Good morning. Id like to call the subcommittee on Digital Congress and Consumer Protection to order. The chair now recognizes himself for five minutes for an opening statement. Again, good morning and welcome to the first hearing of the 115th congress for the Digital Congress and Consumer Protection subcommittee. It is a pleasure to be with you today. Before we get started i want to changer name burgess and vicechairman for the work they did inon the subcommittee and recognize the new vice chair, the gentleman from mississippi, glad to have you on board and working forward to advancing an agenda that creates jobs and puts consumers first. I want to recognize the gentle lady from illinois, our Ranking Member, we will be working with her this congress and looking forward to work in a bipartisan fashion to grow the economy and protect consumers. As chairman, i look forward to working with all the members of the subcommittee to continue exploring areas in the Digital Academy creating new opportunities for economic growth, job creation and consumer empowmt in america. I recently had an opportunity to visit the auto show in washington, d. C. The showroom floors were filled with vehicles equipped with innovative features and newly designed systems promised to enhance the safety and mobility of our drivers experiences and also impressed with the creativity and ingenuity of the Auto Industry that build vehi e vehicles we could only dream about a short time ago. The Technological Advancements are nothing short of amazing. Today, the subcommittee will focus on driverless evacuation and attempt to completely transform our Transportation System. We will hear what testing is happening and what needs to happen and the time frame for that deployment. In 2015, there are over 35,000 lives tragically lost on our nations highways. Over 1,000 of these fatalities were in my home state of ohio. Based on early estimates, traffic fatalities in 2016 are even going to be higher. Unfortunately, we also know human error counts for over 90 of all the traffic accidents. These are startling statistics, however the emergence of Automated Vehicle technology and growing investments into fully selfdriving vehicles promises to significantly reduce lives lost on roads by decreasing traffic accidents making our roadway saver for all users. As the Auto Industry works to make selfdriving vehicles a reality, adequately testing them before putting them out for commercial deployment and Consumer Confidence that they are safe. Each of these settings, vehicle engineers and professional test drivers go through detailed assessments and inspections of vehicles to ensure compliance with crash worthiness and standards. Vehicles fy a vehicles overall structural integrity. Cars are put through thousands of tests to insure once a vehicle is on a dealers lot, it is safe for consumers and families. Fully selfdriving vehicles are intended to operate without the input or control of human drivers. No longer will a manufacturer be able to rely on drivers to take corrective action or assistive failure or unplanned roadway activity. Flexibility will be important to certify Technology Empowering selfdriving vehicles. As we discuss selfdrives vehicles today and steps to commercial deployment ill look forward to learning from witnesses how automakers and other entities are testing these technologies for future employment and how to facilitate Innovation Development to Automated Vehicle technology in this country. Ohios Transportation Research recently announced a significant investment into a Smart Mobility advanced Research Tech center in east city, ohio and testing selfdriving evacuation across thousands of acres of road courses. We need to know how to ensure more states take positive steps for testing for ward and make sure testing doesnt become a roadblock to innovation. Road testing is important for the successful safe deployment of selfdriving evacuation. Testing not only will provide automakers with data for evacuation as safe as possible but help build Consumer Confidence in this technology which is central to realizing the future benefits of selfdriving evacuation. I thank the witnesses for taking the time to be with us today and i look forward to a thoughtful and engaging discussion. At this time, i have about a minute left, and is there anyone on our side that would like to claim the minute . The chair recognizes the vicechairman. Thank you for calling this hearing to build on the su subsmes understanding of dr e driving these cars. The innovation of selfdriving cars has ability to provide countless cars to our Transportation System and invaluable safety enhancements that could save thousands of lives every year. Of particular to me is the benefits selfdriving cars would provide to americans with disabilities including those with intellectual disabilitieses unable to obtain drivers license s and must rely on friends and relatives an sometimes uncertain modes of transportation to get about their daily lives including running errands or just getting to a job. In the disability world transportation is widely viewed as a top impediment to success and advancement in society. Selfdriving cars could offer the Disability Community a tremendous opportunity. Were looking forward to hearing more about this. With that, i yield back. The gentleman yields back and the chair recognizes the gentle lady from illinois for five minutes for an opening statement. Thank you so much. [ inaudible ] this is the first hearing of the newly Digital Congress and Consumer Protection committee. This is a subcommittee and i imiad glim i xwrad to see the name is where it belongs. It has important work the do on behalf of American Consumers and kicking off the congress with a hearing on auto safety, which comes as the number of deaths nationwide is increasing and Consumer Product safety. We need to recall effectiveness and safety issues before products are sold. Meanwhile newlings to poses challenges for cybersecurity and personal privacy. This subcommittee impacts everyday lives and we need to be watchdogs ensuring innovation occurs to the benefit of American Consumers. Chairman, i know we will be able to Work Together in a bipartisan way over the course of the congress. I also want to take a brief moment to welcome the new Democrat Members on this committee. [ inaudible ] and our members from the last congress of joe kennedy and [ inaudible ] im very excited to work with all of you and the rest of our subcommittee colleagues. Todays hearing continues our discussion of selfdriving cars where we left off in november. Selfdriving cars have the potential to greatly reduce the number of accidents caused by human error. However, we added testing and oversight to insure human error is not replacing vehicle error. I share the out to manufacturers optimism about the longterm promise of Autonomous Vehicles. Today, i want to focus on how we get there. While testing is necessary before we can confidently put consumers in selfdriving cars and what is that testing. The Just Trust Us approach simply doesnt work for passenger vehicles. Not after the industrys failure that weve seen from takata airbags to others, the longterm drivability depends on manufacturers and government working cooperatively to share data and promote safety. As we figure out testing we need to figure out the specifics how many waivers are necessary for the coming years and how specific those waivers should be. We need to decide what safety tests or standards are necessary. We need to determine how states and the federal government can best Work Together to insure safe roads. I want to apologize that i have to step out for a moment, as i told the chairman, i also have a Budget Committee meeting this morning. I hope to be back later to ask questions of our witnesses. I want to thank those that i met before this hearing for their time and their information. I want to thank you all for being here today. I now yield the remaining time to congresswoman matsui. Thank you very much, congresswoman for giving me time. The thomas evacuation have incredible potential to change so much more than just cars. This Technology Gives us a way to think about mobility. It has potential to expand access to seniors, americans with disabilities and so much many more who may not be able to drive today. This Technology Allows us to rethink urban landscapes and public space wes may no longer need for parking spaces. Perhaps most importantly, it promises safety benefits for american families. All of this innovation will rely upon connectivity placing new demands on our roads and high y highways and spectrum and infrastructure that powers wi wireless communications. We need a framework that insures we are building a connected future of the 21st century economy. Driverless cars will have an impact to both our local econ y economies, communities and global competitiveness. As we consider this landscape there is an Important Role for state and federal regulators and Technology Companies and manufacturers and congress to play in deploying this future. I look forward to working with all of you in this exciting area and yield back the balance of my time. The gentle lady yields back. Right now, i dont believe the chairman of the full committee is here. I will pass at this time and the chair will recognize for five minutes the chairman from new jersey, Ranking Member of the full committee. Thank you. I want to start by congratula congratulating you on this newly named subcommittee to watch out for the little guy and very pleased that the words Consumer Protection once again appear in the committees name. Selfdriving cars is our obligation and i read something i think can sum up where we are, a decade ago selfdriving cars were a matter of debate, today, theyre an inevitability. Since we know theyre coming to the marketplace. Im pleased instead of talking about the potential benefits achieved in the out years we will get in the weeds a bit and i look forward to hearing where we are today as to testing and what needs to be done to establish these cars are reliable and safe. As i said in november, we need these vehicles to be safe not just when all cars on the road are autonomous but also in the decadeses of transition time when they share the road with human drivers. I look forward to hearing how innovators are using testing, modeling, analytics and tools that these vehicles are safe and can interact with other common obstacles on our roads such as bicyc bicyclist, pedestrians and wed covered snow and past. And how cybersecurities are in place to defend against hackers. Autonomous driving like many of the latest technologies have been created in this krg by hard working men and women, many are immigrants who bring amazing skills to our workforce. We are a nation of immigrants and any effort to put up road blocks there will put up road blocks to be ahead on the technology curve. As many as 47 of American Workers vulnerable to computerization we need way to help find new opportunities through education and training. Thank you again. I yield the remainder of my time to representative dingle. Oops, shes not here. Shes right here. How can i miss you with that beautiful dress . Okay. Im just going to talk loud. No ones ever said i didnt have a big mouth. Thank you for yielding, Ranking Member pallone. Theres never been a more exc e exciting time to be in the Auto Industry. Its a an honor to be a member of this community, too. The midwest is here. Hey, you know, its technology. Were trying to stay at the forefront of innovation technology. Theres never been a more exc e exciting time to be in the Auto Industry. Automated vehicles are not just something you read about in a Science Fiction novel, in reality, theyre are here and helping transform mobility and the transportation of people and goods. Transportations no longer the accurate word. Mobility is. In 2015, 35,092 people died on the road in this country. This would be a Public Health epidemic if it was in any other industry. Automated vehicles will help us save lives as many of my previous colleagues have noted since 94 of accidents are acontributedable to human error and an issue of international competiti competitiveness. They will be delivered globally whether we like it or not. I think its critical we take the lead in these potentially life saving advances or well lose our critical edge in this spacen my home state of michigan is leading the way in this area. Proud the americans for mobility in widow run will test certification in Automated Vehicles and just designated as automotive proving ground by d. O. T. Michigan, in a very bipartisan way, mr. Upton and the governor and others are dedicating resources to Automated Vehicles. Im happy to support it and that being said, safety has to be our top priority here. Nobody wants to let unsafe technologies on the road. We also dont want to prevent vehicle s that improve safety from reaching consumers eats. Im looking forward to working with the committee and stakeholders strike the balance to making sure innovation and consumers are kept safe. I yield back the remainder of my time. The gentle lady yields back. When the chairman arrives he will be given an opportunity to give his Opening Statements. We now conclude with the Opening Statements and the chair would like to remind members pursuant to Committee Rules all members Opening Statements will be made part of the record. We want to thank all of our witnesses for being with us today and taking the time to testify before the sub committee. Todays witnesses will have the opportunity to give Opening Statements followed by a round of questions for the members. Our witness panels for todays hearings will include mike ableson, the Vice President of global strategy of General Motors, mr. Anders karrberg, dr. Kalra, senior Information Science and codirector at the center for decisionmaking under uncertainty. Mr. Gill pratt, executive Technical Advisor and ceo at Toyota Research institute and mr. Joseph apaku, the Vice President of Public Policy at lyft. We appreciate yall being here today and when we begin the round of questions, well start with mr. Ableson and you will be recognized for five minutes and we appreciate you being with us today. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Good morning. My name is mike ableson, im the Vice President of global strategy for General Motors. I want to thank the members and subcommittee members for invi inviting me to tell you more about General Motors vision for transportation coming in mobility and opportunity selfdriving vehicles hold for the future safety of the American Public. If i could, though, id first like to relate a personal story that has struck close to the heart of myself and General Motors colleagues. This past september, one of our colleagues, steve kiefer, suffered an incredible tragedy. His son was returning to college after spendsing a weekend at home when he was struck and killed by a distracted driver. Watching steve and his family go through this terrible avoidable loss has just increased the determination of all those that know steve to make this Technology Available as soon as its ready so we can avoid these loss es in the future. Unfortunately, steve its not alone. 10 of vehicle fatalities and 18 of injuries and crashes are due to distracted driving. More than 30 of fatalities involve a drunk driver. 28 of fatalities are speed related. Vehicle crashes continue to be the leading cause for death in adults and children. Selfdriving cars wont drive while impaired by drugs and alcohol. They wont be distracted by a cell phone. They wont drive drowsy or recklessly and their speed will always be appropriate to the conditions at hand. For years automakers committed our resources to resources when crashes happen. We have the opportunity to avoid crashes all together. Not only are we committed to building safe and reliable selfdriving vehicles, we also believe selfdriving vehicles will provide tremendous benefits to society in terms of convenience and quality of life. Such vehicles will provide unprecedented access to transportation to those who need it most, like people with disabilities, those in underserved neighborhoods with limited access to Public Transportation and the elderly. General motors is incredibly optimistic about the future of mobility. Automakers are faced with a tremendous opportunity to create a new model for personal transportation that changes the way society thinks about the automobile and we are rising to the challenge. In june of last year, gm began test driving on public roads in scottsdale, arizona, the very challenging urban center of San Francisco and in december we announced we would begin testing in metro, detroit. We have more than 50 selfdri selfdriving vehicles testing in these three cities today with more planned in the near future. We announced gm will announce the next generation of selftest driving vehicles in michigan at our plan. The vehicles produced there will allow us to accelerate the te testing and validation of this exciting new Safety Technology. Expansion of our real world selfdriving program will allow us to do so through carefully provided boundaries and driving proje projects. The safety of our consumers is our drivine ining principles an developing technology to uphold the standard is our top priority. We have a person behind the wheel to monitor performance. The safety gathered from these test vehicles will provide data to prove our vehicles are ready to operate without a human driver. Current federal Motor VehicleSafety Standards have served the motoring public well for years. As technologies evolve, standards which take years to develop have lagged behind. Current currently, they do not contemplate vehicles without human drivers. Without changes to those regulations, it may be years before todays technology can be realized and thousands of deaths could have been prevented. At the same time, we have to prove to the American Public that our vehicles are safe. Nhtsa has already began testing the selfdriving vehicles employment. It is impirtive manufacturers have the ability to test these vehicles in greater numbers to gather the safety data. It will be critical to deploy large scale deployment of selfdriving vehicles. One way to accomplish this goal is grant the secretary of Transportation Authority to grand specific exemptions for highly Automated Vehicle development. This authority would be similar to that currently provided under existing law. During this hearing alone, another eight people will have died on u. S. Roads. Eight more families that have to experience the painful loss our colleague and friend, steve, did. This is far too great of a cost to our nation and our citizens and we are within reach of a solution. We look forward to working with the committee to help create the right policy framework to bring this leaf saving technology to our roads as quickly and safely as possible. While we have more to learn, our selfdriving bolt evs are getting smarter each week and were anxious for the public to experience the Technology First hands. Let me be very clear. Our priority is and always will be the safety of our passengers and fellow road users. Thank you for time today and i look forward to answering any questions the committee might have. Thank you for your testimony and the chair recognizes for five minutes, mr. Karrberg. Thank you. Chairman latta and congresswoman dingle. Im Vice President of volvo car group. We sold 81,000 cars here last year. Together with our dealers we employ about 10,000 people with 300 direct employees in new jersey. Negotiate year, we will open our First American factory in south carolina. This will add up to 4,000 jobs in the years there after. Our factory will be the first all new american car factory in 10 years. Safety this is founding principle of volvo cars. We invented the threepoint safety belt. We waived the patent so the safety belts could save millions of lives. Our vision i that no one should be killed or seriously injured in a new volvo by 2020. Therefore, we are very very excited about the benefits of selfdriving cars will bring. Roads will be safer. Its been said many times but cannot be overstated. Over 94 of all crashes are due to human error. Selfdriving cars will be important to reduce crashes. Also, selfdriving cars will free up idle time for the driver to do something more productive while being in the car. Our vision is to every year give back one week of quality time to volvo commuters by 2025. Going forward there are very important preconditions. Technology must be safe. Consumers must trust it. The proper National Framework must be in place. These preconditions are fundamental. When we bring this technology to market. The first selfdriving volvo will be an x 90 suv. It will be offered in the u. S. , europe and china in 2021. The cars will be able to operate unsupervised at level 4 during normal traffic conditions on designated commuter roads only. Our approach is not to provide unsupervised driving anywhere any time. Instead, we start with less complicated conditions, where consumer benefits are the highest. There after, stepbystep, we open up for more complex traffic as technology matures. We develop these cars, we take a comprehensive approach. Ground work engineering is based on our extensive experience from active safety and driver support systems. We Design Systems critical for safety with redundancies. We perform virtual testing based on data from historical crashes. We will start behavioral testing with up to 100 customers on railroads this year in sweden and plan folks tend those to london an china and cooperate with un ber in engineering the hardware. Uber. Our intention is to test ourselves in the u. S. But the patchwork of regulations is a concern. In just the last two months, at least 50 new bills have been introduced in 20 states. This started to become a problem already in 2015. We publicly called for federal guidelines. Last year we got the federal Automated Vehicle policy, a very positive initiative, even if it needs several improvements. What could congress do . First, to accelerate Traffic Safety improvements, crash avoidance technologies should be rated in n cap. The u. S. Is woefully behind, other markets already done this. Active safety assistants in driving cars and take partial control when cars risk a crash and help build Consumer Confidence in unsupervised dr e driving. Second, congress should encourage nhtsa to update with an explicit request that the states refrain from legislating and regulating selfdriving cars. Third, congress should consider incentives for states to adopt the model state policy in the fabp, as is. A patchwork will delay making roads safer in america. Its also a competitive disadvantage. This is a race for jobs. Discussing loss and regulations with pollutionpollution poli and u. S. And china. Six years ago i put you as a leader. Seeing the patchwork, im not so sure. Thank you for your time. Thank you for your testimony and the chair recognizes for five minutes, dr. Kalra. Thank you. Congressman and distinguished members of the sub committee. Thank you for the opportunity to testifying on the safety of Autonomous Vehicles. For those that dont know, rand is a nonprofit organization. My spouse is the cofounder of a Silicon Valley startup working on Autonomous Vehicles though his testimony has no bearing on my testimony. Public crashes poses a crisis in the United States and Autonomous Vehicles help with this crisis. We want them as safe as possible as quickly as possible. They probably wont eliminate all crashes and may introduce new safety risks particularly in the newnew near term. I want to discuss new challenges and then ill propose solutions. The first challenge is there isnt yet a practical way to prove Autonomous Vehicles are safe before theyre allowed on the road for consumer usen the second challenge is theres no consensus how safe they should be before theyre allowed on the roads. We neither know what tests Autonomous Vehicles should have to take or a passing grade. Solving this is urgent because real World Driving experience is crucial for proving autonomous safety. This presents a third risk. Learning in real world settings presents risks from other ado adopters from which late ado adopters would benefit. Its like allowing teenage drivers on the road. They may not be safe drivers yet but need good experience to become safe drivers in the meantime they pose risks to theirselves and others we try to limit with age restrictions and permit restrictions and we may need that for autonomous vehi e vehicles in their teenage years. Ill make three recommendation, i first recommend we rapidly develop practical methods of testing their safety. These methods can be done by industry, researchers and econom economics, federal regulators academi academics. Wherever they come from they need to be vetted, rigorously, objectively and independently. Its not enough for testing methods to exist. Secondly i recommend an adaptable framework that recommends what level of safety performance Autonomous Vehicles needs to meet before being on the roads. A lower level of safety white be okay for demonstration projects in some environment but a higher level may be needed for uncontrolled environments. As for teenage drivers it should balance the need for real World Driving experience and the need to protect the public from undue risk and it should be revised as it evolves. It would likely fall under nhtsas jurisdiction and under industry and the state and federal lawmakers and public. The state already released rules for Autonomous Vehicle but they dont specify testing requirements or develop such a fraimt work and not proposing guidelines at this time. Regulatory framework im proposing will take time and strategy pilot studies and data can help. Pilot studies could start with Real World Testing in controlled conditions like operating in well maintained areas and climates and expand as safety is demonstrated. Risks can be lowered by desi designing and operating vehicles if a crash does occur, risks are lowered by limiting vehicle speed or ensuring all passengers buckle up. As for data sharing the develo Developers Already use the experience of a single vehicle in their fleet to improve the entire performance in the fleet. This could go faster if it is shared across the industry for technology. Theres certainly not trivial concerns about trade secrets and insuring the right data is shared and truly useful. These concerns should be addressed and could be for the balance of safe autonomous dr e driving. To conclude we cant predict the safety of this or impact on American Transportation safety. We can shape that with well designed policies. I want to thank you for the opportunity to testify today. Thank you for allowing me to appear before you and i look forward to your questions. Thank you for your testimony today and the chair now recognizes for five minutes, dr. Pratt. Chairman and congresswoman and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. My name is gill pratt, the ceo of the Toyota Research institute. Before working for toyota, i was a Program Manager in the area of robotics at darpa, the u. S. Defense advancement projects agency. Tri focuses on Artificial Intelligence and related technologies formed in january, 2016, with a five year 1 billion commitment from toyota. Tri is located wholly within the United States with its headquarters in palo alto, california and additional teams in ann arbor, michigan and cambridge, massachusetts. Tri is intensely focused on the development of autonomous vehic vehicles, currently pursuing two paths to autonomy, a system called guardian and an estimate called chauffeur. Under guardian, the Autonomous Technology operates in the background and constantly monitoring the environment st stepping in only when a collision is imminent. Under chauffeur, it takes over the task from the mu man driver. Were currently testing both guardian and chauffeur. Because they have the potential to save lives our hope is to deploy these systems as soon as possible but only once we know they can be deployed safely and responsibly. Society tolerates a circuit amount of human error on our roads. We are after all only human. But it shows nearly zero tolerance caused by deaths in flaws in machines. The question is how safe is safe enough for this Autonomous Technology to be deployed. As we sit here today, it is not clear how this measure will be devised or by whom. Before we can deploy the technology, policymakers, such as yourselves, will need to answer this foundational question. Policymakers must also keep in mind testing is a necessary means to an end. The goal is to develop a vehicle that can save lives and improve the efficiency of our roads. We cannot reach that goal unless we test our technology in real world environments including on public roads. Testing is what will allow us to determine when our Technology Achieves a sufficient level of performance and is ready for deployment. One of the most significant challenges we face this is patchwork of policy initiatives at the state level. Many of the other witnesses referred to the same thing. Under a patchwork of inconsistent state laws, Autonomous Technology may meet performance requirements in one state and not another state. Such a situation will impede the ability of a developer to test the same system across multiple states slowing the development and deployment of the technology. Policymakers should work to promote in advance a single National Framework with appropriate safeguards. We believe the federal Automated Vehicle policy that was released by nhtsa was an important step incrementing federal leadership in this area, however, we also believe there are several areas that should be addressed before the policy ills fully impleme implemented. This includes clarifying in the favp itself that it . Sa does not intend for states to regulate vehicle performance, reconsidering the applicability of a safety assess document the testing of autonomous prototype vehicles by traditional automakers and the need to submit a new assessment for each significant update to a prototype. The reason for that last comment is we develop these systems very quickly and it will create tremendous red tape to submit that assessment every single time a change is made. There has also been growing discuss of need for data sharing. We support the goals of data sharing but also believe theres a significant amount of work to be done to ensure it does not create paradoxical incentives to avoid difficult test conditions which would worsen safety, not improve safety. We look forward to working with other stakeholders to determine how to share data in the most practical and effective manner. Before closing, i would like to provide a couple of additional observati observations. First, with regard to test, the truth is that millions of physical test driven miles are necessary but they are probably not sufficient to achieve the reliability that we need for Autonomous Vehicle technology, particularly if those test driven miles are through easy or predictable routes. All testing miles are not created equal and developers should be focused on testing scenarios where driving is challenging or exceedingly difficult. We believe with computer simulation, billions of test miles are needed to accelerate and expand the range of testing of these systems and these simulated miles, if theyre valid, should be an acceptable equivalent to real world te testing. Finally, its important that the federal government begin looking beyond testing to the deployment of these systems, this includes updating the federal motor Safety Standards to address a hand follow of stands inconsistent with or compatible to Autonomous Technology. I thank you very much for your time and look forward to working with you to advance this technology and most of all, i look forward to taking your questions. Thank you very much for your testimony today. The compare now recognizes for five minutes, mr. Opaku for five minutes and thank you for being here today. Thank you, chairman latta and Vice President dingle. Im the vicechairman of lyft. Lyft was the first to establish peertopeer ride sharing and currently the fastest ride sh e sharing company in the United States. It connects nearly 18 Million People per month for safe rides in over 250 communities across the country. Lyft was founded with the mission of improving lives by offering the worlds best transportation. In less than five years we have proven to be a powerful driver of positive change with respect to economic empowmt, enhancing efficiency of Public Transportation and connecting communities previously underserved by Transportation Options. The proof is in the data. Since our launch in 2012, lyft has worked to reduce traffic and congestion, reduce increase Mobility Options and reduce duis and provide opportunities to our drivers. This is only the beginning. Autonomous vehicles hold potential to improve the quality of life of our users but also save lives by increasing decreasing severity of automobile accidents. The safety benefits of Autonomous Vehicles should be affordable and available to all members of the mcregardless of income, disability or visibility. And the Ride Sharing Network will fundamentally transform cities and the way people move around them. The convergence of ride sharing provides lyft with a tool to provide a Transportation Network that will greatly reduce the need and demand for car ownership and significantly expand Transportation Options particularly for sections that have limited access due to age, infirmity or disability. As vehicle ownership rates decline and consumers continue to engage with the lyft platform we will see fewer cars on the road, less congestion and increased positive impacts. A world with fewer cars provides a tremendous opportunity to reorient, reimagine and redesign our urban fabric. Cities in the not too distant future could be built around people instead of cars and should and could be defined by communities and connections not pavement and parking spots. They could and should include common spaces where culture can thrive and new ideas can be shared in the very places where cars previously stood parked and empty. Lyft stands at the center of this coming transportation revolution as we believe the transition to an autonomous future will occur not only through individually owned cars but more practical and appealing to rely on Autonomous Vehicles when theyre part of a Ride Sharing Network fleet. To this end, it is our goal to operate a pilot in a major city this year that will permit consumers to enjoy for the very first time a lift in an Autonomous Vehicles. There are serious challenges to bringing them to market for mass consumption. The greatest potential obstacle is regulations. The greatest risk as some of the members have already stated on this panel is inconsistent patchwork of state, local, municipal and county laws that will hamper efforts to bring the technology to market. It is well on its way to becoming reality. Since the beginning of the year, over 20 states have filed 60 bills to regulate the testing and deployment of avs. While most bills are wellintentioned, it is our position states should not rush to regulate this technology. Its our view if a state does choose to take legislative or regulatory action with respect to Autonomous Vehicles, it should be to moving impediments and creating a pro competitive and Technology Neutral playing field. In order to facilitate the continued innovation testing and development of avs by all industry participants, i would urge congress to examine two potential avenues for action, first is the authority to allow for a greater number of Autonomous Vehicles to be on the road for testing and deployment purposes and the second is to have nhtsa begin a rule making process to update bms standards and deployment and introduction into commerce of avs at a commercial scale. Lyft looks forward to working with the members of this committee to insure avs can be deployed and tested safely in communities across the country. The potential ability they offer to save thousands of live and reduce traffic and reduce congestion and reorient our communities for the better around people not cars is an achievable nearterm reality. With a collective effort we can all insure this potential is rea reached. Thank you again for the opportunity to testify today and im happy to answer any questions you might have. Thank you for your testimony today. We appreciate it. That will conclude the Opening Statements from the witnesses and the chair will recognize himself for five minutes to begin questioning of our witnesses. We appreciate you being here. Mr. Ableson, if i could start my questions with you, could you discuss gms timeline for dep y deploying selfdriving cars . Pull that mike right up there. We currently have deployed in three cities vehicles that are operating at a level 4 automation with drivers in them. We are collecting data on how the vehicles operate. When we have convinced ourselves that the vehicles are operating properly and are at a level that would inspire confidence in the technology, we will then make those vehicles available for members of the public to experience with drivers. At that point, we will continue to collect data on a wider scale. Only when we have collected enough data to convince ourselves were truly ready to go driverle lesless will we the remove the drivers from the vehicles and let them operate as selfdriving vehicles. Let me follow up. Cybersecurity is a huge out there, across what we deal with in this subcommittee and across the congress today. Can you tell me, or go into detail how youre looking at insuring against Cyber Threats . I can. Cybersecurity is an issue General Motors takes very seriously. We had the Onstar Service for 20 years and we are not new to the connected vehicle space. Specifically around cyb cybersecurity, we were also the first out to maker to appoint a chief cybersecurity officer who reports to the ceo and board of direct directors. We were also a Founding Member of the auto isac, an Industry Committee to share best pract e practices and learning on cybersecurity. Jeff max imilla is our chief cybersecurity officer and also the vicechairman of the auto isac. Its an area weve been very active in. Weve worked with companies from other industries, the defense industry, and neurospace industry to make sure we have the most current learnings, not just in the out to space, but in industrial spaces, wherever they are. Thank you. Mr. Pratt. In toyotas comments on nhtsa on the federal Automated Vehicles policy, toyota mentioned they would be deploying the systems in a stepbystep manner as the technology matures and becomes available. Would you walk us through what that stepbystep process looks like and how long you think it would take for that technology to mature to a point it might be ready to be deployed . Sure. Id be glad to. First of all, we have a number of Automated Vehicle technolo technologies already in our cars today. These include the Toyota Safety sense system and lexus safety sense system. In particular, automated emergency braking is one of these types of guardian system i spoke about before where the autonomy intervenes when the human is driving in order to prevent an accident. Thats already happening now and we believe were saving many lives as a result of doing so. As you desire to have the human being take less and less control of driving and have the autonomy take up more control, you ascend up the sae levels you may know about. Know about. Our plan is to be selftimed in this regard. We dont have a specific date to remove the driver from the car, but rather reare going to test and see when the system is save to do so. They dont happen all the of the time it happens at beginning some of the times. Certain weather, traffic conditions. At beginning with the human supervising and in the end where you dont need human beings. A step by step process of grad wallyry moving the driver with the goal that no supervision is necessary but checking each stage that the system is safe enough. A large part has been about safety. How does this impact with volvo before it puts a selfdriving car on the street before testing and deployment . Safety is our prior to throughout Development Process for the cars. We are targeting 2021 for this. In order to make the safety to come at right point we are co doing a number of different approaches. First of all, well engage into computer simulations. We have accidented that have happened in the past with auto cars. We combine them with u. S. , data from germany so that would be 250,000 traffic accidents. We will put it in the computer to how to avoid this. You have to test this in public roads to learn about the behavior on how customers react to this. We will step by step this drivers more and more advanced technology so we plan to be ared by 2021. Thank you, very much. My time has expired. The chair recognizes the gentleman from the new jersey for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. We have heard concern about the period before cars are fully autonomous the driver doesnt need to be active all the time. Even if the driver is in front of the steering while, if the car is dog most of the work we know its hard for the driver to stay engaged. Someone suggested we can say up dik tick with vehicles to reengage. Volvo said it would skip automation and go from level three to level four. Is it due to the fears i just mentioned. At level three the car is doing the driving but the driver is the fall back so you could end up in situations where the driver has to take back the control that could happen within seconds. We are concerned about the level three stage within sa and therefore we are targeting level four as the end game. Doctor kalra did you want to comment on that . I agree. Theres evidence to suggest level three show increase in level three, so it is plausible for auto makers to skip level three. But it does safety concerns that a lot of recognizing and tried to avoid. Volvo said it will take complete liability at level four can you explain that decision . It is really not that strange. Car makers should take liability for any system in the car. So we have declared that if theres a malfunction to the system when operating autonomously we will take liability. Researchers and investigators remotely drivers are shown losing control, so i want to ask how real is the threat of vehicle hacking especially in the autonomous context. Do you expect the nature of the threat to evolve as the technology develops . Also i think you kind of did you talk about this at all yet, no . Would you respond to that, dr. Kalra. Sure. It is a real threat. Transportation receives a lot of attack from hacking because its a way to disrupt Transportation System. Theres a great concern. Cybersecurity is not to be string wrapped. Its not only hacking for fun and profit but Autonomous Vehicles provided avenue for terrorist because theres a way to use the vehicles to the threat is no longer suicide bomber we have vehicles that can drive around. We dont want to over state it but we need to think about cyber threat as terrorists opportunity as well. I agree because of the cybersecurity threat, we need to design the vehicle with that threat in mind. In our case as we deploy the selfdriving chevy volt, they look like the one we sale to retail but we have begun through changes to ensure cybersecurity in those vehicles. Go ahead. I wanted to add to that too. Toyota connected is subsidiary of our company thats focused on this. Toyota is the chair of auto i sack before for share information. I think its important that as serious to understand as serious as this threat is theres mitigation we can employ. First of all, to make sure that the Safety Technology on the car does not depend on Wireless Network to operate. All the of the seventy function haves to be selfsufficient on the car itself. The Wireless Network improved to efficiency of the car. I agree with the speakers. I want to add approach you have to take encompass supplies and dealers. Thank you, mr. Chairman. The chairman recognizes Vice President , the gentleman from mississippi from five minutes. Thank you for being here. This is remarkable. Mr. Abelson, i have too technical question, lets say you have your driver out of the selfdriving car, it is selfdriving and im driving along and i honk my horn, will it do any good . We have not reached that point of deciding how and whether it would be appropriate for vehicles to react and can i could have to ask the technical folks. Theres scenarios on whats going to happen and whether a car with car driver comes awe cross a selfdriving car without a driver and they realize it will freak some people out. How they deal with that would be fun part in this process. Absolutely. This is so nice. We have a special son but he dependent on us for his ride. So the possibilities are so good in the Disability Community particularly those like my son with a intellectual disability. He social individual but limited in many ways to what he can do. So what this opens up for whether running errands or bookstore or getting too and from to work. As you look at that can you elaborate on the work gm is doing to provided this access in the future. You have discussed it. We have. I agree with you its an exciting opportunity for some of the communities. While we recognize potential benefits theres a lot of work that needs to be done. Inside of general mottors we have Employee Research group that are working with our Engineering Group for potential selfdriving vehicles Going Forward. We look toward to engage internally with our employees and with external groups on how to realize this potential for those communities. Thank you for that work. Dr. Pratt. Can you comment on your company is considering the needs of the Disability Community in the development and deployment of selfdriving cars . Yes. Our president decided to change the companys policy on autonomous as a result of meeting with a blind person. The company decided to change its policy. I want to add one more part. We cannot forget about ageing society. 13 of our population is over age 65. Because of the baby boom that franks will grow from 13 to 20 . This is extraordinary things. My sister and i had to take away the keys from my father because he is too elderly to drive. Our goal is to make that not have to happen in the future. Thank you, very much. Mr. Can you answer what volvo is doing for those with disabilities. We recognize every sunday i meet my father who turned 100 years and he ask when can have this car. We are targeting commuting. Thats great. Mr. Owe pakpaku. One of the initial challenges was that not every one had a smartphone but we recently adopted that process so you dont have to have smartphone to request a lyft. We have heard from the community how rideshare increased their life. In terms of the potential to have that same impact with the ability to bring avs to market to address this issue in a broad and sweeping way. Lyft and ridesharing play a role in sharing that by those who most critically need it. Thank you for. I yield back. The gentleman yields back him time. The Ranking Member from illinois. So even though were some time away from fully selfdriving cars on the road, but manufacturers are developed some exciting Safety Technology right now from blind spot detention to rare seat notification. I want to focus on the discrete technologies. Last year, 39 children died from heat strokes in cars had is tragedy accidents. I heard stories from parent who will never be able to forgive themselves. Last year, representative ryan king and i introduced hot cars to warn drivers that a passenger may be left behind. So mr. Abelson. What is gm doing to prevent child heat deaths . These are tragic circumstance and gm has nouned we are implementing 2017, 2018 model remind you when rare door is open on the vehicle and the ignition is turned off, chime souped sound and message is put up reminding driver to check the rear seat. This has been effective system to implement and one i say is already in production on many models. Dr. Pratt and mr. Karrberg, are your Companies Working on technology to prevent child heat death . First of all, Consumer Education is important. However, what we have recently introduced is emotion sensor. It can sense if a child or animal moves. Its a first step and ill be happy to provide protocol later on how they are to protect our children. The problem the baby is sleeping so theres no movement. Dr. Pratt. I run the research lab, i done know that particular details of the implementation, i can speak to what we are doing research on. We are working on inside occupants in the car. Theres Research Technology, i done dont know when it will fields, that can amp pli, i would be glad to get you information on when were planning to field test anything. I appreciate all the manufacturers to look at that. Automatic emergency breaking is another technology emergency. You said automatic emergency breaking is standard in almost every model toyota model this year. How long would get to 100 . Im not sure. So i dont know the answer but i would be glad to get it to you. Mr. Abelson and mr. Karrberg what are your companys time line for automatic breaking . At gm we agreed with the volunteer rollout, we are working to execute that. I dont know the exact date, but i would be happy to get back and send you the details. Mr. Karrberg. We emergency breaking since 2013. On our large platform, it is system that breaks for cyclist, large animals day and night. I have questions about various technologies, but i point i want to make is that obviously, some of these are available and one manufacturer not available and another manufacture sometimes optional, sometimes standard. It seems to me if it would be great to harmize the safety features that they are standard. Im not saying it has to be exactly the same technology but the same goal at end of the day so that we do develop the safety features. And i yield back. Thank you. Five minutes for the gentleman from new jersey. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Good morning to distinguished panel. Mr. Karrberg once the systems are automatic driving are ready for use by the american people, how should manufactures provide instructions and education about proper use and limitation of the systems or vehicles . That is clearly a priority thats why we start to introduce these vehicles supervised levels this year to 100 kusers to learn how they interact with the cars. We design the cars accordingly. Would that require further testing of the public . Would i have to go back to the state of new jersey and be tested further in this regard . We will do tests of how people behave in different areas so in sweden and plan to move on to london and china and hopefully in u. S. Well. To learn how different types of drivers zi drivers interact with the cars. Mr. Abelson. In gm we entend to roll out in ridesharing need. In ridesharing. Yes, similar to lyft fleet. One of the advance is it gives you without having to buy or own the Autonomous Vehicle. Whether you book the ride to provide the information they need on the Autonomous Vehicle. When do you estimate this may be in use in gms vehicles . As i said we are doing testing on public roads. The exact dated depends on how quickly the data can be gathered. We have to as i said that were ready before we go driverless. To the distinguished panel do you believe that these automobiles will be used on all of our roads or will they first be used on limited access highway system for example or other similar roads . Dr. Pratt. Let me add on to the last question with regard to driver education, i think education is key. Some of the issues are having to do with much trust the driver puts in the system not to undertrust or over trust the auto thats there. Whether or not changes to the requirement for license we done know. Well learn. Also keep in mind we need to educate the public in term of how they sbefinteract with the. So we think thats important as well. I was taught driver ed in gym class, but the year i was taught is a National Security secret. I would like to address your questions about will they expand to all roads. I believe overtime, you will see them used on all roads. We are starting with urban environments. New jersey is most densely populated in the nation. This is interesting because of the conguest that existed in this densely populated state in the country. Yes, dr. Pratt. I grew up in springfield, new jersey. Glad to meet you. Wonderful place. Its important to realize that the ability of Autonomous Car to go anywhere at any time is level five. And we as an industry it could be sometime before we get to level five. I believe it or not there are places in the world that are worse than new jersey and so i think that well hit new jersey before we handle the whole world. Its going to be in stage with the easier stages coming first. Before i yield by time, you did not grow up in my congressional district. I yield back my time, mr. Chairman. The chair recognizes the lady from michigan. Thank you, mr. Chairman. As i mentioned, its critical to ensure that automatic vehicles are safe before they are available to consumer and we need to ensure theres no barriers to prevent i want to be clear here, we should never let an unsafe or unproven vehicle hit the road. So that our challenges as congress is how to strike the right balance between supporting innovation and making sure the consumers are save safe. I know all colleagues want to get the record here on some things. So i have few questions for the members of the panel. I would ask you to answer yes or no. Yes, or no. Do you agree that federal motorcycles safety standard need to be updated in order to support automatic vehicles. Yes we do. Yes. Yes. Yes. My understanding that rule making will tame several years. That rule making were to commence today it will not be completed the time many in the industry have nouned you want to deploy auto mated vehicles; is that correct . Yes. Yes. Yes. Im not sure. The reason im not sure, i whoo hope that nifta could speed up if they could, yes. Yes. I understand nitsa have authority to exempt vehicle based on factors but this exception is limited. Yes absolutely. Yes. Maybe its more complicated than a number of vehicles right now. Theres no reason to believe that that limit is going to be lit and equally important is on what basis they will be granted given that most of the time when you request it, the vehicles are save or safer and theres no way to show that. That is it equal concerns with a number of vehicles. We have same concerns at previous witness. The answer is yes. The development and expansion of the ridesharing industry in 2012 there were a few thousand rides completed and millions show demand for this so i would say its whole hearted yes. We have had good discussion with proactive thing that the federal government should be doing here. In your opinion are there specific Things Congress should avoid doing that would stifle the development of automatic vehicles. We wouldnt want to see the government taking steps to specify specific solution. Keep in mind the goal is to prove the vehicles are safety. The nit sa guidelines are they specify what the expectation are before vehicle is deployed in driverless fashion. You have a minute and nine seconds. We could not Like Congress to engage because it would stifle development. Also, we i agree with the gentleman from gm its clear that technology is important. Limitations when it comes to technology that should be done by industry. Technology neutrality is important so is design to keep up. In terms of what she shouldnt do, im not sure. I would agree with all the witness before that evidence based approach is the best one where the government sets what the criteria are and thats done at the federal level but does not dictate what the ways are to complete that level of performance. I agree with the rest of the panel. Theres concern about precluding or restricting potential innovation to make that technology safer. Im out of time. Thank you. The gentleman ladys time has expired. The gentleman from kentucky for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I have figured it out with driverless car cans, everyone drives the speed limit, nobody blocks the left lane. If youre going to turn left and the incoming traffic using up the yellow, youre in the park way coming from the airport lined up to get on 395 and somebody forces themselves because they dont want to wait in line, nobody does it here im sure. My question is does the does selfdriving cars have to be perfect to have them on the highway and how do we get to it point where we are safe fluff to have them on the high wie. Theres no way to prove something is perfect. We have to agree on the metrics. I think thats why this testing in real world is important because youll see the real Life Conditions we deal with on a y daily basis. What is your level of vehicles are safe, for example, what about level three cars . I would like to comment on the traffic conditions you described here. Thats not where we go initially. Those are complicated conditions. We are targeting consumer roads. So the next question was comment on level three scars, what you do consider safe. At level three, the car is doing the monitoring, however the driver is still the fallback. The driver may have to be able to take back control in short time. Thats far less safe where the level four car should be able to put the car in save control unless driver takes over the control. Should be able to predict that can be done in a safe manner. I know i think youre talking mr. Karrberg is people commuting every day because the car is taking care of that issue. But your guy is picking people up and dropping them off at capitol hill. How do you see that happening in that environment. Lets look at it from the network. How to manage thousands of cars transporting people around and making sure they are doing so in efficient manner. Is a car going to heading if your direction efficiency of that nature. Number one, thats one of the expertise we can bring to the aav revolution knowing how the vehicle can get passenger where they are going. Reduction in congest home state would you like to comment on how safe does it have to be to be safe . We have thinking about this deeply. We feel there may need to be a safety factor multiplying human fo performance. If a Autonomous Car is lightly it could have hamm happened to us. When a machine makes a less our empathy is less. We would like is to work collaboratively to figure out what the answer is. We worry it may not be one that the public will accept if there was a 35,000 fatalities ayear because of the human. Would the public accept 499 because of a machine, the answer would be no. So we have no factors need to be there. I yield back time. Thank you, the chair recognizes the chair lady from california. Many of you have expressed concern for potential patchwork different state standard for vehicle codes. California has been a leader in trying to develop a framework for this technology. I understand the need for the laws to be flexible. Ask you encourage enno nation. I would be concerned about undermine safety and accountability standard which would harm the driving public by Consumer Confidence in your products and services. I think we can agree we need some rules of the road. Can each of you provide your perspective on where regulation may be needed at the state and federal level. I would say gm we recognize if a patchwork were to develop on the Technology Sides of the issue that auwould be an issue r the industry, we have seen states pass like michigan did recently. With nits sa we recognize the state and the government have a role Going Forward and we look forward to working with the government on all levels in rolling out the technology. The way approach that nits sa has taking with the automatic vehicle policy, its flexible, its not perfect but i think thats the way forward. I think federal regulations are needed to set tested methods and what threshold are needed. Until those are in place, states are in in the interim for those federal regulation it would be important for the federal government to provide support in developing relevantinglation that are not contradikry and pave the way for the federal regulation and the policy put forth last year take a step towards that. To be clear, we totally support rigorous standard of this. But we think it should be one standard. I want to give an example of what could be wrong and it coming from california where we have a lab. In kcalifornia theres a requirement that you report to the government what you are disconnection right is every time the car has failure of a certain kinds. Thats not sufficient a bad idea. But that information becomes available. It creates perverse intensive and for companies to make the figure look good because the public is watching and that causes the company to not try to test difficult case but test easy case to make the score look good. I think it should be deep thought about this issue before the rules are made and we think concentrating that before the federal government is the best idea. Thank you for the question. If can i touch patchwork of state legislation quickly, there is something we have experience in this. Over the last three or four years, we have seeing cities next to each other, implementing ordinances. It was real situation we were facing for years. Thats been resolved. The concern that the member of this panel are expressing is a real one that one we experienced recently. To the heart of the question, i agree with the gentlemen, that some of the proposed regulation we are seeing, we are seeing proposals that infridge upon federal government in regulating standard thats dangerous. If if i were going to encourage state focus on anything, it would be focusing on making sure they were not enfridging upon that which is the province of the federal government. I understand what youre talking about, i believe the test sha should be test bed for innovation. Other than what you said, are there any specific concerns about californias testing regulations . I live where the governor lives it would be nice to have this information. From my perspective the reporting i heard that. I dont reporting in california would encourage companies to do easier testing. We are testing in a difficult environment. Making the data public any way. Im not aware of the details of the california but it has honerous reporting. I think i have heard from you. Thank you, very much. Thank you, very much. The lady times expired. The gentleman from west virginia. Thank you. As one this is intriguing process. Im fascinated with that. One of them is since i have learned that we were going to have this hearing, i tried to do more reediading about this. I have not seen Third Party Certification for butting Public Safety first overriding come come pettive come pettive. Im not aware in theres any requirement for third party. Okay. The second are there going to be global standard because i heard mention in europe and china would are we going to adopt standard that are comparable is that on the way to sell america and china avs over there. I would have to say our experience overtime is we dont get global standard that the regulating bodies send to move in similar but different details directions. One thing i have not heard is im a little concerned about lack of global standard is cost. No one has mentioned cost up here. What is the projected additional cost per vehicle that could be i guess you could answer it depends on whether you go to level 2, 3 or 4. I understand that. What are some costs projections that were facing. Is the overall goal that it would be universal or it would be an option that i as a buyer can choose not to have auto mated. Dr. Pratt. The cost is high. Tens of thousands of dollars. Part of the reason you are seeing push to see rideshare because you can advertise cost override share vehicle. The incredible rate in decreasing cost of scale. Think about the cell phone which rifle some of the best cameras you can professional use in the past now costs pennies to put in the cell phone. We do not know the number but we are confident that the numbers will decrease. Do you see this its going to be universal or is this going to be option for your car . It will start as option and eventually 15 years out it some functions will be standard. It will be standard in. Yes. The last because i heard some very interesting arguments, very heart wretching. Is the automobile through this autonomous process put us into an Entitlement Program or is that something thats privilege to be able to have a car . Thats one of the reasons why lyft is intrigue about Autonomous Vehicle because we believe the only way it could be equitably provided to all society is to be presented on rideshare. Thats sound like entitlement. Im in the very short time i have left, im curious, you have been talking from 30,000 people. I dont understand someone going to get in the car theys go to level four or five and they program something to take me to destination x and you get there and sit back and enjoy. Is that thats basically the goal. As we said it will take a long time before it gets everywhere for everyone. Will be able to interact with the car as you see that visually as youre driving down you get a phone call or email pick up milken milk. Will you be able to tell your machine to pull into that absolutely. It may know the closest way to get there and suggest a destination for you. That would be fascinating. Getting the cost down so that it is affordable for more people and not just a comment on cost. It would be expensive but come down in cost in the years later. You save on fender bender and the economy is going to be improved. Fuel efficiency, i know from engineering perspective, Cruise Control use more gas than otherwise. The fundamental to im questioning whether or not this is going to be fuel efficiency. It may save lives. Thats one of the reason were rolling out the technology. I have gone overtime. I apologize. Yield back. Gentlemans time has expired. The gentleman from texas for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. A lot of us heard about selfdriving cars. My wife is the one because she complains about my driving. But i guess we would not have to use way to find out to get close closest milk. What used to be Science Fiction is fast approaching reality. Thats for the 50 years we have seen so many different changes. While the Technology Benefits society like any new Ground Breaking devise. I look forward to talking about this. Dr. Karrberg, you talked about the many approaches of testing the vehicle, that real World Driving experience may be the most important tools for improving vehicles. The sharing of data can improve overall safety based on the knowledge accumulated by the car. You mentioned that tests call it fleet learning. Can you tell us what fleet learning is what it can play in the role of improving Autonomous Vehicle safety. The idea of fleet learning, what is fundamental to Autonomous Vehicles, computers are design today learn betser ways of performing without being programmed to do so. They have data and use learning alga rhythm to improve performance. The more data the better performance and faster it can improve. Companies like tesla are using this so entire fleet can be upgrade the. The question is whether that limited o that kind of learning is limited to individual developers or whether theres opportunities learning across developers. I believe that kind of data needs to be thought through carefully. You compare risk of the early Autonomous Vehicle they may not be good drivers, but they will develop in good drivers. I would submit with distracting driving we could all be 15 or 16 year olds for driving, we have limited restrictions on teenager drivesers you see similar what do you imagine some of the restrictions would look like whether it it comes to selfdriving cars . It doesnt need to be requirements, but mean of the things that my colleagues have described, for example, limiting to commuter road or low speed. Reduce likelihood that the crash occurs. Owe reducing the consequences of a crash these are be industry developed ideas and choices or it may be something down the line that is done through regulation to say these are the ways in we are going to start rolling out. Reducing risk, is an important step. In your mind what does the air bag regulation teach us about regulation for Autonomous Vehicles. It may not be effective and may take a long time to correct things. If anything air bag regulation tells us this is extremely complicated and difficult to get right but its important. Air bags were developed in the 1950s. They were first introduced in the 70s. It took a long time. One can argue that some mistakes weres made along the way. Air bags were not smart. Air bags we have today can detect unmaled message. That was learned through experience and deployment of the Technology Available at the time. Theres this conflict Getting Technology on the road and learning ways in which it is not safe. We need proceed carefully and thoughtfully. Mr. Chairman, with my one option left r i yield back my time. The gentlemans time expired. The chair recognizes the florida for five minutes. Mr. Pratt, we heard a lot about vehicle to vehicle communication to in previous hearings on this subject of Autonomous Vehicles. Where does the work you are doing to v to v doe deploying sever driving cars. Vehicle to vehicle as well infrastructure are important to Autonomous Vehicles. We drive Autonomous Vehicles use sensors on the vehicle and neighboring vehicles to see better. Vehicle to vehicle communication can give you egive lens of xray vision. Its hard to make a vehicle that is safe in all conditions, thats this level five vehicle we keep talking about, and standard are high its a machine thats going to be running this not a human being. Our ability to empathize and forgive will be low. We have to give ourselves every tool in the tool chest to be i think saving the spectrum for that use is important. Thank you, very much. Mr. Okpaku, the problem safety benefits of safe driving cars are significant. We have already talked about the potential benefits in the Disability Community which could allow to the Elderly Community p as well, especially in our community and i represent tampa bay area in the state of florida. There are many elderly to benefit from this technology, maybe they want to get to their medical poirmt appointment, i can see a lot of benefits there. In lyft view what are benefits we can see for the deployment of selfdriving cars . We talk about the benefit that lyft in a ridesharing platform for driving, one of the things gets lost is how important transportation is for upwa upwa upwa upwa upward mobility for passenger side. We have seen impact we have on the campus her side just by providing option that didnt exist. If you buy that concept and apply it across the scale the av platform provides, its significant and help a lot of people who are in Economic Needs get to and from their job. I would echo what you mentioned nonemergency medical inspection, we see them do expand once you includes automatic driving into mix. Mr. Karrberg its been suggested that welcome show federal leadership, it may conta contain guidance that has unintended consequences of can you come men on that and how the am by ambiguity, should be involved. Reporting on Software Changes that you do in course of the testing. Thats difficult because in engineering you deal with direction all the time and you report every one of those thats practicely impossible. Theres a waiting period for you hand in your change theres a fourmonth waiting period. It calls for third party version, preapprovals, we are certification, its worked for 30 years, we see no reason to change that. We also think that for the vp nit sa should staffing and av develop so nit sa will not be a part of the delays. I know my time has expired. I will make it short. We agree with what the last witness said. Thank you. I yield back. The gentleman yield back. The laid from california. We talked about the need to prevent a state by state patchwork of laws for Autonomous Vehicles. While i appreciate mrs. Matsuis concerns about california regulation. I think we need to consider the impact on the state regulation. I have seen my state california and its over regulation of the i saw it up close and i seen thousand of productive business flee for most friendly states. When uber moved its testing arizona after california took i can think a few states that would benefit from this technology considering its promise congestion and ability to move products from west point. At thank you very much for the question. I can give you the local regulation to impact testing. As of right now in california there is only one allowed location or theres a proposal that would make limiting to testing to one part of california. If it were to pass the ability to test in different environments and different situations would be hampered we have seen enough proposed legislation all across the country, whether it is in massachusetts all the way from california that does raise that exact concern that if inacted it would inhibit the ability to deploy. Thank you very much. I yield back the balance of my time. The chair now recognizes the gentleman from pennsylvania for five minutes. Thank you to all of you who have testified here. I have spent a fair amount of time reading up on this. I feel that your testimony, which i have had the time to read through really lays out the issues that are in front of us as policymakers in a very thoughtful way so we can go about facilitating this technology with you to the publics benefit. Each of you, i think, lay out what the various Public Benefits from this. I think each of you also lay out a little bit differently but nevertheless the central question here as being are we erecting or are there regulatory barriers or is the regulatory frame work facilitative for your technology to be tested so that we can expedite increasing safety, carbon emissions, etcetera, etcetera they should be focused on the driver. Are you aware between states that facilitate testing across state lines . Thats the first question. I think thats important too. As some of the testimony has reflected you need to test this technology in a lot of different topographical climate and urban rural circumstances in order to know how effective it could be. If not, if you have not engaged is it something that would be he helpful to the technology. We have one in california, one in michigan, one in massachusetts. We do most of our testing in michigan. The reason we do that is because of different regulatory environments in three states. It is any sort of reciprocity. We work to make sure to do a lot of testing. So far we have not had an issue in conducting the testing in those three locations. It could be related to the data sharing, doubleedged sword that was part of the analysis. It could be things related to those issues. It is important there be a low overhead way of making changes. My time is up. Thank you very much. The gentleman yields back and no further members asking to question the witnesses. Im sorry. Would you let me ask one absolutely. Thank you. Am i correct that General Motors as sertd fied preowned when they have open recalls . All of them have been updated for all appropriate recalls. Is that also true for your company . I could not comment on that. I dont know the answer. I would like to admit that. And i myself dont know since im the head of the research lab. And some sort of statement but have open recalls are permitted for resale. So i would like to hear from that. Thank you so much. Thank you very much. No further members asking im sorry. Can i just ask unanimous consent to put it in the record of this hearing . Thank you very much. Well submit that for consent. Again, thanks very much for witnesses today. You can see from the folks that were here in the audience today. Its a topic thats on everybodys mind and seeing where the technology is going, safety factors and making sure father or mother folks are heard. It is a topic people are looking forward to especially in the next few years. A letter from the insurance companies. Letter from the National Council and disability. A letter from ford motor company. A letter from global auto makers. A letter from epic. A letter from competitive carriers association. Letter from safe. The rules are numbers they have ten Business Days and i ask the witness to submit their response in ten days. Thank you for our witnesses. Wednesday a hearing on efforts to end Human Trafficking and modern slavery. Ashton kutcher cofounder to fight Sexual Exploitation is among the witnesses appearing before the Senate Foreign relations committee. Thats live at 10 00 a. M. Eastern here on cspan3. A signature feature of book tv is our coverage of book fairs across the country. Nonfiction and viewer segments. Saturday book tv will be live beginning at 9 00 eastern from savannah, georgia. Featured authors include author of who needs the fed. A low country heart. Terry mcdonald, William Dougherty talks about his book. Jerry willis in other book on rich is not a four letter word. Well also be taking your calls with featured authors throughout the day. Be sure to follow and tweet us at book tv on twitter. Join us for the tenth anniversary on book tv. Cspan, where history unfolds 1979 cspan create bid Television Companies and brought to you by your cable or satellite provider. Israeli Prime MinisterBenjamin Netanyahu will meet. Next, a discussion on the future of u. S. Relations and a preview of the meeting. It was hosted by the washington