So we know she met with muellers team. Do we have any idea what they asked her . We dont right now, anderson. What was asked by muellers team to davis. But we know this woman, as you said, known as the manhattan madam voluntarily spoke with investigators. And what she knows and how she fits isnt exactly clear. But sources tell cnn muellers team would like her to testify in front of a grand jury. This really points to the fact that the Special Counsel seems to be focusing on stone as they continue this Overarching Investigation into russias interference in the 2016 election. And davis really has a very close relationship with stone. Theyve known each other for a decade. Stone is the godfather to davis 2yearold son. Stone put davis on his payroll. And conversely, when davis made a new york gubernatorial run, stone worked on her campaign. Perhaps she has information on his finances, his connections, his friendships, any other personal life matters. We should mentioned, anderson, that stone did release a statement saying this, quote, Kristin Davis is a longtime friend and associate of mine. Im the godfather to her 2yearold son. She knows nothing about russian collusion, wikileaks collaboration or any other
but stone hasnt been interviewed by muellers team as far as we know. We have to make that point. Brynn gingras, appreciate it. Now the president s former campaign chairman, his trial and what appears to be his growing legal troubles two accountants for Paul Manafort took the stand. What they have to say about his taxes will leave a mark. Shimon prokupecz joins us for that part. What happened today . It was big day really for the prosecution. They had their first person of testifying really with direct knowledge of manaforts alleged scheme obviously to hide money in offshore accounts, to lie on his taxes. This witness who testified, cindy laporta, she was one of the witnesses Given Immunity. She was one of the five Given Immunity by the Special Counsels office. And really, anderson, it was big day for prosecutors. Damaging testimony for manafort. She testified that manafort asked her to falsify documents, and some of this activity while he was running the Trump Campaign in 2016. In one case she said that money
that manned for claimed he had in offshore accounts, that it was a loan when in fact it was income that he had made, that by doing so that reduced his taxes by 500,000. There is emails of communications between her and Paul Manafort. Really, this is setting up quite the number of witnesses that are going to be coming and really all the evidence that prosecutors seem to have against Paul Manafort. Did the accountant explained why she lied for manafort initially . Yeah, she was regretful, anderson, certainly. She said he was an important client to her and she simply did not want to fight him. She didnt stand up to him. But in the end, really her only reason for not doing it was because she felt he was too important a client. Do we know when gates is going to testify, rick gates . That is going to be a big day. We thought maybe it could start today. We now think it is likely, if there is any chance that it could probably be monday the earliest. It could be on tuesday. They have to finish with this
but the goal was to get him convicted to give him a goal of choice between dying in prison or turning on his former associate. Yeah, thats what this is about. John, do you agree thats what this is about . Theyre not really interested in the charges of bank fraud, money laundering, violating Disclosure Law or evading taxes, that its ultimately about squeezing him . That is a possibility. They certainly appear to have stacked up some charges. The reason there are two case, there is one in d. C. And one in virginia is that manafort refused to waive the venue issue, otherwise these would have all been tried together. As you watch the trial, you watch the information, whats curious is that manafort went to work for trump when the guy apparently was flat broke and asked for no salary. So this suggests somebody as the commentators are saying who might have been ripe for pickings by the russians. And that may be the cliff this trial leads us on. Professor dershowitz, this is within the purview of muellers team. Theyre directed the Special Counsels office is authorized to investigate, quote, any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation. Thats a pretty broad mandate. I think thats right. And i think the judge wrote the right decision when he refused to dismiss it. But nonetheless, the judge did say that the purpose is obviously to try to get manafort. Look, manafort was smart not waiving venue because he is much better off with judge ellis and a virginia jury than he would be with a judge who revoked his bail in washington, d. C. And a d. C. Jury, which is going to be largely democrat. And so but it gives the prosecution two shots. Its risky on both sides, but in the end they will probably get a conviction and probably try very hard to squeeze manafort. We cant know at this point whether manafort will, a, sing or compose, or b, whether hell be pardoned. It was interesting, john, to hear all the details how far
manafort went to attempt to hide a very significant amount of income and how many different ways he allegedly went about trying to do it. Yes. His accountants on the stand today were certainly revealing his Modus Operandi and how little they actually knew about some of his affairs, yet they were enough aware the fact that his taxes were not accurate, and they put that into evidence today. And this defense of blaming everything on gates is getting tougher and tougher as they report that manafort himself was signing many of these documents. Professor dershowitz, about gates, he is expected to testify monday. How important do you think his testimony is going to be in the case . Because certainly defense has been trying to paint him as the bad guy from the start. Well, a little less important than i previously thought because this accountant, who doesnt seem to have an ax to grind did testify pretty persuasively. Now, of course, she could conceivably have been prosecuted because she did sign the tax
returns, but thats rarely done. So gates will still be important. He will be easy pickings for a good crossexaminer because hes gotten the deal and he can be shown to have an interest in being stating testimony that would be acceptable to the prosecution. But if he has corroborated testimony and if hes corroborated by the accountant, then his testimony can be per sways alternative a jury. John, it is possible to make a deal once the trial start . Absolutely. As the professor im sure could instruct us, and maybe in his own experience, i understand that you can you take a plea up to the time the jury is even out to deliberating. Is that right, professor . Yes. And that has happened. There is a famous case where Rudy Giuliani was a young assistant district attorney, and a congressman was on trial, and the plea was obtained after giuliani devastated him on crossexamine. He then submitted a plea. There is another famous case
where while the jury was out, they accepted a plea, and then the jury came back and acquitted. Nonetheless, the guilty plea was accepted. So you can do it any time. Thank you. John dean as well. Stick around. Were going to talk to you in the next hour of 360. There is a lot more ahead tonight in this hour, including the question of why the president always seems to be at odds with the rest of his administration on russias threat to u. S. Elections. Keeping him honest if they ever seen anything like this before. And a judge gives a tonguelashing and all the kids who have not been reunited with their families. See how he is keeping them honest tonight on 360. So what do you guys want . Pistachio. Chocolate chip. Rocky road. I see Whats Going On here. Everybodys got different taste. Well, now verizon lets you mix and match your family unlimited plans so everybody gets the plan they want, without paying for things they dont. Jetsetting moms can videochat from europe. Movieobsessed teens can stream obscure cinema. Its like everyone gets their own flavor of unlimited. chuckles its a metaphor. Simile, not a metaphor. Hm. Well played. vo one family. Different unlimited plans. Starting at 40 per line. Switch now and get 300 off our best phones all on the network you deserve. Stay at la quinta. Where were changing with stylish makeovers. Then at your next meeting, set your seat height to its maximum level. Bravo, tall meeting man. Start winning today. Book now at lq. Com
crisp leaves of lettuce. Freshly made dressing. Clean food that looks this good. Delivered to your desk. Now delivering to home or office. Panera. Food as it should be. Its these new freshfx car Air Fresheners from armor all. Each scent can create a different mood in my car. Like tranquil skies. Armor all, its easy to smell good. The new united Explorer Card hooks me up. Getting more for getting away. Traveling lighter. Getting settled. Rewarded learn more at theexplorercard. Com kremlin today lashed out at the russia investigation. A Foreign Ministry spokeswoman referring to it, and im quoting here, the twoyear hysteria
surrounding the russian interference in 2016 elections that did not happen. It sounds almost exactly like what President Trump said last night. Speaking at a rally in eastern pennsylvania, the president had warm words about his summit with Vladimir Putin, harsh words about the russia probe. We got along really well. By the way, thats a good thing, not a bad thing. Thats a really good thing. Now were being hindered by the russian hoax. Its a hoax. Ill tell you what, russia is very unhappy that trump won, that i can tell you. But i got along great with putin. Were being hindered by the russian hoax, he said. Now the president sometimes clarifies what he means by that, saying any notion of collusion is a hoax, but he often doesnt make that distinction, and seems to imply the entire Mueller Probe into the election is an attack or the attack itself is one. Any claims he said in helsinki
on camera he wanted trump to win, and the pat has ever attack ed putin the way he has other world leaders, even allies of the u. S. He determines the Foreign Policy course he wants to set for the country. Thats not the issue. Keeping him honest, this is. The president s position on russia often undercuts his administrations position and the tough statements his own advisers make, which raises the obvious question, is the president trying to have it both ways . Or it is now explicit white house policy to speak out of both sides of its mouth on a Vital National security issue . Regardless of the motivation, this is something thats been happening over and over again, the president undercutting his own National Security team after the fact or undermining their message beforehand. Again, here is what the president said last night. Now were being hindered by the russian hoax. Its a hoax, okay . All right. He says its a hoax. Here is what his top National Security and counterintelligence officials said on his orders at the white house just a few hours before he said that. Our democracy itself is in the crosshairs. What we see is the russians are looking for every opportunity regardless of party, regardless of whether or not it applies to the election to continue their pervasive efforts to undermine our fundamental values. I fully share the Intelligence Community and the odnis past efforts and those today to interfere with our election and of the current threat. They stepped up their game bigtime in 2016. Thinking is a threat we need to take extremely seriously, and to tackle and respond to with fierce determination and focus. Have you heard the president say anything like that . These are the president s own top advisers and Cabinet Members sent out with his blessing to push a message that he himself doesnt seem to fully accept. Here is the secretary of Homeland Security again, Kirstjen Nielsen again on tuesday. Two years ago, as we all know, a foreign power launched a Brazen Multipassed influence
campaign to undermine public faith in our democratic process and to distort our president ial election. Let me be clear, our Intelligence Community has it right. It was the russians. We know that. They know that. It was directed from the highest levels. And we cannot and will not allow that to happen again. Again, that was tuesday. A day later, the president tweeted, not backing nielsen up, but instead he tweeted about the one aspect of the russia probe that seems to truly concern him, and i quote. Russian collusion with the Trump Campaign, one of the most successful in history, a total hoax. The democrats paid for the phony and discredited dossier which was along with strzok and his lovely lover lease a page used to begin the witchhunt. Disgraceful. He didnt condemn russian interference in american elections, and certainly didnt use the opportunity to back up his own secretary of Homeland Security. Nonthen and not a couple of weeks before. Here is fbi director christopher
wray, two days before the president had such general words for putin in helsinki and for putins denial he interfered in the 2016 election. The Intelligence Communitys assessment has not changed. My view has not changed. Which is that russia attempted to interfere with the last election, and that it continues to engage in malign influence operations to this day. Thats pretty clear. But even as the networks were broadcasting that, they were also still broadcasting this from the president just a day before. I accept our Intelligence Communitys conclusion that russias meddling in the 2016 election took place. It could be other people also. A lot of people out there. Two contradictory messages on russia a day apart the very moment the entire world was asking what the message really was, and two contradictory messages in the very same
president ial statement, one written by the president s staff that he read, and barely a beat later the president s own ad lib thoughts on the matter that it could be other people there is a lot of people throughout. As we said, this happens again and again. Dni coats in february. Take a look. We need to inform the American Public that this is real, that is going to be happening and the resilience needed for us to stand up and say were not going allow some russian to tell us how to vote, how we ought to run our country. And a i think there needs to be a national cry for that. Well, those remarks came just a few days after the president tweeted out something he saw on fox news discrediting the russia probe, blaming the justice department, the fbi for victimizing him during the 2016 campaign. Again, time and time again. One white house, two messages. And time after time, the president prefers the one that lets russia off the hook. It raises a host of yes, some of which well put to our guests. Former obama Chief Of Staff and former cia director leon panetta
and x files host david axelrod, former adviser to president obama. Its pretty remarkable the president at times seems to be more in line with what the Russia Foreign minister is saying than what his own Intelligence Security chiefs are saying. Anderson, i have never in my lifetime seen an administration that is presenting such a confused message when it comes to a National Security threat. And the fact is that its sending a very mixed message to both our enemies and our allies that the United States does not have a clear policy when it comes to russia. Do you know why theyre sending such a mixed message . Well, this has gone on too long to be just the consequence of incompetence. I think this is deliberate. Certainly, its deliberate on the part of the president , but whether its deliberate on the part of his Cabinet Members, i dont think thats the case. But it clearly is deliberate
that hes trying to send two messages here. One is a message to the russians and to his base. And the message to the russians is keep doing what youre doing. And the message to his base is regardless of the facts, please stick with me and listen to me. The other message is one to the majority of the american people, which is that u. S. Policy remains the same, that it remains firm with regards to russia and that were taking steps to try to protect our country. Those are the two messages that are going out. But when you put them together, it creates tremendous confusion about just exactly what the United States of america really stands for. David, obviously you worked this the obama administration. You watched many others. Have you ever seen a president and members of the administration on such different pages when it comes the a National Security threat . Unthinkable, unthinkable. I agree with leon. Ive never seen this, whether in pn politics or my years as a journalist. This is totally unprecedented. You know, there was a time when we had this bipolar world, the u. S. And the soviet union. Now the world looks at us and they see a bipolar administration. And its very hard to determine what the truth is here. But we should point out, like i want to give credit to the members of the National Securities team because i think they did the right thing by standing up. I think dan coats and others and bob wray and chris wray, i should say, have been very consistent about the nature of this threat. But the president of the United States has the biggest mega phone. It was the president of the United States who sat alone for two hours with Vladimir Putin. It was the president of the United States who stood on a platform with Vladimir Putin and
essentially undercut his National Security team and his intel team and gave credence to putins lies. So the world sees that first. And it makes them wonder. And i think it gives putin the idea that the back doors open, come on in. Secretary panetta, david just mentioned dan coats. Last night the president said he had a great meeting with putin. The director of National Intelligence, dan coats said yesterday that he is, quote, not in a position to either understand fully or talk what happened in helsinki. Now either he knows and cant talk about it, but the idea that to even say he is not in position to understand what actually occurred Behind Closed Doors is pretty stunning. Well, you got director of National Intelligence who obviously has no idea about what the president said to putin in that room. And i suspect that there isnt
anybody in the administration, the National Security team that really knows exactly what was said in that room. Right. Because when john bolton. He referred to john bolton right next, and then bolton quoted Vladimir Putins statement, not something that the president himself had told him. Yeah, i know. I think the russians have said things about what was agreed to in that room. But we have heard absolutely nothing from the president of the United States about the specifics of what was discussed or what was agreed to. And so the result is that there is a tremendous amount of suspicion here of what exactly what is it that the president and putin really talked about that impacts on United States Foreign Policy. This is unheard of. Ive never seen a situation like this. But thats what were getting with the Trump Administration. What really bothers me is that this is an enemy whose trying to undermine our democracy. Thats what the russians have tried to do since, you know, since recent history is basically undermine our democracy. Thats what theyre engaged in. And right now they are successful at doing that in the way they continue to try to interfere with our election. That means that a National Security threat facing this country has a very confused response in terms of the administration. David, it is simply the president cant separate anything having to do with russian interference from the legitimacy of his electoral win . Is that what his silence on the issue is about right here . Well, thats what you keep hearing from his people, that privately you read this, you hear this. He just doesnt want his win den
denigrated or downgraded or called into question. But that doesnt speak to even if that were the case, it doesnt speak to where we are now. I mean there is a threat now. And one of the reason theres is a confusion that leon speaks about is that the president is parroting putins line. When the president calls the Russian Investigation a hoax, that is exactly what moscow said today. This is the kremlin line today. They were bitterly denouncing the investigation and said there was no truth to it. So the president keeps reinforcing the kremlins line. And that is a source of great concern and confusion for anyone who is trying to read whats actually going on here in our own government. David axelrod, secretary leon panetta, thank you very much. A lot more straight ahead, including the Breaking News of a federal judges rebuke of Trump Administration attorneys who wanted a Civil Liberties group, the aclu, to take charge of Finding Hundreds Of Immigrant parents deported without their kids. And later word that the tsa is discussing even more costsaving measures at the nations airports, besides the one cnn already reported earlier this week. The question, of course, could the changes compromise security. Chicken . chicken. Chicken thats right, candace new Chicken Creations from starkist. Buffalo Style Chicken in a pouch bold choice, charlie just tear, eat. Mmmmm. And go try all of my Chicken Creations chicken man are unpredictable crohns symptoms following you everywhere . Its time to take back control with stelara®. For adults with moderately to severely active crohns disease, stelara® works differently. Studies showed relief and remission with dosing every 8 weeks. Woman stelara® may lower the ability of your Immune System to fight infections and may increase your risk of infections and cancer. Some serious infections require hospitalization. Before treatment, get tested for tuberculosis. Before or during treatment, always tell your doctor if you think you have an infection or have flulike symptoms or sores, have had cancer, or develop any new skin growths, or if anyone in your house needs or recently had a vaccine. Alert your doctor of new or worsening problems, including headaches, seizures, confusion and vision problems. These may be signs of a rare, potentially fatal brain condition. Some serious allergic reactions can occur. Do not take stelara® if you are allergic to any of its ingredients. Man are you fed up with crohns symptoms following you . Talk to your doctor today, and learn how janssen can help you explore cost support options. Remission can start with stelara®. Gathered here are the worlds finest insurance experts. Rodney mastermind of discounts like safe driver, paperless. The list goes on. How about a discount for long lists . Gold. Mara, you save our customers hundreds for switching almost effortlessly. Its a gift. And jamie. Present. Together we are unstoppable. So, what are we gonna do . Insurance. Thats kind of what we do here. Im a small business, but i have. Big dreams. And big plans. So how do i make the efforts of 8 employees. Feel like 50 . How can i share new plans virtually . How can i download an efile . Virtual tours . Zipfile . Really big files . In seconds, not minutes. Just like that. Like everything. The answer is simple. Ill do what ive always done. Dream more, dream faster, and above all. Now, ill dream gig. Now more businesses, in more places, can afford to dream gig. Comcast, building americas largest gigspeed network. Breaking news tonight in the family separation front. A federal judge in san diego has delivered a stinging rebuke to the Trump Administration. Attorneys who proposed that a private civil rights group, the american Civil Liberties union, the aclu be in charge of Locating Hundreds of deported parents who have been separated from their children in the wake of the governments family separation policies. Now the judge is the same one who has been overseeing the return of those kids over the past several weeks. He calls the administrations proposal to let the aclu and other groups locate the parents unacceptable. He also added that the reality is for every parent who is not located, there will be a permanent orphan child and that is 100 the responsibility of the administration. Joining me now to discuss democratic senator jeff merkley, who has visited some of the Detention Centers the parents and kids have been kept. Senator merkley, thanks for being with us. Do you have any understanding as to why the government thought it was the aclus responsibility to
relow to find these parents, to essentially right these wrong in the first place . It wasnt the aclu that separated the kids from their parents. No, absolutely not, anderson. The situation is that the government has so botched the connection between the parents and the children that theyd like to shed that responsibility and put it off on to someone else. When they sent the parents back without their children, and many of the children of the 700 still not reconnected to their parents, 500 or so their parents have been deported. They didnt track carefully where the parents would be. We dont know if they have more information than they revealed in terms of Phone Numbers or email addresses. But in terms of street dresses, many of their files just say things like sin calle which means without a street, or maybe lists a city and no other details. And theyre finding it difficult to find the parents since they didnt track the administration. Theyd like to say, well, we messed it up, but lets make sure someone else has to clean up this. Its been going on for weeks now. The government still doesnt know how theyre going reunite these families. Because even when people are deported, theyre not sent back to where they came from. They could be sent to another town, in some cases im told even another country. Yes. So that adds to the confusion. And in this situation where the government, our government knew that their kids were still in the United States or should have known they tracked it carefully, they made no effort to say we need to make sure we know how to find these parents because we still have a child, a Family Member whose in the care of the u. S. Government. And they simply apparently didnt do so with any sort of diligence. Throughout this entire process, from the time that the trump team decided to start ripping children out of their parents
arm, there has been a thorough lack of preparation, planning, a certain callousness about the impact of this treatment on the kids. Were talking about a policy that deliberately inflicted trauma and then followup that was so incompetent as to further aggravate the situation. I mean, the aclu say theyre willing to work with the government. But according to them, they say the governments Contact Information is so unsatisfactory that even though it appears hhs has Phone Numbers for many of the parents, they really just dont know how to locate them. The government acting in good faith here . I dont i think there are some individuals in this process who are doing everything they can to assist these children. But in terms of the decisionmakers who designed the program, it was done in a horrific, incompetent, callous fashion, and now everybody is paying the price. And it does there is no
end in sight right now and no solution. You have the judge saying its unacceptable and the responsibility is 100 of the government. Are there repercussions here, or is that part of the issue here, there are no repercussions for this . Well, certainly at this moment, were dependent upon the judge to keep the heat on. The judge is demanding that the government assigned a specific team that carries a responsibility. There really should be an action team now for every one of those children, a pair of employees of the federal government who have responsibility for a certain child, tracking them their parents, using every possible resource, using our fbi resources, using our international contacts, using our state department, advertising. They need to do everything possible. And this is just a message that the administration has never internalized. Theyve been doing the minimum time and time again, missing the deadlines, not mobilizing the
resources, kind of begrudgingly saying, well, we really wanted to separate these kids from these parents. Were being told we have to reunite them. Were just not going to make that much of an effort. It is amazing when you think about you had Secretary Kelly who at the time, before was Chief Of Staff of Homeland Security telling wolf blitzer more than a year ago it was that they were considering separating the children as a policy and that it would be a deterrent or potentially a deterrent, and even in all that time, it wasnt planned out enough, or that hhs just isnt up to the task, even though you had claims from officials saying oh, it would just take a couple of key stroengs a comput strokes on a computer to figure out where the kids are and exactly where the parents are. And realize that the entire premise of this program is completely flawed. The administration for publicity said this is catch and release, that people dont show up to their hearings. But the administration shut down the family Case Management program, and the inspector
generals report says 100 of the families and the family Case Management program showed up for their hearings. So the administration basically lied to the American Public, said people arent showing up for their hearings, so we have to do something dramatically different, that is to treat people as criminals, and they did share finally, after a year, after a year of launching the pilot project, they shared their real intention which was to deter people from seek asylum in the United States of america. So we cant forget kind of the dark and evil place that this came from, which was a deliberate decision by kelly, by steve miller, by the president , by Jeff Sessions to inflict harm on children in order to send a political message. Senator merkel, i appreciate your time. Thank you. Earlier this week cnns rene marsh reported that the tsa is considering a proposal to eliminate screenings at 150 small airports across the country. She is now learning its just
one of several cost saving measures up for debate. Here is her report. Reporter a senior tsa employee tells cnn the agency is looking at cuts that could save more than 300 million in 2020. Among those cuts, reducing the number of fulltime air marshals, reducing the workforce at tsa headquarters, and a 50 cut in reimbursements to state and local Law Enforcement agencies for use of their k9 units. This is an agency under pressure to reduce costs, does not have an animating people there where theyre going to do it, and is potentially exposing americans and traveling americans to risks that they do not need to be exposed to. Ladies and gentlemen, we are the police remain calm. Reporter air marshals are the last line of defense, armed agents aboard planes to prevent hijackings. Critics question its effectiveness, but the tsa has defended the program as a deterrent. Tsa did not respond to a request for comment. Earlier this week, cnn revealed the most controversial cut under consideration, eliminating screening at more than 150 small and some mediumsized airports. An idea that has already been widely panned by lawmakers, security experts, and airports. Since i as the airport dont want the take on either the liability nor the cost, and im quite certain the airlines dont want the take that on. So if tsa backs out, there is a void. And i dont know who would fill it. And rene joins me now. Is there any indication why these areas are the areas that the tsa is discussing cutting . Well, anderson, we do know that agencies discuss where they trim all the time, but honestly, The Big Question tonight that congress and likely the American Public is asking is what can explain why tsa is focused on these specific programs and whether these cuts are being considered because the threat and risk to aviation has changed or whether its just an indication that the agency is
under extreme pressure to cut costs. It really is unclear why they have highlighted these specific programs, because weve reached out on multiple occasions and the agency has not respond. Anderson . Rene marsh, thanks for the reporting. His lawyers advised against it. The president reportedly still wants to sit down with robert mueller. That decision could reportedly be coming soon. Well hear from two lawyers who know exactly what its like to question donald trump, next. Come away with me barnabas but i am a simple farmer. My life is here. [telephone ring] ahoyhoy. Alexander graham bell here. No, no, my number is one, you must want two two, i say
like my father before. [telephone ring] like my father before. Ahoyhoy as long as people talk too loudly on the phone, you can count on geico saving folks money. Fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. Now im gonna tell my momma that im a traveller im Gonna Follow The Sun now im gonna tell my momma that im a traveller im Gonna Follow The Sun transitionsâ„¢ light under controlâ„¢
was president in a case involving Eminent Domain back in the 1990s. Trump was claiming Eminent Domain to take possession of a an elderly widows home in Atlantic City so he could use it as a parking lot for his casinos limousines. Overall, how would you describe him during the deposition . Selfdeprecating is not donald. Donald was the donald that you see now, you know. He walks in. He wants to take over. He wants to make the deposition his deposition, even though its mine. He tries to control the questioning. Reporter zeitz says trump tried to come off confident, but that his emotions got the best of him. Thats when the insults started flying. Now he is calling me a third rate lawyer. I thought it was pretty good that he was saying that because it meant that finally after almost two hours, i had gotten to him. Reporter how would you describe his technique . We call it a nonresponsive answer. He will add things on, hell make selfserving statements, hell shuck and jive. If i asked donald a question, i said donald, what time is it . Hed probably tell me how to build a clock. He was grossly unprepared or he was just deliberately being evasive. What he was doing, at least in the deposition was saying that he delegates everything to everybody else. Reporter in fact, trump responded with i dont know more than a dozen times during the deposition, often saying ask my representatives and its called delegation. I have some very good people. The problem is trying to figure out are the answers a deliberate lie or are they a product of someone who is indifferent to the facts or indifferent to what is signed and therefore there was no intent. Reporter what surprised this lawyer most, though, was trumps bizarre request to go off the record moments before he fired
his own lawyer. In his 46 years practicing law, zeitz has never seen anyone do that. We go off the record, and then he wants to talk to me while his poor lawyer is sitting there like a potted plant. Reporter zeitz says trump wanted to make a deal and settle the case, but zeitz refused. And in the end, trump lost. Hes like, you know, an animal in the woods. Hes been through plenty of depositions. If you approach him in the normal way, hes going to pick up the scent. Hes going to understand hes got to be careful about what he says because hes no dummy. Reporter randi kaye, cnn, palm beach, florida. Neither the white house nor the Trump Organization have given us a comment on that story. With us now, another attorney who wants to depose the present, jason forge, one of the lead attorneys for the plaintiffs in the Trump University case. Thanks for being with us, jason. How would you describe the president during a deposition . Hes certainly not a novice at them. Hes given them really his whole adult life. Anderson, id say hes fully
engaged, completely uninhibited and frankly pretty fearless. Are those good qualities to have in a deposition . Well, for me as an adversary, those were wonderful qualities. I found it very easy to get the types of answers that we are hoping to get from his deposition and then some. If i was his attorney, it would be a nightmare. It didnt seem to you that i mean did it seem to you he had been coached or that he responds to coaching because thats certainly the impression of him is that, you know, hes not really going to be responding to a lot of coaching from his own attorneys in advance. Hes going to say what he wants to say. You know, he had a great lawyer. Dan petrocelli represented him, and hes done a number of highprofile cases. But i am very confident that mr. Trump is uncoachable, and theres no way that dan prepared mr. Trump to give some of the answers that he gave. But the fact of the matter is hes in charge whether its in a
deposition or in any other context, and no matter how highranking the lawyer is, no ones going to tell him how to answer a question. Weve certainly seen this in interviews, and ive heard you say that he really responds to flattery. He definitely responds to flattery. On the other hand, he does he will push you, and if you cower, hes not going to respect you. So you have to push back. But at the same time, a compliment to him goes a long way. It actually has an impact on him . It really does. Theres a clear difference in his responses, just in his demeanor. Once you start complimenting him, his guard goes down, and he is much more cooperative. The reporting that hes been pushing for a sitdown interview with mueller, do you think people underestimate how persuasive he can be under oath . I always found he can be charming and, you know, a pleasure to talk to, which people that dont even like him might be surprised about if they actually met him. Youre exactly right. In fact, i experienced two different versions of him. I deposed him once in december, and it was the first time we had met, and i think he was going through his normal routine of seeing how far he could push me. I then deposed him again in january, and in the meantime, he had realized, okay, im not going to bully this guy. Now im going to charm him. And he is extremely charming. Youre 100 right. He can be very charming. As far as being persuasive, i think hes a very formidable witness for a jury. I dont think hes going to persuade these prosecutors, but as far as presentation in front of a jury, hell be a very formidable witness. What do you think makes him formidable for a jury . I assume the same things that makes him formidable for voters. Whats your opinion . Well, number one is like you said, he is very polarizing. So there are some people who i
literally would play the same clip of a deposition for one group of folks who are politically inclined to agree with him and another group of folks who are disinclined to agree with him. And they would see the same exact testimony and come away with completely different reactions. But its almost like a Stockholm Syndrome with him. He can be a bully, but then when he goes from bullying you to complimenting you, the contrast is so stark, it does it is charming. He does that with reporters. I mean if people watched during interviews, hell often to say to a reporter, oh, your ratings are great or ive been watching what youre doing, things like that, which i assume is part of i mean he does watch a lot of tv and follows ratings and things like that. But its also part of his charm offensive. It is, and it drives me bananas to see this time and again that, you know, if people dont at least, you know, kiss
the ring a little bit, i think that they dont get as much nearly as much information from him. But on the other hand, if he does turn on the charm, its obviously important to keep in mind whatever objective you have, whether its in an interview or a deposition, its easy to become, you know, swept away when he starts turning on the charm because its such a stark contrast to the way he can be otherwise. Especially if you have a limited amount of time with him, that would be a real concern, obviously a real danger for the mueller prosecutors. Jason forge, fascinating to talk to you. Appreciate it. Thank you. Reminder, dont miss our daily interactive newscast on facebook called full circle. You can see at week nights at 6 25 eastern. Its a lot of stories we dont end up getting to get to on this broadcast. A lot more variety. Up next, theres Breaking News. New reporting on what appears to be a connection between an alleged russian spy and a former Trump Campaign adviser. Well be joined by the correspondent who has that story. Also Robert Muellers Team Interviews the woman once known as the manhattan madam. She has ties to longtime trump ally roger stone. The question is, is mueller trying to build a case against him, and is that why he wants to talk to her . Details ahead. How do you win at business . Stay at laquinta. Where were changing with contemporary makeovers. Then, use the ultimate power handshake, the upper hander with a double palm grab. Who has the upper hand now . Start winning today. Book now at lq. Com. So what do you guys want . Pistachio. Chocolate chip. Rocky road. I see Whats Going On here. Everybodys got different taste. Well, now verizon lets you mix and match your family unlimited plans so everybody gets the plan they want, without paying for things they dont. Jetsetting moms can videochat from europe. Movieobsessed teens can stream obscure cinema. Its like everyone gets their own flavor of unlimited. chuckles its a metaphor. Simile, not a metaphor. Hm. Well played. vo one family. Different unlimited plans. Starting at 40 per line. Switch now and get 300 off our best phones all on the network you deserve. A lot of paints say ordinthey can do the job,ver. But just one can behr through it all. Behr premium plus, a top rated interior paint at a great price. Family friendly, disaster proof. Find it exclusively at the home depot. Just for a shot. With Neulasta Onpro patients get their dayr back to be with family, or just to sleep in. Strong chemo can put you at risk of serious infection. In a key study neulasta reduced the risk of infection from 17 to 1 , a 94 decrease. Neulasta onpro is designed to deliver neulasta the day after chemo and is used by most patients today. Neulasta is for certain Cancer Patients receiving strong chemotherapy. Do not take neulasta if youre allergic to
it or Neupogen Filgrastim . An incomplete dose could increase infection risk. Ruptured spleen, sometimes fatal as well as serious Lung Problems allergic reactions, Kidney Injuries and Capillary Leak Syndrome have occurred. Report abdominal or shoulder tip pain, Trouble Breathing or allergic reactions to your doctor right away. In patients with sickle cell disorders, serious, sometimes fatal crises can occur. The most common side effect is bone and muscle ache. Ask your doctor about Neulasta Onpro. Pay no more than 25 per dose with copay card. The new united Explorer Card hooks me up. Getting more for getting away. Traveling lighter. Getting settled. Rewarded learn more at theexplorercard. Com
vimarsana.com © 2020. All Rights Reserved.