Quote, youre losing all credibility with the court, but making no decision on the matter. Matter. Then testimony continued from david pecker, who took jurors deeper into the world of catch and kill, detailing how his National Enquirer or sought out stories that might damage the Trump Campaign in order to catch them and then bury them. Afterwards, the cameras rolling, viewers watching the former president spoke out about not being allowed. He believes two speak out you have a gag order which to me as a totally i got situation im not allowed to talk, but people are allowed to talk about me so they can talk about me, they can say whatever they want, they can live but im not allowed to see that the sit tat look at my conflicted, judge. Its i dont think anybody interested in well, nor has anyone seen what might happen if hes jail for violating that order, which to be fair does not yet appear to be on the table. It seems unlikely that said theres Breaking News on discussions underway on how that might work, and well bring that to you in our special coverage tonight, joining us, this Criminal Defense Attorney or their Dollar Bestselling author and former federal prosecutor, geoffrey toobin, cnn anchors Kaitlan Collins and abby phillip. Cnn senior legal analyst, elie honig, and cnns kara scannell, who watched the proceedings today from inside the courtroom. Caroline, start with you. What was like i mean, donald trump was there at the Defense Table again, this time sitting across from his longtime friend, david pecker, who was getting into the actual heart of this testimony because the day before he was setting the table to explain to the jury what the National Enquirer was and what they did. And today, it was really bringing them into this alleged conspiracy this august 2015 meeting where donald trump, david pecker, Michael Cohen, all hatch this catch and kill scheme and made the decision that they were going to bury you some stories, promote negative stories made up, stories about some rivals, all to help Donald Trumps campaign and david pecker really underscored that today. And then of course, getting into some of these, these two of the three catchandkill deals, both the one involving the doorman, one involving Karen Mcdougal and all throughout the time, david pecker was very imposed. Think a credible witness. He was being specific in his testimony and he was addressing the jury for most of the time at the time, donald trump was variously intently watching david pecker and then otherwise looking, appearing to either be staring off or looking at this monitor in front of him, which actually gives a feedback i guess the Video Feedback that plays in the overflow courtroom. And so hes watching himself, watch the trial, so to speak. Thats come surreal i mean, its its actually the david pecker was made the point several times today that they were he was doing this to benefit the campaign. He wasnt he didnt say he was doing it to benefit to protect Donald Trumps family. It was to benefit the campaign thats the theory thats the prosecution theory, and thats what theyre really trying to establish that this was not about helping donald trump preserve his marriage. This was a conspiracy to get donald trump elected president. The question is, and i think it was a coherent theme theory about all the ways that pecker was going to help donald trump. Wheres the crime . Thats the question is, you know, a Magazine Editor helping someone get elected president. Thats what magazines do in this country. The expenditure of money is allegedly the crime, but you can be sure that im on crossexamination gen. Pecker is going to be talked to. Theyre going to say, you know, youre just supporting the candidate you wanted. Thats what magazines do, right . Kaitlan, how do you think it did on this . Im not sure thats what all magazines do not way if people would like to have a word, but i think its watching all of play out. Its fascinating to see david pecker sitting there in testify in this way, and theyre laying the groundwork to get to something bigger obviously, with all of this and with his relationship with trump. But he met marlow. He met trump visited maralago, met him in the 80s, worked with them in the 90s, worked with him when the apprentice became a show, trump would send him Apprentice Ratings and they would publish them in the National Enquirer. And david pecker was kinda saying it was this mutually beneficial relationship between the two of them, this twoway street. And then you he was helping promote trump. And then when he got closer to the election, he was helping bury negative stories which he had never talked about. Good, never done that before, never paid anyone for a story related to donald trump until it was the door and who has shopped chocolate, the shopping around an untrue story about Trump Fathering A child out of wedlock, but still, they were worried about it and mainly he kept making the point. I only wanted to keep it out of the press and so did Michael Cohen until after the election and so that was the key point that they really got david pecker to make today, which was saying things were different as weve got closer to the 2016 election, are there what did you think of factor . Well, i mean you got to just backup before even takes the stand. The prosecutor opens Opening Statement this is a conspiracy and whos in the conspiracy . Donald trump, pecker and comb. Now, there is no Conspiracy Charge. They could have easily charged some form of a conspiracy if they could figure that out. But one of the reasons why i dont think they tried to even charge of conspiracy is you have three people and conspiracy, two of them are gonna be witnesses and once the defendant why usually its one cooperator and two defendants, not the other way around. Additionally, anderson, he got immunity not a cooperation agreement, immunity, which goes to jeffries point. I think there is really no we havent spoken about a crime yet. There is no crime at this point. Everything hes talking about, theres nothing in the penal law that says this catch and kill theory is criminal. So thats obviously in summation, the process the defense is going to focus on who this guy is and where hes all about. But heres what they have to get out in crossexamination. Isnt it true, mr. Pecker, that one point mr. Trump said in addition to the campaign, melania need to hear about this. Its only need is for that m ms . Yes, he was concerned about meloni. He was concerned about baron because its gotta be that the expenditure is a for him to become president of the United States. Im sorry, thats wrong. Thats just not the law. It does not have to be 100 . I see jeffries agreeing with me. It does not have to be 100 campaign related. Those campaigns should be both. I wanted to predict campaign, but also i was worried about my wife. Yes, the campaign has to be a substantial factor, does not have 3,100 and nobody would ever be able to prove that my view of david pecker today is he was a rock solid start for the prosecutors. So youre not going to win your case that the first witness, its a mistake to try to do that. I agree if the case ended right now, wed have no crime made out, so hes sort of setting the table exactly what i think he did. That was really interesting is he took the jurors inside this cd unseemly world of catching kill and what happens behind the scenes at the National Enquirer, he painted a very vivid picture, even just following along with the updates as we were doing real time it was riveting and he explained how this world works. He explained who the key players are. He explained what the relationships are that Michael Cohen is sort of Donald Trumps lieutenant and dylan howard was his lieutenant. He explained the chains of communication. So youre not going to win it all with one shot right off the bat. But i think its a good start by the way prosecutors should not be highfiving in the beginning, middle, or end of direct. Its all about cross because then youre going to have a good Defense Lawyer like arthur aye. Dala trying to tear you down and theyre going to score points. I got asked you this question. If because heres the problem with this, okay. We dont exactly know what that secondary crime is, right . So you and i are talking about election law. Were not talking about whether he falsified. I think its opening shock pace that he puts something in his books that warrants wasnt accurate. But if he put down i bought this suit to be present to run for my prints president ial campaign but he was going to wear it also to a wedding. He cant write that off. Its not a campaign expense. Its gotta be Campaign Expenses are this is my Campaign Headquarters on paying rent for it. And im only running my campaign out of it. He cant say im running my campaign out of it and im doing some real estate items, but its not a campaign. But if they were had this meeting, is now infinite this meeting with Michael Cohen and pecker and trump in 2015 and the whole purpose of the meeting was, what can i do to help your campaign is in that setting up the framework for what does still work gets them to intent. And thats the secondary part of the crime. Trump is charged with falsifying business records, but with the intent to conceal or commit enough their crime and prosecutors were talking about this in court today with the jury out of the courtroom. This thats what theyre trying to prove with david pecker that the intent was to violate new York State Campaign finance laws, which is just to promote a candidate its more artful than that, but thats the s, youre spending money to influence a campaign there are laws that regulate how that money can be spent. Is that, is that what youre saying . Thats how much you can give. First of all, weigh less than 130,000 and that you have to report it. And i think its worthwhile to step back and just reflect on what exactly the charges are here. And i think arthurs doing effective job showing where some of the questions are going to be raised. But the core charges here you have to start with falsifying business records. And so this goes to what we were just talking about. They paid this money to Stormy Daniels to hush her for the election and the allegations they falsified the payments they may try to make it look like an attorneys legal fees retainer, and the argument is theres the falsification and you have to tie that to donald trump. From which is not going to be easy. And then the back half of it is you have to show that the motivation was political, not 100 , but that is substantial portion of the motivation was published. And this is where i think that the nature of David Packers relationship with donald trump changing in 2015 is going to be critical information for the jury. They were friends for a very long time. Were in this cdd york world. Donald trump was someone put it a friend of peckers. They had that close relationship, but it wasnt until 20 that suddenly david pecker was talking to Michael Cohen every single day, almost trying to give them advice about where the story, the bad stories are there, the nature of the relationship changed . When trump started running for president , which suggests that the motivation was the election that was right there. And what we learn today that was also different than what i had remembered being characterized at the time when there was a lot of reporting and the Wall Street Journal and what not when we were covering the white house was it was written that august 2015 meeting that pecker had gotten said, what can i do . Do to help your campaign . But what he testified to today was that trump sought this meeting with him, that Michael Cohen set it up. And then when they went to the meeting, they asked how david pecker could help with the campaign, that it was the reversal that they were asking him how he could help not him asking them. Theres a history here which makes the prosecutions case i think even a little bit stronger. I mean, the relationship between pecker and trump was one of hero worship period. I mean, it pecker revered trump. I wrote about, i wrote about pecker in 2017 in the new yorker. This was no, right . Well, before which i reread the other day yes it was a trip down memory lane, but one of the odd facts that i always remember from that story is that you mentioned it briefly. He actually published a vanity magazine called trumps style, which when you checked into a trump hotel, it would be there with the gideons bible that you got you got a free copy, but it was so over the top in its praise of trump in his style and his wealth and his glamour and that was how pecker saw trump. But in 2015, he took that hero worship and turned it to the campaign and it makes sense. And its, its, its really beneficial because pecker talks about they surveyed the audience or the National Enquirer about a trump ron, and it was overwhelmingly positive trump was a fixture in that magazine. But the viewership wanted to hear about trump two in a positive way. Perhaps not in the new yorker, you cite an example. I dont know if you were listening in on the call of a new of a call in the among National Enquirer editors about stories. There is a Story Pitch Meeting and thats how the piece opens up. There are pitching a story about i think Melania Trump not holding down from his hand or something. And david pecker says, on the call, well, i didnt see that. And then they tried to pitch the story again, which was a negative story about trump and pecker again says, i didnt see that and they get this sense. Move on, right . Well and i wanted to editorial meetings of the national shall inquirer where they decided what was on the cover every week and pecker was very active in this. It was all about the cover for all about the cover. And they had lists of who sold and who didnt Jennifer Anniston sold Jennifer Lopez didnt sell. I dont know why, but thats true. They also had words that sold or didnt sell on the cover tragic last days, always sold. And also, the last days will live. I live in clinton, won one man were elected, but trumps sold. That was the thing that in addition to this, this may come out in crossexamination, that in addition to the fact that that pecker wanted to help trump that during the campaign 2015, 2016, trump was good for the inquire. Thats what youre suggesting, abbe, in the sense that it was mutually beneficial because when they put him on the cover its sold and david pecker said that today. He said we needed it at the time coming up next, well look at the Trial Transcript that we just got some of the key and detailed moments from inside the courtroom and more would david pecker said about the catch and kill scheme designed to protect the man he said was known as the most eligible bachelor. 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