No television, of course, with Andrew Johnson. What do you remember about what happened and how this all of this transpired over the next month . The senate trial was fascinating because of the idea that it is called a trial, but its not a legal proceeding. It is very political. It had so many interesting dynamic characters involved in it. Robert byrd, senator byrd of was of west virginia, stalwart constitutional scholar. Not a supporter or friend of bill clinton in any particular way. He ended up at one point just throwing up his hands and saying, this should not have even happened. That the trial was misguided. He told his colleagues that he was going to introduce a motion to dismiss the whole thing. So, different senators played different roles. The house managers were fascinated to listen to the president s legal team. He had a strong array of legal representation there. He also tried to sort of add english on the ball. He wanted to represent, he had women as his legal representation. He had his own personal attorney. Chuck ross was the white House Counsel and was representing him. He really relied on them to give this really passionate idea about how log headed this enterprise was, to remove a president for what they were basically arguing was personal failings. And that the president had not failed the American People. That he had worked for them. It really helped the president that he was not in any way denigrating Monica Lewinsky or any of the witnesses. He tried to stay out of that. Even as hotheaded as he was throughout the entire process and the mistakes he had made early on, he played it politically in a different way than we are seeing right now with president trump. And yet, the biography on president clinton, the first paragraph includes, only the second president to face impeachment proceedings in the house and senate. And then in the senate. That is a mark that will be forever part of his presidency. It has been. Absolutely. There are so many unusual things about it. Because bill clinton actually turned to his wife to carry the banner. If you remember, when the articles of impeachment failed, first Lady Hillary Clinton was sitting down in the white house with one of the president s advisers talking about the senate race that she launched in new york, a state she has never lived in. Had never represented or lived in. So bill clinton was counting on the idea of being absorbed by the senate, not convicted. Absolved by the senate, not convicted. He turned to his wife in some ways to present herself to the electorate. He left office more popular than when he came in. As i mentioned, the day that he was impeached in the house, he was at 73 approval. Hillary clinton went on to compete for a seat in the senate and won. And was considered and she found that probably discomforting, because she was considered a feminist. She actually was considered a sympathetic figure and a very accomplished senator when she served. And the role of the chief justice of the United States, i remember seeing him with the black robes and the gold bars. That was his own personal touch in the Supreme Court. He actually was he loved opera. And he had actually borrowed this idea of the gold braid on his robe from one of his favorite operas. He had had them custom made. It was his touch. Like i said, he tried to retreat from the public perspective of being the manager, but the manager is in the constitution. If this goes to the senate, if we are seeing a senate trial, chief Justice John Roberts would be in the chair in the senate managing what would become a trial, the second we have seen. Steve during this time period, there was no other agenda for the senate. This was priority one. And the Supreme Court essentially on hold until the chief justice could return. Alexis absolutely. All of that did not get freed up until february. So i think the chief justice behindthescenes kept up with the paperwork for the Supreme Court and was able to manage behindthescenes. But the actual hearing of cases or any kind of action was on pause. One of the reasons why we are talking about this in a very interesting way now is because we are not exactly sure where this timeline will go, and we are heading into an election. If you are talking about senators serving as jurors, we are talking about five president ial candidates who would be anchored to their chairs in a very interesting time. Steve we will hear in a moment from two key players, congressman Lindsey Graham, republican from South Carolina, and former senator dale bumpers. Set up these two individuals, what their role was, and what you remember. Alexis Lindsey Graham was then the republican from South Carolina in the house. He was one of the managers of the case because he had been on the House Judiciary Committee and one of the 13 managers who presented the case to the senate. He felt very strongly and gave passionate speeches about the idea that the president had violated his oath of office and that impeachment was a way to cleanse the office. There has been much debate from scholars now about the idea that impeachment was not envisioned by the framers to cleanse the office. That is what voters do. But that is what Lindsey Graham felt at the time, and felt very strongly that because of the report from ken starr that had come to the republicans with the details involved and the president s effort to obstruct justice, which he was obviously impeached for, he felt strongly that this needed to move forward. Dale bumpers is a senator from arkansas, a democrat. He was willing to defend the president by arguing that he was many things, that it was despicable, poor judgment. He asked the senators, here are some of my adjectives, and he had a list of very negative pejorative adjectives of what president clinton had done as president of the United States. But he said that it was not impeachable because, he said, whenever you hear someone say it is not about sex, it is about sex. He argued this was a personal behavior, and he said all of us, we are all imperfect. And he looked around the room and scanned the eyes of his peers in the senate. He made a very persuasive case as someone from the same state, a southern state, as someone the senators knew very well over decades, and someone who had left the senate in strong repute just days before, literally. It was 20 something days before he left. Steve this is all playing out on television. You are at the white house. What is president clinton doing . Alexis president clinton was following this very intensively. We look back now and say, thank goodness that social media did not exist because he was not tempted to try he left it to the surrogates to opine about the injury and the injustice of all of this and complain about it. But he felt that a very strong part of his tactic was because he was so popular, his job approval was so high, the economy was doing so well, he kept arguing again and again, look what i am doing. I am traveling around the country, i am still the commander in chief. I am dealing with international affairs. He was trying to persuade the American People that he was doing a good job as president and he had not betrayed them. He may have betrayed his wife, but not them. And he was still doing the job he was elected to do. And he said this after he was acquitted as well, that he would continue to represent their interests until the last hour of the last day. What was interesting, though, is while he left office very popular, it was the case that after impeachment democrats were hamstrung to get more legislation through congress. His final two years may have looked like he was very popular, but it wasnt as if they had enough juice with congress to get a lot of legislation through. Steve we thank you for your perspective, and more from the senate trial, january of 1999. We carried it live on cspan2. Republican Lindsey Graham and democrat dale bumpers of arkansas. Hear ye, hear ye, hear ye. Mr. President and members of the senate, i announce the presence of the managers on the part of the house of representatives to conduct proceedings on behalf of the house concerning the impeachment of William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States. The managers on the part of the house will be received and escorted to the senate. The sergeant at arms will make the proclamation. All persons are commanded to keep silent on pain of imprisonment while the house of representatives is exhibiting to the senate of the United States articles of impeachment against William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States. The managers of the house will proceed. Mr. President , the managers on the part of the house of representatives are here and present and ready to present the articles of impeachment which has been confirmed by the house of representatives against William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States. The house adopted the following resolution, which with the permission of the senate, i will read. House resolution 10 resolves that in continuance of the authority conferred inhouse resolution 614 of the 105th congress, adopted by the house of representatives and delivered to the senate on december 19, mr. Mccollum of florida, mr. Kennedy of florida, mr. Bryant of tennessee, mr. Barr of georgia, mr. Hutchinson of arkansas, mr. Cannon of utah, mr. Rogan of california, and mr. Graham of South Carolina are appointed managers to conduct the impeachment trial against William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States. That a message be sent to the senate to inform the senate of these appointments, and that the managers so appointed may in preparation in the conduct of the trial exhibit the articles of impeachment to the senate and take all other actions necessary, which may include the following. One, employing legal, clerical, and other necessary assistence and expenses that may be necessary to pay under applicable expense resolutions or from the applicable accounts from the house of representatives. Two, sending for persons and papers and filing with the secretaries of senate on the part of the house of representatives any pleadings in conjunction with or subsequent to the exhibition of the articles of impeachment that the managers consider necessary. With the permission of the senate, i will now read the articles of impeachment. House resolution 611 resolved that William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States, is impeached for high crimes and misdemeanors, and that the following articles of impeachment be exhibited to the United States senate. Articles of impeachment exhibited by the house of representatives by the United States of america in the name of this house and the people of the United States of america against William Jefferson clinton, president of the United States of america, in maintenance and support of its impeachment against him for high crimes and misdemeanors, article one. In his conduct while president of the United States, William Jefferson clinton, in violation of his constitutional oath faithfully to execute the office of president of the United States and to the best of his ability preserve, protect, and defend the constitution of the United States, and in violation of his constitutional duty to take care that the laws be faithfully executed, has willfully corrupted and manipulated the judicial process of the United States for his personal gain and exoneration, impeding the administration of justice in that. On august 17, 1998, William Jefferson clinton swore to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth before a federal grand jury of the United States. Contrary to that oath, William Jefferson clinton willfully provided perjurious, false, and misleading testimony to the grand jury concerning one or more of the following. One, the nature and details of his relationship with a subordinant government employee. Two, prior perjurious testimony he gave in a federal civil Rights Action brought against him. Three, prior false and misleading statements he allowed his attorney to make to a federal judge in that civil Rights Action. And four, his corrupt efforts to influence the testimony of witnesses and to impede the discovery of evidence in that civil Rights Action. In doing this, William Jefferson clinton has undermined the integrity of his office, has brought disrepute on the presidency, has betrayed his trust as president , and has acted in a manner subversive of the rule of law and the justice of the manifest injury of the people of the United States. Wherefore, William Jefferson clinton by such conduct warrants impeachment and trial and removal from office, and his disqualification to hold and enjoy any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United States. Article two, in his conduct while president of the United States, William Jefferson clinton, in violation of his constitutional oath to faithfully execute the constitution of the United States and preserve, protect, and defend the constitution of the United States, and in violation of his constitutional duty to take care that the laws be faithfully executed, has prevented, obstructed, and impeded the administration of justice and has to that end engaged personally and through his subordinants and agents and a course of conduct or scheme designed to delay, impede, coverup, and conceal evidence and testimony related to a federal civil Rights Action brought against him in a duly instituted judicial proceedings, the means used to implement this course of conduct or scheme including one or more of the following acts. One, on or about december 17, 1997, William Jefferson clinton corruptly encouraged a witness in a civil Rights Action against him to execute in that proceeding that he knew to be perjurious, false, and misleading. Two, William Jefferson clinton corruptly encouraged a witness in a federal civil Rights Action brought against him to give perjurious, false, and misleading testimony if and when called to testify personally in that proceeding. Three, William Jefferson clinton corruptly engaged in, encourage, or supported a scheme to conceal evidence that had been subpoenaed in a federal civil Rights Action brought against him. Four, beginning on or about december 7, 1997 and continuing through and including january 14, 1998, William Jefferson clinton intensified and succeeded in an effort to secure job assistance to a witness in a federal civil Rights Action brought against him in order to corruptly prevent the truthful testimony of that witness in that proceeding at a time when the truthful testimony of that witness would have been harmful to him. Five, on january 17, 1998, in his deposition in a federal civil Rights Action brought against him, William Jefferson clinton corruptly allowed his attorney to make false statements to a federal judge, characterizing an affidavit in order to prevent questioning deemed relevant by the judge. Such false and misleading statements were subsequently acknowledged by his attorney in a communication to that judge. On or about january 18, january 21, 1998, William Jefferson clinton relayed a false and misleading account of events related to a federal civil Rights Action brought against him to a potential witness in that proceeding in order to corruptly influence the testimony of that witness. On or about january 21, 23, and 26, 1998, William Jefferson clinton made false and misleading statements to potential witnesses in a federal grand jury proceeding in order to corruptly influence the testimony of those witnesses. The false and misleading statements made by William Jefferson clinton were repeated by the witnesses to the grand jury, causing the grand jury to receive false and misleading information. In all this, William Jefferson clinton has undermined the integrity of his office, has brought disrepute on the presidency, has betrayed his