Transcripts For CNNW CNN Tonight With Don Lemon 20181218

This is cnn tonight. Im don lemon. The special Counsel Robert Mueller releasing a memo tonight full of details about then National Security adviser Michael Flynns interview with the fbi at the white house. That interview took place on january 24th of 2017 just days after President Trumps inaugurati inauguration. Flynn pleaded guilty to lying during that interview about his contacts with then Russian Ambassador sergei kislyak. It cost him his post as National Security adviser. And in a matter of hours he faces sentencing. The special Counsel Robert Mueller has recommended no prison time for flynn and thats because unlike his lies to the fbi he told the truth to muellers investigators. That includes meeting with prosecutors 19 times. Mueller also said flynns guilty plea a year ago encouraged others to cooperate. Michael flynn was not alone in having ties to russia. According to cnns count, at least 16 Trump Associates had contacts with russians during the campaign or transition. Todays memo shows us one more piece of that puzzle. We have a lot to discuss this hour. I want to bring in now Fareed Zakaria, the host of Fareed Zakaria gps. Good to see you. How are you . Hope you had a good weekend. Thank you for coming in. The sheer scope of the russian outreach and interference in americas election is breath taiking. Seems like they spared no outlet, no possible point of contact. They went all out. They went all out. And again, its important to point out this is not true of every country. This is not if you were to try to do a similar sweep on china you would not find anything like this. This seems to have been a pretty systematic effort with one campaign trying to get at the lets remember, they tried to get to the Campaign Manager. They tried to get the candidates son. They tried to get to the candidates chief National Security adviser. So they really were surrounding the people who were surrounding donald trump were all being lobbied pretty hard by the russians. And michael flynn, you know, when he talked to the fbi and lied to them, its unlikely that this was a slipup or a mistake or an error. Flynn was the former head of an intelligence agency, a huge intelligence agency, by the way, with a massive budget. Thousands of people working for him. He knows what it means to lie to federal agents about National Security issues. Hes a 33year veteran of the armed services. Hes a lieutenant general. And he was National Security adviser for trump effectively during the campaign and the transition. It is highly unlikely that he somehow accidentally forgot to tell this or he knew what he was doing. And apparently, hes come clean. Hes the last person to say this is how you conduct yourself around investigators. There were people on the trump circle about whom you could say that. They were naive, theyd come in from the business side, they may not have known. Not michael flynn. Michael flynn was a veteran of the National Security establishment. As i said, run one of the largest intelligence agencies. He knew about intelligence, about lying, about federal agents. When i talked about outlets as well, this is beyond the campaign. Lets talk about the american people. Right . And social media. Lets talk about the senates report on russian interference on social media. Details and stats as disclosed as discussed here. Researchers analyzed more than 10 million tweets, 116,000 instagram posts, 61,000 facebook posts, and 1,000 videos posted by the Internet Research agency, a russianlinked troll farm that was indicted by the Mueller Investigation earlier this year. Does that speak to how well planned this operation was . Thats a lot. 116,000 instagram posts, 61,000 facebook posts and then 1,000 videos. It speaks to the fact that the russians have had this capacity for a while. They got very good at it. Ukraine, then western europe and the united states. They seem to have been the early adopter, the lead player in this game of governments trying to do this. And its scary how effective they were able to be just with the breadth of activity you described. But the reason most americans on both sides of the aisle should be really alarmed by the Senate Report is it is absolutely clear that this is relatively easy to do today, that other countries are probably watching and have learned from the russians and that this can easily happen again. What russia did in 2016 china could do, iran could do, north korea could do. There are all kinds of it didnt take a lot. It took concerted government effort, some resources but all well within the scope of what a government can afford. And if were not worried about what the russians did in the past we should be worried about what they might do in the future, what the chinese might do, iranians this is now open season. They also played on our divisions as well in society. I just want to read a bit, you talked about it in your Washington Post oped, about political divisions in america and the west. And heres what you write. You say the fissure between relatively educated urbanites and less educated rural populations appears to have become the new dividing line in western politics. Outsiders feel ignored or looked down upon and feel deep resentment toward metropolitan elites. Its part class, part culture, but there is a large l economics to it as well. So how big of a role does race or culture play versus economics here . You know, in america particularly these things are, mied up. You cant entirely separate race and class and culture because partly through a history of government policy it has been possible to discriminate and segregate against blacks, for example, keeping them in getos. And so you know, its difficult to unpack. What i would say is this. If you look at the people who feel the most outrage, these are people who tend to be again, you were talking averages and big data. It tends to be on the older side, white men with less education who live outside cities. Because in a way their world has been upended. They lived in these small towns and they felt they have a lot of status, they had a steady job. And that world has gone away and that world has been replaced by the jobs have gone. That status has gone away with the rise of a much more diverse heterogeneous society. I think its difficult to say what part of it is going on. But what has happened is these two americas are growing further and further apart. And heres the scary part, don. These forces are working at overdrive. So there was a great report by brookings on since the recession of 08, 75 roughly of the economic employment gains since that in this last decade have gone to the 50 top cities in america. Now, to give you a perspective, you take all the cities in america, not just the 50 top cities, and they occupy 3 1 2 of the land mass of america. Whats happening is Economic Opportunities and activities being constant trauted in these small strips on the coast and a few cities in the center. And the people who are not there feel like they have just been left behind and they once had status and now theyre angry and resentful. And the russians youre right. The brilliant thing the russians did was play on those divisions and amp them up. Just as they continue to do, by the way. But thats where the populations are. The populations are in the city. 70 of americans now live in the city. But thats what has people so upset. You see resentment upon on the part of people who live in the city because they feel theyre being represented by a Smaller Group in the country. What is, it next year were going to have a senate that the majority represents a minority of americans in this country . Well, another way to put that statistic is 30 of america is now electing 70 of the senate. All those states with think of wyoming. It has roughly a Million People. It has two senators. California with 70 Million People has two senators as well. We have a kind of structural problem here where the land is being overrepresented. The people are being underrepresented. So both sides feel deeply wronged. So then how do you bridge that gap, so to speak . Because youre going to have a rural minority overlooking an urban majority and our lives dont really mirror each other at all. And theyre going further away. Look, this is one of those things where everybody wants to be an optimist, everybody wants to have a solution. Look at whats going on in france. Its the same people protesting. Look at who voted for brexit. Its the same people. More rural, less educated, older. And nobody has an answer lets be honest the next wave, dons going to be automation and artificial intelligence. You have 3 million Truck Drivers in america. Whats going to happen to them . But thats the point. And listen, i dont mean any i dont mean to disparage older rural people. But thats not the way the world is going. Thats not the way the world is moving. The world is not moving back to rural older america. And in a way i dont know what the answer is, but i think better to have an honest conversation about this rather than what trump has done is its a scam. Its snake oil salesmanship where he says all these jobs are going to come back, your status is going to come back, well make America Great again. Its a nostalgia tour. Its not real. The problem is actually the opposite. The jobs are moving faster than they were before. Yeah. Thank you, fareed. Dont miss Fareed Zakaria gps sundays at 10 00 a. M. And at 1 00 p. M. Our thanks to Fareed Zakaria again. Were learning a lot more tonight about the members of team trump who had contact with russia during the campaign. But is President Trumps real achilles heel his businesses . Spread a little love today spread a little love myy way spread a Little Something to remember philadelphia cream cheese. Made with fresh milk and real cream makes your recipes their holiday favourites. The holidays are made with philly. I felt i couldnt be at my best for my family. , their holiday favourites. In only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured and left those doubts behind. I faced reminders of my hep c every day. But in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured. Even hanging with friends i worried about my hep c. But in only 8 weeks with mavyret, i was cured. Mavyret is the only 8week cure for all common types of hep c. 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And it prevents streaks and hazing better than a micro fiber strip mop, giving you a thorough clean the first time. For a convenient clean, try Swiffer Wetjet with a money back guarantee. Brand power. Helping you buy better. The greatest wish of all. Is one that brings us together. The lincoln wish list event is here. Sign and drive off in a new lincoln with 0 down, 0 due at signing, and a complimentary first months payment. Only at your lincoln dealer. Robert muellers investigation into russias attack on the 2016 election is getting the most, most of the headlines. But President Trump is also facing questions about his businesses, and he has warned that would be crossing a red line. Right now the president is surrounded by investigations of his campaign, his transition team, and his administration. Plus the Trump Organization. The now shuttered trump foundation. And his inaugural committee as well. Lets discuss. Michael d antonio is here. Hes the author quf the the truth about trump. David cay johnston is here as well. Hes the author of its even worse than you think what the Trump Administration is doing to america. Its very positive, david. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. That was sarcasm, everyone. Good evening, gentlemen. Good to have you on. Michael, there are now so many questions into President Trump. You say that trump believed that the real estate business in new york was corrupt and deceptive and he acted accordingly. Explain. Right. He did believe it was and he did act accordingly. When Donald Trumps dad was coming up in the 30s and the 40s, it was a profoundly corrupt business. You had to pay off the unions. A lot of what you purchased had a big markup because you were also paying off people there. Politicians were greased. Donalds father actually went around and gave federal Housing Authority People Television sets and cash. So this was the way it was back then but it wasnt the way it was by the time donald got into it in the 1970s and 80s. It was starting to be cleaned up. The corruption in all of the big rust belt cities was being squeezed out of real estate development. But he assumed that this is what you do. So you didnt rent to black and hispanic applicants. You just committed fraud and denied them apartments. You when russians came calling with their cash to launder money through your apartment buildings, you sold to them even though you were supposed to do Due Diligence according to your lenders. So there was all kinds of fraud going on in the Trump Organization all the way back and all the way through till today. Wow. So david, the sdny is also looking into how the 107 million raised by trumps Inauguration Committee was spent. Where do you think that will lead . I think its going to lead at least in part right back to the trumps. I called on congress when we first found out about the first hint something was amiss here, the congressional the government accounting office, the investigative arm of congress should do an audit to find out where this money went. Remember that melania trumps interior designer friend who worked for five weeks was paid about 26 million. For what . This was a lowrent inaugural that raised more than twice as much money as the lavish inaugural in 2009 of barack obama. David, the most recent revelation over the weekend by Rudy Giuliani is that trump was still discussing trump tower moscow until november of 2016. He was talking about doing business with a country that was known to be interfering in our election at the time. Well, and a lot of that explains trumps solicitousness to Vladimir Putin and the kremlin to today. And the information we have is that they were discussing this at least through the period when trump knew he would get the republican nomination. It may well have gone on beyond that. Theres nothing that tells us it did not. And thats one of the many shoes from robert mueller, whos going to turn out to be a legal centipede, that im waiting to see drop. A legal centipede . Wait, wait, explain that. What do you mean . The old saying were waiting for the shoe to drop. And muellers got a lot of shoes to drop. All right. I thought thats what it was. But there you go. Okay. Thanks for explaining that. So michael, lets talk about adam schiff, the soon to be chairman of the house intel committee. He was asked on sunday about trumps red line. Listen to this. The president has wanted to draw a red line and say you cant look at my business. But if the president s business is trying to curry favor with the kremlin, we cant ignore that. And the president should not be in a position to say you cant investigate certain things, only other things that i dont care as much about. So thats what i mean. If mueller is not looking into this, and i dont know whether he is, someone needs to. Because otherwise were being derelict with our security. Is the president in for a rude awakening when democrats take over the house . Well, he is. And if they go back far enough, theyre going to discover amazing things. I mean, the number of russian mobsters who were investing in Trump Properties is stunning. There was a fellow who went into one of trumps buildings, actually bought the unit right below Kellyanne Conways unit. He invested in it, sold it a month later for a half milliondollar profit. A year after that he gets shot to death on the sidewalk in new york city. There is such a mess in this Trump Organization. There are so many frauds to be investigated, so many crimes to be investigated. In 2015 the trump taj mahal paid a 10 million fine for laundering money through the casino. This is 2015. And they had to confess to this practice going on for years. So i think congressman schiff is absolutely right. Theres a red line they should march across and deploy the troops in all directions. Wow. David, did you want to respond to that . I had a question for you here, but i know you wanted to respond. Well, i think michaels exactly right about that. And lets remember two important things about trump tower. Right underneath donalds triplex there was a fullblown gambling operation that ran for years run by russian gangsters until the fbi shut it down. And donald was what, what . Theres gambling going on in my building . And the other was when donalds close business associate for whom he did favors, the International Cocaine smuggler joe wexelbaum, got out of jail he didnt have money to pay his federal fine. I think it was 30,000. But somehow ended up living in a multimilliondollar trump tower apartment. There are just so many of these stories. The ones michael mentioned and the one i did and there are others that will lead to all sorts of corruption around trump involving money and money laundering. Yeah. We have seen i mean, earlier this year remember the Trump University thing. The Class Action Lawsuit from the Trump University. 25 million. 25 million. Right . So weve seen when its scrutinized in court there is an outcome thats not always good for trump. Well, this is the big problem with a man whos also called individual 1, is that so much of what he did was based on the assumption that ill never be investigat investigated, that im operating these 500 Different Private Companies all trading back and forth with each other. What about the entity that the trump family created that marked up renovations and supplies sold to trump buildings and then raised the rents based on those markedup rates of investment in these properties . And those rents are still high now years after they sold the building, tenants are still paying more than they should be paying in these buildings because of a fraud perpetrated by the trumps. A lot of shady stuff going on. Unbelievable. Thank you, gentlemen. I appreciate it. A newly unearthed interview could be pretty embarrassing for the president s acting chief of staff. Mick mulvaney was caught on tape during the 2016 Campaign Calling trump a terrible person. Hes not the only member of team trump who had some pretty terrible things to say about him before working for him. Voicecommand navigation with waze wifi Wireless Charging 104 cubic feet of cargo room and seating for 8. Now thats a sleigh. Ford expedition. Built for the holidays. And for a limited time, get zero percent financing plus twelve hundred and fifty dollars ford credit bonus cash on ford expedition. Allow you to take advantage of growth opportunities. Ford credit bonus cash with a level of protection in down markets. So you can be less concerned about your retirement savings. Talk with your advisor about shield annuities from Brighthouse Financial established by metlife. Theres no place likargh e im trying. Yippiekiyay. Mom. A terrible human being. Thats what Mick Mulvaney called then president ial candidate donald trump during the 2016 election. But now there could be no way Mick Mulvaney still thinks that because he is now the incoming acting chief of staff for President Trump. He must have changed his mind once trump was elected because hes been busy as a director of the White House Office of management and budget. So lets dissect the mulvaney 180. Heres what he said. This was back in 2016. Thats not the only time he criticized donald trump either. Days after the access Hollywood Tape came out mulvaney posted on facebook that trump is not a very good person. A spokeswoman for mulvaney says his comments are old news and he now both likes and respects the president. And now hes going to be acting chief of staff in the trump white house. But imagine stating on the record that someone is a terrible human being or disagreeing with what they stand for or objecting to their morals and then willingly working for that person. When it comes to donald trump, a few people besides Mick Mulvaney have done exactly that. Im going to start with rick perry. He once offered this blistering unfiltered attack on trump. He offers a barking carnival acting that can best be described as trumpism. A toxic mix of demagoguery and meanspiritedness and nonsense that will lead the Republican Party to perdition if pursued. Let no one be mistaken. Donald trumps candidacy is a cancer on conservatism and it must be clearly diagnosed, excised, and discarded. A cancer. A barking carnival act. Well, the cancer must have been cured because perry now works for trump as the secretary of energy. Remember . He couldnt even remember what the third one was in that debate. It was the secretary of energy. Now he runs the place. Lindsey graham, a then campaign rival of trump, laid out his take on the future president. Im not going to try to get into the mind of donald trump because i dont think theres a whole lot of space there. I think hes a kook. I think hes crazy. I think hes unfit for office. But once trump won Office Graham became a key senate ally and a vocal defender of trump. What concerns me about the American Press is this endless, endless attempt to label the guy as some kind of kook, not fit to be president. Senator graham . I think hes a kook. I had to do that. And senator ted cruz. He had this to say about trump when trump attacked his wife on twitter. Labeled him lying ted and insinuated with absolutely no proof that cruzs father had something to do with the assassination of jfk. Hes proud of being a serial philanderer, a narcissist at a level i dont think this countrys ever seen. This man is a pathological liar. He doesnt know the difference between truth and lies. Hmm. So tell us how you really feel, senator ted cruz. Fast forward to midterms in 2018. Ted cruz called in President Trump to campaign for him in texas. No hard feelings . Someone who once worked for ted cruz also made it very clear how she thought about Donald Trumps business practices. He says hes for the little guy, but hes actually built a lot of his businesses on the backs of the little guy. A lot of them through Eminent Domain or through not paying contractors aufr built something. Little guys have suffered. That was kellyanne conway. That was in early 2016. But later that same year she went on to become Campaign Manager for donald trump. Now she is a counselor to the president in the white house. So much for little guys. And then theres the one person who actually spoke out against trump while working for him and could still be working for him today. Of course we dont know who that Senior Administration official is because they penned an anonymous oped in the New York Times claiming the president is unfit for office. They said the root of the problem is the president s amorality. Anyone who works with him knows he is not moored to any discernible First Principles that guy his decisionmaking. This person said the president has nothing guiding him while he makes decisions in the oval office. And whoever it is, we may never know. Claims they stay in their job for the good of this country. Maybe some of these people have good reasons to support the president now. Or maybe they dont. I think people will think thrice when they go in that ballot box and say ive tried to send a message to the establishment but now ive got to get serious about sending somebody to the white house and do i want somebody who hurls insults or who goes and talks about philosophical differences . Clearly theres a lot to say about all of this. Dan pfeiffer, alice stewart, tara setmayer. Were going to dig into that next. The greatest wish of all. Is one that brings us together. The lincoln wish list event is here. Sign and drive off in a new lincoln with 0 down, 0 due at signing, and a complimentary first months payment. Only at your lincoln dealer. And a complimentary first months payment. And just like you, the further into winter we go, the heavier i get. And while your pants struggle to support the heavier you, your roof struggles to support the heavier me. [laughter] whoo. [crash] and your cutrate insurance might not pay for this. 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Understand the details and get approved in as few as 8 minutes by americas largest mortgage lender. So a lot of top officials in the Trump Administration and some of his allies on capitol hill did not always have flattering things to say about the president and they werent shy about expressing their negative feelings very publicly. Lets discuss now. Dan pfeiffer is here. Alice stewart. Terra s tara setmayer. Tara and alice were part of a lot of those panels. Tara, you were sitting with kellyanne. With kellyanne. And you were also on my show as well. You are a republican. You have stood firm with your characterization of this president. What do you make of all these folks changing their tunes now that they are working for the administration . I think theyre all cowards. Either they were lying then or theyre lying now. So i think that theyre probably theyve sold they made a decision to sell their souls in order to have access to power. And i find that to be terribly dishonest. And look at what its created. Look where its gotten us. Its destroying the Republican Party from the foundation. Its fundamentally changed so many aspects of what we were supposed to believe as conservatives. I mean, if you were an alien that came to this planet right now and saw what republicans were, youd be like what is this . These people have completely thrown out almost every principle that we stood on as conservatives. And you know what they said about him behind the scenes. Absolutely. And they do now. Correct. Except its different when the cameras roll. Go on. Specifically some folks that we saw in those clips, you know, ive had dinner with them where theyve disparaged donald trump up and down left and right and yet theyre sitting by him and some of his biggest proponents. Its despicable. This is were people hate politics. And the level dishonesty and just the hypocritical nature of it all has disgusted me. And i understand why so many of my other nevertrumpers have decided to leave the Republican Party. I get it. Because its unrecognizable now because of people like this. But somebody has to stand by and hold them accountable. So thats the only reason why i stay. Dan, what do you think . Alice, im going to let you speak. But alice is, by the way, not hypocritical. She wasnt always shes not. And ill explain why. But dan, go ahead and tell me what you think. Yeah, i think what taras exactly right. What everyone knows is that republicans and democrats actually in washington actually agree about trump. They think hes dangerously unfit for the job. Has basically a thirdgraders knowledge of how government works. But for some set of republicans trump is a useful idiot. He is someone that they can use to advance their agenda whether thats having him simply be an organism with an opposable them to sign tax cuts, somebody who can help some of these grifters enrich themselves, to push forward a nationalist agenda. And theyre using trump for Something Else. Everyone knows, anyone with two eyes and two years knows he should not have this job, but some people cannot say it because it serves their means, personal and otherwise, to have him there. Okay. I usually pose that in the form of a question because if i say the words that you said people would accuse me of calling the president names but im not. Its a figure of speech, useful idiot. Thats been my feeling all along. There are people who will just go along with him because the agendas getting done and hes doing all these crazy things, saying all these crazy things and the medias reporting about it but theyre getting it done behind our backs. Right . Or when the cameras arent on. So alice, again, im going to say this. And ill let you say your piece here. You have been honest about saying you dont always agree with everything the president does. Back in 2016 you appeared on cnn many times. You said the president s actions, his behavior, his conduct is unbecoming for someone running for president. And you supported him the whole time. You said the same thing then. You say the same thing now. Why support him now, though, when his conduct hasnt improved all that much . Ill admit, i thought he would grow into the office and he would jane his tune, but he certainly hasnt. And while he says some terrible things and he does some terrible things hes not a terrible person. And i think Hillary Clintons policies were terrible, and thats why i supported donald trump over her. I worked really hard. Tara worked really hard for republicans that would have stepped up and represented our policies and represented the country in a different way. But at the end of the day what we have is a republican candidate that is representative of the policies that i support and that i voted for. He has delivered on the Supreme Court. He has delivered on putting immigration in the forefront. While we havent accomplished much on that front, he has put that forward. He has reduced federal government regulations. He has worked really hard on improving the economy. He has worked hard on issues that i support. And he is making progress. And number one, the Supreme Court is something that was a huge issue for me and many other evangelicals that voted for him. And he is delivering on these promises that he made. Ive got to get to another thing before we run out of time. You mentioned the Supreme Court. This may go there. So real quickly, please, if you will, dan, on friday a federal judge in texas ruled the Affordable Care act was unconstitutional. Its going to be appealed of course but the president is crowing about it. What do you think . Should he be . Well, the same five justices who twice ruled that the Affordable Care act was constitutional are still on the Supreme Court. So its unclear what would have changed. And for republicans the idea that the conversation about health care is continuing into the 2020 election should be very alarming after what happened in the 2018 election where health care was the issue that delivered the house to the democrats. Yeah. Ive got 20 seconds left, tara. So do you think republicans should really be happy about this ruling and the president as well . Because democrats just won a whole lot of house seats running on the health care issue. Yeah, this ruling really has no teeth and it will probably get overtured in appeal. I actually know the judge who ruled on this. I worked with him when he worked for senator cornyn on capitol hill. But no. But theyre going to use this as a political victory lap just because. And just really quick to alice, you know, we could have had any sane republican and gotten the same results if not better. We didnt need donald trump to do this. Scl i knew that was coming. I couldnt let it go. With all due respect to my friend alice we didnt need donald trump to do this. He did win, though. Those things are not worth it. He won the primary. Yeah. And its not worth it. Ive got to run. Thank you all. Ill see you next time. I appreciate your time. Whats next for obamacare . Were going to talk about that next. vo you do more than grant wishes when you share the love. You give hope. Get a new subaru, like the all new forester, and charities like makeawish can receive two hundred and fifty dollars from subaru. vo get zero percent during the subaru share the love event. Little things can be a big deal. Thats why theres otezla. Otezla is not a cream. Its a pill that treats moderate to Severe Plaque Psoriasis differently. With otezla,75 clearer skin is achievable. Dont use if youre allergic to otezla. It may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. Otezla is associated with an increased risk of depression. Tell your doctor if you have a history of depression or suicidal thoughts, or if these feelings develop. Some people taking otezla reported weight loss. Your doctor should monitor your weight and may stop treatment. Upper respiratory tract infection and headache may occur. Tell your doctor about your medicines and if youre pregnant or planning to be. Otezla. Show more of you. This holiday season, families near you need your help. Visit redcross. Org now to donate. A federal judge in texas dealing with dealing a potentially devastating blow to the Affordable Care act. In a sweeping decision made in a case against obamacare brought by 20 republican attorneys general and governors the judge struck down the entire bill. The aca remains in effect while appeals play out. But whats next for obamacare . Earlier i talked with dr. Ezekiel emmanuel who was the White House Health policy adviser in the obama administration. I started by asking him what he makes of the judges ruling that because the individual mandate is unconstitutional the entire Affordable Care act is unconstitutional. No, its a very bad ruling. You know, the republicans took undermined the mandate by repealing the tax penalty of the mandate. So for the last year there hasnt been a tax penalty for it. And yet the rest of the aca has stood. According to law, if a part of the bill is severable, you can remove it, then you can say that part is unconstitutional but the rest of the bill can stand. Clearly the rest of the Affordable Care act is operating. We still have medicaid enrollment. We still have the cost troll and the exchanges by the way are working fine because of the subsidies. So lots of the aca is working fine without the mandate and the penalty, the tax penalty from the mandate. So the judge is just wrong about how essential the mandate is when he declared the whole bill unconstitutional. But there are those who say on appeal that this will be overturned, this judges ruling. Do you agree with that . Yes, i do think so. The i think the Appellate Court will see that the mandate and the tax penalty are not essential to every working part of the bill and they will say its severable and the mandate may not work but the rest of the bill can work. This is what a poll shows, a poll just last month showed that 65 supported protections for preexisting conditions. Is this a political problem do you think especially for republicans now . Oh, its a huge headache for republicans. Actually the poll i would quote, don, is the fact that recently 52 of republicans were for medicare for all. And that just shows you how much they have undermined peoples confidence in the Health Care System and that if they have a preexisting condition or one of their loved ones does, that theyll be able to get insurance at affordable prices. People are very worried and this doesnt enhance their confidence in the system, and on this issue on health care they clearly trust the democrats much more that they really genuinely care about their Health Care Insurance and will ensure they get protection and they get coverage. I think when you have 52 of republicans for medicare for all, it should tell you a very strong message how Important Health insurance is for the average american. And it should tell you where the momentum is shifting towars especially when it comes to health care. Absolutely. The president tweeted out he said this is great for america. Whats your reaction . Well, health care is very complicated and im not sure he understands it even yet. As simple as that. Yeah, i just i mean its not great for america. It undermines peoples protections. If we get rid of the exchanges theres no guarantee for people theyre going to be able to buy insurance without if they had preexisting conditions without suitable protections. This effort to bring down the exchanges in the Affordable Care act if it succeeded would actually undermine peoples ability to get insurance at an affordable rate. They understand that and they dont want it. And i think the president thinks repealing the aca is a good thing for americans, and they have told him loud and clear thats not true. And they told him in the midterms that hes just not reading their views very clearly. Yeah, or he just doesnt want to hear it. Listen, the former president , it wasnt officially named after him but republicans named it obamacare and it stuck. He said he on facebook he said republicans will never stop trying to undo the Affordable Care act. Does this ruling add to the uncertainty around aca, the Affordable Care act . It certainly adds to the uncertainty. I think those of us who follow this carefully this ruling is not going to stand. But if youre the average american and dont spend all day worrying about Health Care Like i do, it just 5adds to the uncertainty. And i think thats why the American Hospital association, nurses, even the Health Insurers have come out against this ruling. They are working within the framework of the Affordable Care act. They think its working reasonably well, and they want it to continue. And they dont want it upset every six months Something Else coming down the pipe to upset that framework. They need some certainty to plan their insurance products, to plan how theyre going to deliver care, to plan whether to expand or not expand. This doesnt help them, and therefore it doesnt help the american population. Im just wondering two things here, and ill put it one question. How should democrats respond to this . And also the wall street journal, the Editorial Board said theyre concerned that republicans are going to, you know, maybe get scared and do some sort of a deal that will actually end up shoring up the Affordable Care act or obamacare as its called. What do you say to that . Well, i think republicans are going to have to find an answer here. And if they are going to protect Peoples Insurance and protect people bhwho have preexisting conditions theyre going to have to come to some arrangement and i do think thats what the wall street journal is worried about, and you see republicans supporting medicare for all. You see the fact that this uncertainty is driving people to embrace something which they think is certain and will guarantee them Health Coverage come hell or highwater. And the more uncertainty created the more that pushes people to embrace Something Like medicare for all. So i think their worries are not misplaced. And if you could have a single judge who upsets the apple tart like this then republicans have sowed their own problems and theyre going to have to show that they can actually help solve this problem. Dr. Emmanuel, thank you so much. No problem. Thank you, don. Take care. Thank you so much for watching. Our coverage continues. Ould youe the power to do . Listening to people answer that question, is how we find out what matters most to them. For a business, its the power to grow. For an entrepreneur, its the power to innovate. And for a family, its the power to own a home. We stand with the ones who day in and day out put in the hard work to make things happen. For themselves, for their communities, and for the world we all share. We want to fuel their drive. And celebrate their accomplishments. That is what were here for. And above all else, its really what people want from us. The power to make a difference. I am brian moynihan. And i work for bank of america. Hey yeah . 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A very big night of Russia Developments including two new Senate Reports on how systematic russia interference in the 2016 election was, first on helping candidate trump and later President Trump. Which is new. So the this late piece