Transcripts For CSPAN3 Military Officials Explain Reasons Behind Pilot Shortage 20170329

The available pool of candidates. With the problem being of United States efforts with the deficit at the point of over 1,000 total pilots. We are here to hear on the on services on their plan. We know we cannot buy our way out of the problem since the military does not compete with the potential salary and some cases of the lifestyle of commercial airlines. We must make sure services are using all lever of all control. The to incentivize these pilots and discuss the way forward to stop the flow of military pilots. I look for waward to hearing fr the witnesses to understand the retention problem and to assess the proposed resolutions for the services and increasing retention. Before i introduce our panel, let me offer an opportunity to make opening remarks chairman, thank you and thank you to our witnesses who are here today. The Arm Service Committee have been receiving quite a bit of testimony over the last few monthst on the issue of readiness. There is some debate on the readiness crisis. The shortage of military pilots does, of course, have a direct impact on readiness. It is been along the same vein to throw more money at the problem in the form of cash Retention Bonuses. Without addressing the route causes, this will do little to stem the departure of valuable experienced military pilots. As witnesses and several members of the subcommittee are well aware, our Service Members are not in it for the money. Military pilot serves for the love of country and the love of flying. There are many reasons besides money that military pilots leave the service for the private sector including family concerns and a desire for more stability too few flying hours and too many assigning task unrelated to fly. Today, i am interested to hearing how each of the services working to identify the root causes and how you use that analysis and authorities that congress provided to better target non monetary incentives as well as monetary in order to increa increase retention. I am interested to hear joint initiatives of what you maybe taking under. It costs millions of dollars to produce a single single aviator. Thank you, and i look forward to your testimony. Thank you, miss speire, well give heeeach member to present their testimony. We remind the witnesses to summarize and the high point of your written testimony in five minutes or less. Statements will be made part of the hearing record. Let me welcome our panel. Lieutenant general lakist and deputy chief of staff form man and power personnel. United states army and director Army Aviation. With that, general brilakis. Thank you, chairman coffman. Our pilots like all marines have answered all the nations call faithfully serving the American People and maintaining first class standard of excellence. Today, we need critical support to combat operations. Operational commencement and tempo and challenging deployment dwelled ratios. We are experiencing a shortage trained aviators. This is in large part exacerbated by our Current Issues of aircrafts. Addressing this issue is one of mind. Aviation readiness in the form of ready basic aircraft and resource to operate them is the single most important factor in alleviating our manpower challenges and contributing to retention. Our responsibility to train and retain the best aviators is imperative for us. And doing so for the aviation field is particularly important due to the time and expense required to train these marines. Well close limon to the trend of our aviators and take action should we see retention problem so that your core remains the most ready. Thank you for the opportunity to present this testimony. Thank you. Thank you for this opportunity to discuss this status of naval retention. I am honored to represent the men and women. Aviation today is strong of the Maritime Air Force in the world and our deploy unit is ready to response to any challenge. We maintain operate and train with approximately 3700 aircraft in support a worldwide carry base to include combat operations. On any given day, two or five of our nine carrier air wings are deployed. We are prepared to deploy and our ability to sustain the effort depends on a number of factors among the most critical of our people. I am here to outline the current risk and what we must do to sustain peak combat readiness. Our able to attract our young men and women our nation have to offer is central to maintaining readiness. A number of factor making this challenge increasingly complex of low unemployment and increasing opportunities for employment in the private sector of the commercial Airline Industry. Additionally aviators have expressed dissatisfaction of Quality Service. Inhibited timely team of tactile qualifications. Those who wear the cloth of this nation do not do so of the money but rather to be part of something bigger than themselves. We have been able to positively influence retention behavior by providing a fair compensation package but more importantly we provide an enticement a few other employees can offer, call to service. The allure of service deminute issue deminute today, aviation depot struggles the get our airplanes maintenance on time. Such challenges are further exacerbated by low stats of critical parts and aging shore infrastructure while our first team on deploy is always ready and our bench and the depth of our forces at home is growing increasingly frustrated and operational tempo on certain deployment schedule and administrative burdens and life issues for families including late permanent changing stations and Housing Options especially in non fleet concentration areas to stay in the navy. Restoring short term readiness will require predictable funding which will allow our pilots flying the hours needed to maintain optimal efficiency. It would enable the navy to restore parts and returning to aircraft operational status and better prepare them to remain deploy as it requires. It will allow our pilots to do what they want to do is to fly. Well continue to pursue resolution through uses of resources and refinements of plans and process is for recruiting and addressing the Quality Service needs of our aviators. We welcome our assistance and looking forward to working with you. We appreciate your continued support for Initiative Design to help us achieve our optimal readiness and retaining the best and brightest of young men and women that have to offer. Thank you, i look forward to your questions. Thank you, general burke. Thank you for the opportunity to discuss the status of the air force Pilot Shortages and our efforts to address it. During that time, we provided air dominance through Global Vigilance and global power for our joint force. Make no mistake, your air force is always there. However, being always there comes at a cost of infrastructure. We are now at a decision point. Sustained global commitment and recent funding cuts affecting capacity and capabilities for a spectrum fight. Upcoming surge of mandatory retirement of an increasing market of Global Commerce is causing civilian industry to begin hiring at unprecedented rate. This circumstances has birth a national air crew crisis. It is a result of multiple factors. High operational tep poe ovmpo years. Of this amount, the total force were short of pilots. The cost to train a fifth generation fire pilot to prepare him or her first squad is 11 million. It acivilian companies are recruiting the world class experience of our rated airmen. Out pacing our 2016 studies, they increase the salary of their pilot force by an average of 17 . These annual hiring levels are expected to continue for the next 10 to 15 years. Civilian job prospects are not the reasons jobs are lost. The air force plans to address these shortfalls, reducing requirements, increase production and retention. The air force reduces the number of operations in order to maintaining and flying. We are leveraging our partners to staff and planning positions and deployments and in Pilot Training units as appropriate. The air force recognizes the need to increase pilot production and expand undergraduate Pilot Training. Future increases will require additional manpower and infrastructure operation and maintenance resources. From a retention perspective, the air force is for example, we reduce additional duties and eliminated essential courses and out source select routine tasks just to name a few. All of these are given back time to our aviators so they can focus on flying. We are grateful of your support of the 30,000 bonus a year. We identify areas of greatest need to retain pilots and exchange commitment beyond their service commitment. The air force is committed to a wholistic strategy. Our attention is focused on developing agile set of solutions. We appreciate your support as we address our town on aviators and moving out on bold and solutions. Thank you for your time on this important matter. I look forward to your questions. Thank you, general grosso. Chairman coffman. You appreciate the opportunity to discuss our Pilot Shortages and our mitigation strategy. Providing the reach and protection and situational understanding requiring to win. At the foundation or a highly trained Army Aviation professionals, the pilot component of our total Army Aviation consists of 14,000 across the regular army, the Army National guards and reserves. Several years of sustained fiscal constraint making difficult resources choices. Out of necessity we prioritize short term readiness over longterm recruiting and training. We cannot afford to train the number of new pilots we need just sustaining a healthy force. Specifically, we have a shortage of 731 regular Army Aviation warren officers across your group 2010 through 2017. We are temporarily sustaining acceptable aggregate hiring. Over 25 of which are retirement eligible. We are addressing these challenges and well build longterm readiness through three lines of efforts. Retention of pilots is key of mitigating seven years of con strength training. Overall army retention, is healthy, we have seen an increase of Army Aviation attrition from 7 to 9 annually. Given growing commercial demand. We expect this trend to continue unless address. In anticipation, we are formalizing targets that encourages pilots to continue and retaining those who achieve advance qualifications. Additionally, we are correcting the accumulated deficits by fully resources our Flight School. Fully resourcing our Flight School is not a quick fix, it must be phased in for several years. It will require consistent funding and increase levels to be successful. We are increasing our aviation officers in sessions in increase foot of Pilot Training. We are addressing our pilot manning challenges while simultaneously meetings are in requirements. However, sustained predictable and on time funding and relief from the budget control act are vital to any solutions that we attempt to apply. Mr. Chairman and Ranking Members and distinguish members of the committee, thank you for your support of our army and your commitment to our neighbors defense. Thank you, Major General peterson. I wish to thank not yet. So let me, if we look at the biggest reasons on the demand side of this equation, i think there are two factors and i dont know which one is dominate. One factor is you got an aging population of pilots on the Civil Aviation side and that was aggravated by the fact that they increased the retirement age of pilots so now we are hitting that increasing retirement sage so we are seeing significant retirement. A significant part of demand side, too, i would think is that in response to an aviation, i am trying to remember which year it was, i think it was in new york state, 2012, the reaction to that was the plus up the numbers of hours required. I believe 1500 flight hours for civilians and airlines fa requirement. And so quickest way to get there, is to look at the military because thats very hard to get on this civilian side. And so and i dont know if if the faa needs to revisit that number if that was an over reaction to that accident or not. But, that does seem excessive, thats on the demand side. And then so on the supply side, i believe that i know lieutenant grosso, you briefed me on a Retention Bonus structure that you want to put forward. You want to tell the subcommittee about that. We did come up with the Business Model to understand where our greatest need was. This model is the model that we use to give across air force which is about manning is weighed at 40 and retention at 30 and replacement time at 10 . You put all of these numbers together and you get a ranked ordering and based on the increase in the bonus which you gave us in the 17 nda as well, we looked at the greatest need and we stair step it down to match the weapon systems that were most indeed in accordance to your need. People choose to come and go will change. Is the bonus structure the same across the board . Do you mirror the air force or do you have your own struck a chance for shower that you look at . Sure, thank you, thank you congress for the authorities and the ndaa. Since 2011, the marine core has not paid a retention bow nut y pilots. Our inventory were solid and attrition was not a challenge. We arrived at 182,000. In doing that and leveraging all the authorities that you gave us, the priority was to reduce numbers of marines. We saw an unequal reduction and our retention which ideally of 91 for aviators or in the officer committee fell down to 86 or 87 . We made that up in a session. Our challenge right now is i have got 500 officers still in the Training Pipeline more than i need. This year, because in addition to reducing the size of the force, we are introducing new type Model Service in the inventory. F35 and mb22 and etcetera, camelot is Going Forward requesting of the secretary of the navy and tho right turn tau Retention Bonus in three communities. F35 and f18 and b22 are current aly growing communities. We dont want to be caught short in those communities. We got more majors than lieutenant prefers. And so we want to make sure we have the opportunity to lev tragedy leverage to maintain those officers and coming out of the requirement of commitment and capture for a bit time. Thank you, general. Miss speire, you are now recognized. Thank you. Thats when they graduate from the training. That training takes a year and after that year, they have a ten year commitment so it is typically of the 11th year of service than airman is offered of some form of bonus. Is the 35,000 given in al a lump sum or given in per year based on the number of years that aviators continue to serve. This year, we are proposing to offer cracks for a year, two years or nine years or 13 years and you can take some of that up front and some of it will be anniversary payments. So no one aviator is going to get a 35,000 check or will they . If they tyke it fook it for. They would stay a total of two years and get a 35,000 bonus in day one. What happens if they decide to quit . Do you claw that back . Yes, maam. Thinking of the one year because of the work that we are doing of culture piece, those things take time. We have to build trust with our airman. After significant long periods of conflict where we took off the ball a little bit. We have talked about putting resources back and one of our chief goal is to revitalizing our squadran. They are giving us a year. That gives them a chance to relook and take it in another year, hey, are we doing better and is my family in a good place and did you do what you said you are going to do. Well look at the environment and what our retention patterns look like. Okay, i particularly wanted to talk about nonmonetary inducemen inducements. I noted that in the report there was a reference made to 260 days away during deployment for some of these aviators and 110 days away even when you are on home. Those are long stretches away. In your actual statement, general grosso, there is a chart here that shows the ranking of the civilian jobs is much lower than additional duties which was at 37 and maintaining Work Life Balance and meeting family commitments which is at 31 . Available of civilian jobs was at 24 . So i think the lure of commercial airline jobs while it does have some allure, i think addressing those top two would be significant so to each of you, i would like to ask the question in a minute and 36. What if anything you are doing to trying to address the nonmonetary issues. Thank you. Member speire. We did a study talking about our enlisted forces and issues. Fullyi flying hours are the most concern. They want more time in the castle rock p it a cockpit and more time in the back. The third issue which is the most concern to them was the cycle. The cycle as you know the marine core is on a 12 ratio. Three concerns, one they w, want more time to fly and time to fix and a little bit more time at home. Our deploy and while our number shipping at seas on any given day remains the same. Thats starting to come under control now. The things like pcs move, lead times and shrank down as we use pcs funding as a mean of making our top budget coming in under control so families were getting a month or a month and a half of lead time to move in the summer going from non concentration area where it was difficult to find housing and things of that nature. And then just other sort of normal quality of Service Types of things and administrative distractions and career flexibility. We really been using the tremendous flexibility that you gave us of the program to go in effect and in the aviation community. We had 13 aviators. Okay, my time is expired. We had a female of one of our top young helicopters pilots that would have gotten out. We were able to gotten out. So she could get out. She was married to a naval aviator as well. She came back in and did her Department Head tore and d phenomenaly. Another Success Story there. Things like that we have to add flexibility while our soldiers are out at the cockpit and coming back in and entering back to life and being competitive of their careers. Maam, maybe you can fold our answers until well response. Miss russell, you are recognized for five minutes. I appreciate all the things that you do and a couple of questions and bonus question time. How much does American Airlines offer bonuses up to for pilots, for regional pilots. Anyone . About 35,000. Interesting figure. And so, you know, once again we go into this chasing around the 35,000 of some astronomical figures. You know the phrase that comes to mind is nothing is too good for the truth and nothing. I applaud you for putting together the bonuses and they do retain. And because of your extensive background, you are very unique pilot with a unique background. If you dont have the types of pilots in our special aviation community, what impact does that have on the missions that are rangers and special Operation Forces do that we rely heavily on in most of our mission. Can you speak to that a little bit . Without the retention of hands selected and highly trained commanders, one, we would not be able to accomplish the complex mission in support of our elite soft Ground Forces the nation asked us to do. The physical ability and planning ability and leadership would not be present. We would not have the ability to accumulate and grow that and supporting the mission that they asked for. Further, well not be able to sustain those capabilities overtimes. Those same leaders are selected and retained at some cost and investment are also are mentors and teachers for the next jegeneration. They serve to accomplish the Mission Today but they also grow on the next generation that our nation relied upon. Even as a combat without helicopters to have convey us to a location. We would have had a lot less option on how to get to the enemy and without the United States air force, our troopers would have no delivery capabilities of any lengths to get to or even lodgistics or any number of things. This Pilot Shortage goes behind just having somebody of the flight suit standing next to the care craft with a cool picture. It is everything that our military relies on no what tmat what their capacity is. You talk about the aging of the warrant population and even a w4. What are they making now, 60,000 a year . I am not sure what it would be today. Anybody have an idea of what it is . Closer to 80,000. Yet, it takes 11 million to train a pilot to do their first combat mission. I am not a mathematics major or a rocket scientist, 11 million or 35,000, retaining them for a couple more years or not . It seems like a good investment because when we dont do it, much like the cliff that we had with our air Traffic Controllers in the 1980s when president reagan said fine, you want to protest, well hire a bunch of new ones. And they did. They all left in one shot. 25 of the pilot force is just in the army. Not only are you losing your most experienced lawyers but you dont readily replace them. We have to fix the problem. We have to do better. With that, i am out of time and thank you mr. Chairman. So better data shaping o f the response that we have in the military. And bet understanding the pilot attitudes whether across services or within each individual mis or there is a driver decision to renew other careers with commercial airlines or outside the military. Well start from left to right with Lieutenant General brilakis. We are working on a longitudinal covering enlistment of over their 30 long careers that looks at attitudes and retentions and separation and etc. We believe that provide us better information in the future. The signatuurvey we did gave us feedback. It is about doing what they came to the marine core to do which is to fly airplanes and fix airplanes and serve those aircrafts. On the officers side, are challenges. The t it is been an issue and we work hard to it. Getting those pilots and hours per month thats necessary. It is a satisfaction thats seeing an aircraft you are responsible for and take off and loaded with bombs to go do the mission. Those were the things that were working on as well. We do bonus for retention. We are looking to capture experience to retain it to the squadrons and thats another initiati nicinitiative that we are bring in. We have specific data but we are working on to have better data in the future. Sir, we do the exact same approach from the navy looking at things that form our entire portfolio and seller 2025 which was aimed at everything of the non monetary aspect of things and everything from how we do detailsi detailing and evaluations and fitness support and for Promotion Board and policies all the way down to our physicals and health and wellness of things. In this case to look at those data and all those sorts o f aspects. We have a very good pulse on where we stand on retention or critical point. We target our retention bone for our naval aviators at our two critical points which is department had at the lieutenant command level after they had 05 or commander command. Repa i the boes nuss how skills may translate in the outside job markets. We know how many committed because the contract lengths. We have a good indicator of how many we have committed and we talk to them on a weekly basis of how many are on defense and how many are saying yes and how many are saying no. We keep a pulse of that every time and that helps us inform our management. If that answers your question. Um, we do sir, there is a survey you will see in the written statement which is a resuspension survey of every year. Thats the data of the Ranking Member spirit pointing out. The at gives you sort of realtime thinking. That from our pilots, the data is about the same, maintaining work and life and balance is the number one reason and thats 45 . Availability of civilian job is 21 . And one to three dwell, every three years they deployed 180 days and they come back and because they are not proficient in the high end fight. They go to tdy a lot to get the position again. There is an incentives to get in early. I realize i am out of time. Okay. Go ahead. Pleaseplease. As you are a 12 year point and you are looking back and things that we need to be working on. Of them are affiliated in the recivilian component so they can start that successful career for their family. Thats why the 112 year point is very important. We have airline hires going up, retentions go down. We can correlate that. We now recommend you for five minutes. Thank you, i appreciate all of you being here. Those who are doing a be nus, we know how many people signed up for the bonus, how do we know how many of those would have signed up anyway to stay in . Do we have any data that shows and my concern is a lot of reasons people are getting out had very little to do with the money. Curious, can we correlate the number of folks that takes the bonus of 5 that said that was the main reason why they stayed there. I cannot correlate that way. People dont that take and bonus, 96 separates. We do though about 2 3rd of them going to the airlines. Onethird sopoint. I think all of us is onethird and onethird. Because we invest so much money to make them, we think the trade office worth. We are not too sure of that would have stayed in anyway. Similar situation. You get to the point where some individuals it can be economic rant. Exactly. With respect to the arm any, we are not applying the bonus to this point to our overall forces. We have used it as a target in our special Operation Community only. We feel like we have very good return on investment and trends of that small population. We are anticipating points and incentives beginning at fy 18. You are not going the balloons. This year for fy 18, well will. Thoses are t are the communi that we have some concerns. To your point, there is not a whole lester holt of pensions and guaranteed pension. What hopes the case better is, seeing correct correlation of more people signing up. Just my thought. Thanks, mr. Chairman . You are back. Mr. Abramsabrams. I hope that i always send them of the best because they hold the life in your hands. They also hold the light in their hands dodging bullets. So it is a whole different dynamics o f our aviators and personnels. The other suspect is, i would compare that to a top tier executive level in a company as i would be one of the big ones. When they give them bonuses, theyre not talking thousands. Maybe general peterson i will ask you the question first. How does a cr for the reminder of advertise cal the strategy simple terms is it stops our initiatives to mitigate this. Well not be able to increase the input in our Flight School with respect to investments and additional in structural pilots and maintenance as well as sustaining additional airframes for the school. It will essentially dev this problem another year until we have the prerequisite funding that has been budgeted for by the army to implement thesis in enactivi in sexual behavior ti these in top heavy retirement eligible population. If we carry that forward with an imposition of sequestration in 2018, what does that do for your readiness, general peterson . Ill start with you. In addition to exacerbating the pilot readiness challenge that we have, we will suffer readiness hurdles with respect to airframe material readiness. Very significant and important modernization programs will either be halted or slowed to include the ch 47 block 2, the improved turbine engine program, the future vertical lift initiative and program. Probably most salient and important is that we will slow or defer very important protection and countermeasures initiatives that are under way right now. Other comments on the cr 17. How will it affect each of yalls services, if you dont mind going down the line. Sir, real quickly, very similar to general peterson. We wont be able to execute the bonuses that we like to. Our retention season actually begins in july. So that will be impacted. The funds that are available to do that wont be available. We will by the summertime have to basically idle 24 flying squadrons. Wow. And on top of that, with the lack of spares and repair parts, we are going to take a step backwards on the readiness efforts that weve done to bring back the number of ready basic aircraft that are available for our pilots to fly. Admiral burke . Sir, for the navy, we would be forced to reduce flight hours across all naval aviation, 15 to 20 reduction in fleet training squadrons. Those are the training squadrons. Onethird of our junior aviators would not be able complete basic qualifications. Squadrons Going Forward would be 20 to 30 undermanned. That would pay forward for several years. I would be forced to cut sessions by a thousand Going Forward in april. That would translate directly to gap debillets at c ashore and ultimately pilots, instructors, and aviation maintenance folks. And then there would be impacts to pcs fundings which would delay in issue orders, quality of service, quality of life as we discussed earlier. And then similar to what general brilakis laid out, we would have to stop bonus payments on most critical skills. So it would impact retention of, you know, experienced and specialized sailors including aviation officers and aviation maintenance rates. General, real quick. I echo, very much like the other services, it would have a devastating impact on our readiness and we would have to stop flying, which has all the other negative consequences of trying to keep these aviators in the force. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Just one comment, its my understanding that now its difficult not only to maintain just currency, but several to maintain readiness. And those are two different numbers of flight hours, i understand that, to be able to just fly the plane, but to be able to fly the fight are two completely separate and distinct issues. I thank you, mr. Chairman, for the indulgence. Dr. Wenstrup, youre recognized for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you all for being here today. Whats tougher right now, recruitment, initial recruitment, or retention . What do we have the most trouble with down the line . Sir, fortunately neither is a problem. Navy overall recruiting is good. We just made our 120th consecutive month of meeting our recruiting mission. Were seeing the beginnings of fraying at the edges. Overall retention is good, although were seeing individual specific areas such as aviation officers, nuclear rates, special operations forces, and information warfare, you know, cryp cryptological rates, were having individual retention challenges there. Were able to manage those with the authorities we have right now. We have no issue recruiting talented people to be aviators. Our sole issue is retention. Were not retaining enough to sustain the force. We are not facing challenges with recruiting either. However, that recruiting pool is artificially restrained because of our throughput challenges due to tough fiscal decisions. We are seeing leading indicators of impending retention challenges based on the retirement eligibility of our force as well as the increasing commercial demand. Ill just say, i have another point of curiosity, i guess, youre getting exit information, exit surveys. On the exit survey, do you ask them why they joined to begin with . Or do you know that on entry . I imagine the entry reason is pretty much the same for everybody, to be honest with you, for many reasons. Wanting to serve, et cetera. But on their exit, do you ask them why they joined . Im just curious. Like what changed for them to want to leave. So what our experience, a couple of years i had the opportunity to watch that. Youre right, American Youth join the service in general for a number of predictable reasons. Each different service, again, some predictable reasons. Why they leave, sometimes its the opportunity to remain in the marine corps. We only retain about 27 of every years cohort because twothirds of our forces are in the operate forces and about onethird is in the supporting establishment. Its a young force, a fighting force. When i answer your question, i was talking about the aviation enterprise, aviation maintainers, et cetera. We have some retention issues in the cyber force, high demand, low density moss. Some of the reasons folks leave those is because there are opportunities on the outside. I can take a cyber marine getting paid maybe 55,000 a year. Hes leaving and picking up a job for about 190,000. Those are challenges that i dont think youre going to give us enough money to throw at those particular problems. Why they come and why they go have been pretty much standard across the board. The thing thats amazing right now is with the employment rate as low as it is, were still finding good people who want to serve. Thats good to hear, good americans. Im referring more to aviation than anything else. Admiral . I think a lot of people now you changed the question to be specific to aviation. They join for the adventure and to be part of something bigger than themselves. And i think they find that here, and theyre generally very happy with it. Why they leave, i mean, all the reasons we talked about earlier. But then theres the there is the family separation thing. We ask a lot of our folks. It is not for everyone. I guess a lot when they enter are young, for one, and possibly single at the time. General . Yes, i agree, theyre at different points in their life. I think you make decisions depending on your situation 12 years later which is very different than when you joined. Right. Although i can presume that trends are probably the same. Im not aware of a specific question on our survey that would substantiate that. Thank you. I yield back. Mr. Kelly, you are now recognized for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. General peterson, im going to start with you real quick, and talk about ari. And they asked about or they were going to get lakotas to modernize Pilot Training at ft. Rucker. The goal was to retire the older fleet and create a more relevant, safer, and more Cost Effective training. Could you update us on how the modernization of Pilot Training is progressing on the lakota trainer . Our modernization efforts are slowed a bit right now. Just partially due to fiscal decisions on our fielding plans for the lakota. As well as some ongoing litigation. The lakota is progressive to be an exceptionally reliable and very beneficial trainer. It is too early to comprehensively substantiate the full benefit. What we do know is that the use of a more complex aircraft in initial Pilot Training, a twinengine aircraft with essentially a modern glass cockpit, is translating very well to the assimilation of skills in the combat aircraft that the initial entry aviators transition into for their subsequent training phases. Were looking forward to substantiating that and objectively documenting that as we get to the pure fleet. At this point we are roughly half and half with respect to the very early phases with our legacy fleet training aircraft and the lakota. And we talked about im not going to put you on the spot. The bottom line is there is a lawsuit that is slowing that down. That definitely has an impact on not Going Forward and contemplative with something that has an impact on our training readiness, would that be correct, general peterson . It does. But we are compensating with the extension of the legacy aircraft which was proven in past years, sir. And this is i think im going to Lieutenant General grosso, one question that i have, the 35,000 bonus, it amazing me anyone questions it. After five years of service, when they go to the airlines, five years later, theyre probably at the airline making double what a u. S. Army major or u. S. Air force major or wo3 would be making at that point, would that be correct . The data we have right now is very quickly youll get to 160,000 a year. So probably. I havent really done the mast but i think thats correct. And quite a bit. And thats not for the 20year guys. I know ive missed every bonus ive ever been offered because i was too old to get it and was in too long when it became critical. Those are the 11 and 12year people at that critical stage, that midlevel management, that is hwhen that 35,000 applies, that critical point in their career; is that correct . That is correct. And this is for all three of yall, and i dont know if youve experienced it, theres some things you cant replicate. The ctcs in the military and the army or your red flags in the air force, are those things, but does anything replicate combat experience other than combat experience . I think its relative to the combat experience youve got. If youre doing although level counterinsurgency operations, youre getting a much better overall Training Experience at red flag or at the Fighter Weapons school or at wti. Its all high end stuff against simulated high threat iads. Combat is combat. And again, those things are great, and ive gone to many of those things, but it still doesnt replicate. And then the final i guess the final question that i would have is, its not just the flying experience that you lose. Its also that command experience, that leadership, that management. So a brandnew flight trainee coming out of Columbus Air Force base in my district does not have the same skills as that major who has been an Operations Officer for a squadron, would that be correct, Lieutenant General grosso . Yes, sir, it would. Taking out the flying side of that, you cant replicate that leadership experience at those critical levels, midlevel management, whether youre talking about maintenance or in the nco level, or warrant officers who are wo3s or majors or senior captains, you cant replicate that anywhere, can you . No, you cant. It takes ten years to make it. And if you get out, you cant get back in at the same spot, can you . We do have programs to bring people back in but its challenging because we dont have the capacity to train them again. Thank you. I yield back, mr. Chairman. Thank you. Colonel mcsally, United States air force, retired, now recognized. Thanks, mr. Chairman, thanks for your testimony. I think youve talked about it to some level, some of the conversations ive had with some of the leadership in the services is about it not being a win lose and a finite pie, looking at this as a nation. Weve got requirements for our airlines, a good, strong, growing economy in our Airline Industry is good. Weve got requirements for our military. If were looking at this as a finite pie and win lose, in the end were not going to be able to compete with quality of life and resources, especially at a time when pilots are not flying because of sequestration, theyre doing more creep and more stuff that drives you crazy and impacting the family. What are you all thinking innovatively about turning this into a win win to partner with the airlines for individuals to be able to fly in the military and maybe have seasons of flying in the airlines and then come back for a threeyear tour later on and then go back to the airlines, as opposed to competing with each other . Maam, our chief is meeting with executives in the Airline Industry. Were looking at just that. Based on the Authorities Congress has already given us with the career and remission program, were going to see if we can get, to your point, a win win, and get some predictability for the airmen who want to start their line number early and get predictability for the air force. Were also starting to look at can we allow aviators to fly parttime on their own. Those are two ideas. I think theres many more ways to think about this for the nation to get a win win between the military and the private sector. I totally agree. And when you think about the bonus, people at the 12year point taking the bonus, in the past, maybe you get somebody inching towards the 13, 14. With the old retirement system, even if they didnt necessarily want to stay, they would start to make a decision, i might as well suck it up towards 20 now. Not everybody is thinking about getting out at 18 as i did, most people as they get closer to 20. Are you concerned that not providing a hook, you know, to bridge them from, say, 1314 to 20 now, that they have the option to leave, is that do you think going to be a factor . We are concerned, we really dont know. We do a lot of force modelling and we know how the old retirement system pulls people, youre exactly right. We do have that continuation pay in the new retirement system. And that, the intent of that is to get people to 20. Were going to have to be very agile at executing that. Any other sources . I would just add, we thank you for the help in fy 17 in the aa that gave us the flexibility, the timing on that continuation. That was very important to us, because we see that as a component with existing retention tools that we have, because we you know, were going to probably have to modulate those other retention tools along with that continuation pay to influence retention behavior. Together we think well be able to influence the behavior that we need to get them to 20 and beyond. Great, thanks. I think, you know, the career intermission is a great first step in a direction of i just think in general the next generation wants to be able to move in and out of the workforce, get unique experience. I think we need to open up the revolving door. How long does it take to replace a tenyear pilot, a joke, ten years. Maybe they went to start a business of their own or tried some other grass is always greener and they realize they miss the camaraderie, they miss the mission. I really urge you to look, its challenging to try and find these people, where are the experienced pilots that have left . Maybe theyre two, three, five, eight years out, doesnt matter. Retraining them with the experience theyve had and bringing them back even for just one assignment is worth the investment if you can find them. Are you doing any initiatives to go find those that are not in the airlines but working in many different sectors of the economy . We have a return to active duty program. Its got to be a short m. O. S. You have to have the talent. Im not sure weve looked at people being way for six to eight years, you still have a ptfd to get past. I just think its that kind of innovation to be thinking of rather than saying, we have to produce more pilots and start at the beginning of the line again. Weve had conversations with industry as well, similar to what general grosso discussed. Were taking a look at the s. I. P. And seeing how we can fit that into a model that works for us. One of the items were looking at is more permeability for active reservists in the navy, were nowhere near as permeable as the army and air force are. Weve brought a number of Airline Pilots now, they were formal navy ate aviators in, top us stand up our remote pilot triton project down in jacksonville. And, you know, they wanted to stay. So we were able to help them out. So after having gone to the Airline Industry, they wanted to come back. So there is a little bit of that dynamic as well. Great, thanks. Im out of time. I appreciate it. Thank you, ms. Mcsally. Vice admiral burke, going back to this Retention Bonus structure, can you brief the subcommittee in terms of what you are looking at right now in terms of a bonus retention structure . Yes, sir. Our current structure right now, weve got two main points of concern. So our Department Head area is the most critical. And that applies for lieutenant commande commande commanders, that we pay by type model series or community, the type that theyre flying. Our most critical needs right now are electronic attack aircraft, strike fighters, and then helicopter mine countermeasures. Those folks are getting the top rates. And were paying them at current rate is 25,000 per year. And then depending on type model series other are less. And as soon theyre eligible for that after they finish their initial obligation, which is eight years after winging. So typical winging occurs define winging. Three years. You get your aviator wings at about the threeyear point after you finish Flight School. Okay. Its probably somewhere between 10 and 11 years of commission service, is when your active Duty Service Obligation is over. So you become eligible for this bonus. And this bonus now obligates them for five years, which takes them through a Department Head tour and all the way through. If for some reason they dont select for 04, they dont make it through their Department Head tour, we recoup. They dont get paid for that which they do not serve. So there is that aspect of it. Then we vary the rates. We put some economic factors in. We have some economic modelling that we base the rates on. Its not extremely sophisticated. Its the best that we have available to us. Were working to get much more Predictive Analytics behind it and make it more sophisticated as we go forward. Then we have our second critical zone is the post command level. So the first command opportunity is at the 05 or commander level in the navy. And then we ask them to obligate to which the post command level. There are numerous post command jobs on aircraft carriers such as, you know, the Operations Officers, the air bosses, things like that, that run critical operations on aircraft carriers. We need them to obligate, to stick around a little bit longer. And we structure that bonus to keep them at least through the window where they would make 06, the theory being once they make 06, theyll stick around a little bit longer. So thats a twoyear bonus at 18,000 per year. And both of those have had some positive effect. Were not getting exactly the response we want, so were going to tweak both of those this year, both in terms of the bands and the numbers a little bit. But dont expect to make full use of the legislative authority that youve given us. But were going to move them both a little bit up in each direction. One of the ideas that were looking at here is something that we did in the Surface Warfare Community Last year. We tied merit to the bonuses as well as need. And early look screeners for the next milestone. So in the case of aviators, if you screen early for Department Head, thats based on a look at your professional performance. The requested would be perhaps theyre eligible for the bonus earliered and get extra payments for it. Thereby youre securing a contract with the best talent sooner. So were looking at structuring something along those lines. Right now were paying for those two specific windows at a fraction of the available authority youve given us. Major general peterson, United States army, whats your approach in terms of Retention Bonuses Going Forward . Sir, were looking at two specific targeted windows at the outset. First is, at the cessation of their obligation for Flight School, which is the sixyear mark, that would be the first hook for multiyear commitments subsequent to that. Then at the retirement window, to retain that talent subsequently. Its too early for us to tell the impacts of the blended requireme retirement and the opportunities that may pull that window left to that 15year mark. But we are looking for those leading indicators. And then last we are exploring warrant officer aviation incentives not tied to merit but tied to actual objective qualifications for advanced qualifications and skills, sir. Fair enough. Let me just say one thing to all the services, that i believe that this situation is temporary. This National Shortage of pilots. And my concern is what always seems to happen in government is theres a response to it, and somehow that theres a feeling that once that response is baked in, that its permanent. And i just want to stress that this is really a temporary solution to a temporary problem. And i fully expect that we will come up, that you will come up with dynamic measures that as this problem recedes, that these Retention Bonuses recede. Ms. Speier. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I would also like to point out that i had a friend who did over 30 years at United Airlines as a captain, and, you know, pilots talk. And the United Airlines retirement system went belly up. Instead of getting 150,000 a year in Retirement Benefits per year, it was reduced to Something Like 60,000. So thats something to remember too in terms of the solid nature of the retirement system that exists in the u. S. Government. So a couple of quick questions. I wont belabor any of this. General grosso, there was a time in the not so distant past when the air force was giving the same bonus out to all pilots regardless of whether there was a particular need and a particular specialty, so that a tanker pilot was getting the same bonus as a fighter pilot. Have you changed that now so that it reflects more in terms of what your need is . Yes, maam, we have. I can give you great detail when you have time. Okay. I was kind of alarmed when i heard in answer to one of my colleagues questions about the continuing resolution, that we would conceivably be in a position where we offered a bonus to an aviator and then because were doing a cr instead of an appropriation, that that bonus th that we end up renegg on that bonus. Is that what happens . The challenge in the cr, if it wasnt authorized in the previous year, were not authorized to pay it. So if we had planned to pay a bonus in the fy 18 year time frame that we werent paying, remember, were going to be doing a bonus for the first time in six years. So its not in our 17 budget. It wasnt in our 16 budget. So it wont be available to us in this 17year budget. And the flexibility, well have to reprogram, well have to go for a specific reprogramming action to free you want dollars to be able to do that. But we now have a contract with this i have aviator to giv this bonus. And were reneging on it . Or are you saying were reprogramming . Were reprogramming that money. Its important not to renege on these bonuses, that would be a disaster in the making. I think it was you, general brilakis, who was talking about parts, was it not . Or was it you, admiral burke. I did, maam. I think we both did. Okay. Weve been focused on the pilots, but as you pointed out, if you dont have the parts to fix the planes, the pilot cant fly. And what are we doing about the mechanics . Is there a shortage of mechanics that we should be addressing as well . So for our part, on the enlisted maintainer side, our challenge is not necessarily the number, but its also the experience. Your aviation maintenance marine gets his basic training in his field. But on top of that, there are additional certifications. Because aircraft are so critical, and the fact is every time you go up, we want you to come down the same way, they have certifications that are required. Those certifications take time, upwards of a year or multiple years, to receive all the different certifications, so you can sign off on the maintenance. Our challenge has been, in the drawdown, the availability of those marines with those experiences, et cetera. On the enlisted side, while we do pay Retention Bonuses to manage the numbers, were also pursuing in the beginning of this next retention year what we call an op 4 kicker. An additional payment for marines who are willing to reenlist and then go in that fouryear reenlistment 24 months in the squadron, retaining those capabilities. Because more often than not, a marine who reenlists has a location option. He may want to go to recruiting duty or at the drill field because our marines serve across the marine corps. This will take the hard won experience at the Senior Sergeant staff nco level, retain in the squadron in certain numbers so they can train the next generation in those certification requirements. Thats new for us. Anyone else have any comments about mechanics . Were in good shape, mechanics. All right. Maam, we are short mechanics based on decisions made in the 14 president s budget. Were having no trouble bringing new airmen in, but obviously there will be an experience gap. We expect to be balanced in fy 19. Were reasonably strong with respect to our mechanics. However, we do have experience challenges that have been brought on by force Management Levels in recent years where mechanics have not displayed with their units and theyve been replaced by contractors. Were overcoming that now. But we will not regain that years of expedience. Mr. Chairman, i wont ask this last question, but you do want everyone to think about it. Were not using aviators in the same way in all likelihood that weve used them in past wars. And with the advent of drones, i think we all have to think about the makeup of our forces in terms of the technological advances that have taken place and how we are going to engage in subsequent actions around the world. With that i yield back. Thank you, Ranking Member speier. Just a very quick point, major peterson, that entire issue with force Management Levels and leaving maintenance personnel behind so that we dont reach some artificial gap in afghanistan and use contractors in their stead is a horrible decision in my view and its something this subcommittee needs to revisit and make sure that it never occurs again. I wish to thank the witnesses for their testimony this afternoon. This has been very informative. There being no further business, this subcommittee stands adjourned. [ room noise ] live sunday at noon eastern, investigative journalist and bestselling author Annie Jacobson is our guest on book tvs in depth. From these pentagon documents whats clear is its moving humans in the military environment toward being comfortable with this idea of merging man and machine. Shes known for writings on war, security, and government secrets. Shell discuss her four recent books. Area 51. Operation paper clip. And her most recent, phenomena. Join our live threehour conversation with Annie Jacobson with your calls, tweets, and facebook questions, live sunday at noon eastern on book tvs in depth, on cspan2. Sunday night on q a. Britain was the dominant power in the middle east, everywhere in decline her nationalists were rising up. Should the u. S. Support britain or try to create a new order by mediating between the nationalists and the british . Hudson Institute Senior fellow Michael Duran on his book, ikes gamble, about the 1956 suez crisis and its aftermath. Is the soviet union coming in aligning with the nationalists, undermining the british, and taking control of the oil in the middle east . The oil was 100 of european oil came from the middle east. We wanted to make sure we had friendly arab regimes that if not align with the United States, would keep the soviet union out. Sunday night at 8 00 eastern on cspans q a. The Supreme Court ruled 53 that texas used outdated medical guidelines in determining if an intellectually disabled person can be sentenced to death. In 2002, the Supreme Court ruled that executing a mentally retarded person violated the constitutions eighth amendment ban against cruel and unusual punishment. In 1980, bobby moore was convicted and sentenced to death for shooting and killing a Houston Store clerk in a robbery. After Numerous Court proceedings, a lower court judge ruled moore intellectually disabled and ineligible for the death penalty. That was overruled citing current medical standards in defining intellectual disability, not the 1992 standards set by the texas court of criminal appeals. The Supreme Courts decision reverses the Texas Court Ruling that bobby moore was not intellectually disabled. Well hear argument this morning in case 15797, moore versus texas. Mr. Sloan . Mr. Chief justice, and may it please the court. In atkins versus virginia, this court held that the eighth amendment prohibits executing people who are intellectually disabled. And in hall versus florida, this court reiterated that the inquiry into whether somebody is intellectually disabled, for that important eighth amendment purpose, should be informed by the medical communitys diagnostic framework and by clinical standards. Texas has adopted a unique approach to intellectual disability in capital cases in which it prohibits the use of current medical standards. It relies on harmful and inappropriate lay stereotypes including the socalled bresineo factors. It uses unwarranted causation requirement, and most fundamentally, it challenges and disagrees with this courts core holding in atkins, namely that the entire category of the intellectually disabled, every person who is intellectually disabled, is exempt from execution under the eighth amendment. Thats a long laundry list