consideration. And then, finally, youll send me the report on the 30 officers, sworn officers that are currently working in positions that youve agreed should be civilianized. So that we can look at, perhaps, what to do with those positions this year and then, you know, i just want to express my support and agreement with supervisor walton about the amount of overtime and there was Something Else you said and im blanking on. Im sorry. We need envisioning if be fade police out of what police have taken up, because weve neglected more appropriate agencies and roles to take care of those duties. And so i dont know that theres anything formally in place in the city and county right now to facilitate that conversation in reenvisioning work from happening. I certainly am looking forward to after the budget process, working with whoever wants to work on this to put a structure in lac place so that envisioninn happen and so that this work can shift to more appropriate types of professionals over time and so, those are all of the things that im hoping that you can can talk to the bla about and can analyze and bring us back recommendations that this committee can consider as additional policy changes to the sfpd budget next week, most likely, so thank you and i appreciate your time. Thank you, its a pleasure. Thank you very much. Next is supe supervisor mamdelm. Thank you, chair fewer. I have some questions about the bla recommendations and the chiefs response. But i think before i get there, i do want to go back and this is partly because supervisor walton brought it up, but ive been thinking about it. I think this conversation would be easier, better for us, if we had confidence that people who shouldnt be Police Officers were not Police Officers in San Francisco. And, you know, when we have someone in the Planning Department who isnt well suited to their job, we made have bad Planning Decisions and thats too bad. But if we have the wrong person in the Police Department, someone can end up dead, you know, an entire generation of people can be harassed and bad things happen. I understand that not everybody on the brady list shouldnt be a Police Officer and people end up on the brady list for all types of reasons. But i dont want us to get to the point where and i dont know the specific messages that supervisor walton was talking about, but there are people that shouldnt be Police Officers, that we have the ability to get rid of them more easily than it would be to get rid of someone who is just a bad planner, you know. And i dont know how we get there, but i think these conversations about policing are going to continue to be challenging and i know you want to get there, too. I know youre doing work on the front end to make sure we dont hire the wrong people, but if we have the wrong people in there, we have to figure out ways to get them out. I am continually impressed by so many of the Police Officers who i engage with and my constituents engage with who go above and beyond and do heroic things but if we have even one problematic officer in that department, the impacts ripple out and create problems throughout a community and then throughout the city and create problems for you and create problems for all of the good officers. So i know youre doing this work. If we can be helpful to you through charter amendments, through contract negotiations, through whatever we can do to empower the leadership of the department to make sure that the people who are doing the work on the streets of San Francisco are the right people. Thats my little speech. And so i still do not understand the discrepancy. So what i heard, and tell me if im understanding about the bodyworn cameras, this roughly 600,000 discrepancy is attributable to batteries for the bodyworn cameras that werent purchased last year because of covid but are still needed and so taking that money out of next years budget will be a problem. Is that the issue . That is correct. And i have patrick leon who is still here. Let me swap the camera. Good afternoon, supervisor mandelman. With the balance, that work was originally planned to be performed in fiscal year 20 and the process would have required us to get personal Services Contract request from the Civil Service commission and that process was delayed due to covid and there were several meetings that were canceled and we didnt get approval until late in the year. And so, the delays from that process, there wasnt sufficient time to procure a contract award that would allow us to replace all of the bodyworn cameras that need to be replaced. And all of that work has now been deferred to fiscal year 21, so that money, the funds that are carried over the balance, the 613,000, thats a plan for the battery replacement. And if those funds are taken away, then that really removes our ability to perform that task and it really puts us at risk with our bodyworn camera program. Ok, so can we go over to bla now . I think you explained this mr. Bernard, but whats the answer to that . I think the answer lies in looking at the historical spending and carryover from the program. The budget, right, what you see before you is just 3 million and doesnt include what theyre bringing in. Right now theyre bringing in another 600, right . But this happens almost every year and so in 201819, they brought over one. 5 million and in 2019, 20, they brought over 600. Im saying given the budget they have. In the next year, yeah. Theyre bringing in money and getting a new budget and so this is kind of right sizing them. Based on their actual spending over time. And then maybe the Police Department could respond to that. I would like to. What the bla is confusing is that the manner in which the citys new Financial System treats carryovers are different than in years passed. And so the budge bla is basing t has been carried forward. With the citys Financial System, what happens at the end of the fiscal year, at the end of june, any purchase orders, any encumbrances that are still open are rolled over into the new year. And its a characteristic of the new system, but it doesnt represent what has been spent or what is needed, and so, in the slide that we had presented earlier, we showed what we spent for each of the years and we spent to the budget, very close to the budget in fiscal year 20, we spent, i believe, 4. 1 million in the year prior and so, a lot of what the bla is basing their decisions on has more do with the characteristics of the Accounting System than it does with what we havent spent. If you referenced a slide that we shared, it shows what we spent per fiscal year and we spent to the budget in fiscal year 19, we spent very close to the budget in fiscal year 20. And so, the amount that we have to Carry Forward from fiscal year 20 to fiscal year 21, we planned to use that money to replace all of the batteries that need to be replaced. The camera or the batteries that are in existence, those are the original batteries and its already approaching it will approach the end of its useful life during the next year. I get what youre saying. So maybe one last time to mr. Menard. So you are being accused of sort of misunderstanding the citys accounting and police are saying they spend all of money theyre budgeted or close to all of the money theyre budgeted and that the only reason they didnt this last year was because of the pickup with the batteries. And you think thats wrong . I dont think im misunderstanding. I think were just disagreeing about what actually will happen in the next year. And i guess theres a difference between spending that a has occurred up to june 30th and spending that was supposed to happen until june 30th. But theyll move the funds over because theyll spend in the new year, right . So i think the carrying forward cant capture both of that, and i think thats why the chief Financial Officer thinks of a misunderstanding because hes lumping those two things together. Mr. Rosenfield, you just popped up on my screen. I dont know clarity, but a suggestion. If its of help to the board, were having a fairly technical conversation regarding and understanding how the Financial System works and accounts for things. If it would be helpful, we would be helpful to join the characterization with mr. Menard and patrick from the Police Department and see if we can help bridge any difference in understanding and bring this item back to you. I love that and it seems like thats relevant to the next item, too, for the supply, i think. I dont know, chair fewers committee, but i think it would be helpful to have the controller weigh in. Ok, suggestion taken. On the academies, im perplexed because six months ago, and i dont know when the matrix came out but its saying this is the sort of thoughtful alternative to our dumb charter provision that says we need 19 whatever number it is, and not achieving what is recommended by matrix for all of the reasons weve talked about, but trying to avoid going back down and also six months ago, there are. And so that was the conversation six months ago and it is true that the world has changed and that is a positive thing and it may well be we do not need, you know, the 245 additional Police Officers that the matrix study recommends and may be that we could even do with some fewer number than we have now. I have had any frustrations but i still think that some of the work that they do will have to continue even if there is no hstock and maybe a lot of it. You know, if there is drug dealing and drugrelated crime and sometimes violence disruptions, some will require a police response. Force that discussion and once we make a policy decision it doesnt just happen overnight. And i did sort of bring it up almost a year now. And in the regard to the situation i feel well be there next year and should really take that seriously and force that discussion. Someone has to secure the perimeters and stuff like that. I really urge the rest of you to carry on that conversation because i think that is one of the bigger chunks of the impact in the Police Department. Thats it. Supervisor ronen, any other comment . Yes, thank you so much chair fewer. I just wanted to sort of respond to supervisor mandelmans comments and just challenge us a little bit in this moment. What changed from six months ago is that the entire world erupted after they kneed george floyd in the neck and killed him before you are eyes and officers went into Breonna Taylors home and shot her for whatever reason and though this happens over and over and over again this was the straw that broke the camels back and not just the city. The entire world stood up and said theres something fundamentally broken and wrong with the way we conduct policing in the United States of america. Its a moment ive not seen in my life time and im 44 years old and the only thing that gives me hope that we have a Better Future in front of us. I think we cant just give lip service to this time and movement. The 2. 6 cut to the Police Budget is a slap in the face. And while i agree with you, oh, my gosh, there are so many officers i have the highest respect for including my own chief who is a remarkable human being and leader and man. But that its not about individuals that we respect and like and who do their job well. Its about the system that is rotten to its core and truly developed out of slavery and has grown in that way and has taken on brown bodies in addition to black bodies and has created a system where your and not even you, because your gay, it has attacked your community too in a brutal and disgusting way and continues to attack and lead to violence against the trans community. And the Police Community with me is great and thats not the situation for most black and brown people. Police have discussions with their children including my sister and her husband with my nephew. Its a completely different relationship and so we must rise to this moment and we must not give lip service to these movements. We need to start something and agree with chief scott and think were all on the same page. We cant do it in one fell swoop. Its irresponsible and not going to work. We need to be thoughtful and have a process that reenvisions what a just Public Safety system can look like in our society so when a black person looks at authorities of safety they feel the same as a white person. And that is not what we have. So this is so hard. This is the hardest work were going to do because of course we care deeply about safety. The thought of anybody falling victim to crime is the sickest feeling you could have as an elected official and that is on our shoulders. Thats on our hearts and certainly on the shoulder and heart of our chief and its difficult to cut the budget and with all due chief, if you cut the budget citizens will be in harms way. Its a bit of an exaggeration and scare tactic and im sure thats not how you mean it and believe you believe it but i think we can all rise to the occasion and do Something Different and better. Were not going to be able to it in one year its going to take a decade if not more. But weve got to do Something Real and significant this year. We cant let down this movement and im frustrated with the movement in for instance. Im just going put that out there. I havent been that impressed with it but talking about the national movement, the Global Movement that i am impressed with. And i want to meet this time and this movement and i just wanted to challenge us because i know youre all feeling the same way i am to do that even though its scary. Thank you. Thank you, supervisor ronen. Chair, may i just respond to one part. I wanted to say and clarify because im not trying to use a scare tactic but want to be clear on what i said and what i continue to say and we have a deficit and as the chief of police and we have a command staff and our job is to put resources in the right places. Knowing that we have that deficit, what i have said and continue to say is we have to have the ability to redeploy. If were going make cuts to certain units, if that is what we decide to do or are forced to do, we need to have the ability to redeploy because it is a true fact we have shortages in patrol as we speak. Thats just a true fact. That has an impact on service. It does. Im not trying to scare anybody but it does. The other thing one more comment on one of your questions earlier about whether theres 5, 15 or 20 people surrounding an individual when we go to make an arrest or call to a situation, one thing i didnt say they should have said and deescalation in the past you rushed in and took care of what you have to. We now have a model where we assign officers to reasonabilities. Youre the contact officer. Youre the arrest officer. You guard the perimeter. If it requires lethal. It takes time and people. Often when you see 10, 15 people, when its done right they all have responsibilities and the end goal is to not use force. Its to not rush in and put our hands on somebody when we dont have to. It does take more people and thats proven that it works. Its proven that it worked for us. Our use of force has been steadily declining since we reinvested into time and training into this model and shootings are going down and a want to reemphasize those are investments paying off and thats what reform looks like. I get we have a lot of work to do but all the things happening have resulted in positive outcomes. Thank you for letting me say that chair fewer. Thank you and thank you for joining us today. I know this part of the hearing has been really long but i think its a really good conversation to have especially in this tone and in this manner. So i want to thank my colleagues. So weve heard a lot today and have been listening to every one of my cloaks and i have a couple colleagues and i have a couple things to comment on. Chief, when you came last week i talked a little bit about Public Safety in general and Law Enforcement is is one piece of Public Safety and we have disproportionately funded certain things and when we not invest in communities we leave them behind and not invest in Affordable Housing and public education, early care and education, job training, Mental Health services, all these things that we dont fund actually we increase our police force is what happens. We dont have these things that stop people from committing crimes. We haven we havent invested in them and one when we cut your budget and we will cut funds its going to services we feel are also part of Public Safety. I just wanted to mention that because as i said i think there will be cuts to almost every single department. Police department is not immune to cuts at this time. And to say if you have more police, youre safer, actually, and if you dont have police you will be suspect to more crime and more harm to the community and i actually think its a false choice because i actually think we can do something very different. It doesnt have to be always funding police. It can be funding strategy to keep people safer. Its almost like when we had the discussion and i know we had a difference of opinion about tasers. People said well, people are afraid of being killed by a taser i mean to be killed by a gunshot theyre saying our people are being shot and give ace give us a taser instead, with four taser deaths in San Francisco we know its a false choice. Its a weapon. I dont think people see me as a radical person but i trying to very pragmatic. When i look and i talk about the matrix study, when i look at the academi academies will i see one in spring 2021 and fall 2021 and spring 2022 i would propose to elimina eliminate all four and ill tell you why. One, i dont think the matrix study is accurate for this time. It was done before a call toyenvision with policing is. Also, i think when we had talk about staffing recommendations and you say this and the lack of patrol on the street i get that. And there are recommendations and the recommendations are in here and in this recommendation in the audit, it says that actually that if you had just implemented a fixed schedule and many could be shifted to a five hour day off and one three off or 36 schedule it would give more coverage of Police Officers and this was something that we brought up before in the past and it was like we have to meet and confirm about that. Then we should meet and confirm about that because the simple shift change they did, for example, in other jurisdictions resulted in more and better coverage is something we can simply do with the same amount of Police Officers we have. Also this november San Francisco voters will have an opportunity to vote where they think the staffing level should be. The charter mandating staffing level may not be appropriate frankly for our new Police Department or what we envision. Why would we budget for that we can only add one better and we deploy them on the streets of San Francisco. We find the efforts arent working you can always just have a supplemental appropriation, frankly and the mayor can do that herself. And it would be after the election when we have a clearer viewer and why would we complete the academies when we dont have Staffing Levels and doing reenvisioning of staffing and everyones in agreement they dont want to respond where they dont have expertise. They also feel theyre not as effective because they dont have the housing inventory. They dont have all the tools we can offer to people who are living on our streets. Another thing is this pushes the conversation that weve had and i know weve had disagreements about it is more of the organization of police personnel. The p. L. A. Identified 350 positions and you said 50 and supervisor is pushing for more but we agreed on 50. The fact only three are done and its my third year in the budget and we began on the discussions years ago is disheartening. I would think if we fund more academies, we can do other and why does a uniform Police Officer have to respond and take the report three hours later. Why cant a civilian do that. And also ive had discussions, president yee brought up, about the airport police. Airport is looking at a very decreased capacity. Why would they need another academy and over 200 Police Officers at the airport and also we are closing jail number four. This transition for deputy sheriffs we could have 70 people 70 deputy sheriffs work at jail four. We can try to implement a switch over. Getting those Police Officers and men and women in blue back on the streets without added academies. Look, i know this is a difficult theyre difficult choices but we have a 1. 7 billion deficit these are things we have to look at and the airport too. Also, we know it cant happen overnight but oakland has deputy sheriffs and to be honest with you the sheriffs do all the arrests of sfo. And its a different comparison to whats out there. Do we need a chief out there or need a deputy chief . Do we need an assistant chief . Do we need a commander and things at the airport . I know its part of the airports budget but frankly if we were to transition the Police Officers to working within the city and county of San Francisco, we wouldnt have to have those academies and not only that, the airport does not take fresh recruits out of the academy. The director himself said we only take those that are tenured Police Officers that have the extra training so why wouldnt we have them on the streets of San Francisco instead of at an empty airport where theyre not making that many arrests. And i would also say this is why. I think its scary to think we wouldnt be funding academies, however, i think it would be funding cad mys and we academies and saying were going to fill positions of people that retire and leave and if we keep saying that, theres mo movement and its no movement and the movement has been slow. When brought up shifting the shifts theyve been slow because we know we have the funding for those academies. You can fill it with new bodies but frankly its getting harder and harder to fill the academy in recruits and 20 dont finish the academy and thats thousands and thousands invested in these people without a Police Officer hired. I dont think we need to hire more. I think we need to use the ones we have in a more effective and efficient way and in different times theres a different conversation and those reluctant to fight against and increase in the Police Overtime budget are now willing to say lets take a second look. This becomes, i late to say about overtime. We have to cut the overtime. The overtime is mandatory but you said yourself most the overtime comes from investigations after hours in the same audit performed by our own legislative analyst and asked by president yee states here in their report that actually about overtime arrests the increase in overtime hours for arrest investigations has not coincided with the increase in the number of arrests. Overtime hours will be tripled between 2010 and 2016 even though the real estates and violent arrests and violent offenses decreased and overall the number arrests made are for felonies with 30 lower than 2010 and yet the overtime has increased triplefold. You have told me its because so some is mandatory when you take i think a protest but when you tell me the bulk of overtime is because of these investigations after hours, then i say to you, it does not correspond with arrests. Something is wrong. Theres a disconnect here, chief and the reason we look at them is because its our job as board of supervisors to make sure monies are spent well and efficiently. If youve been hearing hes hearings your department is not the only ones weve been grilling. I had a harsh conversation with the department of homelessness and pushed on them too. We all have to do better. Im saying to you like the other subject which is that. I think were saying maybe people who have seen this have seen the Culture Shift and that ned to happen in the Police Department is slowly not happening as well intended as you are about the reforms a lot cant hire about reforms and about who we hire and who comes in first. Wed see teachers wed have to get rid of later. They wouldnt pass for probation though we needed teachers badly but were teaching on a premise of equity now and if you cant do that, you can be a great teacher some where else but you cannot be a teacher in our district and i say the same about Police Officers. I also want to say in the blue plan on panel panel on transparency and many have read this cover to cover and they tuck about the investigations and the people doing background investigations and theres one small part of your budget id like to see eliminated thats the use of using retired Police Officers to do this work because thats in the right. I think the majority of retired Police Officers are white. Its just what your police force was at that time. When we have people who retired 30 years, get a pension. They wait that time. We were talking about Police Officers who trained 30 years ago. Thaes thats different for the 21st Century Policing department we want today. Im not in favor of layoffs. Police officers are working class folks. They support their family and put food on the table and most have families. I think we can be using our monies much more efficiently. So chief, these are recommendations around the cuts of the equipment and i think the other budgetary ones im glad we are talking to the bla and having a deeper conversation about it but i want to say that over time as you know and i just want to commend you also is that a lot of these departments come back from mid year appropriation and overtime. Its still a large overtime budget and why would we over fund it and assume youd use that much. If you have that much in the bank youll use it and youve seen if youre not using it well take it back. Why would we do that knowing you could depend on well, i have this much in my budget also. We talked about better protocols for overtime and weve discussed this many times at the Budget Committee and very little progress has been made. Chief, there are things we can do to make it more efficient and effective without adding more Police Officers because we can use the Police Officers we have in a much more efficient and effective way. I do think that when we talk about your budget, this year especially theres a spotlight on it but its also a moment i think that a call to all of us how to better use the city funds to be more efficient and more effective . By no means do we want to put people in danger including Police Officers but i think we can do it more efficiently and effectively and again i always say this because it is a job of this committee to take seriously the money that we are entrusted with and use it to the most efficient and effective manner. Having said that id like to just say we welcome you back next week to have a further discussion on the elimination of some of these Police Academies and also the chief budgetary recommendations from the bla after youve met with the b. L. A. Again and also as per supervisor ronens request Police Officers to asoc and the cost and the School Officers and what is the budget for that and what is the status of that now. Public housing and the transition plan and how much money is going into that and also a report on the 30 or so officers that can be civilianized and i just want to say that i think we should be looking at more were just going to push you harder. I think things we could have civilians do. We quite frankly have hundreds of thousand of people unemployed in San Francisco. We need to hire them back too and i just think that Police Officers also with each Police Officer in San Francisco we have invest invested 100,000 into them with training and think they should be used for what they were trained to do and some of these office jobs frankly are not really what Police Officers what we invest and train them to do. Having said that, i look forward to seeing you next week at our committee. Know these things are contentious. Its set up to be adversarial and have deeper understanding and reflection how to make budgets more reflective and efficient. With that, colleagues, i want to thank and excuse our police chief and thank you for joining us and colleagues thank you very much for your suggestions and insight and then i will ask madame clerk, do we have any mer departments before us today . That does complete the departments set to speak today. Thank you very much. I would like to recess this meeting until 10 00 a. M. Tomorrow morning. May i have a second, please . Second. Roll call vote, please, mr. Clerk. [roll call] on the motion to recess the meeting until 10 00 am august 21, 2020 meeting of the budget and appropriations committee, supervisor walton. Aye. Walton,