Transcripts For CSPAN3 Politics Public Policy Today 20140714

Warrant for content in all cases, it tends to be things that you have to be able to get a search warrant to investigate. So that sort of drives a lot of it. But, you know, the data types and the data fields that are provided are sort of incumbent on what data there is in existence and how long its stored and what specifically they ask for. You know, we typically require them to be very specific in saying what types of data theyre seeking under a request. They cant just issue a search warrant and say give us soandsos data. They have to specify what fields and things they want. Both of you or both Companies Get quite a lot of requests for information for transactional data or activity logs or other kinds of subscriber information, so that takes up the bulk of the requests. Im wondering what those tend to look like and whether thats something that usually is fairly focused, or whether the number of accounts, obviously, are going to be larger than the number of requests to both companies, and so i wonder if thats general requests for a couple accounts, or do you occasionally see what one might consider egregious attempts to rope in a whole lot of people at once . Yeah. With the caveat that we can talk about what we did on the domestic side of things under eppa, you mentioned sort of the bulk of requests we receive tend to be transactional information. Its not particularly exotic. Its basically subscriber information that users provide to us, for example, when they sign up for a google account, so that could be name, gender, information like that, and thats the information that generally can be obtained under eppa with a subpoena. There is a specific percentage, somewhere in the neighborhood of 20, 25 that we tend to get that does ask for content in which case well ask for a search warrant. But its not, you know, generally speaking the type of information that we get is pretty run of the mill stuff that you tend to provide when you sign up for our services. If i could just actually build upon what i think greg and katie were alluding to before, because i want to be clear in terms of the civil agency side of things. A warrant for there is a perception that a warrant for content leaves the civil agencies without a remedy to do the sort of things that civil agencies do. In the case, for example, of the securities and exchange commission, the sec, to investigate and prosecute securities fraud. Typically speaking, in civil litigation, and i think nate was alluding to this before, when youre investigating someone or initiating litigation, youre going to serve a demand or Legal Process on the target of the investigation. So you wont be going to a Third Party Service provider. That is, generally speaking, how civil litigation works. So, you know, if there is a person thats being investigated, that theyre the target of an investigation and informations with is within the custody and control, theyll have a legal obligation to provide that information. To the extent theyre intransient, the sec has remedies to push the search warrant. They can be prevented from pursuing claims, there are all sorts of remedies that civil agencies have to sort of ensure that bad actors cant be perpetrating fraud sochlt i. So if we focus on how that happens, by providing end means to service providers, i think were missing the boat. But i also think there are other remedies, too, some of which exist under eppa, to the concern of destruction of evidence. You dont have to have any Legal Process at all to come to google or microsoft and serve a preservation request. That will freeze the account and ensure that any information that is destroyed isnt really permanently destroyed. And, look, a lot of the examples i think weve heard where this may actually end up being a problem where civil agencies dont have a warrant requirement tend to be sort of edge cases, and they tend to be framed in hypothetical or theoretical terms. There are actual examples of actual cases where these things tend to cause problems. You can imagine a situation where, you know, x person is doing y thing, but without sort of real world examples of how this is impacting civil agencies, its really difficult to crack a solution that would address the problems theyve been raising. We think they are adequate remedies under existing law, and thats why we think there should be a bright line for content standard. Going off of that again, were talking about criminal versus civil. On the criminal side, you have the probable cause warrant standard which would be used to go to the third party. I would also be notified as the target. On the civil side, there is no warrant authority, so you go directly to me as a target. Remember, this side over here, life, death, limb, children, women, all the scary words go over here. Money and white collar things and, i dont know, other kinds of fraud goes over here. So there are Emergency Exceptions for when someone is missing. There are Emergency Exceptions when someone is getting hurt. That is taken care of. And the Law Enforcement, domestic Law Enforcement, has agreed that that makes sense. But if we want to find out stuff about you like, i dont know, who is your affiliation as an organization when you file your taxes for status . Just read some emails. If you look at some of these things that this, having the ability to circumvent the target and subpoena the third party by civil agency, what kind of door that opens and what kind of authority that gives the executive branch. What kind of authority that gives an independent my favorite is the fcc, but maybe your favorite is the fda or the epa or maybe labor Consumer Protection bureau, i dont know. But this wouldnt apply to just one of these agencies, it would apply to all of them and not just federal ones, either. This would apply to state ones as well. So lets talk about local Law Enforcement that can read your email now. So were looking at if electronic communication privacy act reform that is in the house right now, the section about warrant for content that congressman hill was talking about. There is a bill straight up for content, there is a bill straight up for warrant in the senate. If there are changes, no, were not good to go. It becomes worse than what the law is right now. There are a kind of dizzying array of bills out there. Some are warrant for content. What bill or mix of bills do you guys see as moving the ball furthest . Which of the ones are the best prospects right now which are less likely to move . I think ill jump in on that. I think the ones with the best prospects are the ones that are straight up warrant for content right now. And the reason im saying that is because its a relatively simple concept, its been well debated on both sides. The House Judiciary Committee has had a couple hearings, though they havent yet moved a bill. The senate has had hearings and has moved a bill. But honestly, the other piece of data that i most want to protect, Location Information, its not yet right, particularly at this point in the calendar to have that kind of legislation moving. Too many hypos will come up. Its too hard to account for all the hypos that will come up and its just going to weigh things down. So if i had my druthers, it would be that the bill in the house has 220 cosponsors as katie was saying, straight up warrant for content, the bill advances. Its the counterpart. Its identical to the bill that went through the Senate Judiciary committee. Just to respond to one of the questions that was asked of representative poe, the question is youre doing email, what about all these other ways to communicate . You had asked the question . He covers those other ways to communicate. Because his bill goes to all content, and content is defined as substance, meaning or purport of a communication. So it doesnt matter kind of the electronic structure, if you will, its all content. Hes covering all of it. It would be a warrant required for all of it. You guys have this weird puzzle of saying is it a facebook message it functions cannotly li exactly like an email, does it matter if its a facebook message . No. One of the things that the thing i find particularly troubling is the growing popularity of what are called tower guns, where people dont want to say we have a suspect, we think he did the crime, we want to confirm he either was or wasnt or his cell phone was or wasnt at the scene, but rather, we have three robberies we think were committed by the same person. Give us every phone that was near each of those locations and well look for anyone who was at all three different places. Obviously, gathering huge amounts of information about a lot of peoples location in a way that obviously is not linked to a particular suspicion about any of them. Is that something that either of you are aware of having been attempted with respect to location data retained by google or microsoft . Im not aware. Im not aware. I dont mean to give you any ideas. Just kidding, dont do it. Obviously, theyre most concerned about content. There are a lot of ways in which, for example, lets say the irs which, until very recently, had in their manual a section saying, by the way, if youre investigating and you want to read a tax filers email, you can do so by subpoena. They finally agreed they shuc t shouldnt do that anymore. For a lot of things, whats your affiliation . Are Tea Party People having too much communication . A lot of this can be confirmed by metadata. If youre particularly concerned now that you see as, at least in some quantity, requiring some additional protection. So for me personally, and just speaking for myself as probably more as katie at digital liberty, i personally care much more about content and about location than i personally do about metadata at this point, because metadata is one of the checks Law Enforcement can use to be sure you turned over all the email that has been sent. So when they say dont get rid of anything, they can look at what the provider has and say, you deleted this from soandso and i need to see that. That kind of thing is important, especially when were talking about protecting content. Which, granted, its innocent, its all content, but were talking about the actual the meat and potatoes of the email, right . I think i find that to be the most important, and then i also find Location Information to be very important and look forward to working on that a lot more. As greg was saying, right now its become complicated with the raleigh decision that just came out. Youre dealing with gps location, youre dealing with tower location these are two different types of locations so you need a different type of law. I click this button here so it goes in the cloud, i click this button here so it goes on my phone. So do you search on the phone or do you search in the cloud . These are the types of things that are being discussed, the types of decisions coming down and moving forward in a locations base, that needs to be taken into account before kind of talking about what will be done with location, and also what is the future going to look like, right . So what is perspective and retrospective data going to look like . Right now you might say prospective data, no big deal, retrospective, no big deal. I wouldnt say that about either of them, actually. So you talk about that and move closer and say, just a onetime ping doesnt really tell you that much, but if we keep going down this route that were going, when is one time going to be too much and we dont know that. So that is a discussion that is ongoing, and that a lot of members are taking very seriously and looking into that. And as things change and aztec no as technology progresses and we see that, there will abe a lt more discussion on that. I would be surprised if congress got to Location Information before the supremes did. And i say that because theres now a split in the circuits. The 11th circuit ruled that you need a warrant for Location Information to store cell site Location Information, and the Third Circuit said you might need a warrant for it depending on the circumstances. And one other circuit said i think it was the fifth one circuit said you dont need a warrant for it. So theres a split, and its right for the supremes to weigh in when they want to and when somebody feels a case to them. Part of the issue with a lot of ecfa, as congressman poe was pointing out. There is a violation to the Fourth Amendment. The remedy is you get the evidence excluded. So what does that mean . It means a lot of criminal defendants will claim their Fourth Amendment rights were violated and youll get a body of law that develops about whether those rights were violated. Ecfa doesnt have a statutory exclusionary rule. There is one in the wire tap act but not for stored communications. And the consequence of that is you dont get the same development of the law, except when the person makes the Fourth Amendment claim. If you could make the statutory claim, hey, they violated the statute, and so i get to get this evidence excluded, you would get a lot more cases coming up through the courts. We dont have that many cases because were only in the Fourth Amendment land when it comes to the exclusionary rule. It is sort of a per verversif law that you dont want a judge shrugging his shoulder, maybe ask another judge. But some judge will issue those orders, so Fourth Amendment law seems to be exclusively by guilty people trying to overturn convictions which is perhaps not the most healthy, Structural Condition for the development of protective law. When metadata, when its transactional records that are obtained, they dont always require notice to the people whose data is obtained. Which means if data is obtained about you, data about what sites youre visiting, data about who youre communicating with, you may never learn that it happened, therefore, have no opportunity to bring, lets say, an action for violation of your federal constitutional rights. Theyre incredibly there, anyway, but if you wanted to, you would like the opportunity. So i think part of the issue here is theres obviously an enormous amount of data gathering happening leading to charges here. But not as much of a Public Awareness how incredibly frequent those digital searches, much more frequent than traditional wire taps. Before we shift to audience questions, are there any last remarks anyone wants to make, or can we jump to the audience . I would just make one last comment. Ive been watching for a long time, and ive never worked on an issue where there was so much consensus. Really. I mean, how often do you see google and microsoft sitting shoulder to shoulder advocating the same position . How often do you see americans for tax reform and the aclu on the same ladder . Its extraordinary. There is a website you can read about this coalition. Its www. Digitalprocess. Org and youll see just how many people have gotten behind these ecta reform principles, how Many Political groups across the spectrum. Its really amazing. Its worth thinking, google and yahoo, microsoft companies, and telecommunication carriers that in the last couple years have begun voluntarily disclosing information about the quantity of request for information. Its a positive trend that i hope we see continue, and im glad its something that these companies have been taking the lead on. So, yeah, lets let the audience jump in with questions. I will be less tolerant than representative poe in that i will enforce a threesentence rule, which is to say somewhere around the end of your third sentence, if not before, i will hope that your voice rises in such a way as to suggest by that inflexion that an interrogative is being posed. Lets start there. Just picking up on your last point, why does metadata seem to get such a pass . It strikes me that if i have a communication with julian, it doesnt say necessarily much about the content, but if i have the same email thats addressed to the five of you, that is somewhat indicative of what the subject and the content of that email is about. So why the pass . I think its partly in historic artifact that when courts were coming up with rules for what was going to be protected by the warrant requirement you know, there is a case smith v. Maryland where the issue was how about the numbers you dial on a phone . Is that going to be protected by the warrant requirement when that information is stored with the Telephone Company . And the court said, well, its not as revealing as the content is. It doesnt even tell you whether the call was actually completed. It doesnt say who you even talked to. It just says you dialed these numbers. And you know youre conveying these numbers to the phone company to make the call, and so maybe it should be warrant protected. Whats changed is that there is so much more metadata out there now about us, and it can paint a much fuller picture of what our activities are. And i think there is a growing consensus that metadata ought to be protected at a higher level than it is. One of the Digital Process recommendations goes to metadata collected in realtime. I think were moving in that direction, but in particular the noncontent most likely to be first protected by a warrant requirement is going to be Location Information just because its so revealing, particularly when collected over a long period of time. And so i would jump on that and say metadata is not getting a pass, its ranking. Right . So the content in my email is this is in my mind, right . The content in my email is more revealing than perhaps my gps location, and that is more revealing than perhaps my communications. So this is my personal perspective. And im looking at what can be done and what cant be done. If i walk down the street and say metadata to the next ten people, most will think im just babbling. Youve got to look at education, youve got to look at what people are ready for, youve got to look at where we are and what can be done, and then theres this great universe where everything is perfect. I tend to believe that any metadata is indistinguishable from content in the kind of most proximate kind of scenario that youre discussing, its not as if you send all of us an email, its that there are things with no real analog in the telephone context. I might take out a craigslist ad looking for foot fetishes, lets say. Craigslist will create an email account corresponding only to that. The fact i take that email address is telling you very specifically what the communication pertains to, because the only purpose for which that email exists is to communicate to that specific ad. There are email addresses that are in themselves a kind of content or action, so i send an email to subscribe at libertarian universalists. That tells you i intend to join a political actions group. If youre interested in following up on that, professor ed felton of princeton wrote a very Interesting Data to the teen program discussing how in quantity, metadata can, in fact, be effectively as revealing as content because content is more structured. But this in a sense requires a level of technical understanding of really just how revealing that can be. It may not be there in the courts yet. Weve got time for a couple more. In the middle . Whats the law or situation now with standard mail . If the post office uses electronic sorters, could it collect the addresses and names . Because it does have them in the computer forever. The cia does that. The intelligence agencies do that routinely. By statute, one of the First Federal privacy statutes was legislation protecting, protecting the privacy of postal communication knowing that people would not use the postal system if they believed the contents would be read indiscriminately. At least with respect to, i guess, snail mail metadata, that is routinely analyzed by the intelligence agencies as part of things weve learned recently. I dont know if greg i dont believe its been challenged. Greg, is that even on the criminal side you get a mail cover and it allows the fbi to get the addressing information on the envelope. I think that it probably hasnt been challenged as of late. I think its pretty much accepted. The issue that i guess were talking about is whats inside the envelope, not whats on the outside. [ inaudible ] the theory is you have to expose the address information to the government because youre asking the government to deliver the letter. And the analogy sort of works the same way. On the content side, the theory, i think, being, look, youre exposing the metadata to the company. Youre asking them to use that information to convey your communication, whereas they dont really need to inquire into the contents of the letter itself. Its not a record they need to create to wrap your communication. How that works on the internet which essentially has sort of a nest of a set of envelopes one inside the other is a kind of interesting and difficult puzzle. One of the things theyre probably doing is essentially looking a layer into the envelope, looking at sort of the information at the backbone level, but the backbone we normally look at, so theres legal challenges there. There is a whole sort of array of fascinating kind of legal puzzles depending how these analogies apply. The courts are not always sort of superattuned to the Technical Details that may make simple analogies break down when you actually start getting into details. I think we can do one more. Lets go there. Its good to hear the comments that sort of acknowledge the fundamental speechlessness of the metadata versus content divide. But my question is actually about the riley decision which was providing a search in the telephone device just incident to arrest, and so does that apply specifically only to a device that has a cell phone or radio in it, or, for example, if i had my laptop there in the car, does it apply to that, too . It would apply to that, too, yeah. There is a point where roberts says, we could call them phones, we could call them cameras. If you arbitrarily picked one of the thousands of functions these devices serve as the name of the whole device, but the thing i do least frequently is make phone calls. Oh, it has an app for that . I didnt even realize. But part of the decision does mention the network capability, but the essence of it is the massive quantity of data stored on it is what makes a difference, and whether it has an lte radio or Wifi Capability doesnt seem to be the core of a logical decision. How about somebody who would try that against just a simple laptop and then another will bring another case to clarify it . I dont think thats really necessary. When you read that case, i think theres no question that a laptop content would also be protected. David, you had had some commentary about the case and what it means for the cloud. There was a passage in the courts decision. Julian actually allude to do this at the outset. I think there is some fairly strong and powerful rhetoric and decision. Justice roberts general admonition, i think, to Law Enforcement agencies in this context was im just going to read from it. Our answer to the question of what police must do before searching a cell phone seized incident to arrest is simple. Get a warrant. But the other thing that he discussed, and again, that juliana le alluded to is most u of cell phones dont know if the data is being stored locally on the phone itself or in the cloud. He said it generally makes little difference. I think that has enormous implications for the issue were talking about today. While i think its unlikely that well see a case that comes before the Supreme Court, in part because we dont see the challenges happening at the lower courts, i think that just underscores the importance of congress caudifying the warrant for content standard. But theres no question, i think, that if you read the decision that its more broadly applicable than just the contents of communications that might be stored locally on the device. There are implications for the cloud, otherwise that discussion that Justice Roberts went into in the decision, you know, would be necessary. Well, as one of cato institu institutes jayzee would put it, i know my rights and you dont need a warrant for that. Possibly in the future that would be legally in the cloud and physical devices. Please thank the panel and thank the windsor garden for drinks and snacks. [applause] today the Senate Homeland security and Governmental Affairs committee will hold a confirmation hearing for nominees to serve on the u. S. Postal Service Board of governors. The hearing follows general patrick donahues announcement that they will process mail facilities. Live coverage begins at 3 00 p. M. Eastern on cspan3. Coming up at noon today on cspan2, former Vice President dick cheney will be joined by his wife lynn and daughter liz for a discussion with politicos chief White House Correspondent mark allen. On the conversation on the border and the upcoming midterm elections. Again, thats live at noon eastern on cspan2. Recently the Senate Commerce Committee Held a hearing regarding academics and the exploitation of College Athletes. They talked about safety issues and the notion of compensating student athletes. This hearing is about two hours and 45 minutes. This hearing will come to order, and i want to thank all of you very much for coming here. Youre a bit squeezed in there. But water is on the house, so be comfortable and be glad. College sports has an absolutely extraordinary position in the culture of our country. Not only do College Sports inspire incredible fan passion across the country, but they provide a very important way for young men and women to, as is written, do athletics as an avocation and get an education. Were going to talk about that today. Many young people, however, athletes provide an avenue to college which otherwise wouldnt have existed, and we understand that. College athletes and athletics are rooted in the notion of amateurism. And the history of that is very interesting and important going back to the founding in 1906 and the rest of it, going back, actually, to a greek concept of amateurism. Playing College Sports is supposed to be an avocation. Students play College Sports for the love of the game, not for the love of money. That is the ideal. But many people believe this notion of College Sports is being undermined by the power and the influence of money. I remember a meeting i had in my office with the three top executives of espn, and it was one of those meetings in which i didnt say a word because they just went around in circles, each talking about what a great Business Model they had, how they had control and power that no other broadcast system would ever have, and how thrilled they were with it and how they were going to make it even stronger. There is a growing perception that College Athletics, particularly division i football and basketball are not avocations at all. What they really are is highly profitable commercial enterprises. They believe that. Critics of big Time College Athletics say the goal of these programs are not to provide young people with a College Education but to produce a winning spot in the brief financial awards for their schools. It is not, however, about the students. Theyre part of what generates the money. Its about capturing the billions of dollars of television and marketing revenues that College Sports do generate and will generate even more. Colleges and universities say these revenues benefit College Athletes and their student bodies at large. But i think we have to consider whether the lure of such riches could corrupt the basic mission of Athletic Programs. Winning teams get higher payouts than losing teams, which creates a strong incentive to win, an incentive which land grand public universities and others are more than happy to follow. And win at any cost. Much of the money is often funnelled right back into those sports programs in the form of milliondollar coaching salaries and state of the art facilities, many of them paid for by the taxpayers to perpetuate the cycle of winning. I think somewhere in my reading here, about 48 million of all the 900 million that nca gets from, you know, their broadcasting, march madness and all the rest of it, a very small portion goes specifically to academics. But even thats hard to figure. Because nobody has the figures. They work for them, they make the decisions, he carries out what they want, and yet i think the discussion is how does he carry out what they want . What powers do you have, mr. Emmett, for actually carrying out what you think is a good idea . Youve been president of three major universities at different places, and i would think that your passion for education would need to show itself. Athletics to me are meant to serve schools and their public duty to educate students, not the other way around. Thats the way its always put forward and thats the way it should be. Dr. Mark emmet is here to present the position of the colleges. Some declined to come here, but you did, and im grateful for that. I believe you were put at the helm because you have incredible credentials, and i think we all appreciate that youre tremendously compensated. I think im just very skeptical that the nca can never live up to the lofty mission that you constantly talk about and which is written and printed in speeches and statements and responses to penn state this or Something Else that. You know, the mission nothing comes before education is always there but the actions dont appear to be. I dont see how the nca will ever be capable of truly making a safe, good education experience for students their number one priority. I want you to tell me that im wrong, that i am wrong, and that im particularly wrong about the future. But ill be a tough sell. I think we believe that the nca has largely been left to its own to determine what forms are appropriate and how to accomplish its mission. As we continue to learn more about what goes on in some major universities and colleges, we want to know if the nca is seriously considering how College Athletes are faring under this system. Not just living as they do, but injured as they often become, racked by poverty. If they dont do well, maybe their stipends are cut off, and is there a mandated fouryear scholarship. All these things are put at play. How are young men who strap on their helmets on a football field in front of a thousand paying customers, how are they doing . How are our young men who lace up their shoes and play basketball for march madness which consumes the nation and is deliberately spread out over a long period of time so that no kid 10 years or older can ever hope to do any homework because theres always basketball on. Are colleges and universities living up to their end of the bargain and providing them with a good education . Are these Young Athletes entitled to any of the billions of dollars that are reaped from their Athletic Services . And when young men and women are putting their bodies at risk, they have Adequate Health insurance . I dont know. I dont know. And i never go into a barber shop or anything without asking, do you have health insurance, and i know the answer is going to be no. I care about health care, and im unhappy when people who work in places where they dont make a lot of money dont have health insurance. Do the schools and Athletic League minimize the risk of concussions and injury, and what about if theyre injured before graduation, can he or she finish out their studies or does the scholarship run dry . Well, a couple months ago, we all heard the deeply troubling comments of chavez pier, the most valuable player in the 2014 basketball tournament in the midst of a tournament that generated hundreds of millions of dollars for the nca and its members, he talked about how sometimes he didnt have enough to eat during college. How did the college benefit mr. Napier the nights he had to go hungry . There he is, trying to turn an example of a famous athlete and turn it into a large problem. Im not trying to do that, i think it is a problem, and the whole sense of giving students a safety net and a sense of confidence that if they dont turn out to be as good of running backs or point guards or whatever and they dont make the team or theyre let off in their third year, are they dropped . Do they get scholarships or what happens . I dont know. The title of todays hearing is promoting the wellbeing and academic success of College Athletes. I want to have an open and frank discussion on this subject and im going to try my best to. The nca has the same goal as i do. Doctor dr. Emmett is going to tell us that the ncas goal is to promote sports as a means of achieving academic excellence. Today i want to explore whether the nca is fulfilling its mission. We still hear too many reports of fraudulent academics, we still hear too many tragic stories of College Athletes that have absolutely nothing to show of the services they provided even though they helped generate millions and millions of dollars. This subject is often discussed, but im here to tell you that if, per chance, the democrats should control the Congress Next time, and nobody is quite sure of that. John thune has one idea, bill nelson has another idea and you. Yeah, okay. And then i think we want to continue this. We want to make this a continuing search of this oversight committee. We have jurisdiction over sports, all sports, all sports. And we have the ability to subpoena, we have the ability to we created a special investigations unit. Were very into this subject. I permanently sonally am, i thi members are. So this is a part of a process here. So im going to have some tough questions for our panel as the nca and its members skoolchoolse they a cartel . Have they become an enterprise which is no different than the corporate witnesses who have appeared before this committee or is the nca truly different . And does the 100year organization in fact have the best interests of our College Athletes. I turn now to my very distinguished Ranking Member, senator john thune, from the state of south dakota. Thank you, mr. Chairman, for holding the hearing today, and i want to thank our panelists for the opportunity to examine the current state of collegiate athleti athletics. And, like you, i look forward to hearing from our witnesses, including the president of the National Collegiate Athletic Association is how the members of its institutions are fulfilling the commitments made to our collegiate student athletes. Im an avid sports fan. I know all the members of this committee are as well. As a former basketball player in high school and college and a proud father of a daughter who competed at the division i level, i certainly recognize the participation in organized sports not only requires physical and mental strength but also teaches teamwork and other skills that serve you throughout life. However, the College Student athlete is and should be a student first. Colleges and universities must remember and prioritize their academic obligation to student athletes. As the popularity of College Sports has grown, particularly the popularity of College Football and mens and womens basketball, so, too, has the possibility of many collegiate programs. In the current environment, the stakes have been raised both for the student athlete who wants to succeed and for the university who has a financial interest in winning games. Skr increasing revenues for some games and the broadcast rights have become more common. Re revenues for ticket sales are also significant and alumni want to see their teams win and may be inspired to contribute to winning programs. It is a driven organization to enter collegiate athletes into Higher Education so the education of a student athlete is paramount, end quote. However, some institutions appear unable to balance the core Academic Mission of the university and the commercial considerations that often accompany college at lekts, particularly in highprofile sports. Many feel the commitment to the student athlete is falling short. Another point of contention involves athletic scholarships and whether the practice of offering annual as opposed to multiyear scholarships unfairly puts the student athlete at risk of losing their scholarships as a result of poor performance or injury. While multiyear scholarships may provide an advantage, they may disadvantage smaller schools that cant match certain institutions. We will hear from ncaas most vocal critics today. While im sure todays hearing will highlight important issues, i hopewell not lose sight of the positive impact that amateur athletics have made on the lives of countless student athletes. We must remember that College Athletics is not just about football and basketball. The general director of south dakota recently shared the interviews he conducts annually to evaluate the schools Athletic Program from the Vantage Point of the athletes themselves. He underscored two stories that stood out from this past year of interviews with athletes. He reiterated how a sophomore diver at usd recovered from open heart surgery to qualify for a dive in the championships, a feat that would not be possible without the work of a dedicated training staff, academic support, coaches, team and family. He also noted the moving story of a sophomore swimmer who leaned on friends, family and teammates to help her through the tragic orphans and teammates with the death of her father who passed agree bay way early in the season. With this support, hannah was able to return to the pool and achieve lifetime best times in the summit leak championships. As the usdaa Athletic Director put it these are examples of what college means, if you strip away the buck, you are left with student athletes who often have to overcome personal, social, economic, athletic adversity all just to compete but they frequently do wit passion and determination na makes us all proud end quote. Thats from the Athletic Director of the university of south dakota. Recognizing challenges exist. Its my hope the Member Institution the student athletes, themselves and other stake hold, will Seek Solutions to promote the education, health and seek to preserve amateurism. This is an area where congress can provide a forum but the solutions are postlikely to come from those most wage involved in the education and development of student athletes. Mr. Chairman, thank you again for holding this hearing. I look forward to hearing and having an opportunity to question our witnesses. Thank you. Thank you, sir. What were going to do now is were going to hear the testimony and then both senator mccaskill and senator booker, both of whom are sterling and wonderful people are going to get very, very anythingly at me because im going to charge into the regular order and im going to allow senator coach to ask the first question, which rights all the rules of the committee. Amen. That will make you a better questioner. As the most Junior Member of the committee, the rules will not allow me to be mad at you. Miss chairman, for what its worth. I was under the impression we were one of the first to arrive and be able to ask questions in order. I arrived at 23 10 so i could be first. I didnt want to put you in a bad spot or breach the rules eitherer. You never do you will ask the first questions after the two of us. And thank you for being here and dont be nervous. Okay. I mean it its a wonderful opportunity to say whats in your heart and on your mind. First i want to invite the committee to share my experience of knowledge on this very important subject. Its a very complicated subject as well. Ive had many conversations with fellow student athletes on this issue about the current role of student athletes today in this giant scheme of collegiate athletics. We often walk away from those conversations with more questions than answers. So im hoping today is a First Step Towards answering some of those questions and providing some context and some clarity to this discussion so that we can see our student athletes receive maximum edification in all aspects of their person, be it a student, and at leth, a wasnt and a him who, thats very important to me. I want to start my remarks by the genesis of my story. My parents are from the highlands of the bahamas, i was born here in the states and raised in unl noochlt i went to high school in princeton, new jersey. Afterpy school days if princeton, i would go over to the university and i saw the big poster, a statue and trophies of this guy who became my he. Reporter his name was bill bradley. He was just a rockstar, in my opinion. The epitome of what a student athlete out to be, best player in college. At a school like princeton, nba. Hall of famer, u. S. Senator and a road scholar. Thats the first time i heard those roads in the same sentence. Once i finished high school in princeton, i had 83 scholarship offers to go anywhere and play football. I watt rated the number one prospect in the country by espn. When i got to campus the first thing i did was go to the office of National Fellowships and tell them i want to be a scholar. Three years later, i was fortunate to earn that then i went to meet my teach ertz and tell them i want you to increase my educational capital, so i can be a pediatric furs him now im a seccier medical student hopefully able do that in the future. Lastly, i went to my athletic coaches and football coaches and told them i want them to equippy body and get pe ready for a career as a National Football player around fortunately i was able to be democrated by the tie tans and play for the steelers as well. Now it may sound like my story is pristine and ideal and used as the poster child for which you want a collegiate athlete to have an experience. I will say my story is quite rare and unique. Some people call it an anomaly. Outside of for cory booker the last to win a rose scholarship was a guy tauld called pat hayden. He played at usc and Los Angeles Rams as a quarterback. There are few athletes i have come in contact with had the same instra structure the Family Support the foresights, not come from a broken school or family able to engage if their College Experience and maximize their team. Many more of my teammates, family, friends, struggled in the college environment, struggled minorly, economically. Now with the scholarship stipends they received they became believe it or not the main bread winners for tear families and had so send some scholarship money home to take care of their immediate and extended family. They struggled academically as well. A lot would go through this academic machinery and be spit out of that machine, left, torn, warn, asked some questions. We were no directional guidance on where they should go. No purpose, no idea of their trajectory, sometimes it didnt behoove their interests. I open we can shed light as you said chairman rockefeller we are pouring energy and exposure and highlighting on tv the life of the athlete. But i believe we are still falling a bit short of edifying and improving him augustmenting the aspect of the student, the person the man, the woman and the philanthropist and the leader. I believe if we do that, we can see these athletes at major schools be productive, but more importantly, be productive leaders and citizens that go on to be industries of men and women and really have an indelible impact as they go on to their future. Thank you for having me here. Im looking forward to having this drugs. Thank you, very, very much and now devonn ramsay. Welcome. Good afternoon. Devonn. Right . Good afternoon, chairman. Yeah. Good afternoon, chairman rockefeller and members ought committee. It is an honor and a pleasure to have this opportunity to be in your presence and share my story and thoughts on the current state of College Athletics. Let me first thank you and your staff for the invitation. I was born on december 8th, 1998th 88 in red bank, new jersey. My mother has always vowed anything education and sent me to a Blue Ribbon School that covered kindergarten through 38th grade. I excelled in the claszroom and participated in athletics. By the time for me to leave, i had the opportunity to go to the Lawrenceville School down the road from princeton that played against byron. I decided this would be the best academic and athletic environment for me. I would go on to successful academic and athletic career and i decide to sign my better of intent to go to the university of North Carolina, chapel hill. What drew me so that school is not only the esteamed top Academic Institution but also a new hire with coach davis. To show the university had an all around commitment to excellence. Now, my career at the university of North Carolina has been one filled with adversity. I have undergone five surgeries, three head coaches and asked if i want to transfer or take a medical register. However, despite all this i managed to succeed being named and offensive starter four out of the six years by nfl analyst mel kyper. The top three in my position. Most importantly i got my degree in public policy, concentration of business. After i graduated, i moved back to red bask, where i will pursue my hopes of making an nfl team. However, i didnt make the team at tampa bay. Now, in the summer of 20130, two of my teammate versus violated ncaa rules and attended a party by sports agency. The university of North Carolina then launched their own investigation into the merit and discovered several potential counts of academic fraud. After the final practice of the week, ford played clemson, i was told to report to one of the Conference Rooms and brought into questioning by university officials. Before the questioning began, i was told this conversation would be record and was asked if i feed a lawyer. I thought id be called in before they had leads for the investigation. Then they asked, began to ask me about my definition of academic fraud, academic dishonesty and plagiarism and that is when they brought umm a twoyearold email correspondence between piefl and a tutor. In the said email, i asked the universitys tutor for help in the paper. She replied by adding four to five sentences to a twoandahalf page paper. They asked me if this paper, if this is the exact same paper i turned in. However, i couldnt remember since it was two years ago. In the final four weeks that i was held out of competition, they sent me to the universitys honor court and the attorney general of the army court said there was no case here, there wasnt enough evidence, they had no final version of the paper. It wasnt submitted electronically him i dont know, most people dont keep papers from two years ago. As i was being held out by the unc, an official from the Compliance Office proposed if i were to plead guilty after being held out for so many games the ncaa would, in fact, allow many eto play. At this time i believe the uncs compliance was very well versed in policy. However, it was a shocking proceed in the ncaa than ruled me, guilty of academic fraud, which strips away my remaining eligible and tarnishs my reputation. After realizing unc was more concerned about scholarship than protecting one of its own, my mother and i set out to find lawyers that hopefully would have my best interest at heart. However, none wanted to stand against the ncaa or its leadership. The state Supreme Court judge reached out to my mother after reading an article she had been involved in as an observer. Without judge orrs legal tenacity, i would have no one to turn to. As we went through the appeals process, which was possiblet the endorsement of the university of North Carolina the leadership of the unc wanted me to take plea for a reduced sentence, judge orr, my mother and i needed to have my name un by going back and looking at the original interview, revealing the evidence, the ncaa overturned its ruling and reinstated my eligibility. Unfortunately, the next game i torely the ligaments in my knee. I was not able to return to the field of play until my final game which i participated if two plays. Now, one of the things that was looking back at my career that i wish i could have partakeen in, was internships. A few of my friends from lawrenceville went on to play at the ivy league and with their, its not as demanding as, you know the high Level Division 13 football. They were allowed to go in and pursue other things during the summer. And upon graduation, some of my friends got great job offers. The internship gives you direction, teaches you valuable life lessons and prepares you for a level of professionalism. Completing internship is almost impossible. In order to be eligible to receive your scholarship stipend during the summer and graduate aid, one must be enrolled in team hours. Several work out workouts. Most of these athletes ended up quitting the internship because the sheer landfall of exhaustion on an average day. Only one was able to complete its internship. It counted toward his credit hours. He wasnt required to go to any classes. At the university of North Carolina, Football Players are one of the only teams not allowed to participate in university camps, which would hone skills for those that werent into coaching and create another source of income. In fact, during a Panel Discussion about the documentary school, the price calls for it. The head coach of the george mason Mens Basketball Team paul hewitt stated his team has to do an internship before they graduate. A mandatory one. I think this is a great practice if the ncaa truly wants to develop student athletes and prepare them for success on the field, they should mandate all athletes complete an internship. The reason is it needs to be mandated is because there exists a culture, it demonizes any activity. Players that go home from a semester. I have friends that have done this are labelled at selfish and lazy and almost a chancer to the team. But, in fact, hes just going home. Hes still working out. Hes trying to prove his own value for the likelihood hes not going to make the nfl. I have come to realize there is a void in College Athletics. The ncaa as an institution no longer protects the student athlete. They are more concerned with signage and profit margins. I wasnt aware i needed to defend myself against my university and the ncaa and as a student, i lacked the resources and knowledge to defend myself against an 80yearold institution. My family lacked the resources to hire a lawyer. If i refused to be interviewed, i would be held down until i testified. In the ncaa, College Football players have a small opportunity to prove our worth to the nfl. Every game is a lost opportunity. There nodes to exist an entity that quickly and effectively advocates for the student atmosphere lee. I was fortunate judge orr reached out to my family. It terrifys me how many students had their ability unjustly taken and the reputation damaged. The student at leth is an amazing renewable resource. Because of that the ncaa is able to take advantage of the young men and women. There nodes to be an organization that will protect the College Athlete and has no ties to the financial being of the universities or the ncaa. They continue to schools and athletes is dangerous and unfair. To quote a famous poet, who will watch the marchman . Thank you for the opportunity to speak before you today. Thank you, mr. Ramsay. We appreciate it a lot. Miss Taylor Branch is from baltimore, an author and historian. Hes written what i call five best books ever win in terms of my own reading preferences about the civil rooidz Rights Movement and the development of it. He is also an expert about this subject and has written extensively. We welcome you, sir. Thank you senator rockefeller and senator tlun. Thank you members of the committee, guests, sports fans, educators. Im honored to be here. The subject for your hearing today College Sports and the well being of College Athletes is full of minefields and myths. I hope to offer some summary comments for a possible discussion under three headings, amateurism, balance and equity. Amateurism has become the distinguishing feature of ncaa governance. It is identified in official pronouncements as the bedroom principles of College Athletics. The bylaws defend and pan date am cure conduct as follows. Student athletes may be amateurs in their sport and participation should be promoted primarily by education and the physical, mental and social benefits to be derievd. Student par tis spacing an avocation and student athletes should be protected from exploitation from commercial enterprises closed quote. Thats ncaa byha 23. 39. The word amateur has conflicted attitudes about money, youth and recreation. Its broad ambivalence opened a muddled flexibility in public habits allowing the United States to become the world only nation to develop commercialized sports at institutions of higher learning. Even the major universities involved which were pounded to uphold intellectual rigor, continued to ignore the contradictions of a multibillion side industry built on their undergraduate students. Confusion and mythology begin with the word, itself. The dictionary synonyms for amateur range from a wholesome enthuse yft or devotee to a bumbling dabbler or rookie. Miriam gives the sting the people running that company are a bunch of amateurs. Areadyingly the same word expresses praise and scorn without distinction. This ambiguity gains reenforcement and in our uniquely designed popular world of sports, where fans are encouraged to cheer and bo without thinking objectively. The ideal of ancient greek amateurism has always been misleading because the athletes of olittle pus competed for huge prizes, ar Aristotle Research and development and modern scholars have evidence of high stakes victory and loss. Amateurcism a myth. Purists who refuse to mix money with sport did not exist in the ancient world. Victors monuments boast of success in the cash competition as they boast of victory in the sacred contests. Golf legend bobby jones is enscharrived as the ideal model amateur and gentleman who declined every championship prize he earned. His reputation fits the true definition of onlyture, derived from the latin as lover specializing one who chooses a skill out of devotion rather than financial gain. Some nonCollege Sports allow athletes to declare and renounce amateur status. Significantly, students, themselves, call themselves amateurs within they invented intercollegiate sports after the civil war. Until 193035, students contained general control of the new phenomenon and everything from scheduling and equipment to ticket sales. They recruited alittle nigh to construct Harvard Stadium in 19303 with zero fund from the college. Neither the faculties or critics declared walter camp, yale class of 1880 who became the father of College Football in his spare time. The ncaa created in 19306 slowly transformed the am cure tradition inherited from freej athletes. Its board contained control until 1922 and the weak organization could not hire its first full time staff member until 1951. After that, however, burgeoning renew allowed ncaa officials to enforce amateur rules as an objective requirement rather than a subjective choice. This is problematic. Because attempts to regulate personal belief run afoul of the constitution. Even if internal standards were allowed and somehow could be measured. Ncaa rules contradict the key rierkt that College Sports must be an avocation or calling. It comes from to call or vox voice by denying athletes a voice. Ncaa says governing the players by fiauto. Considering them for balance. Checks and balances are required for sound governments. The ncaa structure is unbalanced in four basic respects. First, ncaa enforcement suffers an end inc. Hearn conflict in football as opposed to basketball because the organization lost its Television Revenue from College Football and is almost wholly depend on the soul source broadcasting contest. Second the ncaa structure creates a false impression of common practice between the very few schools that aggressively specialize College Athletics, roughly 1300 to 1350 ncaa members and the vast majority of schools with small clouds and an elastic ncaa amateurism stretches from a division threeios country race to notre dame football on espn. Third, officials resolutely obscure differences between commercialized sports and the mission on campus. In the classroom, College Values highly valued expertise to students. But this role is reversed in big time sports. There, they develop expertise. This distinction is bake and is promoting educational integrity. The competitor players in the athletic department. They face careers like many americans, but their conflicting demands cannot be managed or balanced unless they are squarely recognized. The ncaa undermines this logical separation by insisting sports are an educational supplement for a hybrid creature under its jurisdiction called the student athlete. Universities implicitly concur by offloading some academic responsibility to the ncaa. Fourth the ncaa and its member schools strip rights from athletes uniquely as a class. No college tries to ban remunnerative work for all students, no legislature could or would confis case earnings from one group in a legitimate enterprise, on the contrary, universities sponsor extensive work Study Programs and student citizens everywhere market skills everywhere from book store jobs and pizza delivery to the entrepreneurial launch of facebook unless they are athletes. For College Athletes alone the ncaa brands such industry industry unethical. Equity. Basic fairness requires attention to the rights and freedom of participants above the convenience of observers. Applied to College Sports, this principles would mean no freedom should be a bridge bus of athletic status. While i am neither a lawyer or professional economist, i find ample historical evidence that experts object to collusion in the ncaas regulatory structure. In microeconomics, a prominent text book professors make the ncaa a featured example of an economic cartel, which reaps anticompetitive profit t. Courts have agreed in two landmake mark case in ncaa versus the board of regents of oklahoma, 1984 the u. S. Stream court struck down the exclusive control with College Football broadcasts as in the legal restraint of trade. Overnight the major football schools win the freedom to sell every broadcast their markets would bear without having to share proceeds through the ncaa. We eat what we killed, bragged one official at the university of texas. In law, the ncaa, 19 napth, assistant coaches won a 54 million settlement along with an order have a indicating the ncaa inter16,000 will be starting salaries. The compensation of assistant to be coaches cracked the 13 million barrier with salaries skyrocketing in nonrevenue sports. By 2010, the university of florida paid its volleyball coach 365,000. Thus, the supervisors of College Sports have won Economic Freedom and they enjoy enormous large s from a marketplace that shackles only the most vital talent, the players, to reduceburgening producer by student athletes the ncaa creates rules regarding eligibility and the terms of compensation. Ncaa officials, of course, steadfastly assert their whole system is devoted to the Educational Welfare and benefit of the College Athletes, football will never again be placed ahead of educating, nurtureing and protecting young people. Ncaa president mark emerratic sitting near me vowed when he announced ncaa sanctions for the recent scandal at penn state. Such professions must be reconciled with ncaa rules that systematically deny athletes a full range of rights from due process and representation to the presumption of innocence, these rawls can turn words on their head like alice in wonderland the bed rock pledge to avoid commercial exploetation of College Athletes, for instance, aims to safeguard them from getting paid too much or at all rather than too little in the ordinary usage of the word exploit to use selfishly for ones ends as employers who exploit their workers. In closing, i would suggest one hopeful precedent from the past work of your commerce committee. This is not the first time that the governance of am cure sports together with the education of College Athletes has presented a daunting tangle of passions and vested interests. 50 years ago, an early bonanza in sports revenue intensified the bitter feud between the ncaa and aau, which controlled access to the olympic games. Aau leaders accused and quote unpatriotic ncaa of sabotageing u. S. Chances to win med also. They claimed College Athletes already were paid and, therefore, not amateurs at all since the ncaa approved scholarships in 1996. Aau coaches they said were parasites on College Training facilities. They nit picked, boiktd, boiktd boycotted each other and sabotaged each other for the hopes for the fine 64 tokyo olympics. The squabbling exhausted macarthur who recommended a blue ribbon competitions that brought proposals eventually to this committee. Your predecessors shaped what became the olympic and amateur sports act of 1988. One secured for active athletes a 20 share of the voting seats. Those small, this representation soon transformed amateur sports, granted the boys athletes tipped the governing committees in the United States and inoaksorably around the globe. Marathon races and tennis tournaments recognized the players to keep their olympic eligible. New leaks strang sprang up, volleyball and other games, olympic officials came to welcome professional competitors in every sport except boxing. By 1986 when the International Olympic committee expunged the word from its bylaws, it dwoe defied everything from disasters. Some of you helped recognize success in the revised ted stevens olympic and amateur sports act of 198. This example suggest as good as place to start. Wherever possible, make athletes true citizens rather than glorified vessels in College Sports. Where markets extend into College Sports, make them fair and competitive. Recognize the rights, uphold the rights of College Athletes. Give them a voice and calgary universities, inturn to make wise, straight forward decisions about the combatibility of sports in education. Thank you. Thank you very much, mr. Branch. I want to be very critical of myself because what is the general rule around here is witnesses speak for five or six minutes but i failed to make that clear and so which just got it says five minutes right here but i wasnt watching. Sorry. Id keep it for thetive or six or seven minutes. That would be the best and i thank you for your testimony and it was my fault mr. Bradshaw at temple university, we welcome you, sir. They were rockefeller, Ranking Member thune, members of the committee, good afternoon. Your indication to me to testify about promoting the wellbeing and success of our student athletes is appreciated. Its an honor to represent the 1,600plus institutions and 11,000plus individual members of nafta and administrators the practitioners of our enterprise in representing in excess of 3500,000 student athletes across the Ncaa Division as well as the naia junior colleges. Nanta serves for our athletic administration. It provides Educational Opportunities and serves as a veck for new yorkering the exchange of information and advocacy on behalf of the association. My career in Higher Education includes positions as an assistant baseball coach, head cable baseball coach, director of alumni, 36 years as a division 13 Athletic Director at three universities. My career includes three years as a student athlete. One as a walkon, followed by two years as a professional baseball player in walk Senators Organization where two broken ankles influenced a Career Change and a masters degree. I trust my ankles are safe with you washington as far as today. These experiences prove valuable to my ascent things year as a director at lasalle, depaul and temple universities, retireing from this wonderful profession one year ago. During the five decades, i have seen significant commitment by universities to the academic, athletic and personal experiences of student atmosphere leechlts from state of the art support services, elite coaching and training to the much improved equipment, safety requirements and emerging ncaa permissive benefits, our student athletes have never had it better. Yet, we know we can do it better. We as educators are committed to the academic and personal potential our talented student athletes bring to our universities. In assessing the wellbeing of student athletes, its important to examine our University Performances and trends in the areas of academics, financial security, health, safety and life skills. Academics. Oefr the past 20 years, Graduation Rates by any met trek have drastically improved for student athletes. In 2013 the graduation succession rate measured for all student athletes in division i was 82 including 72 for division i sps football participants and 73 for mens basketball student athletes. Among the reasons for this dramatic improvement and Graduation Rates are increased ncaa requirements for initial eligibility and continued eligibility and universitys proactive response for the academic progress metric instituted by the ncaa to measure individual teams classroom performs each semester. Health and safety. While universities strive to use best practices, we can never do too much to insure the health and safety of our student athletes t. Prevention of concussions, for example, particularly in the sport of football remain as the highest priorities for every director at every level. Best practices that have become common place include coaches, dietitions and few tristianistings. Required seminars to discuss drugs and alcohol, assault, date rain and gambling as well as comprehensive regular drug testing and followup. Financial security. As we all foe the real cost to attend college have risen above inflation for years, causing many students to have massive debt upon graduation and proving too costly for others to attend a college of their choice. Currently, division i students receive 23. 13 billion in athletic scholarships. This total will escalate with ncaa legislation covering real costs, combined with the annual increases in tuition, room, board, books and fees. In addition to the real value in athletic scholarship and according to u. S. Scence sus on average the College Students earns 1 million more over a lifetime than a nonbenefit. Others include University Health insurance, ncaa catastrophic insurance, multiyear athletic grants and student Assistance Funds available through conference offices. The vastly improved conditions afforded student athletes have resulted in their unprecedented performances in the classroom. On the playing fields and if preparation for life. Few other campus activities or clubs produce such natural diversity as intercollegiate athletics, bringing together men and women, regions, nations, beliefs, with the common denomination being their academic profiles and skills. Less than 131st of athletes will participate in professional sports. That lasts on average a few years. This reality underscores the reality of a College Education that many young men and women cannot afford. In our profession of inner collegiate athletics, they are the center of our universe and the most important people to consider in our decisionmaking. If we always ask ours before allocating resources, building facilities or hiring coaches, is this decision in the best interest of our student athletes . Then i believe that answer has helped us arrive at the right decision. Any of your questions are postwelcome. Thanks for inviteing me to be with you this afternoon. Thank you very much, mr. Bradshaw. Now, dr. Richards, who is a professor at the university of South Carolina the director of the College Sports Research Institute. Welcome, sir. Thank you. Chairman rockefeller, Ranking Member thune and distinguished members, thank you for the opportunity to speak for you today. My initial draft of my comments was only 35 minutes so thank you for giving me the advice. As director of the College Sport Research Institute at the university of South Carolina, my comments today are not off the cuff remarks but informed by social, logical, organizational and economic theories as well as empirical studies and drawn exextensively from ncaa documents and my work and colleagues and scholars. I am aware there are distinct sociograbbing differences within Ncaa Divisions and revenue and olympic sports, my testimony today will focus on how within big time College Sport ncaa members have sought to protect their interestss at the expense of the well being and academic profit athletes. For several decades, the ncaa was aware it is the scale of Revenue Generation and spending continue to grow, there is a general sense that big time athletics is in conflict with the principle of amateurism, increased governmental and public scrutiny is likely if Graduation Rates do not improve and consequently in 2003, the ncaa embarked on a twophase organizational rebranding strategy, a part of a public Media Relations agenda, that addressed critics and provided an alternative to what the ncaa described as a dogrel of cynics, they created a model of afrt, a collegiate model of am curism that isolates the principle in the way College Athletes are viewed without imposeing itsed a vocational nature on opportunities. Notably, division i revenues have more than doubled since 2003. Tellingly, internal ncaa documents reveal protecting the collegiate model is nearly, by definition, the primary focus of the ncaa president. Concurrently in the effort to maintain the deception of a clear line of demarcation between college and professional sport and offer the support for the effectiveness of the academic progress program. The ncaa developed the progress rate for apr and graduation success rate for gsr. Since 2003, the ncaa has consistently sought to utilize these rates as proof that big time kreej sport has one clear focus, education. However, several items are noteworthy, one, neither the federal Graduation Rate fgr mandated by congress nor the ncaas gsr is perfect or inherently a more accurate met trek. They utilize different sampling and afal cease to examine different cohorts, in short, they are different Graduation Rates. Two, the gsr consistently returns a rate 12 to 25 higher than the fgr. As far back as 1991, the ncaa knew that removing eligible dropouts, in other words, transfers or athletes who leave school in good academic standing from the gsr cohort would result in a markedly higher success rate. Three, since there is no comparable National Level gsr for the general student bid to report gsr and fgr data simultaneously in press releases or data set tables, invites inappropriate comparisons and posted theers confusion among the general public. While the Ncaa National Office Sought to protect its collegiate model. They labor within a system that too often depends on a special talented admission process, focuses on maintaining eligibility and results in athletes often clustering or being steered to majors conducive to their practice and competition or in other words work schedule. Tellingly, several authorities within the ncaa and university govern fans structures, recognize clustering and scheduling of easy course as problems. In addition, contrary to the ncaas public postureing, they are normal students. Profit athletes tend in important respects to be physically, culturally and socially isolated from the campus community. They live in a tightly controlled parallel universe indicative of total institutions. Through the steady drum beat of sophisticated and subtle institutional propaganda the ncaa has sought spontaneous consent to a mythology that big time College Sport enhances the educational experience of quote unquote student athletes. Propaganda is effective because it exploits peoples reluctance to intellectually engage alternative views. Since 2003, while the ncaa has successfully embedded its collegiate model of athletics, including the graduation success rate into the publics consciousness, there has been little progress in insuring profit athletes of equal access to Educational Opportunities afforded other students. In conclusion, there is clear evidence the ncaas collegiate model of athletics not only systematically inhibits access to education but exploits profit athletes by denying them basic bargaining rights due process and standard forms of compensation. I want to thank the xhd members for the opportunity to visit with you today. Thank you for your excellent testimony and finally dr. Mark emerick, who is, you all know who he is. Dr. Mark emmert. Good afternoon, senator and good afternoon to you and for thune. Is your microphone thank you. I appreciate that. Is it working now . Can you hear me fine . I notice no difference. As a every roing University President , ive learned to project. So, thank you very much. And good afternoon to all of you on the panel. Im make emmert. I serve now as the president of the ncaa since okay of 20130 following 30 years as a professor, University Administrator and University President. I certainly appreciate the opportunity to appear before all of you today and discuss what i agree are very important issues and i particularly want to thank you, mr. Chairman, for working with us on the timing of this hearing. Its good that we are able to be here. The ncaas core purpose as already pointed out is to promote the well being and success of 34 sxikt i 60,000 students athletes as they enjoy world class athletic experience and receive access to top notches educations. Thats why i have been working diligently with the division i board of directors, member universities and automatic stake holders to drive policy changes that supports student athletes success and, indeed, address many of the issues that have been raised here today. During my tenure, we have enacted more than a dozen key reforms, two notable examples are raising academic standards and raising the opportunity for multiple year scholarships. As we discuss how to improve College Sports today, its important to understand the ncaa is a democratically governed association of nearly 1,100 colleges an universities. As such neither i nor any member of my staff have a vote on policy or infractions decisions. Its important to note that University President s, themselves, are the ultimate Decision Makers within the association. Members make rules through a representative process much as you do in congress. It is challengeling, obviously, to bring together coaches, student athletes and University President s to achieve consensus on much of anything let alone College Sports and while the pace of change is not what i or many others would like the division i member schools are working very diligently even as we speak to create a new decisionmaking structure that will yield practical and i hope timely results on all of these issues. Before we discuss the challenges at hand, let me be clear. College sports in my opinion works extremely well for the vast majority of our 3460,000 student athletes. While it can and should be modified the collegiate model should, in fact, be preserved because all the good provides for so many. Nonetheless, i agree there are many changes that need to be made and many president s agree with me. Let me describe the most important ones. First, student athletes in my opinion should be given a scholarship for life so they may complete a bachelors degree even if their education is delayed for any reason unrelated to a lack of academic progress or serious misconduct. Sec, scholarships should cover the full and actual cost of attendance, not simply twirks room, board, books and supplies. 3rd, ncaa schools must always lead in the area of health and safety. For example, the nca, along with a variety of medical experts released recently new guidelines that address the diagnosis the management and prevention of sportsrelated concussions. Fourth, the ncaa must work assertively with all of our universities on Sexual Assault prevention and support for victims. This is a National Crisis and we can all do better. Fifth, while all student athletes today are covered by insurance for injuries and the ncaa covers catastrophic injuries, any gaps if coverage must be closed. Sixth, the academic success of student athletes must remain our ultimate priority. This means providing them with a time as well as the resources they need to take advantage of the opportunities at College Campuses as our two former athletes here have testified. Finally, all changes that are made, these and others must maintain a support for title 39 and cannot come at the cost of student athletes and womens and nonrevenue generating sports. The ncaa provides countless opportunities to men and women, including many from low income family was would not otherwise attend college. In fact, some 82,000 current student athletes are first generation College Students and at the risk of correcting mr. Intlaud, it is now 23. 37 in athletic scholarships provided to students that make that a reality. Further ncaa revenues are reinvested in our mission. Specifically, last years revenue allowed us to conduct 89 National Championships in 23 different sports with nearly 50,000 student athletes participating in those championships from across the entire country. Those revenues allowed us to provide 3700 million wage to colleges and universities in all division, 100 million was used to cover extra expense for division i student athletes. Furs, those revenues allowed us to cover the 14 million Insurance Premium for catastrophic insurance policies for our student athletes. College sports are serving student athletes very, very well for the most part. Yes, there are changes to both policy and a culture that are needed and they require frank conversations like the one were having here and serious action. Im committed to, whoing with you and our member schools to insure that student athletes have all the opportunities for success they deserve and i want to thank you for the invitation, mr. Chairman, to appear today. I look forward to taking your questions and working with you in the future. Thank you very much, mr. Emmert. I will start, senator thune will follow, then senator coach and we will proceed from there. According to your website, im going back to some bake stuff. Student athlete, Health Safety and well being remain our top priorities. Yet, in court papers filed for a lawsuit in which a family sued the ncaa after their son died from a brain injury suffered in the preseason football practice, the ncaa asserted that, quote the ncaa denyles it has a legal duty to protect student athletes. Closed quote. I find that extraordinary. Now i know your answer is going to be. Thats going to upset me. But the question is, how do you reconcile your websites publicly stated priority, promoting health and safety with your private legal arguments which you will declare somehow are different that the ncaa doesnt have a legal duty to protect student athletes. You either do or you dont. I will not quibble about the language. I think that was at the very least a terrible choice of words created by Legal Council to make a legal argument him i am not a lawyer. I am not going to defend or deny what a lawyer wrote in a lawsuit. I will unequivocally state we have a clear, moral obviously gaegs to make sure we do everything we can to support and protect student athletes. See, what i perceive is a web of convenient protection from, to all parties. You suggested that there are a number of universities, see, what i really want to see is to have a panel of subpoenaed University President s from land grant publicly funded universities up here. I think lit come to. That i think its going to have to i dont know how we will work anything out without it. But you say that was bad language by a lawyer who got confused or was later didnt have a good nights rest or whatever it was. And so you sort of slosh over that. Earlier, you said that there are a number of universities that want to make a certain number of changes, which you then enumerated three or four of them. But then you have also said frequently in answer to questions, that you dont have the authority to do anything. Its, you dont have a vote, which you said here, everything is in the hands of the universities. My cynical self says that universities like things exactly the way they are. Theyre making a ton of money, pacific, theyre making so much more money than they ever have been before, not all, but some. That there is about 120 that make most of it. 1320 universities. That i dont know how change is possible. How do you make the case for saying that you can be a participant in this process of bringing about change when you say that they dont have to listen to anything you say . Well, i can tell you, for, what is going on right now. In less than a month now, the division i board will vote on a completely changed decisionmaking structure. They will put all of the subjects that were describing and discussing here today in the hands of the 65 universities that have the largest revenue. The schools that are within the five major im soimplt i got to interrupt. Why would you ic the 65 schools that make the most money . To me they would be the least likely to make changes at all . Quite the contrary, theyre the ones that want to make changes, changes often that have price tags associated with them. They want to make those changes and are often blocked from doing so by institutions that have less revenue, if, for example, you have a model that covers full possible attendance, something the division i board in my first year twice passed. It was overriding by the membership of the 350 schools in the division i predominantly with the support of the 65 major schools saying this is something we really need and they were blocked from doing so by the other institutions. So those schools are, indeed, those schools that i, whose interested are the points that i just enumerated. Indeed, i was practically quoting from a letter signed by all the president s in the pac12 and the president s of the big 130, all of wh big 106789. Are these the smaller ones you say block progress because its expensive . Yes, sir, these are the 65 schools that are members of the five largest revenue conferences the sec, the big 12, the big ten, the pac12 and the acc. Would you agree with me in my final 1st round question that College Sports has long forgotten the word amateurism. . Im talkingt t abouting about tt majors. Western university signed onto the big 12, which guarantees one thing and one thing only. That means that most of the people of West Virginia who are not high income or even moderate income cannot go to any games out in the southwest . But they have done Western University sure makes a ton of. From them. How do you respond to that . Is that right . Is that fair . Is that progressive . If i may, senator, theres two questions being asked there. The first is, do i believe that the 120, the owe 120, expenditures moved up sharply in the past two decade t. Fact that schools are investing those dollars back into the Athletic Program makes it quite clear the universities, themself, are not doing this to turn a profit. Last year the schools, 23 in all of america had positive cash flow, in other words, spent, invested all of the money they had in College Sports and had some left over. Everyone else in the country put resources into College Sports, instead of taking them out. In terms of the changes that occurred in the construction of the conferences over the past handful of years ago i probably agree with you. I was very disappointed in the changes that the conferences saw to make progress in. They created some significant travel challenges, i believe not just for the fans, but also for the student athletes. When you have to go across country for a Football Game is one thing because that only occurs okaeshlly. When its your volleyball team, your basketball team, your soccer team, it means student athletes are traveling a great deal at great expense both on time and energy and commitment. I was quite disappointed in not all but many of those changes that occurred. I thank you. I turn to Ranking Member thune. Thank you, mr. Chairman. You indicated that you have taken the initiative to form some of these division i subcommittees to address needed changes. Im wondering if you can discuss what you hope to accomplish in this initiative. Thank you, senator, first of all, i mentioned, within a month, well see, i hope the board passes a completely new decisionmaking structure because of the challenges of the past 24 hour months of making decisions around a very aggressive reform agenda. The leadership of the 65 leading universities have said we simply have to find better way to make progress. They have identified as their agenda many of the items that i just addressed and a hand. Of others, so there is a very keen interest in finding, first of all, ways to provide greater support for student athletes. Weve passed twice over the past 36 months a proposal to allow universities to give student athletes as a bear miscellaneous experiences. I believer the universities will approve a proposal to do something just like that yet again and i hope an even more robust model to cover the real legitimate costs of being a student athlete. We were able to pass changes that allowed but didnt require multiyear scholarships for student athletes. Prior to three years ago, the universities were literally forbidden by ncaa rules to provide multiyear scholarships. We were able to get a change in the rules to allow them, and i think were well on our way toward mandating they in fact be multiple year commitments, so student athletes dont have to worry about whether or not theyll finish their degree on time. I think that is extremely likely to happen. As you mentioned also, theres a very strong interest in the same group of leading universities to cover the costs fully the costs of insurance programs. The vast majority of the universities cover all of those costs today, but it shouldnt be a question. It should be quite clear that no student athlete will ever have to cover insurance or injuries that are inflicted on them when theyre a student athlete. I think, finally, weve got to address this issue of time. The demands that are placed on student athletes are in my eyes and in the eyes of many, including i suspect mr. Bradshaw, the demands on judge men and women, in terms of whats required for coaching, whats river for informal coaching, whats required to be simply competitive these days is far too great a time demand. We need to find ways i completely agree with mr. Ramsey, for example, we need to finds ways young men and women can take advantage of internships, study abroad opportunities, all the things we know that help prepare them for life, because a very, very tiny fraction of them will ever play professional sports. For virtually all college players, their last game is their last game in college. Their professional life and life in general will be changed by having a meaningful degree and meaningful experiences that go along with that. That means we have to create opportunities for them to do the many things that are available on campuses. Mr. Bradshaw, you bring unique perspective as a former a. D. And as Member Institution. Taking care of the wellbeing of your student athletes. Im told it was your practice to conduct exit interviews, and at sometimes those led to substantive changes in policy, but you have some programs were improved. Do you have any examples from those interviews that you can share with us that led to direct improvements . We gathered our best information from our student athletes about how they were being treated. As many of you might now, student athletes are not the most shy. Absolutely. Like my teenagers, they actually let you know when theyre hungry, when they need things. The exit interviews were invaluable, because seniors were leaving the institution. We also followed up, had questionnaires we sent the seniors a month before they left, then we went over those questionnaires with the student athletes to talk about every facet of their experience he university. That was helpful. We also have a captains council, which was an aggregate of the captains from every team that got together without the coaches, just myself and some administrators to hear everything they had to say about their experience, so that we could use that in recruiting and help to do a lot better job. We also have Team Meetings to welcome the freshmen, and we were able to gather very valuable things. We had one team whose practice facility was maybe about 25 minutes from campus. When they got back in the evening, they werent able to get the kind of quality dinner, because a lot of the students had already been in there, and things were picked over. We were able to extend that time for their meals for an hour so that those student athletes could eat. We also had Football Players who were practices in the afternoon, some of them in premed, and some of the courses they were taking were right up against their practice. We were able to get that football coach to take those practices in the morning when 97 of the classes that the kids were taking were there. So those were very valuable that was very valuable input. Right from the center of our university, the student athletes. My time has expired, but from the Athletic Directors standpoint, what role do you see the a. D. S and universities playing . Some of these you can go beyond what the ncaa is required, but theres a lot of flexibility for the Member Institutions to make decisions in the best interests of their student athletes. And we should. We have the responsibility. Its not only the chairman of the board of trustees, but the president and Athletic Director should all be on board and have similar philosophies and missions and principles about how that works. And in concert with all those people, because sometimes you need funds to do the things that you need to do, and you need the support from the board and the president. So its very important that all of us Work Together to do that. Were out recruiting other student athletes. Thats a brand, we call athletics the front porch of the university. It might not be the most important thing you see when you drive by, but its the most visible messenger of the brand of the university. Thank you, mr. Chairman, thank you. Senator coates. Mr. Chairman, thank you, dr. Emmert thank you for being willing to testify. I think its been constructive to hear of reforms that you have initiated and those that you hope to initiate, and it sounds like theres some real positive things that are happening relative to the issues that are, as you have acknowledged, are challenges for the ncaa, and challenges for the universities, and challenges for our committee. Mr. Chairman, i want to thank you for following through on your commit me to me and to others that were going to have a good solid nontheatrical investigation and Committee Process here. Because i think were all on the same page in terms of how can we best preserve the student athlete and best provide for them, how do we address some of the challenges that were facing today with the revenues, and so forth. And i think this is a very constructive effort that were undertaking here, and i thank you for it. For pulling all that together. Heres what im hearing, and im leading to a question here. Im hearing from our witnesses there are many positive things happening and many posit results coming from being a student athlete. Opportunities that are available to athletes that would otherwise not be able to get the College Experience in the education process. The list of reforming that dr. Emert has bakley said these are his proposals, and i think it goes right to what were, the full and actual cost, taking the lead in areas of health and safety, addressing the Sexual Assault issue which goes across all aspects of athletics, but also College Experience. Its not limited to just one. Medical insurance, dealing with those questions, academic priorities. Weve talked about the time issue, support for title ix. Its been remarkable whats happened under title ix and the number of women able to participate in athletics, gain scholarships. Many of those may not have had a chance for scholarship help and support. The vast majority of schools, whether division ii or division iii, not in the top 65, that offer all these opportunities, its something we want to preserve. Its something we want to improve. I think we have a president of the ncaa who is a reformer, known as that. Thats why he was hired. Hes taken steps already, and willing to take significant steps forward. Now, obviously it goes to this question, dr. Emmert, of the 65. I was encouraged by your response to the chairmans question, relative to their interest in addressing these issues. Its one thing to say theyre willing to do it, its another thing to do it. We wish you success, but we understand that youre the proposal, youre the initiator, but theyre the Decision Makers. So i hope, mr. Chairman, over some period of time here, hopefully relatively soon, we can get a positive result from that effort. I think thats where the these major issues fall. But dr. Emmerit, would you give us one more shot at the ability to address what i think goes to the root of the problem, but also the root of the solution. And that is that the top 65, which are the revenue generators, what we dont want to jeopardize are the other thousand or so that arent, and put them in a situation where they wont be able to fulfill title ix or the level of sports that give so many young people opportunities to participate and get a College Education at the same time. Yes, mr. Chairman and senator coats, i think youre asking two of the most important questions. The first is a recognition that 100 or so years ago when the ncaa was created, it was as mr. Branch pointed out, with some impetuous from the white house and congress because of all the challenges in College Sports. At that time, it was determined that College Sports should be appropriately selfgoverned, that the universities themselves were capable of providing the right kind of structure and guan