Cnn Special Coverage or former President Trumps Hush Money Criminal Trial. Im Briana Keeler in washington with kaitlan collins, who is outside the courtroom. House in new york. And today trumps defense has pressed Michael Cohen, trumps former lawyer and fixer about his history of lying under oath in an attempt to discredit him the defense is also highlighted some of the various insults that he has logged against trump over the years, painting him as a man out for revenge after their relationship fell apart. At one point, the defense play this clip from cohens podcast in october of 20 he 20. Here it is truly hope that this man, ends up in prison. It wont bring back the year that i lost or the damage done to my family but revenge is a dish best served cold and you Better Believe i want this made to go down and rotten side for what he did to me and my family it only got crazier from there with cohens credibility clearly on the line, when trumps Defense Attorney here, todd blanche, is trying to do is repeatedly using the word lie in his questioning is often as possible forcing Michael Cohen to recall lies that he is told to congress, the fbi in other branches of government with me now is the chief Legal Affairs correspondent, paula reid, and seeing a national correspondent, Kristen Holmes. Paula, its getting weird in there because right before i mean, theres no other way private, but what is happening right . Right. Well, its been weird, but what was happening right before they just took the break for lunch is Michael Cohen testified that he had this call in october 2016 with Keith Schiller. He said he was calling to get to trump to pass on a message about the payment to Stormy Daniels todd blanche is trying to draw blood right now and say actually, in that 92nd phone call, you were complaining to trumps body man about getting Harassing Phone Calls from a 14yearold prank caller . Yes. And the reason theyre able to to draw this out is because they have logs and records that show cohen had texted Keith Schiller about this 14yearold primer and said, who do i talk to about getting the Secret Service to help me with this . Now, cohen had also threatened this 14yearold the threatened him that he was going to stick the Secret Service on hand. So you have this timeline that really raises questions about whether this next conversation with Keith Schiller and allegedly the president would have been about the prankery that you were just threatening and following up with case shiller about how you can retaliate against the prank or if it would have been about Stormy Daniels. And this testimony that cohen had previously given was significant for the prosecution because it shows that trump was aware of what was happening with a hushmoney payment. And if you undercut the credibility of that conversation is not game over for the process fusion, but its definitely a blow to their key witness. And one of the most important pieces of testimony that he gave to support the idea that trump was behind this entire conspiracy. Well, and to be clear, what we found out this person was 14, i guess theyre there of age now because Michael Cohen had said he was going to put the Secret Service on this and the person said, im 14, please dont a great moment for Michael Cohen. I mean, we were talking about the embarrassing thing that todd blanche has tried to bring out conversations with his daughter where hes trying to explain how he didnt get a job at the white house. His own daughter telling him donald trump and all of his people are walking all over you right now. Michael cohen agree. But threatening of 14 with secret Service Action seems to be one of the more embarrassing moments, but i think particularly this is critical other than being impressing because part of this has been what weve seen todd blanche doing, which is essentially lining up all up until this moment that Michael Cohen is somebody who would lie to get what he wanted out of this theyve said that what Michael Cohen wants, is for donald trump to go to jail. Now they are trying to question what he actually said on the stand, but it doesnt what happens if order doesnt undermine that . He was being paid for legal services, that he didnt render that it wasnt actually a Retainer Agreement when he was submitting these false invoices to Allen Weisselberg, but what my goal what type lines to try to do to Michael Cohen is to embarrass him and humiliate again and have the jury not trust him. Yeah. One juror was just released. All they need is one. Right. With Reasonable Doubt. And this particular piece of evidence that he offered under direct was support. The idea that trump was well aware of this alleged conspiracy to cover up a Hush Money Payment to Stormy Daniels in the days ahead of the election. But a jurors dont believe that cohen actually had this conversation with him in late october 2016 . That does hurt the prosecutions case because they need each one of these little building blocks. Its all they have largely right. Is it . Testimony of Michael Cohen to support the idea that trump was creating are causing all of these documents to be falsified to cover up the hush money. Its pretty well established that this was all done to help trump win the white house. We have multiple witnesses. Who can speak to that. But Michael Cohen i wanted is really the only one who can speak to trumps role, direct role in the conspiracy. If you start to chip away at what he said on direct, this this is a huge problem for prosecutors, but it also so just raises the question where is Keith Schiller . I mean, Keith Schiller is the other person who has come up. So much at this trial every single day, and hes not witness. Hes not expected to a as a witness, but hes not expected to be when acerbi called to testify being there, these key pieces, Allen Weisselberg, i understand has pleaded guilty to perjury great. And hes in prison right now at rikers. Keith schiller is not hes not but he is someone who is still considered a trump loyalist. He left the white house on very good terms with the former president he just wanted to get out of the world. I remember reporting at the time that he just didnt want to be in politics. And in this line of work. But hes still considered an ally of the former president. So now we have two situations that we have seen that have been outlined in which there are three the people who could potentially cooperate. A story, donald trump, Michael Cohen, and the third party, and neither of these situations, the third party is being called. And cnns Kara Scannell is outside the white house or outside the courthouse. And kara, youve just been in there watching. Is this crossexamination . Of Michael Cohen was happening, especially that key moment at the end, tell us what you saw caitlin. I mean, it started out as a kohn back and forth where he was channeling punching Michael Cohen with all of these paths, misstatements are lies as trumps lawyers were calling out Michael Cohen on several of them. And then it just crescendoed at the end with trumps lawyer focusing in on a phone call that Michael Cohen said he had with donald trump in october of 2016. This was right around the decision to Michael Cohen made to pay Stormy Daniels 130,000. And so trumps attorney, going backandforth with him about this call and the timestamp babette at 8 02 p. Will also show cohen that he was having Text Messages with Donald Trumps security officer, Keith Schiller, and that is who Michael Cohen testified. Just the other day that he had connected through schiller to speak with trumps. So what todd blanche trumps lawyer did was show him that cohen was exchanging a lot of messages with Keith Schiller about a Harassing Phone Calls he had been getting saying that now he knew who it was. It was 14 yearold, nashville or what he should do at ido to shiller said call me. Is that point that cohen has that phone call according to the call logs with keith filler. Now, cohen has testified that it was then that he talked to donald trump updated him on Stormy Daniels and said that it was going to be resolved. So todd blanche saying in the oneminute 36 second phone call that these call records show that is when you say that you talk to Keith Schiller and also spoke with donald trump at this moment todd blanche it she is now pacing in the courtroom flailing his arms up, his raised his voice into high pitch, and cohen was maintaining then that he said that he was able to speak with him so trump because he said he ran everything past trump. And this will time cohen has not broken his composure. He has still been answering all of these questions and answering that question. Wow. Maintaining an even tone, but certainly the most dynamic moment of this crossexamination, because todd blanche also asking cohen, if you only remember this phone call when you were refresh your recollection was for flushed by documents from the prosecutors. Does that mean you didnt remember any of these phone calls that you had in 2016, so theyre really trying to hone in here on cohens recollection of calls with donald trump, and that is because michael code is the only person that links donald trump directly to the Hush Money Payments decision to make those payments, and the reimbursement. And that is the part of this case that prosecutors say whats the crime, the false of the records. So it sounds like there are still getting started. Were at the break here. The trumps attorneys, did they do expect to go the full day. And so this session of cyber from that last moment, otherwise they spent it really trying to point out different leinz that Michael Cohen is given in the past, admitting that he lied under oath two, a federal judge, among other things. So really again, this theme of trying to undercut his credibility and suggest to the jury that they shouldnt believe cohens testimony. Caitlin yeah. Qarrah, great reporting from inside hi, that courtroom watching all of this, briana a notable moment for Michael Cohen is they just let the jury to marinate over this during this lunch break before he returns. So the stan yeah. No, it certainly is caitlin. Were here with our panel now to talk more about this, lets take a little bit of stock of this moment where we are right now, elliott, where are we today in crossexamination and big picture, i am having trouble seeing where the defenses really scored huge points today. Now i understand theyve had i think a better day than they have in the past, but just step back. Much of what the defense has gotten out today, the prosecution sort of laid the groundwork for Michael Cohen lies a lot and lied a lot Michael Cohen has prior convictions and Michael Cohen has a bias against the former president , like those things were all pretty wellestablishe d and laid out. I think the most effective moment today, by far was playing the sound of Michael Cohen this podcast for the jury. They hadnt heard him sounding incredibly shrill and incredibly pointed about the former president in a way that this measured Witness On Stage whos done quite a good job, sort of keeping his cool. I think they havent heard or seen that and far more than the particulars of any one lie hes told i think that was the moment that people thought, wait, wait a second. Who is this guy that weve been hearing all this stuff about . How are we in the middle of talking about this 14yearold business . Elie, and how problematic is that for the prosecution . In this matters a lot, dont dont be distracted by the funny fact that Michael Cohen is getting into a war of texts with a 14yearold, which is funny. But heres why its really relevant part of this crossexamination was completely expected, as elliott said, we knew Michael Cohen has a long history of lying. Hes having trouble embracing some of it didnt sort of denying that hes lying about some of the things he obviously lied about. We know hes a liar. We know hes been convicted of crimes. We know he hates donald trump. The story with the 14yearold is so important because it goes to the heart of the allegations in this case heres how on direct testimony, Michael Cohen said crucial piece of testimony in october, i think its the october 24 of 2016. I had one of the key Phone Conversations in this whole case. I call Keith Schiller. He patched me through to trump or he put me on speaker cone, doesnt remember. And i told them stormy has been paid matter result. Thats goes to the heart of the case well, now were finding out on exam that day actually what cohen was texting schiller about all day leading up to that call, was this 14yearold is her asking me sit the Secret Service on him and so blanche said, well, that was actually what you called Keith Schiller about not this Stormy Daniels thing. Cohen then retreated to while i talked about both actually, the 14yearold harassing me and stormy, daniels the problem is Michael Cohen did not tell the grand jury that this phone call in october 2016 was about Stormy Daniels. So there are major questions about a core aspect of Michael Cohens testimony that goes right to the heart of this case and the whole call it Something Like 80 to seven, 30 so in that time, its completely plausible that yes, he raised hell about this 14yearold or that he talked about Stormy Daniels, but it just defies logic that he had both of these major conversations with with the white house are with Keith Schiller at that 0. 14 yearold demand needs a little explanation to it. How many seconds . The next one now wouldnt it if you calling someone to say just say matter unresolved, thats a short conversation. Yeah. Exactly. I think the Stormy Daniels part of that could be real short, but to explain that youre being harassed by a 14yearold and you want this Secret Service to get after this kid and what that takes doesnt that take a little bit more time and energy and effort fact that cohen didnt say in his grand jury testimony that the reason we had this call with Stormy Daniels thats really a problem. All of this to say, all of these explanations are perfectly plausible that they had to conversations, that they had one conversation about stormy are one about 14 in yearold anyone could work. The problem is that its all placing these little seeds of doubt in the jury about the witnesses credibility, just in terms of the story that is being told and what is believable. I mean, what is your impression of these details . Well, you asked for a step back and i do think that its interesting to hear you guys kind of talk about each one of these discrete anecdotes, which in the end is kind of a death by 1,000 cuts in terms of his credibility. And how people speak, how they sound. This is why the podcast is meaningful, right . That the jury these are its one thing to have heard about Michael Cohen. All of those weeks. Its another thing to now be there and be confronted with the full force of his for sauna. The only other thing i would add is that were only in this place because correct me if im wrong, there was not a piece of paper from the prosecution are some piece of evidence that said cover this up. My thanks. Yeah. Love with the heart djt like that, didnt happen. So they really are left with his word, which is its why we can be showered with all of the ways his word is not exactly gospel. Well, i think the question for the jury is or this would if i were sitting on the jury im my question would be, is it can we believe that Michael Cohen is having a