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Former GOP representative Joe Scarborough and Mika Brezinski interview newsmakers, politicians and pundits about the issues of the day.
was obvious the meeting was to get information from foreign nationals which is a crime. lawyers running around collusion is not a crime. anybody knows -- a low he ranking congressman like i was in my first year understood you can't get an in kind contribution from mullahs in iran or vladimir putin in russia. >> that's right, joe. the president is concerned. he's anxious, fearful about where this is all headed. his legal team is focused on that trump tower meeting as they have been for some time. that's a key moment in the mueller investigation. our reporting, despite what the president tweeted in response to it very much is that he's worried about don junior, expressed that worry to people he's been talking to on the phone, privately brouting about this. mueller seems to be inching
closer and closer to the oval office, to the people in the president's circle. that's why you see the president lashing out at twitter, lashing out at the campaign rallies, tweet about the witch hunt more and more, tweeting about robert mueller more and more and more. that's how he's channelling all that frustration and for. >> it's important to keep reviewing the facts as the president and others try to muddle them on twitter. "the new yorker's" adam staved son lays out the facts about which there's no dispute at all, that the president and top advisers knowingly met with officials connected to the russian government hopefully to obtain dirt on their political opponent. that document stolen and were later used in an overt effort to sway the election. these are facts, that when the trump tower meeting was uncovered, the president instructed his son and staff to
political scandal, at the end of the day, it may not be the crime, but the coverup to the crime that does the most damage. we have all this in broad daylight. donald trump lying through his teeth about this meeting specifically from the beginning. >> that's the principle point of danger for mr. trump right now, what happened after post meeting. we know for a fact, f-a-c- t, he sat on air force one and helped prepare a false statement. richard, this further i'm meshes him into, not collusion, but a conspiracy. >> harkening about watergate, it's about what you did and then what you do about what you did. when you read the law, it never says money has to change hands, it can be a contribution of any sort.
power of the office of the presidency, but it cuts even deeper than just simply the symbolic significance of that office. it cuts to the heart of who we take ourselves to be as a democratic society. not only was it conspiracy to defraud, he's aiding and abetting, and undermining of our democratic society. what's interesting, i keep going back to this page 379 in michael wolff's "fire and fury." bannon blowing his stack over this meeting and what they did on the airport. he said donald junior will crack like an egg. michael cohen will crack like an egg. bannon said way back when -- whatever we think about that book, bannon expressly said that this would be the problem, this meeting right here. >> and you can disregard so much, kasie hunt, of what bannon
said. you can disregard so much of what's in fire and fury if you want to, but bannon was dead on there. i actually talked to a reporter back in march or april of 2017, and i asked who do you think is in the most legal jeopardy. his response, don junior. he knew about this meeting. none of us, though, knew he was in close with the trump campaign. he knew about the meeting. and if he knew about the meeting, you know mueller's team knew about the meeting. there is no doubt for over a year the mueller team has been looking at don junior and this meeting and the setting up of this meeting and how excited he was to have this meeting and considered him to be perhaps of all the people around donald trump, the person in the most legal jeopardy. >> joe, think about robert mueller's broader strategy as a prosecutor.
he has shown throughout this investigation that one of the most effective ways for him to put pressure on the principals he's interested in going after is to go after their families, to pressure michael flynn's son, for example, to pressure manafort -- paul manaformanafor daughter and son-in-law has come under pressure. it shows you that this is working. this is his name sake's son. those tweets reveal this president has been pushed farther than he has ever before and this is really getting to him. that's not an accident. that's a strategy. >> hey, phil, i've got to ask you just because your team, your paper, you all have done some of the best reporting on this and done the reporting on this particular case that seems to have triggered the president. i find it one of the most extraordinary iron anies of this
whole thing, by writing this tweet out of concern for his son, donald trump has made his son's situation worse by effectively going on the record and saying his son, in fact, was doing something that was illegal. i want to ask you in that context what do people around the president think comes next, given one of the things that triggers trump most is the possible jeopardy of the people close to him including his family, what do they anticipate will be the next stages of this, as trump starts to lash out on twitter, how far do they think he will go to try to protect his son, son-in-law, daughter, anybody in bob mueller's crosshairs. >> john, it's entirely speculative. in truth, they don't know quite how far the president will go. there's a couple of things going on here. there's a general feeling on the legal team, at the white house, generally speaking, that there could be a big shoe to drop from
mueller in the next couple weeks before labor day, he may have another round of indictments and take some action before the midterm campaign season really kicks into gear, labor day, at which there's an expectation that mueller would go dark for a little while until after the election. the second thing going on is trump is currently weighing whether to sit down with mueller for an interview. those discussions are going on right now as we speak over the next few days. he's expected to decide -- he and his lawyers have been disagreeing about this. the president wants to talk to mueller for the interview. the lawyers obviously don't want him to because of all the potential problems the president could create for himself if he's not truthful. we know he's not always truthful. "washington post" fact checker has over 4,000 miss truths and lies so far. that's what you're seeing fueling the president. >> a larger universe that
haven't spoken about. it's the universe called america. right now america is being led by a man who uses his public appearances at rallies across this country, first time in my lifetime, first time in anyone's lifetime, that the president of the united states uses these appearances to foster hate, division, unrest, and you just wonder now really the impact of that. i wonder about it, about the impact of that much more so than these legal things that he's going to go through, obstruction, whatever you want to call it, conspiracy. this is really a pivotal moment in the course of american history. >> it really is. there are so many different americas. it's a big place. i remember during the bp spill and we looked at the sewage -- the oil coming out of that pipe at the bottom of the gulf.
and somebody that was a lifelong resident of the gulf of mexico was concerned. we were all concerned. we read articles about how that would destroy all life in the gulf for 50 years to come and shrimping industry would be wiped out. well, it's a big gulf. it went away. thank god it went away and hopefully there won't be too much contamination about it. but there are different americas. there is the america of donald trump's white house. there's that reality, something that we focus on an awful lot because it's our job to focus on it. the russia investigation is extraordinarily serious. the violence he does to constitutional norms, extraordinarily serious what he says about reporters, extraordinarily serious. we focus on that. most of americans aren't focusing on that right now.
they are still focusing on their job, their paycheck every two weeks, how their small business is doing, are they going to be able to comfortably afford to send their kids back to school in the fall, are they going to be able to get a new car? by that standard, a lot of america is thinking things are going pretty well and no, i'm not going to be watching donald trump at a rally, i'm going to watch "the office," "modern family," a movie on netflix. that's sort of what i found during impeachment. we were all going crazy up on capitol hill. most everybody else during that time, the kids were out of school. they're getting ready for christmas. they were focusing on things far different than what we were focusing on. it doesn't mean what we or talking about, mika, right now isn't extraordinary important. i think it is. as far as history goes and
government goes, it is the most important thing, and we have to talk about it. people have a responsibility to talk about it. we do have to understand that for a lot of people donald trump is an entertaining side show, perhaps a maddening side show, but they see a very strong economy. it's going to be a question, do more of those people go out in november, or do more young people, black voters, hispanic voters that have been insulted, muslim american voters who have been told you don't belong in america, do more of those voters go out and say, enough, this isn't the land that we read about growing up. this isn't the land that is framed by the statue of libbert. we'll see. there's no doubt right now it's a little complicated out there and either party can win. >> a lot of folks are busy with their jobs. our jobs are to ask the
questions which we'll continue to do. philip rucker, be thank you and your reporting. >> mika, also, what our jobs are, too, to watch the yankees and the red sox. >> well, there is that. >> richard, let me tell you something, 162 games -- as you know, this time yesterday, this time yesterday 40 years ago the boston red sox were 40 games ahead of the new york yankees and then a guy named bucky dent came into fenway and hit a home run. it ain't over, richard, until it's over. but just between you and me, it's over. >> joe, i thought you were a bigger and better man. if it makes you feel big to go after me today, i mean really. >> it's really all i have in life, richard. >> still ahead on "morning joe," trump says he likes mike. michael jordan says he likes lebron. how the president's attempt to
divide sports fans, backfired completely. one of the folks weighing in on that, the ex-president of iran who stepped up his twitter trolling over the weekend. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. call in the next ten minutes... and if that's not enough, we'll look after your every dollar. put down the phone. and if that's not enough, we'll look after your every cent. grab your wallet. (beeping sound) (computer voice) access denied. and if that's still not enough to help you save... oh the new one! we'll bring out the dogs. mush! (dogs barking) the old one's just fine! we'll do anything, seriously anything, to help our customers. thanks. ally. do it right. it's a high-tech revolution in sleep.
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and lets you control your network with the xfi app. it's the ultimate wifi experience. xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. president trump spent part of his weekend in a war of words with basketball superstar lebron james. >> because that really makes sense, mika. if you're worried about an upcoming election in ohio, you want to attack ohio's favorite son right before that special election. >> the president tweeted, lebron james was just interviewed by the dumbest man on television, don lemon, he made lebron look smart which isn't easy to do. i like mike, a reference to michael jordan. the tweet followed an interview by lemon of james for the new school for at-risk children in
his hometown of akron, ohio. it included a negative assessment saying the president using sports as a way to divide us. james received a wave of support including from michael jordan. a spokesman saying he supports james adding he's doing an amazing job for his community. first lady melania trump commended james on his school. her spokeswoman maintained in a further statement that mr. trump was not taking sides on the matter. >> kind of like the united states saying on december 8, 1941, we or not taking sides on the matter. >> over five years ago, he tweeted congratulations to king james on winning athlete of the
year. lebron is also a great guy. >> you can almost hear -- this guy sounded like an old, grumpy, white racist grandpa in queens or in alabama yelling at his tv said saying this black man is stupid, that a black man is stupid. first you'd say, gee, boy, he's really losing it because who would be that racially insensitive to do that, but no, it's his strategy. it's what donald trump thinks. he told his staff members, basically attacking black athletes, that's really good for me, that's really good politically going into the midterms. >> i think you're right, joe. remember the speech in alabama when he went after nfl players
and called them s.o.b.s. it's a situation trump is most comfortable, especially when he's in trouble, to to be the cultural warriors that speaks to the dark underside of this country. to go after lebron revealed very clearly a pattern, a pattern that speaks to his on going belief about black folks and women in particular because he has this pension to describe black people as dumb. he has a tendency to describe women as dumb, not just maxine waters, but women in general. so it seems to me this is trump being the cultural warrior. the irony is this is the man who founded trump university, this fraudulent thing. here is lebron james opening up a public school in cleveland. you couldn't get a better contrast of moral human beings. >> and every phase of their life, mike barnicle. by the way, mel len dwra's spokesperson can say she cuss on the trying to get involved, but
she got involved in the middle of it and chose to side with lebron. >> joe, this gets to what we were talking about before the break and what eddy just spoke about. race remains now and forever the third rail of american life, not american politics. we really don't have a handle on it. we have a leader, the ostensible leader of the united states of america, the president of the united states, who continually plays with it and provokes people with it. it's truly dangerous and it's going to end even more badly than it is right now. >> it would be bad enough if it were restricted to african-american athletes and to african-american women, female members of congress like maxine waters. think about it. you have barack obama, the first african-american president of the united states, he's from kenya. maxine waters, she's an idiot.
blackwater, idiot. black after countries, s holes. if you think of anything in political life, cultural life, gloenl life that associates itself with dark pigmentation, the president of the united states thinks they're idiots, evil, fraudulent. it's not just a pattern that extends -- yes, he's obviously mao maoing colin kaepernick and african-american nfl players and lebron james now. he doesn't restrict himself to one species of african-american, or one category of african-american. if you're black, the president takes a crap all over you. this gets to your point about toxins. it's the most consistent thing in your public profile. >> he's injected it. >> other than don king you can't find an african-american that the president has any respect for. >> it's such a turn to his
private life before he was in politics and when he actually both personally and professionally had friends, had acquaintances in the black community. yu can talk to reverend al about it. you can talk to a lot of entertainers about it. so it is this calculated, cynical, david duke-like use of racism for political gain. as meacham always says, it may be a good starter, but it's a terrible finisher. you don't have to go back that far, john heilemann, to see what's happened in the past, predict what's going to happen in the future. go back to doug jones' special election in alabama. i think one of the most remarkable statistics i've seen in quite some time is the fact that more alabama black voters
across what they call the black belt in central alabama, a higher percentage of black voters came out to vote for doug jones in that special election than voted for barack obama in '08 and '12 percentagewise, is unheard of. it is historic. it's probably never happened before, and donald trump is the reason it happened. right. joe, i'll ask eddie about that. the president thinks this strategy helps with his base clearly. there's plenty of evidence to suggest that donald trump is a stone-cold racist. beyond that, there's the politics of it. he thinks it helps with his base. for every dispossessed, self-pitying white voter who likes the fact that donald trump takes on every feyerick in sight, there's often an african-american female voter we saw in alabama who is equally
inflamed by donald trump's behavior towards african-americans and his tolerance for and praise for white nationalists and neo-nazis in charlottesville, virginia. >> we saw that evidenced in alabama and virginia. i think it's important that we not simply think about donald trump appealing to a racist base. he sits in the sweet spot between loud racist, the soft bigotry of liberals and the contradictions of american capitalists. and what do i mean by that? when he sends out that bone, throws out the red meat, that's okay. it speaks to them. the soft bigotry, that's the silent majority, the folks that believe big government is taking money from hard working white people and giving it to undeserving brown people. these are folks that want to keep their neighborhoods the way they are, the folks committed to
racial equality but according to social science data, that are skeptical of policies that will remedy racial inequality. then you have folks working their behind off in rural america, working their behinds off with three jobs in urban america who can't make ends meet. donald trump sits right in that sweet spot. every time he engages in a cultural war, he's throwing a bone to the racists. it's easy for us to think we can just denounce him as the loud racist, but that's not the source of his power. the source of his power is he sits at the intersection of all three of those things, in my view. >> he kbruuses this power to cr policy that separates children from families and attacks a sports star who creates a school for at-risk kids. it's really sad to use the president's little term, sad.
still ahead, from the start of his presidency, donald trump has muddied what should have been a clear message, russia interfered. now "the washington post" is taking a deep dive into what happened in 2016. that is coming up next. is z hey, no big deal. you've got a good record and liberty mutual won't hold a grudge by raising your rates over one mistake. you hear that, karen? liberty mutual doesn't hold grudges... how mature of them. for drivers with accident forgiveness liberty mutual won't raise their rates because of their first accident. liberty mutual insurance. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty ♪
this president wants to make very clear that he was not the president in 2016 when evidence of russian interference and meddling in our democracy in 2016 was presented to that president and his security team and buried because they wanted the other person to win and indeed thought she would win the presidency. >> white house counselor kellyanne conway yesterday giving some more alternative facts. but when the department of homeland security and director of national intelligence issued a statement in october of 2016 publicly blaming russia for hacking, president trump claimed it was to hurt his candidacy. >> i notice any time anything wrong happens, they like to say the russians -- she doesn't know if it's the russians doing the hacking. maybe there is no hacking. they always blame russia. the reason they believe russia
because they think they're trying to tarnish me with russia. >> this morning "the washington post" announced this coming october it will release a book exam eng russian enter fines in the 2016 election and the subsequent political, legal and diplomatic fallout. the book is entitled "the apprentice, trump, russia and the subversion of america," written by greg miller who joins us now. greg, thank you very much for being on. >> thank you. >> who is the apprentice in this case? and also, i understand you conducted hundreds of interviews with people who are there. as much as donald trump thinks it's to hurt him, this is about america being attacked, is it not? >> the apprentice, we love the title. it works on a number of levels here. trump is an apprentice in many ways, learning on the job.
it ties back to the job and he's so subservient to vladimir putin that he seems like an apprentice to the ruks leader. >> to what extent would the russian policy or intervention, however you want to call it, was that triggered by donald trump's emergence on the american political scene. regardless of the specific candidates that emerged if. >> that's a great question. what we know from intelligence reports and intelligence sources is that it started broad for russia. the sber feerns in the 2016 election, started with broad objectives to undermine american democracy, to make america look dysfunctional. it had a side objective of trying to tarnish hillary clinton because of vladimir putin's animosity toward her. in the middle of the campaign when it looked like trump was starting to rise above the
crowd, the russian campaign pivoted behind him. we're coming to terms with the extent and reach of that effort. this books goes really, really far in trying to understand and explain just how significant it was. >> greg, it's kasie hunt. i've envious that you've had so much time to focus on one topic as we've struggled to keep up with the daily pointing. to that point, we are struggling every day to understand, to follow these tweets, figure out what is important, separate the noise from the substance. having spent all this time looking at this, what are the points that we should be spending the most time focused on? is it the trump tower meeting? is it the president calling for russia to find the 30,000 missing hillary clinton e-mails? what are the key turning points? >> you hit on a couple of those key turning points, but i have to say two things. one, i feel you.
the daily deluge -- even working on this project for the past year was really hard at times, to turn your eyes, to avert your gaze from the daily developments and crazy and chaos. by i think what i took out of this exercise was to look at the sweep of the story. what we tried to do with this book is help people understand the origin of this and where it's taken us as a country. it goes inside not only the white house, but the president's legal team. it goes inside facebook. it goes inside the cia, inside the fbi and inside the mueller investigation, and it brings all of that together. >> greg, you just mentioned one of the least discussed aspects of where we are now with regard to putin and russia and the present administration, and it's the root of this, the origin of this. hillary clinton and vladimir
putin. give us an explanation of what happened and why it so affected putin to the extent he's doing what he's doing. >> as you must know, vladimir putin is really animated and motivated by a deep sense of grievance, a conviction that the collapse of the soviet union was a terrible development for russia, that it stepped back and ceded power in the world in a way it should president have. he became focused on hillary clinton much later when he was president of russia, when there were protests around russia in places like ukraine. and then when protests erupted in moscow, he blamed hillary clinton who was the secretary of state at time for fomenting this opposition to him, and he identified her as the point person for an american effort to
unseat him, for regime change. he really believed that that was the case. >> the book "the apprentice, trump, russia and the subversion of american democracy" will be available october 2nd. greg miller, thank you very much for being on this morning. >> thank you for having me. still ahead, a closer look at the abolish i.c.e. movement and the president's child separation policy. we'll talk to the author of a new piece entitled "how i.c.e. went rogue". plus, nicolas maduro survives what his government describes as an assassination attempt. we'll discuss that when we come back. (vo) this is not a video game.
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in caracas. he was speaking when an explosion occurred. the camera cuts to a wide shot of the scene and following another apparent explosion. large number of soldiers in attendance break rank end flee. the attack came from overhead drones. in an address shortly after, maduro blamed far-right groups in venezuela inaddition to financiers and planners that live in the united states in the state of florida. maduro also says it's part of a plot linked to colombian president, something a colombian officials tells reuters is absurd. the ap and reuters report a group called national movement of soldiers in t-shirts has claimed responsibility on twitter although nbc news has not confirmed the account. venezuela says it has detained at least half a dozen people so far. richard haas, what is going on? >> what you have is a country that has the world's largest
reserves of oil is collapsing. venezuela is a failed state. the currency is down 1 mill thrown the dollar. hemorrhaging between 25 and 50,000 people a month. overwhelming its neighbors. this is a country that -- it's way past the point of any viability. being propped up more than anything else by cuban security personnel, and the question is how does this nightmare end, or does it end? >> richard, let me ask you, how does a country that has such a wealth of oil reserves, how does it collapse this way over a decade or so? >> because over a decade first you had chavez now mr. maduro. it's totally corrupt. totally status leadership. it's anti-business. it's against the people. it's driven out the most
educated, talented people. this is a tragedy. any other place in the world, joe, we would be having a conversation herer and elsewhere about how does the world act? is there some form of intervention. ? instead we have limited sanctions. we can have this conversation in six months or a year. this is an unfolding tragedy. let me spend 30 seconds on something else. what's so interesting with these drone attacks as if we didn't have enough to worry about, we have to add this to the list of things to worry about, wherever people congregate, people can use a drone against our political figure. i think this is a real threat. >> absolutely. coming up the president blows up his team's lie about the trump tower meeting with a single sunday morning tweet. we'll talk about what it means for the mueller probe. and is the state of new york in a position to take out the n ranch. andrew cuomo tweeted if the nra goes bankrupt because of the state of new york they will be
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compares in reducing the risk of stroke. don't stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase your risk of stroke. while taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. it may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. get help right away for unexpected bleeding or unusual bruising. do not take xarelto® if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. before starting, tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures and any kidney or liver problems. learn all you can to help protect yourself from a stroke. talk to your doctor about xarelto®. all throughout, like hundreds, a hundred years, 125 years, whoever has the white house, that party tends to lose the mid-terms. i don't know why. we have the greatest economy in the history of our country. we've had things that never happened before. if the democrats get in, they are going to raise your taxes.
you're going to have crime all over the place. you're going to have people pouring across the border. why would that be a blue wave. i think it could be a red wave. really, it should be a red wave. [ cheers and applause ] >> welcome back to "morning joe". it's monday, august 6th. >> by the way, again, so many things -- >> where do you begin? >> you have to say it. things going well out there. this isn't the greatest economy ever. this isn't close to the greatest economy ever. barack obama had more people getting jobs his last 16 or 18 months than they had jobs during donald trump's first 16 or 18 months. again not to say the economy is not doing well. it is. but all of these claims and i'm not even talking to trump supporters, i'm talking to news reporters who i cannot believe actually will ask a question by saying yes the economy is doing better than it's before done
before. we're in an extraordinary six, seven year recovery right now and that's a recovery we can all be grateful for. and, you know what? that's something we republicans, now a conservative, we conservatives have always given credit where credit is due and that's the small business owners to people working hard. unfortunately, this economy taking two or three jobs. but, yeah, it's a strong economy but mika, this is not an economy that donald trump gave us. this is an economy that's part of the seven year on going recovery. >> got to keep up with the facts. still with us we had have mike barnacle. national affairs analyst for nbc news and msnbc john heileman. professor at princeton university and president of the council on foreign relations richard haas. nbc news capitol hill correspondent and host of ca
kaciedc, kasie hunt. and columnist and political contributor for msnbc and nbc news, peggy. >> -- peggy noonan and peter baker. >> peggy, i want to start with you. always curious what you're thinking. obviously donald trump this past weekend -- well actually hard to say that he went to new territory because he's always in new territory, but, obviously, more unhinged and more unmoored than usual. obviously concerned about his son's possible legal troubles. but where do you put donald trump, the white house and this country as we move into the dog days of august? >> well, i still think in a funny way, even though there's
so much that happens each day the news cycle always seems to dance that there's too much going on. at this same time nothing happens, i think, until more mueller stuff comes in and a final report comes in. that's the point at which you really know where you stand. having said that, i think the thing with the president is something true of him now that was true of him the second day after he took office. it's been true throughout his administration. he talks too much. he obscures and steps on and made us obvious not anything good happening in his administration. he thinks his constant communication is his power. i think instead his constant need to talk and tweet and be in your face and be the center of attention is, in fact, his weakness. but he cannot stop.
he doesn't have enough self-discipline to hold himself back and let events unfold in an interesting way. i think his rallies are amusing to his supporters, and kind of inspiring and kind of fun. for one thing, they all get-together. americans aren't normally together in a big room. they get to see each other. they get to cheer their guy together. i think he says a lot of things that are not true that they know are not true. but they understand or they recognize it's part of his show business, part of his desire just to say things. also he seems to me very big on this statement that's farther to the reality. he likes to say things as if they are true to make them true. that's what we have a year and a half in is a continuation of the drama of donald trump. >> yeah. you know -- >> sorry to go so long.
>> no, no, no. >> no, no. mike barnacle i spoke with three gentlemen this weekend, educated, good guys, decent guys, all trump supporters and sat there and just listened to them and requested why they supported trump, and quite gave me some, you know, some facts that just weren't the case. but, again, i was just listening. but what struck me was they were good men, they were decent men, they were honorable men, they were fathers, they were grand fathers, they would never accept that sort of behavior out of their children or grandchildren or friends that they ignore when it comes to donald trump. there's no doubt donald trump lives by a different set of standards than everybody else. and it just seems -- it was interesting. these trump supporters, these voters did not like him as a
man. wouldn't want him around. but the economy is doing well. and it reminded me so much of what frustrated republicans in the 1990s about bill clinton. it didn't matter what he lied about, if he was lying about transferring missile technology to china versus an intern, it just didn't matter. people would go, you know, the economy is doing well. he is who he is. and that seems to be the attitude that has stuck here. >> well, i'm sure bill clinton will be thrilled that you lump him in with donald trump in what trump is doing, but joe -- >> but it is important, though, that republicans -- republicans were saying the same exact thing in the late 1990s about bill clinton and his lies and nobody caring about him lying that democrats and independents are saying about donald trump now, and i guess what the bigger point is this.
as long as the economy is doing well, everybody is fine. >> that's true. that's true, joe, to a point, i think. but the people who you were with, the men who you were with, i'm sure they were great guys. sadly for them and a lot of others, including a lot of people we see in these halls where the president gathers the crowds together they are falling for the con. language and words as peggy alluded to are the currency of leadership. and the words that this president uses, that mr. trump uses, are all aimed at two things that presidents of the past, no matter who they were, no matter what party they belonged to they never utilized these words in these two ways, to poke at agree grievances and enlist division. >> i said it in the last hour there are so many different
americas, so many subsets. you got, you know, all the americans looking at donald trump and i suspect, i predict that democrats are going to do very well this fall. i'm not so sure how they will do in 2020 if trump runs for re-election. then you have the subset of people that go to these rallies and this really does seem to be the most hardened core of donald trump's supporters who may believe half the things he says there even though so many are lies. then you got the type of people i spoke to this weekend that i know you talked to out on the campaign trail that say yeah i don't like him. i wish the guy would stop tweeting. yeah, he may not be well mentally. he makes a joke of himself. he embarrasses himself. he embarrasses the white house. but things are going well. the economy is going well. my god, what am i going to do, turn it over to nancy pelosi and chuck schumer and have my taxes raised and have my small business damaged.
that's the mindset for so many americans out, there isn't it? >> it is. look voters have always weighed pocketbook issues. i'm surprised he's doing as poorly in the polls as the economy is doing good. a good economy we float the boat of a president and his party heading in to an election. yet this president is still around 40%, 45% depending on which poll you see. numbers as bad as any were before the mid-term debacle for bill clinton in 1994, barack obama in 2010. so, you know, i look at the poll yesterday, in fact. the differential between his approval rating and disapproval rating is minus 15 which is higher than any president. but that core group of people, 40%, 42% whatever it is are sticking by him and part of it is yes the economy is doing
well. he's not getting as much credit as normally he would because of these other issues, his own conduct in office, the investigation, other things that are holding him back. >> we talked about last week, there are political realities. presidents that have 40% approval ratings, lose the house and they lose the senate in mid-term elections. presidents that kowtow to vladimir putin, ex-kgb presidents. donald trump is not in a strong political position. again when we're trying to figure out why people are supporting him a lot has to do with economy which might help i'm in 2020. i'll keep saying this over and over again. 1994 a huge republican year, bill clinton had a strong economy. 2006 a huge democratic year,
guess what? you had george h. w. bush with a strong economy. you can say the same thing about 2014 and barack obama, the economy was, at that point, was in a four or five year recovery. republicans still had a big year. sign the mid-terms it's not always the economy, stupid. usually that's in presidential years. >> let's talk more about the president's sunday tweet. here it is. fake news reporting, a complete fabrication that i am concerned about the meeting my wonderful son, don't had in trump tower. that was a meeting to get information on an opponent totally legal and done all the time in politics and it went nowhere. i did not know about it. donald trump confided to friends and advisors he's worried that
mueller probe could destroy the lives of innocent and decent people namely trump jr. who is under scrutiny by mueller for organizing a june 16th meeting with russians promising dirt on hillary clinton. notice the president at the end says i didn't know about it to make sure he saves himself mostly. as one adviser described the president's thinking, he does not believe his son purposely broke the law, but is fearful nonetheless that trump jr. may have inadvertently wandered into legal jeopardy. on saturday former communications director hope hicks was spotted on the tarmac joining the president on his trip to ohio. according to trump, trump jr. senate testimony hicks was in the middle of the president dictating his son's misleading statement about adoptions to the "new york times," followed by explanation that quickly unravelled.
>> politics is not the nicest business in the world but very standard where they have information and you take the information. in the case of don, he listened. i guess they talked about, as i see it, they talked about adoption and some things. >> there was nothing as far as we would know to lead anybody to believe there was anything but adoption. >> president didn't sign off on anything. he's coming back from the g-20. the statement that was released on saturday was released by donald trump jr. in consultation with his lawyers. >> he certainly didn't dictate but, you know, like i said he weighed in, offered a suggestion like any father would do. >> one of those false statements you heard there was from president trump's lawyer, jay sekulow yesterday. george stephanopoulos got a chance to ask him about it. >> why did you deny trump's involvement. when did you learn that the denial wasn't true. >> number one, i was in the case
at that point, what a couple of weeks and there was a lot of information that was gathered. as my colleague rudy giuliani said i had bad information at that point. i made a mistakes in my statement. >> however, sekulow did not say where he got the bad information from. it's hard to keep up, joe, with the twists and turns of how the president is trying to handle his own lies, trying to protect his son but really actually working harder to protect himself because ultimately it appears to be all about trump. >> well, john heileman, it shouldn't be surprising, but you see one, two, three, four not false statements, lies. four lies spewed out by four different people in the administration, including the president of the united states, and any other administration that person would go out, issue
an apology, said i had bad information, i am so sorry, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. in this case, that line has become so common from some of those same characters, that there's quite a bit of discussion this weekend about where somebody who works for donald trump right now and spread lies for donald trump right now, and refuses to distance themselves from donald trump calling the free press the enemy of the people right now, you sit there and go where are these people going to get jobs as soon as donald trump leaves town? the answer is they just are not. not in any respectable firm. not in any respectable business because of their brand is lying. >> right. it's easy given the fact that as was pointed out earlier given how much the president lies, given the documented 4,000 lies
or something in the course of the first 18 months of the presidency it's easy to lose focus on how extraordinary this statement was, what the president said on twitter on sunday. the president basically came on twitter in a casual enraged fit. went on twitter and basically said that he misled the american people, he dictated a statement, helped shape a statement that was an outright lie about a pivotal moment in the history of the presidential campaign and the history of this investigation. basically said, admitted straightforwardly, went on the record and said this meeting was about colluding with a foreign government or attempting to collude with a foreign government to get dirt on my opponent. he basically said i lied about this, i been lying about this. everyone around me has been lying about this. it is -- i would say peter baker
i'll ask you because you've been with many presidential administrations. you've seen a lot of things. you've seen a lot of lies. there's not a president we've covered that we haven't seen lie. even by the standards of donald trump or by the standard of any president i've covered this is one of the most extraordinary admissions of having lied on the record of any president. i can't think of anything in anales of presidency that's anything like this, not just as gratuitous but consequential. >> it is consequential. we've seen these reports of measure mural looking at the president's tweets as part of his look into whether there's obstruction of justice. certainly in the last couple of weeks more tweets would add to that possible case. this being one of them. the other is his not quite order to jeff sessions to shut down the investigation. so you got a president here that
any lawyer would certainly be leery of having as a client because you can say anything at any time, undermines his own case, his own defers, his own story, his own version of the truth. it must be frustrating to lawyers, like jay sekulow shown right before you were talking there about bad information. who gave him bad information. that was an important thing. if i was a lawyer in a situation being given bad information you have to wonder whether it's worth staying and if you're putting yourself in professional jeopardy. >> peggy, you worked for a president who used language to soar, to make america feel more at ease, more comfortable, to explain things to america. the challenger explosion, things like that, ronald reagan. we all had our differences with ronald reagan, that administration had difficulties as well as every other administration does.
what goes through your mind when you listen to the language being deployed and employed by this president? >> a few things. one is that reagan was clear to use clarity. he wanted to be clear about his thinking. he wanted his arguments to be clear. when he said the soviet union deserves to fall and well he gave the logical case for it. he gave you his thinking. so way beyond a certain aspirational nature or language there was the simple desire for candor and clarity. look, that is not the age we're in now. i think when donald trump was elected i said we have entered the age of the post-heroic presidency. it seems to me people kind of decided, kind of deliberately we're not going be looking up to these fellows any more.
the next person we choose might be someone from the field of entertainment, or an unusual field but it won't be a political figure and it won't be someone aiming for the aspirational styles of old rhetorically. we're in a new time. it's a post-heroic time. i think donald trump knows this, and asserts on it. >> richard, the questions that, you know, we've been asking and we can continue to ask because they are just as relevant now as they have been since january 20th, 2017 is what is the impact of donald trump lying. everybody in his administration lying. one day after another. we talk about baghdad bob, but i'll tell you some of, i think some of america's greatest currency during the cold war, ronald reagan's greatest currency was that the soviet
union lied. they lied to themselves, they tlied their people, they lied to the countries they were enslaving, they lied to the world. and for us that was always a sign ever weakness that they had to lie to try to shape a reality that was vastly -- that could compete with the united states with the reality was that they were vastly inferior morally, economically, and militarily to the united states of america. now it's a president who admires russia's leaders, russia's governing that is producing his own form of problem every day. >> the implications are terrible on many front. you have a divided country that many people can't believe what the president says so how can we act in a unified, concerted way. some of the important things the
united states does in foreign policy doesn't have anything to go diplomats or soldiers it's the example we set. we just talked about ronald reagan who we worked for. this is not a shining city on a hill. the idea we're having the coarseness of this dialogue, this degree of untruth said, this is not a country that the rest of the world will respect, and, again, we should never forget the rest of the world depends on us. if we're seen as lying, if we're seen as not being reliable, essentially the rest of the world will take its fate into its own hands. this will be a world that will have far less american influence, this will be a world that will be far less stable because people will essentially be going their own ways or deferring to powerful neighbors. what this is doing is setting in motion trends here domestically where it's harder for us to come together and reinforcing sentry
fug -- centrifugal forces in the world. this is serious, this is consequential. >> totally agree. peter baker, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning joe" we'll have conversations around two of the most controversial and consequential aspects of the trump administration. the role i.c.e. plays in his immigration policy and the dark undercurrents that welled up in charlottesville one year ago this week. we'll be right back.
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[ audience chanting build that wall ] >> president trump speaking in ohio on saturday and joining us now, national correspondent for the atlantic, he writes the magazine's cover story for the latest issue entitled "how i.c.e. went rogue inside america's unfolding immigration crisis" joe there was some critique of my concern that the president has lost a step or two, or is over the edge on friday, and some analysts or i don't know what to call them, trump abologists state tv that what you thought there was brilliance unfolding before our eyes. he's so talented i can't understand talent when i see it.
>> they said you were so boring. >> that's the other reason. >> went on and talked about you for ten minutes. >> that's okay. >> no, it's great. >> got to talk about something. >> got to talk about something. >> no news to cover. there's nothing going on. at all. >> just wanted to talk about boring things for ten minutes. frank, yesterday what fascinated you. we haven't been able to talk about the world cup on tv, premier league, football starts next week. >> it's going to be good. when are you booking your game clock for the show? >> very soon. they will have a great year. we'll get you back on. we'll get you back on with roger. let's talk about i.c.e. right now. it seems that so much of the immigration debate, so much of donald trump's schtick during the campaign, the crowd chanting, building that wall,
build that wall. it's all nonsense. not fact driven. we've talked about immigration rates plummeting, for a decade now. one thing that's very real is what is now happening on the border with i.c.e. and the separation of children, it seems that i.c.e. has lost its focus on its primary mission because they got a president pushing them to do certain things. >> if we step back we can see that this is a donald trump problem but also an american problem in that we've spent generations now building up a massive immigration enforcement apparatus. and because it exists in this little bubble, this little pocket of civil law in the department of homeland security, it exists in such a manner in which it's able to dehumanize all the people it comes in contact with. the department of homeland security is a classic example of a bureaucratic mess that was put
together in a rush with resources not clear delineations of its authority. we just didn't pay much attention it until the trump administration. now what trump has done that's very different is that he's deliberately tried to cultivate fear. that one of the ends of his administration's policy and this grows out of a doctrine that's very clearly declinated is to cause people to deport themselves. that they want to raise the consequences for the 11 million undocumented, and to make them feel a sense of terror and panic and foreboding that causes them to leave the united states on their own accord. and i studied a group, i went to columbus, ohio, spent with a community of west african-americans who came here, applied for asylum, were rejected because they got scammed. every time i go back to columbus
i see people leaving to go to canada because fear has taken hold. >> i want to ask a question. let me frame it in this way. i want to ask a question about the moral crisis that i.c.e. has put the nation in. in the 1850s there was the fugitive slave law. because it did what it did suddenly tissue of slavery was nationalized. not justin south. it was a moral question that m emerson had to confront in massachusetts. now we have i.c.e.. trying from text family members from being snatched from them. this fear you've talked about. how has this i.c.e., this 248% crease in jail tran fierce, how has this created a moral crisis that's nationalized now, not a local issue. >> that's exactly the way i would frame tight, there's this moral crisis that, you know, i believe in borders and that a nation state has the prerogative
to figure out who comes in and who comes out of the country and immigration is something we should legitimately regulate. when it comes to the 11 million who exist within our communities, these are the other who exist within us, and two-thirds of them have lived in this country for over a decade. and so the way that we treat them is a test of our national character because never before or very, very rarely in our history have we attempted to excise the other from our midst. sure we've turned people away at the border oftentimes callously or turned away immigrants trying to enter through ellis island. but only in very, very rare instances have we gone after and tried to remove people who live amoungs. we did this in 1950s with operation wet back where millions of mexicans were moved and that was a moral stain on our country.
but before the existence of i.c.e., before we ramped up i.c.e.'s existence after nooirn we never had a significant police apparatus that was assigned the mission of removing immigrants from the interior of the country. and it's a tremendous power. it's really -- it's largely unchecked. the way we use that power is indeed a moral test. >> well, you know, peggy, the man you worked with, the man you worked for, ronald reagan believed that immigration was a moral test. he also believed that immigration was extraordinarily critical to who we were to the character of america and he said it throughout his presidency. >> i think in his farewell address he said if a nation has to have walls, the walls should have doors, meaning those who want to come here, who have a compelling reason, who we can
accept, get them in here. it's what we have always done. why would we stop this? reagan thought, i think, in part that the desire to be an america, a hunger to be an american, the hunger to live here was to a certain degree an establishing rationale or a reason for you to be taken in. however, i'll tell you i think we need immigration control, we need an immigration control agency. of course we do. but it looks to me like this is a large agency that maybe has a very strong sense of what is possible for it in terms of its aggression. i'm wondering what could a president do right now, could this president do if he had a mind to, what two things could he do to make this albert on the ground and make i.c.e. seem less intrusive and less obnoxious and
less bullying. >> the ronald reagan example is an interesting one because he was the last president to give amnesty in large number to undocumented immigrants and really the failure of impressive immigration reform is the most serious indictment of our political system because we've had bipartisan agreement about the necessity of coming up with some sort of compromise on immigration reform and because we've had major votes endorsing it it's only because of guerilla tactics of house republicans and the lahaster rule. ronald reagan would understand the problem of bureaucracy has run amuck. that's the issue with i.c.e.. barack obama struggled with how to corral this institution. it took him a long time and a lot of trial and error and a lot of flops before in the last couple years of his administration he was able to
impose priorities on the organization. he said that, that i.c.e. should only target serious criminals for deportation. in the absence of immigration reform that would grant amnesty to most of the 11 million, he said you know what? we're not going to send you out of this country if you swerve out of the wrong lane or run a red light, but if you commit a serious crime you're going to be deported. i agree with you, peggy, that we do need to have some sort of apparatus that deports, deports immigrants because that's just something that we need to have a functioning society but i don't think we want to have a bureaucracy like the one that we've amassed. >> yeah. frank, thank you very much. we'll be looking for your reporting online and in the upcoming september issue of the atlantic. still ahead nearly a year since the deadly rally in
charlottesville, virginia and many perpetrators of that racist violence have not been held accountable. a new documentary is investigating why. that's coming up next.
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nearly one year after the deadly rally in charlottesville, virginia, pbs front line are investigating white supremacist resurgence in america with a new special entitled documents hate, charlottesville. here's a clip from the report that premiers tomorrow night and some of the scenes might be disturbing to watch. >> charlottesville rally was supposed to be about a confederate monument. but anyone who was paying attention could see it was about more than a single statue. it felt like a national reckoning around race was coming. i came here to ask questions. and as the day unravelled into chaos around me, one thing became clear, this was not a place to listen or understand.
charlottesville was a crime scene. front line correspondent and reporter a. c. thompson joins us now. what did you fine in your search for whether or not justice was served out of charlottesville? >> you know, i think one of the key things for us is we encountered one person after another who had been violent in rallies after char advocatesvil -- charlottesville before and after charlottesville. there was no consequence for them. we went looking for these violent actors, not the people who wanted the spotlight but the people who didn't want to be in the spotlight, want to operate
from the shadows and engaging criminal activity and there were a lot of them out there. >> why no consequences, one year after charlottesville why no consequences? >> that's a good question. what we know is that a lot of these local authorities, for example, in berkeley, california to charlottesville don't have a ton of resources to go after these characters. in some cases they haven't been vigorous in going after these characters. we believe that the federal bureau of investigation is more interested in some of these groups, and has acted. but it's still an open question why some of these people haven't been brought to justice. >> what's the consequence that follows from the failure to foum. we know what just happened in portland, oregon. what are the consequences that follow? >> i think the concern is that people that are able to go from one rally to the next and physically attack people, and basically then return to their normal lives they feel like hey i can do this, i can get away
with this and engenders more violence. >> how is it that a collection of neo-nazis stone cold racist from across the country, from many, many different states across the country gather in charlottesville for one specific purpose, everybody in charlottesville once they gets there know what the purpose is. where was the preparation, police planning? >> that's a totally crucial question. it's been overlooked. there was a 200 page report that came out after charlottesville that said hey here are the failures and there were many. there were intelligence failures on the front end. there were failures to really plan. there were failures between the virginia state police and the local police to coordinate and even be able to talk to one another on the same radiofrequencies, but most importantly what we know now is that basically the police said we're going to allow this to escalate. we're going to allow violence to
happen. when that violence has happened we'll have a reason to declare unlawful assembly and clear these people out. that helped to lead to failed consequences of that day. >> it's a year later, right. i'll ask you the biggest urgent question i can. take everything that's all happened, all the attention ever char lost via, what the president said, the counter reaction, the recruiting videos, the totality of everything. a year later has charlottesville been good or bad for the cause of white supremacy in america. >> it works in two ways or even three ways. a lot of people have left the movement. they felt they were chastened by what happened. they don't want to be a part of it. other people said we have to organize big ways. we'll do flash mobs. posters. other people said we'll do terrorism. we'll go underground. we're done with protests and politicking now we'll start
killing people and start blowing stuff up. it goes in three different ways. >> how many people were at charlottesville that day when it all blew up? how big transparent crowds? how big were the opposing forces. >> that's still in debate. if you look at the numbers people put white supremacist 500 with more people on the opposing side. that's about right. you had mostly, you know, around 500 white supremacists, a bigger group of opponents. in the streets directly in front of them was a smaller group. most opponents were nonviolent. >> in a nation of 305 million, 500 really bad guys that's not a lot. so what does it imply to you >> two things. one thing is i think they are reflective of a deeper fissure in society. that's a key thing. is that they are the extreme edge of a deeper movement and a
deeper unease. there's a lot of white people who have to some competent in the last few years said hey, i'm unhappy about illegal immigration, i'm unhappy about immigration period and returned to this na negativist racist rhetoric and these guys are the most extreme version of it. the other thing you don't need a lot of people to do extreme violence. we know that from tim mcveigh. he killed 168 people basically by himself. when you have people this motivated to do harm you don't need a lot. >> you know, kasie hunt, if you go back over the trump presidency, yes, there are bizarre things happening every day. there are abnormalities politically. but i look at three events that caused donald trump, i think, the greatest political consequence. one was charlottesville. two was ripping babies from their mothers at the border and three was what happened in
helsinki and vladimir putin. i think the long term impact of that will being a great. but also great for the republican party. i think going back to charlottesville wasn't that really the beginning of almost -- well, a dramatic abandonment from suburban moms, suburban women and suburban voters that were formerly republicans who helped elect a democratic governor in virginia and helped elect a democratic senator in alabama? >> i think that we are still facing as a country pretty crucial tests around exactly those moments that you point out, and this one in charlottesville was in some ways the beginning. also, it was the sharpest, most emotional in many ways, crystallizing all of the things that this president has done -- did as a candidate, in pushing on these -- or ripping open
really these wounds that have been a part of the american fabric since the beginning of our country. and it is a real test, i think, for american voters to see, okay, you know, are those women that you mention, are they going to come out to the polls in droves in 2018 and then in 2020? or is this president's strategy of inflaming these racial wounds going to really be shown to actually have been effective, joe. >> yeah. and, eddie, i ask you this same question about the long-term political impact of charlottesville. we certainly saw in alabama black voters coming out in higher numbers than even for barack obama's elections in '08 and '12. in a presidential year versus an off-year special election, which it is just an extraordinary political event, and also in virginia. does this -- does charlottesville and beyond, is that what actually breaks donald
trump's hold over washington that's run by conservative republicans? >> i think it certainly will be part of the reason, joe. we will see barack obama numbers, i believe, among african-american voters in the midterm and in the 2020 election. but i want to be very clear, we need to move from melodrama where we have our obvious villains and our obvious heroes and our desire for a happy ending, and we need to understand how deeply tragic this is. a.c. said something that's really important. the white supremacists in charlottesville were the radical edge of a deeper, deeper current. we need to understand that all of this stuff has to be made explicit for us to imagine america differently. if we don't, if we fall back into the old mode we will find ourselves on this racial hamster wheel again, and we can't have that happen. hopefully we are moving into a different moment, but i'm not sure. our history says we won't, but i'm not sure. >> the film is "documenting
hate, charlottesville." premieres tomorrow night on pbs and online at pbs.org/frontline. you can read related reporting at propublica.org. a.c. thompson, thank you for being here. >> thank you for having me. up next, governor cuomo is picking a fight with the nra. we will talk about that and the primary challenger he is facing this fall. the new york democrat joins us straight ahead on "morning joe." ♪ this is a story about mail and packages.
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said he said publicly just a year earlier. he blamed bad information for the original lie without saying where exactly, he joe, that bad information came from. >> well, wherever it came from, it is very obvious you have, first of all, sean spicer lied or was lied to when he went out and gave the briefing, saying that there was nothing but adoption adoption that original meeting was about. then you have jay sekulow lying or perhaps he was lied to by donald trump. either way, it is bad when he also said it was all about adoption. then you had sarah huckabee sanders doing the same thing. she lied to the american people or she was lied to by donald trump. of course, donald trump lying from the very beginning, getting everybody together on air force one, concocting the lie about adoptions, mika. i will tell you, federal prosecutors, state prosecutors, any prosecutors will look to somebody's state of mind.
and when they find out they're lying about something, they understand that there's much more to the story. this was not an innocent meeting that everybody thought was on the up and up. this is not what everybody does, which is their argument. nobody does this but donald trump, and maybe rush's favorite congressman dana rohrabacher. but outside of that, nobody does it because it is illegal to get information, to get anything of worth from a foreign national. so things much cloudier this morning over the white house legally when it comes to robert mueller and the russian investigation. >> and with that, good morning. it is monday, august 6th. just another monday. with us we have msnbc contributor and a very, very happy red sox fan. >> yes! >> mike barnacle. >> yes! >> stop, mike. mike, i may have -- i may have misjudged you. jimmy the greek i am not. i said the yankees since it was august would sweep us. i just had it off just a little bit, mike. >> just a little, capped off by
last night for throws who went to bed early last night, the sunday night game, red sox came back in the ninth to tie it and won it in the tenth, 5-4. richard haas next to me, how are you today? >> let's go back to the news. >> yeah. >> i mean, richard, you could have made that throw from third base to first. i mean in the ninth, i thought -- seriously, i thought it was so nonchalant, i couldn't believe they didn't get zander out. >> even the wild card is beginning to look slightly questionable. this is -- this is worse than the nightmare many of us were concerned going into the four games. so i think it is time to move on though, joe. i don't think we ought to dwell on it. >> mika, it is time to move on, but at some point -- i know we only talk about east coast teams and specifically only two east coast teams. one of these mornings, mike, we're going to have to talk about the oakland a's and the extraordinary job they're doing
right now. >> yes. >> billy ball in full swing. >> oakland is playing very well. again, to richard's point, oakland could catch the yankees for the wild card. >> that would be heartbreaking. >> everyone is a little sleepy this morning. as you see, we have national affairs analyst for nbc news, john heilman, the president of the council on foreign relations -- a very dejected yankees fan -- richard haas. professor at princeton university, eddie claw jr. white house bureau chief at "the washington post" and political analyst for msnbc and nbc news philip rubber, and host of "kasie dc" on msnbc, kasie hunt. i was watching last night. she is awesome. anyhow, joe, as you were saying, it was pretty clear anyway, but now president trump is directly confirming that his son attempted to get dirt on hillary clinton by hosting russians at trump tower. is that bad? we'll get to that in a second. meanwhile, he split his time
over the weekend between attacking the media and attacking lebron james. we'll show you that. and why michael jordan is weighing in, among many others. speaking of stars from the '90s, steven segal is teaming up with vladimir putin. russia made him a special representative to improve relations between the u.s. and moscow. >> that will do the trick. >> we will get to that as well. >> maybe instead of getting a burned-out movie star, maybe just don't try to subvert democracy in america. it will be good. you keep steven, we will keep our democratic processes, and we'll call it even. >> you have dennis rodman for north korea and segal for russia. who is next? who is for iran? anyhow, we will begin with president trump reigniting the controversy around his campaign's june 2016 trump tower meeting with russians. tweeting on sunday, fake news reporting a complete fabrication, that i am concerned about the meeting my wonderful
son -- this is always bad when he does this -- donald had in trump tower. this was a meeting to get information on an opponent. totally legal and done all the time in politics. >> nope. >> and it went nowhere. i did not know about it. >> that's a lie. >> this means he knew about it and his son really messed up. that's my translation. >> three lies in a row, boom, boom, boom. >> he appears to be referring to "the washington post" reporting, trump has confided to friends and advisers he is worried the mueller probe could destroy the lives of what he calls innocent and decent people. remember when he called you about miller, joe? >> yeah. >> anyhow, namely his son who is under scrutiny for organizing a meeting at trump tower, let me help you understand, it is bad. you know he is up and tweeting. as one adviser described the president's thinking, he does not believe his son purposely broke the law. >> since ignorance of the law is actually a -- oh, wait, never
mind. >> but is fearful nonetheless trump jr. may have wandered inadvertently into legal jeopardy. on saturday hope hicks was spotted on the tarmac, joining the president on his trip to ohio. according to trump jr., senate testimony, hicks was in the middle of the president dictating his son's misleading statement about adoptions to "the new york times", followed by explanations that quickly unraveled. >> politics is not the nicest business in the world, but it is very standard where you have information and you take the information. in the case of don, he listened. i guess they talked about, as i see it, they talked about adoption and some things. >> there was nothing as far as we know that would lead anyone to believe that there was anything except for a discussion about adoption. >> the president didn't sign off on anything. he is coming back from g20. the statement that was released on saturday was released by donald trump jr. and i'm sure in consultation with his lawyers. the president wasn't involved in that.
>> he certainly didn't dictate but, you know, he -- like i said, he weighed in, offered suggestion like any father would do. >> it really is odd. it is breathtaking. we're used to the lying, but on something this big, perhaps the most important part of this entire investigation, everything you heard from every white house representative there was a lie. and donald trump admitted this weekend they were all lying. what are the consequences of this? >> well, i don't know what the consequences are, but i know that it is an indication that some folks here are not just in serious trouble, but now recognize they're in serious trouble. i think if you ask the question, joe, you know, last week we watched as donald trump went further, deeper into the realm of public obstruction of justice when he started attacking the mueller probe, suggesting that the attorney general should shut it down. we now have a pretty clear explanation of why it is, that the president is starting to look at the manafort trial
focusing on rick gates, focusing on some of the things that perhaps michael cohen has told investigators about this meeting, about what led up to it, about who might have known about it in advance, about what the president's role might have been, about what donald jr.'s role was. we have an e-mail trail on that. as the president has started to recognize, using various metaphors, walls closing in and the facts are starting to come closer to the surface and corroborating witnesses are starting to come forward or appear to be about to come forward, the president is in an exact 180-degree opposite of what his statement in the tweet says. as mika suggested just a second ago, you know if he's up and tweeting about how he's not concerned about donald trump jr., he's concerned about donald trump jr. >> he's concerned about donald trump jr. phil rucker, he's concerned that donald trump jr. may have stumbled into some illegal territory on his own. also obviously he has to be
concerned by the fact that, again, it is going to be coming out, not only whether it is in the manafort trial or somewhere else, that it is obvious that meeting from the very beginning was to get information from foreign nationals -- in this case the russians -- which is a crime. they can run around -- people, lawyers running around, collusion is not a crime. anybody knows, a lowly-ranking congressman like i was in my first year understood, you can't get an in-kind contribution from, you know, mullahs in iran or vladimir putin in russia. >> that's right, joe. and the president is concerned. he's anxious, he is fearful about where this is all headed. his legal team is focused on that trump tower meeting as they have been for some time. that is a key moment in the mueller investigation, but our reporting, despite what the president tweeted in response to it, very much is that he's worried about don jr. he has expressed that worry to the people that he has been talking to on the phone.
he has been privately brooding over this, sort of feeling very uneasy that mueller seems to be inching closer and closer to the oval office. >> yeah. >> to the people in the president's circle, and that's why you've seen him -- the president lashing out on twitter, lashing out at these campaign rallies, tearing into the media, tweeting about the witch-hunt more and more and more, tweeting about robert mueller by name more and more and more. that's how he's channelling all of that frustration and fear. >> you know, it is important to keep reviewing the facts, especially as the president and others try and muddle them on twitter. the new yorker's adam davidson lays out the facts about which there is no dispute at all, that the president's son and top advisers knowingly met with individuals connected to the russian government, hoping to obtain dirt on their political opponent. that document stolen from the democratic national committee and members of the clinton campaign were later used in an
overt effort to sway the election. these are facts. that when the trump tower meeting was uncovered, the president instructed his son and staff to lie about the meeting and told them precisely which lies to use, and that the president is attempting to end the investigation into this meeting and other instances of attempted collusion between his campaign staff and representatives of the russian government. joe, the president all along saying, no collusion, no collusion. >> yeah, well, i mean no -- that means nothing. he might as well be saying no whiffle ball tournaments in the backyard. i mean if there's conspiracy, that's a crime. if there's a conspiracy to get information from a foreign national, anything of worth, that's a crime. mike barnacle, he can run around saying no collusion all he wants, you know. maybe -- maybe it is a conspiracy again to collude with
a foreign national, to get something -- anything of value. that's a crime. but, again, in this case, as we said about watergate, as everybody says about it seems every political scandal, at the end of the day it may not be the crime, it may be the coverup to the crime that does the most damage, and we have all of this in broad daylight. donald trump has been lying through his teeth about everything, but about this meeting specifically from the very beginning. >> yeah. >> well, joe, that's the point, the principal point of danger for mr. trump right now post-meeting, what happened after post-meeting. we know for a fact, f-a-c-t, that he sat on air force one and helped prepare a false statement. richard, this just further enmeshes him into not collusion but a conspiracy. >> yeah, because, again, harkening back to watergate, it is both what you do and then what you do about what you did. so now we have the pretty clear
evidence that this meeting took place, and when you read the law it never says that money has to change hands. it can be a contribution of any sort. so you've got the meeting, and then you've got now the attempt to essentially hide what actually the purpose of the meeting and what happened at the meeting. so you've got it coming and going. i think we've actually entered now a very different realm because we're no longer speculating. now we actually have people essentially admitting what happened. >> the president. >> the people, yeah. the people in this case being the president of the united states in word on twitter admitting what happened. >> still ahead on "morning joe", it was one of the more biting responses to president trump's attacks on lebron james. one puts kids in classrooms, the other puts them in cages. we'll break down the president's tweets straight ahead. but first, bill karins with a check on the forecast. bill. >> well, mika, we had a lot of hot temperatures to talk about, but first to talk about the fires in california. the mendocino complex fire exploded over the weekend, burning thousands upon thousands
of new acreage. it is the fourth largest fire in california history, it is still growing. only about 20,000 acres to go to top last year's number one, the thomas fire. yes, two years in a row we're likely to break the record for the largest fire ever recorded in california history, and those records go back to about 1932. it hasn't been your average fire seasons the last couple of years. so 50 million people under heat advisories in the northeast. hot, just like yesterday. 26 million people under excessive heat warning in areas of southern california and arizona and southern nevada. we are hot in the northeast and the west. gusty thunderstorms, watch out detroit to chicago. by the time we get to wednesday, the showers make their way through kentucky, tennessee, the mid atlantic and the northeast and we're hot throughout all areas of the west. that's where the heat will be, and it will get worst during the week as temperatures may be record highs by thursday and friday. look at boise, 104 by friday.
looks like another week we will be talking a lot about the heat and also probably more fires out in areas of the west. kind of the opposite of what they wanted. new york city, heat advisory. it will feel like 100 degrees in the shade this afternoon. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ hey allergy muddlers: are you one sneeze away from being voted out of the carpool? try zyrtec® zyrtec® starts working hard at hour one and works twice as hard when you take it again the next day. stick with zyrtec®. muddle no more®. and try children's zyrtec® for consistently powerful relief of your kid's allergies. so let's promote our summer travel deal on choicehotels.com like this. surfs up. earn a $50 gift card when you stay just twice this summer. or, badda book. badda boom. book now at choicehotels.com
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the interview included james' negative assessment of the trump sayi saying trump used sports to divide it. james has received support from michael jordan. a spokesman for the legend says he supports james, adding he is doing an amazing job for his community. first lady melania trump commended him on his schools, saying she would be open to visiting his facility. her spokeswoman said in a statement that mrs. trump was not taking sides on the matter. >> it is like the united states saying on, you know, december 8, 1941, we're not taking sides in the matter. >> just over five years ago, donald trump had nothing but praise for james, tweeting, congratulations to king james on winning athlete of the year in last night's espys. lebron is also a great guy, joe.
a great guy. >> yeah, you know, eddie, you could almost hear, this guy sounded like an old, grumpy, white racist grandpa in queens, you know, or in alabama. >> yeah. >> yelling at his tv set, saying, this black man is stupid! that black man is stupid! i mean, you know, first you would say, well, gee, boy, he's really losing it because who would be that racially insensitive to do that? but, no, it is actually his strategy. it was with nfl players, it is with nba players. it is what donald trump thinks, and he's told his staff members, basically attacking black athletes, that's really good for me. that's really good politically going into the mid terms. >> i think you're absolutely right, joe. remember the speech in alabama when he went after nfl players and called them sobs.
it is a sense in which trump is also most comfortable, especially when he's in trouble, to be the kind of cultural warrior that speaks to in some ways the dark underside of the country. in this instance to go after lebron really reveals, i think, very clearly a pattern, a pattern that kind of speaks to his ongoing belief about black folks and women in particular because he has a penchant to describe black people as dumb. he has a tendency to describe women as dumb. not just simply maxine waters but women in general, right. >> yeah. >> it seems to me this is just trump being the cultural warrior. the irony, of course, is this is the man that funded trump university, this fraudulent thing, and here is lebron james opening up a public school in cleveland, right. you couldn't get a better contrast of moral human beings. >> well, in every phase of their life, mike barnacle. and, by the way, melania's spokesperson can say she wasn't trying to get involved, but she
got involved in the middle of it and chose the side of lebron. >> yeah. but, joe, this gets to what we were talking about before the break and what eddie just spoke about. i mean race remains now and forever the third rail of american life, not american politics. we really don't have a handle on it, and we have a leader, the ostensible leader of the united states, the president of the united states, who continually plays with it and provokes people with it. it is truly dangerous and it is going to end more badly than it is right now. >> coming up, the governor of new york state, andrew cuomo, is standing but. he joins the conversation next on "morning joe." when you rent from national... it's kind of like playing your own version of best ball.
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the nra told npr if insurers remain afraid to transact with the nra, there is a substantial risk that nra tv will be forced to cease operating, and the governor of new york, andrew cuomo, joins us now. thank you very much, governor. i understand there's a little bit of a delay here, but we'll get through it. are you black listing the nra? >> no. what happened, mika, is, as you know, states regulate the insurance industry within that state, and we have a law in new york that says you cannot insure someone for an intentional bad act. you can't insure someone for breaking the law, and this insurance product was called carry guard. it was designed for people who carry weapons, and it basically insured them for an intentional bad act. the expression was murder insurance. the insurance company that was
providing the product paid a fine. they signed a consent order. they're no longer selling the product. the nra was the broker on the product essentially, and they were making a commission. they're no longer making the commission, but they were selling an illegal product, you know. i don't have a lot of sympathy for a group that says, well, i've lost the revenue from now being disabled from selling that illegal product. you know, that's -- i don't -- they don't get a lot of sympathy from me in general, mika, but here they clearly broke the law. they are right that i have been a long-term political opponent of the nra. it went back to my time in the federal government with the clinton administration. i believe they are an extremist organization. i believe they don't want any progress on gun reform because it would put them out of business. the majority of gun owners in this country support reasonable gun control, background checks, et cetera, and i think the nra
frustrates any progress just so they have a business line to further. >> so i don't understand, governor. when i was reading these stories over the past several days that the nra claims it is in a financial crisis and may be facing bankruptcy because of some issues that they're having in the state of new york. i don't really understand that considering they still give millions of dollars to people that promote their agenda on capitol hill. so are we just talking about a reorganization that would prevent them from being liable in any possible legal lawsuits? when they say they may be facing bankruptcy, what exactly does that mean? >> no, joe, i'm with you. i think it is a frivolous lawsuit. i don't even know their point. i am sure they lost revenue from losing the sale of this insurance product.
i did not know that it was such a significant portion of their revenue. i'm not sure that it is, by the way, but they're crying poverty. now, it is true that they rely on the money because the way they bully the politicians, joe, as you know, we have both seen it, they need millions of dollars to run those ads to keep the politicians in line. and they're saying that the loss of this insurance product is going to make a significant dent on their coffers. i don't know if that's true or not true, but, look, from my point of view i do disagree with them politically. and if they have less money to bully and threaten politicians into irrational positions, you know, i'm not going to lose any sleep over that. and if they went away, you know, i would offer my thoughts and prayers, joe, just like they do every time we have another
situation of nninnocents losing their lives, 154 mass shootings this year. the nation is paralysed. we're doing nothing, no reasonable reform that we know we could agree to if you didn't have politicians scared to death of the nra. >> hey, governor. john hooilman hereilman here. i want to ask a question in a broader scale. it seems the action you are taking and the effect you are having, you are fighting a guerilla campaign, like a guerilla warfare against the nra. i wonder if you think you are successful, and if you do at whatever level, make kind of a dent in the nra, whether this provides a blueprint to ways in which other states can chip away at the nra's power or, on the other hand, whether the only way to really take the nra down is on the national level?
>> well, it is a good question, john. you know, i think they have shown a vulnerability here, frankly, that i didn't see. when they said that loss of this insurance product is going to make such a significant difference on their revenues, i am now reaching out to the other states because i believe this insurance product is going to be illegal from a public policy point of view in most states. now that the nra said this is a major source of revenue, i'm going to pursue it nationwide. it wasn't a guerilla attack. look, i think these guys are bad guys, and it started from the clinton administration with the safe act that could have done great work that the gun manufacturers supported until the nra came in and literally pressured the gun manufacturers not to make an arrangement.
i passed the best gun control law in the nation five years ago called the safe act. they demonized me. the safe act does everything we're trying to do today, everything. mental health database, assault weapons, et cetera. you know what? five years later, hunters still have their guns, legal owners have guns. there was no slippery slope. the nra hates that. they hate letting people know that you could actually have reasonable gun control that most gun owners support. but if we -- if we're not willing to take them on, we'll never get anywhere on this problem. i mean i was there. i know the dynamic in washington. the republicans are afraid of the nra, period. the president after the parkland shooting did that briefing in the white house conference room where he was asking very reasonable questions.
why don't we raise the purchase age? why do we really need young people with assault weapons? he met with the nra and did a 180 the next day. they're afraid of the nra and that's why we're doing absolutely nothing. >> all right. governor andrew cuomo, thank you so much for being with us. we greatly appreciate it. >> thank for having me, joe, mika. >> thank you so much. >> thank you. we got quite a delay here, sort of here to pakistan almost. mike barnacle, color me skept kl her skeptical here. the nra in financial trouble? i don't think so. maybe they're saying that in their court filings, but here is an entity that already contributed $5.6 million this election cycle over the past year and a half to republican candidates and maybe one or two democrats, and they're going to be spending another four to five million for the end of this year. it seems like just a
reorganization effort to me. >> yeah, i don't want to talk you out of your scepticism, joe. i think it is well-earned. history has shown it is well-earned. one of the things that is really -- that i think a lot of people fail to understand, and governor cuomo just mentioned it, you know, he has gone after reasonable gun control and has succeeded at a certain level in achieving reasonable gun control. in this day and age when people can organize so many things so quickly using social media, i am amazed and i think more people are amazed that a collection of police associations around the country, in various states, various big cities, haven't been organized as a group to combat the nra. they and the innocent victims who die in mass shootings obviously are among the biggest victims of out-of-control or uneven forced gun laws in this country and people being able to get guns with more ease than a library book. the fact they haven't been
organized as a unit to combat the nra -- and i think it would be a powerful group, police combatting the nra -- hasn't been done is kind of a mystery. >> it is a mystery. what is so interesting is, mika, when we talk about it there used to be a huge gulf between conservatives and liberals on gun issues, even going back into the '90s. conservatives obviously and nra supporters wanting more access to more guns, while liberals were talking about the banning of handguns. >> yeah. >> you don't even have that conversation anymore. what you have now, the gun battle is being fought on pretty comfortable territory for middle america. you know, increased background checks, which have -- you know, a lot of people have wanted since newtown. >> common sense. >> increased background checks to keep guns out of the hands of terrorists, to keep begins out of the hands of domestic
abusers, to keep guns out of the hands of those not mentally fit to have guns. even if you talk about the assault-style weapon, the military-style bans, that's -- you know, for most of the things we've seen, 55, 60, 65, sometimes even 70% of americans support that as well. so this battle is not actually even a battle at all. you've got three or four people who are nra leaders up in washington, d.c. that are pushing the most extreme agenda for the gun manufacturers, while most nra members across america want the enhanced background checks, and also even a majority last time i checked wanted a ban on military-style weapons being sold, especially to people who were under 21. >> that amidst an epidemic of mass shootings that everybody can see and feel for themselves. up next, republican strategist rick wilson joins us with his subtly titled new book,
"everything trump touches dies." we'll be right back. the fact is, there are over ninety-six
now that you know the truth, are you in good hands?
with us now republican political strategist, troublemaker, northwest florida hero rick wilson. he is out with a new book, "everything trump touches dies." our republican strategist gets real about the worst president. >> ever! >> you know, rick and i grew up in the same backyard. >> yeah. >> we knew the same political players. we had the same sort of inter-party battles which actually -- there wasn't a great difference between republicans in primaries, even though -- >> yeah. >> not you, but everybody would have to exaggerate the issues. what i'm hearing from a lot of my republican friends now, especially in northwest florida, some representatives up there, it is just extraordinary. i mean -- >> sure. >> -- people that are doing like
vladimir putin by trying to cover up political investigations of putin's interference in american democracy. >> yeah, imagine how it would have played in the first or second congressional district of florida five years ago. >> yeah. >> the idea that somebody was trying to cover up russia interference in our elections, there would have been pitchforks and torches in the streets of pensacola. >> yeah. >> now we look at the governor's race, and you and i both have known adam putnam for years. he is a guy getting his tail whipped because donald trump is tweeting about his opponent. you know, so the ground has changed, but, unfortunately for a lot of the guys that accepted that gift of trump in the primary, they're going -- it looks like they will be paying a heavy price for it come the general election this year. >> and that's how bizarre it is. i'm glad you brought up adam putnam. here is a guy that's been in politics, in public service for years and years. >> yeah. >> i knew him when he served in congress. >> sure. >> everybody that has known him
says he is great, decent guy, a good man and representative. as i was explaining a week or two ago, just because a guy reads his kid trump bedtime stories doesn't mean he will be able to handle things when it hits the fan and a category four hurricane comes in tampa bay. >> right. >> yet that doesn't seem to matter to a lot of primary voters. >> it doesn't seem to matter to primary voters, but it may matter in the general election when we have a democratic governor in florida for the first time in decades. it is definitely a -- the signs of trump's doom in the general, yeah, we've seen it play out in all of the special elections so far in the last year and a half, and we're seeing it play out i think this fall in the imminent doom of a lot of republican candidates in swing districts all over the state and swing states like our home state of florida. >> i tell you what, we're going to give the audience a treat right now. we don't usually go behind the
scenes, but just so you all know, rick has an understudy for his book tour if for any reason he gets sick during the book tour, has problems communicating because of a bad cough. >> oh, my gosh. >> i couldn't grow that beard. >> john is here. john, do you have a question. >> plus i'm about a foot taller than rick. >> oh, wow. >> can we have the book cover up on screen real quick? just show the book cover. the book cover has two fundamental truths it announces. one, everything trump touches dies, and also look at that tiny hand. look at that little, itty-bitty hand. there's cocktail sausage fingers. i'm not sure it could be clearer. here's the question -- here's the thing. you are one of the avatars of
never trump republicanism, right? >> yes. >> for a little while there were a lot of loud never trumpers, and they seemed important. one of the things we have seen, one of the most extraordinary thing is the fact that the president can genuinely boast he has the highest approval rating within his party of any president in the modern history of america. s there's just a huge courage deficit in this country.
we have eddie with us. >> real quickly, now, we tend to exceptionalize trump. but you just talked about the id of the republican party. give me more content. what's the soil of the republican party that made possible trump? you can be a never trump but it seems to me you need to be a never that too. >> i am a never that. >> say more of that then. >> i think there's a part of the gop that has emerged in this populist culture, in this separated media silo that is built by the 90 million households that fox news hits every day and by this talk radio and online segment that really didn't want a fair and balanced approach to the world and how we talk about issues. they wanted that separate media thing. they wanted what they always think the liberals have. where only their views and their grace notes were hit. and i think there is a -- there is a deep underpinning of racial anxiety that informed a lot of
trump voters. as i said this before, not every single trump voter is a racist and aphobic jerk. every single racist and aphobic jerk is a trump voter. >> true. >> rick, you know, one of the -- i'm just curious how you're sorting through this. guys like you and me have spent our entire lives pushing back on the belief there was this subterranean racism in the republican party. that it wasn't really about that. whether it was about freedom. whether it was about economics. whether it was about low tax rates. whether it was about the american dream. whether it was about affording everybody, you know, equal opportunity, that's what i believe my entire life, and it is, at least to me, it's been shocking and somewhat embarrassing just how wrong i was all along that a huge chunk
of the republican party was exactly what liberals had been accusing us of being for a very long time. >> joe, it's a fight -- like you said, we've both pushed back on it for years and years and years. and said that's ridiculous, that's absurd. we can go back to dwight d. eisenhower. this whole arc we pushed back on for years, we were wrong. there's a faction of this party that really wants to hear that message. there's a whole industry now in the trump world of, you know, what i call the coal country christophs. the people that want to explain away the racial animus trump has ignited in a lot of these folks. there's a part of it, we have to call it out. i call it out in the book pretty directly. if a conservative party wants to survive in the future, it has to purge that. aggressively go after people who believe in that stuff, who touch the alt right, involved in this
sort of explaining away trumpism in this regard. >> mika, you know, when you have unemployment at 3.9% and when donald trump himself says the economy's doing better than it's ever done before, which it's not, but it's still doing very well, it's kind of hard to say, oh, people are being racially incensensitive because the economy's so bad. that's just in the words of my friend rick wilson, that's just chicken bonk. >> yes, or something else. the book is "everything trump touches dies." it's out tomorrow. rick wilson, thank you very much. >> thank you, rick. >> up next, education runs on lies. that's a direct quote from former education secretary arne duncan's new book. he joins us next to explain it. ', we offer innovative investing tools to prepare you for the future. looks like you hooked it. and if that's not enough, we'll help your kid prepare for the future. don't hook it kid. and if that's still not enough,
we'll help your kid's kid prepare for the future. looks like he hooked it. we'll do anything... takes after his grandad. seriously anything, to help you invest for the future. ally. do it right. joining us now is former secretary of education under president obama arne duncan. he has a new book out tomorrow,
"how schools work, an inside account of failure and success from one of the nation's longest serving secretaries of education." in it, writes, in part, education runs on lies. that's probably not what you'd expect from a former secretary of education, but it's the truth. how schools work best is often by confronting and fighting these lies, but this is exhausting and sometimes perilous work. usually undertaken by an isolated teacher or principal. so the lies persist. they are emblematic of our system as an apple left of the corner of a favorite teacher's desk. but unlike the apple, the lies aren't sweet. they are overripe and rotten. arne duncan joins us open in thank you for being with us. >> good morning, thanks for having me. >> what are the lies? >> i'll start with the basic premise that we care about education. and the fact is we as voters, we never vote on education. we don't hold any politician accountable for results at the local level, at the state level,
at the national level. good words, good sound bites, but not reality. we say we value teachers. and teachers are so hugely important. but we don't compensate. we don't train. we don't reward teachers like the true professionals they are doing the most important work as, you know, raising, educating our babies. for me, maybe the toughest lie is we say we value our children. what we've done as a nation, much to my horror, we have raised a generation of teens on gun violence, on mass shootings. that doesn't happen in other nations. that has a direct impact of children growing up terrifies, living with trauma, living with fear. i don't spend much time listening to what they say. >> tell me what the country's going to look like in 20 years when we have an educational system where if your child is in an inner city school, you're a
single mother, you're working a part time job, and that child going on to another inner city high school is going to have to compete against other kids from suburban schools where they have much more materials to work with, their families are more secure. what's it going to look like? >> it's competing with children in india and china and, you know, south korea. so for me, doesn't matter if you're coming out of the inner city or rural america ornative american reservation. if you have access to great teachers. if you have teachers that care about you. if you have a fantastic principal, i'm actually very optimistic. i think you can be on track to be successful. if we don't do those things, though, we perpetuate cycles of poverty. >> are we doing them now? >> it varies place by place and school by school. i had the joy of traveling the nation. visiting schools. i saw amazing schools at the heart of the inner city. in west virginia.
i also saw places that break your heart. >> so one of the lies is we've never committed ourselves to educating all of our kids. all of our kids. how do you convince the country, folks who are in very homogenous neighborhoods, however you want to describe it, that we should be committed to educating owl of our kids? >> that's the right question. if we want a thriving and growing middle class. if we want a vibrant civic democracy, we have to do that. it's in our nation's best interest. it's not just my children, your children. we need to educate all of our children and we all gain. rising tide lifts all boats in this area. >> all right. the book is how schools work. it's out tomorrow. secretary arne duncan, great to see you, and thank you so much for being on the show this morning. >> thank you for having me, i appreciate it. final thoughts, joe? >> well, we see the madness.
ItSonWashington-postMueller-probeTrumpFriendsAdvisersTrump-tower-meetingPeopleIs-trumpJuniorGreg-millerthat is our show for today. hi to the kendrick clan in south carolina. at the family barbecue. sorry i couldn't be here. that's it for "am joy." richard lui has the latest. >> also, the kendrick clan jonathan. you'll invite me one day. >> you'd love it down there. >> thank you, jonathan. i'm richard lui in for alex witt on this saturday. here's what we're watching, charlottesville, one year later, the president tweeting the city under lock down. and new protests planned. what changed since those clashes. today, the city's mayor weighs in on that. and the white house is firing back over omarosa, her latest book. >> the moment we're living in is grave. the democratic party must be a
party that fights fire with fire. we will make america decent again. >> stormy daniels' attorney right there on why he is explores a 2020 presidential run. a stolen plane chased by military jets and then crashes into a small island. what the pilot told the control tower during that flight. we'll start this hour with breaking news. republican congressman chris collins who is charged with insider trading taking a dramatic step society, suspended his re-election bid. s in's white house correspondent kelly o'connell is there with more. kelly, what do you know? >> of course, chris collins was the first member of congress to endorse candidate trump. it's sending repercussions throughout the republican party. collins maintains he's not guilty of the insider trading charges but has assessed his charges and the wider map of what republicans are facing with the election for members of
congress just a couple of months away. so by suspending his campaign, he is stepping out of the way. and that will trigger a flurry of activity among republicans in new york 27 which stretches from buffalo to rochester, to give you an idea of where that's located, to try to find the right candidate to put on the ballot. this is a district that president trump won quite easily. so, this was a prime opportunity, for democrats, had call difference chosen to stay on the ballot, there could have been the kind of nationalization of that race to bring in lots of money and resources to help the democrat. and if that were to happen, of course, we know the margin democrats are looking for it. it looks like it's within reach. a double of dozen seats. and they've got targets around the country and this one suddenly became a prime opportunity once the indictment happened on wednesday. to give you a sense of this, collins who initially said he would continue on has had time
to reflect with his party. he said in part, democrats are laser focused on taking back the house, electing nancy pelosi speaker and then launching impeachment proceeding against president trump. after extensive discussions with my family and my friends over the last few days, i have decided it is within the best interests of the constitt wents of new york 27, the republican party and president trump's agenda for me to suspend my campaign for re-election to congress. he does intend to stay in congress for a while, not resigning his seat. but this sets off a scramble for republicans on what could be complicated this close to the election to remove the name from the ballot and get a new nominee on there. richard. >> thank you so much, kelly o'connell with the latest on that breaking. let's bring in the white house correspondent for the washington examiner. around josh barrett, an msnbc
contributor. josh, why now? why the change and what does this mean for the midterms and for the president? >> well, i think it may be reality setting in. the terms of this indictment for insider trading are just amazing and how brazen what representative collins is accused of doing is. i mean, literally being there on the white house lawn and calling his son, when the stalk is about to fall 90% when they learned the one drug they made is not going to be approved for use. so it sort of reads like an open and shut case. it's going to be very difficult for republicans to defend him. and really, he'd gotten little from the party. after shock, i think it's clear to him and i suspect he got some nudging from top leaders in the party trying to push him out of here. while this district is a strongly republican district, it's not impossible for democrats. collins had just gotten
re-elected. democrats have a serious candidate in this district, they're looking at this thinking they could beat collins because it's not that republican. it would be easy for a candidate not under indictment. the process of replacing a candidate in new york is especially byzantine and weird. and the ridiculous things you have to do to get off the ballot in new york. they're going to have to figure out how-f they want to replace him how to get off the ballot. >> old days of 20 or 30 points in a presidential election, you never know. gabby, reflect on that, why now? and what does it mean for the republicans and the president? >> he's liking facing pressure from the chairman of the national congressional committee who came out today and said he was pleased with this decision to suspend his re-election bid.
obviously, republicans are battling an uphill bill to keep their house majority in november. and this is just one more potential race that could go for democrats if he had remained in. his opponent, nate mcmurray has already seen a surge in support since this indictment was first released. i think they're scrambling to find a have a yav viable candid replace collins who can carry that district and not give one more seat to democrats to take over the house. >> gabby, josh, starting off the sprint with us. thank you so much with that breaking news on chris collins. we'll be talking to you in a bit. also, we're watching this hour for, charlottesville, on lockdown, security preparations underway, many in place ahead of tomorrow that will mark one year since that tragic event was spurred by the white nationalists rally there. meanwhile, a short time ago, president trump did tweet about the deadly violence of a year
ago. for more on this, nbc's kyle perry in charlottesville. rena shaw, and atima o'mara. and we'll go to you first. yesterday, we saw the flashing lights, the cordon. you are saying it's very high in terms of security. what are you seeing now? >> reporter: yeah, maybe over the top, but over the top by design. you can hear the helicopter ahead of me. this is one of the check points behind me, that you have to cross. when i say unprecedented over-the-stop securiover over-the-top security, when you go down the road, you can see the statue of lee that sparked so much a year ago. police are telling people they do not want people to calm to charlottesville. there's a list banned, things
included like bear spray. hairspray. it does not include guns. go ahead and look at the shift change. a lot of people are concerned that this open carry law in virginia is going to cause people and allow people to show their rights to second amendment. that could cause problems. the bottom line here, though, there is such a mass itcive presence. as you said, the president did tweet about the events of last year. probably and what happens the criticism that you'll hear is that he was making up for a lack of making a strong statement about what happened here. we've got it up on the screen now. it will be interesting to see not only how things play out here, richard, as you know, the permits were rejected in charlottesville. they were granted in washington, d.c. probably all eyes will move north, richard. >> cal perry, thank you. eddie, start this off for us,
we're watching the pictures together today. it seems calm. hundreds of officers are there as cal perry was telling us, what is the worst and best outcome and the president addressing the tension of a year ago? >> the worst outcome would be violence and the loss of life of heather heyer, we want to mention her name. the white nationalists gathering in d.c. and threatening charlottesville, shethese folkse just an exaggerated version of what we are in the nation. before we single themselves out as villains and find how do we make this possible we will find ourselves on the hamster wheel. >> atima, i want to play for you
countries. is pretty much in mind with whole he is and making up for a half-hearted tweet of last year isn't going to make up for it. >> coincidentally, from spike lee, "blackkklansman" is opening up. let me tell you what he said. >> he hasn't said anything about the one-year anniversary. >> right. >> he hasn't said anything about heather heyer, who lost her life. so, it's another example of who this guy is. i mean, it's not even for debate anymore. we know who this guy is. >> so, we do know, we have the tweet from the president, looking one year on. is that enough, do you think, for those on the hamster wheel as our good friend eddie was describing it as? >> absolutely, one tweet is not enough. spike couldn't be more right.
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express clear support for that thing. i think we're at a time where honest open conversation from this president and the comfort he's giving to bigots, we need to talk about that clearly and often. >> eddie, i want to watch what laura ingraham was saying sthis country isn't what it was because of immigrants. and all that students and spies. it adds on and adds on. >> interesting thing, he comments about the nfl, players exercising their constitutional rights but he says nothing about the white nationals coming to washington, d.c. what laura ingraham said actually echoes what trump said in europe. they're exactly the same. what's driving this is the
democratic shouft iic shifts. more importantly in 2008 for the first time in the history. country, our president was elected without the majority of white people voting for him. and it fueled, it set off the fire. and ever since then, we have been grappling with this fact that there is a segment of this country who cannot accept that this is no longer a white nation in old europe, right? what you get is this emboldened or loud bigot, or loud racist, combined with the liberals. combine that with the conventionalism of american capitalism where people are busting their behinds. and trump sits right in the sweet spot. and we're focusing on the loud bigots but we don't understand the transformational changes happening underneath that's driving all of this. >> trying to understand two simultaneous phenomenons in
front of us. >> right in front of us. the stolen plane and the fiery crash that enenshsued fro this. what the pilot told the control tower until his last moment. next. but so began the year of me. i discovered the true meaning of paperless discounts... and the indescribable rush of saving drivers an average of $620. why does fear feel so good? i fell in love three times -- once with a woman, once with a country, and finally... with myself. -so, do you have anything to declare or not? -isn't that what i'm doing?
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stolen last night by a ground agent employed by horizon air. that plane was followed for an hour and then it crashed exploding into flames. in this amateur video appears that the male suspect was performing stunts before the crash. authorities have not identifiyi the horizon employee by name but say he's a 29-year-old from washington now presumed to be dead. and you can hear exchanges between the suspect and the air crash, just before the crash, take a listen. >> i've got a lot of people that care about me. and it's going to disappointment them to hear that i did this. like to apologize to each and every one of them. just a broken guy. got a few screws loose, i guess. never really knew it until now. >> okay. let's go to our msnbc aviation
expert john cox. john, that audio by itself we could talk about for quite some time. but i want to start with, first, what probably most americans are asking, how is it for a grounds person get access to a plane and do what appeared here, that is, take off and get clearance to fly around? >> well, it's -- this is a really unusual case. as an airline employee with the proper credentials. he's been background checked. he's been vetted. walking on and off an airplane is something that's done routinely. it's done for maintenance. it's done for catering. there are a lot of people that move off and on planes while they're sitting on the ground overnight. so, he would have access as an employee. what exactly went on here, i think we're going to have to wait for the investigation to
unfold to learn what really happen. >> well, you might let folks in, but to give him the key to the cars. is it secured? you have to have a key to turn it on? >> well, there is a requirement for the cockpit door being locked. but there is a presis sequence of events that has to go on to get those engines to start. it's not like your car where you can just plug a key into it, turn it and it starts. >> right. >> turban engines require a given sequence. it's unclear how he knew how to do that. it's a turboprop. so you have to adjust the propellers. and then, once you have it running, to be able to taxi the airplane. it doesn't drive like a car. so, all of this was a surprise. he had evidently planned this for quite some time. and where he got the information is one of the questions the investigators are going to ask. >> how many buttons, would you say? obviously, we don't know
exactly, is it a ten-step process before he can get this plane up in the air? >> it's more than ten steps to get it airborne. it's probably about ten to get the engines running. >> uh-huh. >> if you know exactly what you're doing. and that's the whole key, knowing the sequence of switches and lever movements that have to occur. once you get that, then the engines are running. how do you get out to the runway. how well do you know what the taxiways are. and there was a lot of confusion with the air traffic control tower that the airplane wasn't moving it wasn't talking to the tower. the air traffic control did a fantastic job. >> really threading the needle, the suspect did, getting it all right, getting it fast enough to get in the air. was he doing tricks or was it more he doesn't know how to flied plane? >> no, some of this was a controlled maneuver. i saw some of the video, it's a
loop. and i also saw one that's an a-run roll. those are precisely flown maneuvers. he mentions that he's flown a lot of video games. and i suspect he used that as the means to do these aerobatic maneuvers. so, he clearly -- he had had some practice in some capacity before he got in the airplane. >> john, what a story. john cox, msnbc aviation analyst. thank you, sir. we'll talk to you later. now, back to politics, the president's personal attorneys, rudy giuliani, jay sekulow, leveling new criticisms. and they can doing it as guest hosts of sean hannity's show. the pair during that radio show laid out examples of why they
believe an interview with mueller might turn into a perjury trap. >> flynn is the example. no crime. if it has been said, the president says, go easy on him. >> which the president says -- >> he didn't say stop it don't do it. so, no crime. however, it didn't take place, according to the president. according to comey it did. >> of course, if it did, it wouldn't have mattered. but you're right, if there's two different recollections of a meaning now you have a perjury situation. >> correct. >> josh barro, gabby morganello. josh, it's different to hear lawyers for the president take on a radio show. number two, josh, what do you continue to argue about collusion here? if it doesn't exist still, and still it's not a crime. >> yeah, first, for them
guest-hosting this television show, i think you have to look at the president's legal strategy being in two parts. there's a legal strategy and there's a pr strategy. the department of justice says you can't indict a sitting president. it's clear that it won't happen, the justice department won't do it even if they had the congressional power to. so the president is not ultimately going to be put on trial for any of this stuff under any circumstance, accept, conceivably after he left office. so, really, the only thing he has to worry about is a political argument. whether congress will continue to impeach him, if there's a democratic majority. and the key part of his lawyers' job is to do public relations. that's not totally unprecedented. you can remember during the monica lewinsky sag gashgs you had lenny davis constantly on television for the president. that is part of the lawyer's job. there was no collusion, even if there was collusion there was no
crime. it's called argument alternative. basically you put out theories, any one will establish your client's innocence. and can be contradictory, like i wasn't there, and the thing i did while i wasn't there is illegal. the problem is, usually one use is more convincing than two excuses. as a pr message that's pretty muddled. under no circumstances no matter what you thought happened the president didn't commit a crime. >> and given that platform on the sean hannity show. gabby, what did you learn over that hosting over the hours, anything new? >> it was shocking to see two of the president's lawyers in a very serious case taking on a three-hour radio program. jay sekulow hosts his own program weekly. but to be using the platform of a fox news radio host is kind of remarkable and really does go to
talk to and speak to how this relationship between the president and fox news really is so cozy at times. but in terms of the substance of that three-hour program, i think it's very similar to what we've heard already from the president's legal team. that they don't believe that the president committed any crime. that there's also justice department guidance. and article two of the constitution they argue that it prevents investigators from interrogating a sitting president of the united states. and the president would have to do that voluntarily. and they said again they're advising the president against sitting down with robert mueller and his team. and that's consistent that the president did want to have input as part of his investigation and that's certainly something that his legal team is concerned about. >> it's got to be that the lawyers from his point have got to get on to the next chapter.
josh, gabby, thanks for givings your perspective. have a good weekend. >> you too. thank you. he says he wants to make united states decent again. what michael avenatti is saying about his run for president. (vo) love. i got it. i gotcha baby. (vo) it's being there when you're needed most. he's the one. (vo love is knowing... it was meant to be. and love always keeps you safe. (vo) love is why we built a car you can trust for a long time. the all-new subaru impreza sedan and five-door. a car you can love no matter what road you're on. the subaru impreza. more than a car, it's a subaru. right now, get 0% apr financing on the 2018 subaru impreza.
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at least one congressman felt it was important to observe one year since the rally in charlottesville turned deadly. saying, quote, i wish i could just say never again. but i recognize we have a long way to go to remove the hate and prejudice in our country and our communities. each and every one of us has a duty to call it out and do what we can to stop it." joining me representative donald mceachin. congressman that was you, what do you think has changed? and what do you think will change in the coming year? >> well, i hope we'll be able to come together as a nation and really push back against all of the hate that we've seen sort of explode over the national scene over the past year. there's no doubt that this country's had a race problem for any number of years, but we were
making progress. and those folks were being pushed back to the shadows that have so much hate. now, they've come around. and it's up to us, those of us who don't believe in that, those of us who believe in the united states of america, a more perfect union, if you will. to push back in the shadows and continue to make the progress that we continue to make. >> representative, i want to play you sound here and then get your reaction. >> we're closely following the terrible events unfolds in charlottesville, virginia. we condemn in strongest possible terms this egregious disdelay of bigotry and violence on many sides. on many sides. you had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. you had people in that group -- excuse me, excuse me, i saw the sa same pictures as you did. >> and you have to stand proudly
for the national anthem. or you shouldn't be playing. you shouldn't be there. maybe you shouldn't be in the country. >> i said it the other day, yes, she is a low i.q. individual, maxine waters. i said it the other day. >> we have people trying to come into the country, stopping a lot of them. but we're taking people out of the country, you wouldn't believe how bad these people are. these aren't people. these are animals. >> i am, as i say often, i am the least racist person that anybody is going to meet. >> earlier today, there was also this here, representative, a tweet from the president about fighting for and securing the lowest african-american and hispanic unemployment rates in history. pushing for prison reform. all of this underlining, representative, what he believes he has done for minority communities. in light of many studies that show many americans are worse off when it comes to race relations. what more should this white house do to reverse some of the
problems in your first answer? >> there's so much that the president needs to do in that regard that i could talk to you an hour about. but among those things is to recognize that folks have a right to protest. and not to pick on sports figures like he has like lebron james and nfl players. not to call people low i.q. people. maxine waters is a very intelligent person. and to stop attacking people the way he does from this bully pulpit that would be a start. >> president obama, when he came to his microphone that he didn't want to make at that stage in his presidency, you remember, he came out and talked about race for america. would that happen with this president? should he come out with a keynote speech, a manifesto, if you will, an each on relations
in america? >> no, in my church, we say, we'd rather see a sermon than hear a sermon. this president needs to start walking the walk. and start doing things that unify the country. his tweets, his comments. they change like the weather, really. you know, there's a tweet this morning and something later on this evening that directly contradicts it. none of us would be surprised that happendo, phappened. i don't want to hear a sermon, i want to see a sermon. >> let's shift to the midterms. the breaking news with representative chris collins now saying he's not going to run again. that therefore opens up for the democrat, this in a space where there's a 24-point difference, at least when it came to 2016 and the presidential race. add to that, when you look at 2018 democrats as nancy pelosi
your leader, 51% are against. how is this going to square going forward to november? >> all i can say, i'm mighty happy with the leadership that nancy pelosi has provided. she's been very good to me. emmanuel cleaver, a congressman from missouri, he said if you want rabbit stew, you got to catch the rant firsbbit first. all of us need to be focused on winning the midterms then we can have the conversation on who our leadership should be. >> are you saying you do support pelosi as your leader? >> i think it's too early to have this conversation. i want to focus on winning. again, these been a brilliant leader. she's been helpful to me. >> i hope for a very peaceful weekend there in the states of virginia and charlottesville, sir. thank you for stopping by.
>> thank you for having me. >> you betcha. could stormy daniels' attorney be the future of democratic party? why he says he might be the right guy and he might run in 2020. by funding scientific breakthroughs, advancing public policy, and providing local support to those living with the disease and their caregivers. but we won't get there without you. join the fight with the alzheimer's association. need a change of scenery? the kayak price forecast tool tells you
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>> michael avenatti, in i, was not holding back last night. the attorney for former porn star stormy daniels reignites speculation whether he might run for president in 2020. atima, your reaction, does commander in chief, when you talk about avenatti there, he's calling on dems advice on michelle obama's if they go low, we go high. >> i'm not quite sure, i think what he meant we should fight more aggressively, i think definitely as a party, when it comes to handling this administration and how the republican party has definitely fought to undermine, in some cases, functioning democracy in congress.
devin nunes comes to mind after this week's tape, that we should be focusing. >> and rina, just what is not working in terms of tone right now? >> you know, look, if michael avenatti wants to throw his hat in the ring, great. i think he's part of the crop of people who thinks if trump can do it, i can, too. he talks about decency. that's important. label aside for the moment, people like avenue atti, if the want to come out and mount a challenge to this president which i don't think is going to be hard to do it's how you message it out to the masses. that's great. but i'm part of the group that doesn't want a quasicollection. somebody who doesn't seek the lime light to come in and talk about how to repair our democracy. it's in tatters right now. >> eddie, we've been watch
something of the special elections, hitting harder means working harder, do you think that's a workable violation? >> absolutely. organizing a ground game. it's really important. having a vision and a set of policies and platforms that actually speaks to the people living in your district. being committed and forceful in making the argument for those policies. i think part of what's happened over the last decade or so has been a weaponization of commitment of progressive folks, right? >> yeah. >> if you hit back, oh, you're in contradiction. if you call people out for being who they are, then somehow you have undermined your values, right? if you get in the pig pen with pigs, you get dirty. if you lay down with dogs, you get fleas. what happens at that moment, you find yourself in a box. you can't forcefully argue for the position you want to put forward. we need an aggressive agenda.
>> you're also talking about being in a box. i'll go to you, atima, we were talking about this in the last segment. this is about nancy pelosi. the yes there, yes or no, nancy pelosi, should she be speaker of the house if democrats regain vole in november? and how should democrats handle nancy pelosi now? >> you had on congressman don mceachin. a congressman from an area where i grew up in virginia. for him, he has to understand, obviously, the politics of where he is on that in the district. but, you know, what i will say about what's happening with some of the 52 democrats that are running right now is that they're very -- there's a generational leadership shift i think that's happening. pelosi has been in charge since 2003, as leader. and then obviously, becoming speaker. most companies don't have someone who serves that long. football teams don't have
coaches that serve that long. house republicans, i believe, the senate -- certainly, house republicans have term limits. they've hadal three new leaders in the time frame since she has been leader of the caucus. most everyone in the caucus who's in leadership is over the age eveof 70. so, i'm hearing members -- not members, but candidates who are running who are millennials. who are gen-xers, who are interested in stepping up and leading. and trying a new way of doing things for the democratic party. i think that leader pelosi has been a great leader for our times. but i do think that there's interest in a generational shift that has certainly taken on a new shape after the 2016 elections. >> here, we'll take a shift to the break. atima omara. rina shaw. thank you. the team and robert mueller
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terms with the president's potential interview with robert mueller. "the washington post" reports after response, significantly lessens the possibility of a voluntary presidential interview, according to two people familiar with the discussions. joining me now is the author of that article. carol leone. reporter for "the washington post" and msnbc contributor. carol, thank you for joining us. what more did you learn about the response from the president of the president's legal team? >> what we learned this was a very long response, to the special counsel's office, explaining where we've been for the last eight months in late december, robert mueller told trump's lawyers he was really interested in interviewing the president, as he completed his investigation. >> and what exactly are they saying is offlimits in this response for a potential presidential interview, at least in this latest stance?
>> they don't want the president to have to answer any questions about obstruction. while there's been a lot of hemming and hawing back and forth about the mueller's need to interview the president about actions he took as president. actions like firing jim comey. actions like telling jim comey privately, that he wanted him to let go of the flynn investigation. the investigation of his national security adviser. there's been a lot of hemming and hawing about mueller saying he needs it. trump's team saying they're worried it would be a perjury trap. in this letter, finally and firmly, the team says there's no need for mueller to ask those questions and it's constitutional inappropriate. >> so this is off the docket. is that on the docket? and that, i mean, by questions of other issues such as collusion? is that okay what they're saying, they have some willingness there? >> they have some willingness.
it doesn't say, yes, we will do it. it says our door is open to other questions of which we have to make a determination if they're appropriate. and they have said they don't believe there's any collusion, so it's not so worrisome for them to ask those questions. what rudy giuliani, the trump's lead lawyer and jay sekulow, his other lawyer, have said to me, is that they're worried that especially mueller will credit the account of jim comey, over the account of trump. and if that's the case, they believe that trump would be walking into accusations of perjury by saying he doesn't remember the things that jim comey does. >> quick, do you think they're going to send another counter? >> it's possible. the three options are significant. one is mueller says, forget this and subpoenas the president, that would involve a lengthy legal fight, all the way to the
supreme court, likely, since is this not settled law. another option is for mueller to say, okay, i got your long letter. here's what i propose. third option is, mueller says, no thanks, i'm going to write my report. i don't agree to your terms i'll just proceed. >> right. >> trump team, i will tell you, is definitely of the view this is sort of their last word. there's very little more they're going to acquiesce to or consider. >> carol leonnig, national reporter for "the washington post." thanks for joining us. change of heart, republican congressman chris collins making a dramatic move.
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Democratic-partyCityOmarosaFiringBookMayorWhite-housePartyPlaneStormy-danielsAttorneyRunto germany france spain and portugal. climate change. waste. pollution. isn't it time for good news eco africa people and projects that are changing our environment for the better it's up to us to make a difference let's inspire others. going to come to be a farming magazine. on d w. such. news. hi and welcome to a special edition of kino coming to you today from the city of frankfurt famous of
course for its skyline and for being germany's capital of high finance but frankfurt is also home to one of the largest film museums in europe and they're honoring with an amazing exhibit a cinematic masterpiece. two thousand and one a space odyssey the mother of all science fiction films. in one thousand nine hundred eighty eight director stanley kubrick rewrote the rules of cinema in a way that continues to amaze and inspire. this conversation can serve no purpose anymore today on keno we're doing a deep dive into two thousand and one we're devoting our entire show to stanley kubrick's classic film turns fifty this year but two thousand and one is still way ahead of its time. when kubrick began putting his saif i master piece
together in the mid one nine hundred sixty s. americans and serviettes were vying to be the first to reach the moon to develop a visionary but believable set design kubrick hired nasa experts who had worked with rocket pioneer vana from back on the frankfurt show explores how meticulously every technical detail was planned. kubrick was the first to use product placement this futuristic watch from a luxury brand hamilton went on sale as the film opened but only a few original props are preserved cooper destroyed most of them. this is a replica of the model of the famous centrifuge a hamster wheel weighing fairly tons and twelve meters in diameter feelingless so complicated that it took several days to shoot just a few seconds. won't see much of the galaxy.
the space scenes were created with elaborate animation by hand without computer technology. you know when you think it's so models it's wooden glue and straining and nothing shows it's. just a testament to how careful he was and god knows how many that. sort of takes they took of a lot of shots because obviously the special effects ticker a lot. more than a hundred people worked on the special effects alone kubrick spent four years making the film at london's n.-g.'s studios going way over his budget and schedule . with his team he created images like none before. i. so there was a very open kind of art school atmosphere let's see. let's try there was no
oh we can't do that it's you know that was a red rag to standing say oh we can't do that it's for why not why can't you let's try it so everybody was able to be is a maginnis heaven is crazy and like it was there were no wrong answers kubrick wrote the screenplay with sufiah legend arthur c. clarke their goal was to create the definitive sayf i found proving the question of extraterrestrial life and artificial intelligence that spirals out of control in the form of the onboard computer how's. it been the puppet doors oh. i'm sorry dave i'm afraid i can't do that. that's the problem. i think you know what the problem is just as well as right what are you talking about . this mission is too important for me to allow you to check the times in.
it's really a philosophical film it's not really a science fiction i call it much more philosophical film and it is so fresh because it doesn't contain in its essence anything that can be outdated because we are as ignorant now as a row fifty years ago about the miracles of the universe not. where we come from where are we going. stanley kubrick's two thousand and one a space odyssey office now wants us only stunning images the journey continues. gay. and i'm joined now with ellen haring the director of the film astute and the film is in here frank thanks for joining us. i want to talk about two thousand and one.
when the first time you saw the movie do you remember. remember what it did with you do you remember. i remember very specifically and one of the great fortunes that i've had in my career is i've been a film programmer and i was able to hold off on seeing two thousand and one until i could see it on the big screen you know i can only imagine that everybody who would have a chance to see the movie this way would just be carried away by it it's a very famous story of when the movie was first released people actually walked out of the premiere you know people who had traditional expectations of a hollywood movie and were looking for a linear narrative and it wasn't a box office success at the beginning but then they redid the marketing and i actually know this the guy who created the tagline the ultimate trip and they positioned it in one thousand nine hundred sixty eight as a movie that would expand your consciousness and you know kind of subvert your expectations of what a movie should be and it attracted
a young audience attracted you know people who were in the counterculture and it became a huge hit because of that i mean what what what do something personally that you find so find interesting fascinated with the film terms of its history but just as a film goer you know the amazing thing about this the photography the visual effects just watching the beauty of each of those sequences and the fact that he's really willing to hold the camera and extend a sequence and ask you to step into that vision and to just take that journey and then when you have the marriage in certain sequences of some of these classic pieces of music that also is incredible because now people when they hear that music it immediately makes them think of the film as it does with me.
and you got all the way here dedicated to the film what the exhibit adds to understanding two thousand one what i really like about this exhibition in the way that it brings the audience in is it shows the whole production cycle it shows that stanley kubrick was an obsessive he did tremendous amounts of research for every movie he made and spent years talking to scientists doing scientific research thinking about outer space exploration and nobody had landed on the moon yet when this movie was made and there's this famous conspiracy theory that neil armstrong never landed on the moon but the footage was shot by stanley kubrick it's one of the great myths of modern culture. so it's amazing to go through the whole production history in this exhibition you get the view of the filmmaker and all of the creative team and then it all comes
together with the projections that you see of the film sequences on how to thank you so much for joining us and two thousand and one has had an immense impact not just on cinema really the film gave us a vision of the future. rounds going through the making. some on nine hundred sixty eight a stone age twenty one year old david bowie watches the film two thousand and one in london's casino cinerama say he goes home and writes space or to take his own musical homage to alienation in the space age with its lonely astronaut major term . strategic. west germany in one thousand nine hundred three major trauma in spine speech a shell into his only since pop hits from. two thousand and one may dystopian sunshine cool in early and ridley scott takes the
idea of how an aloof and indifferent supercomputer one step further. in alien the ship's arrogant intelligence called nada demonstrates how humans themselves have become obsolete. hello today. you're looking well the ominous hal nine thousand times apple computer pitchman in this commercial from the late one nine hundred ninety s. two thousand when computers began to misbehave three hundred twelve the themes and style of two thousand and one and spied countless i five films but he's gone pretend to keep it for his space adventure the motion. but there's no more affectionate how much to two thousand and one than interstellar director christopher nolan says kubrick's masterpiece is his favorite film with interstellar
he delivers an updated and equally fascinating vision of a space odyssey. and two thousand one continues to inspire pop culture in his video to believe that he kravitz rockets into orbit as director michel gondry quotes kubrick with every shot . beach. on trend. and that's all for kino special on fifty years of two thousand and one a space odyssey if you like to geek out on cooper actor website with lots of trivia about the film and if you can't make it to frankfurt for the exam but next year it's going on tour to london but for now i'm here with al harrington and we just like to say to the by open the
pod bay doors hal i'm sorry. i'm afraid i can't do that. please. let me leave the world. of the. planet. for not. tara at the more of a refugee camp there's a terrible suspicion coursing through one of europe's largest refugee camps on the island of lives lost a legend i as followers has said to be terrorizing the refugees some say they've
MasterpieceFilm-museums-in-europeTwo-thousand-and-oneSpace-odysseyMotherScience-fiction-filmsStanley-kubrickWayThe-rules-of-cinemaConversationInspireKeno