Override trumps veto of a resolution that would override the student loan forgiveness rule. Charles hanley is joining us. He is a former peak correspondent out with a new planes, life and death in a hidden war. We thank you for being with us on cspan. Thank you. Host the historical significance of the korean war what is it 70 years later . Guest we can see it simply and the tension that still exists on the peninsula with the. Nuclear crisis. It is sometimes called the forgotten war. It was an indecisive conflict in a faroff place. It came just five years after world war ii. Eventually, it was overshadowed by the vietnam war. But when we look back, we would can see we can see it is a watershed moment in 20thcentury history. It militarized the cold war between the communist and capitalist worlds. It was the first undeclared war by the United States and its history. Conflicts the last between great powers, in this case, american china with soviet with america and china soviet help. It permanently militarize the United States within just a couple years. Quadrupled indget 1950s. Y in that sense, the pentagon never looked back. We can see, as i said in the nuclear crisis, this is rooted in that war. The United States threatened, in to use Nuclear Weapons against the North Koreans, against the chinese. Result, china realized it needed its own deterrent and went to work on it. By 1964, the chinese had a nuclear weapon. We can see the North Koreans as , who suffered such tremendous devastation during the war, have their own nuclear arsenal, which they consider another deterrence against another devastating conflict. Host we have a line set aside for those of you who are veterans of the korean war. Are you saying that the underlying issue in the conflict 70 years ago was the cold war tensions that resulted in the war . Guest at the end of world war ii, korea, which was a japanese colony, was divided by the occupationsmerican of the north and south. Consequently, each followed diversion paths communist and capitalist. 1945,gh in december of washington and moscow reached what is called the moscow agreement to reunify korea within five years, bickering and hostility between the great powers doomed that to failure. By 1948, the whole idea had been the two, south and north, declared themselves independent nations. So we can find the reasons for the korean war very directly in this facility hostility between the soviet union in the United States. , you really try to personalize those on the front lines, including citizens in the war. Walk us through what you learned. Guest i learned even more than i already knew. I had been working on this as a journalist for years, but i learned even more about the devastation of two societies. Characters, these are real people of course and drill experiences, but i called them characters. My characters witness much of the horror of the war, some of the worst of it, from the era ofies to the bombardment in north korea in particular. So this is a way i thought to bring home to the reader the real meaning of any war, and this war in particular, which is in america in particular. From acharacters ranging little northern refugee girl in book with opens the the start of the war, onto various soldiers and civilians, even an american nun who runs a clinic for refugees in south korea during the war, on up to people at the top channels, matthew ridgway, who ended up overall commander on the andican south korean side, the chinese general who was the overall commander from 1950 on the chinese north korean side. I follow their experiences through the war. Picture,hem, we get a an overview of strategy and the conduct of the war. Many of my ordinary people are times, aregh these fleeing, refugees, are under strafing from american airplanes in such and such. Host our guest has won a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting with the associated press. Before we get to the first calls, what specific event led to the initial conflict . Invasion on june 20 5, 1950. I believe it was seven north korean divisions coming across the 38th parallel. There had been skirmishing along the 38th parallel, the separation line, for a couple years before that, some of them pretty serious. When war broke out on june 25 that morning, a rainy morning in korea, many people in the south thought we hope it is just another skirmish. It turned out to be a fullscale invasion. On the northern side, the people in north korea were told that south korea had attacked. This fiction is still maintained by the North Koreans officially in their museums and such, but it was a surprise attack and there was a failure on the south korean american side, and anelligence failure intelligence failure, to not protect these troops across the 38th parallel. The North Koreans cleverly staged a maneuver, which was actually a hoax. The movements were not a maneuver. But rather a fullscale invasion. Host lets take your phone calls. Up from sylvester, georgia. Welcome. Caller i had a relative that served during the battle of who during a battle, the Largest Naval battle in history. President truman called it a Police Action even though it was undeclared. I had was question that the armistice ended the fighting on the peninsula in 1953, but there has been no formal treaty. To many of the North Koreans, the war has never been forgotten, even though we have forgotten the war. Host thank you. Two important points. There has been no peace treaty. There was to be a political settlement. This was within the original armistice agreement in july, 1953, that there be a political conference. The hostilities were just so great that by 1954 when the and it didlace not go very far. Finally, the United States walked out. The disagreements over who would and elections in such such. The United States proposed that the u. N. Oversee elections, but the United Nations was considered to be a belligerent and the war by the north belligerent in the war by the north. Adopteded nations head had adopted a resolution to support south korea during the war. Proposed, and the chinese proposed, a commission of neutral nations, but the americans rejected that end so it ended in failure. So it is a war on hold. No peace treaty. No war, no peace. Your first question related to host it is a war that has never there has not been a formal agreement. Brought up theer undeclared aspect of the Police Action. This is interesting. As a journalist, i see it happen often. That was raised by a journalist to president truman. Yes, he went along with it, but this was not his formulation initially. There was some thought in washington that the entry of the United States into the war, which ended would end pretty quickly, but that proved not true. It went on for three years. There were tremendous costs. You mentioned the casualty toll for americans, which was over 36,000 dead. The total dead for the others and verywas tremendous indefinite. Betweenlieved that 200000 and 400,000 south korea s troops and the same number of north korean troops were killed and even more chinese killed in possibly 500,000. The real toll was on civilians in north and south korea. Probably one million civilians on each, north and south, were killed during that war. Is still considered the war with the most costly casualty toll america has ever fought. We are looking at the start of the korean war in 1950, 70 years ago here on cspan. Sam is next up from hillsdale, michigan. Thank you for waiting. I got so mad toward the end of this book i was reading that i had to quit reading it. It seemed to me that the Truman Administration was just clicking its tongue and shaking its head watching macarthurs crazy behavior. Why didnt somebody do something about that man . Point, and it may be a broader question, some of the key players involved in this conflict. Guest the key players . Host he mentioned General Macarthur, but also some of the other key figures in the conflict. , his on macarthur behavior really came to the fore during the war itself, not leading up to it. War, he was the overall commander in the far east. He was the one who ordered troops in after getting the ok from truman. Ordered the troops into korea. To summarize the early , theandforth seesawing north korean invasion pushed the south korean army and the american troops there into the southeastern quadrant of south korea. In september 1950, macarthur landed a huge Amphibious Force at inchon. That effectively cut off the North Koreans in the south from their resupply. At the same time, the American South korean force in the south broke out from their perimeter and drove the north , very forces north weekend at that point very weakened at that point. They macarthur sent his forces across the 38th parallel, capturing pyongyang, and all the way to the chinese border. The directives from the joint chiefs of staff in washington where that he should not send american troops to the chinese border because the chinese would consider that a threat, but he disobeyed that. The whole u. N. Command at seoul moved toward the border, reached the border, and met the chinese. A disaster for the americans. At the same time, macarthur made a strategic error splitting his forces up the east coast and west coast of north korea. Thehe chinese picked off two split forces more easily that way. They are attacks were a great surprise to macarthur and his generals. They went into it essentially a headlong they went into essentially a headlong retreat all the way back to seoul. The real thing that got to truman about macarthur was that he was speaking out geo strategically, not just militarily. He kept pushing for a wider war against china, attacking chinese bases, attacking china itself, and even mustering troops from taiwan, Chinese Nationalist troops that had fled to taiwan, getting them to reinvade china for a second front in the war. ,y character general ridgway one of the featured individuals early onk, could see that macarthur was making a great strategic mistake on the ground in north korea. , when he wasstood told he was taking over from macarthur, that macarthur had been fired. Ridgway was already in ridgeway was already in korea and that he would leave korea to go to tokyo. Ridgeway knew that macarthurs ideas, the American People would not stand for them. Truman simply became too impatient with insubordination. They fired him. Host we welcome our cspan Radio Audience and those listening on sirius xm. Our guest is Charles Hanley. He is a Pulitzer Prizewinning author for the associated press. Has upcoming book titled ghost flames, life and death in that hidden war at the korean war as we look back at the korean war that happened 70 years ago. Bob is up next from arlington, texas. Good morning. Caller my brother got killed over there august 5, 1952. What bothers me the most is the fact that most people over here these days do not know china was the biggest part of why we lost that war. And we still disrespect it. The second thing is that memorial day everybody says, happy memorial day. Well it is not very happy for me, i will tell you that. Second, people like Colin Kaepernick who disrespect the flag i tell you what, that is the lowest point we can ever respect the honor of the people that died. That is what memorial day is about, but you get a guy like Colin Kaepernick or these other celebrities saying this is our flag, and theyre disrespecting it. I would love to disrespect one of their relatives in the same way. Host bob, tell us about your brother. What happened . Caller he waited to get drafted and he was ready to come home and a sniper got him. [crying] he was with the 5th Regimental Combat Team and evidently it was behind the lines, but they had the snipers out there picking people off left and right. He had been promised to be able to come home. He had already served his time and he got promoted. They did not know how to manage the peace. Everything was quiet, everybody was waiting for the next move. Host how old was he when he passed away . Caller 22. Host bob, thank you for the call and thank you for sharing your story. Guest i am very sorry to hear about your loss and obviously, steve, the mention of china earlier, there were chinese soldiers lost in the war and they were the deciding factor. They saved north korea otherwise we would have a unified force korea back in the 1950s. The chinese still view the war as a great victory because they saved north korea and they pay close attention to the history of that particular war. In fact, one of my characters is the overall commander of the chinese force. Soon after he entered the war zone and set up headquarters he had his oldest son is a russian translator. Soon after the chinese armies entered north korea, the headquarters were attacked and the general had just left his cabin and his son had returned to the cabin. American planes came in and bombed the cabin and killed his son. Maos son, who some considered a potential successor, is buried in north korea and honored on their memorial day so to speak. The connection between china and north korea is quite close historically. They have their animosities, but the Chinese People and north Korean People recognize their relationship is deep and long. Host our guest is joining us from florida and our next caller is from key biscayne, florida. Bill, good morning. Caller good morning to you. It is a privilege to talk to mr. Hanley. My question is two parts. How did north and south korea originally become separated . My second part is, do you think north korea thinks in terms of what drives them today is not selfpreservation, but the desire to unify the peninsula . Host thank you. Parallel. First, on the division between north and south korea along the 30th parallel. Guest yes. There was an agreement between the United States and soviet union to reunify north and south, but the discussions fell apart after a couple of years because of their growing animosity over so many other matters, particularly in europe. They simply went ahead and fostering separate governments. In 1948, the republic of korea was declared in seoul and later in 1948, the democratic republic of korea would be declared in north korea. I tend to say the Korean People are very, lets say, nationalistic, very proud of their culture, their history, their unity over centuries. In 1950 this was the first time korean fought korean in a millennium. It had been unified for centuries before the soviets and americans brought about this war. I think in their hearts all koreans would love to see reunification, but i know in the south there are misgivings because of the great burden that they would have to undertake if there were to be reunification and supporting a very impoverished north korea and politically troubled north korea. As far as the north korean attitude, they consider themselves the legitimate government of all korea and the people have been fed propaganda their whole lives. I think at this point they think it is their rightful place to be reunified and be the rulers of korea. Host the Korean War Legacy Foundation putting together a series of conversations. Those on the front lines of the battle between 1950 and 1953 and among them was alan clark. Here is part of his story. First is the field site visit. It has this hood on the back that can zip up and button off. And it is real thick. Right. The reallyone is godsend we had. , a this was an overcoat and it has an insert which is here. It is london fog and everybody had one of these and everybody wore them. You slept in them, you walked in them. And you are lucky to have one. In addition to that we had a wool scarf which was wonderful because you could put it around your face and that wind, which was really cold. You could put it under your helmet and have your eyes out. That was wonderful. One place the wind was blowing like crazy we were out near the bridge and we were communicating with our headquarters. As i stood there with the wind blowing and, at the time it was 42 degrees below zero, the wind was blowing like crazy and if i faced the wind, i could not close my eyes. [end of video clip] host that is alan clark reflecting what he remembers from the war in korea 70 years ago. Dr. Your phone calls. Al is joining us from it got, new york. Ithaca, new york. Good morning. Caller good morning. Thank you for the program and your guest. I have two questions. One, even though the book starts in 1950, if he could deal a little bit more with the history of a korean resistance to the Japanese Occupation that started in 1905, and also the establishment of the regovernment in the south. From what i understand the , Korean Independence Movement was declared a party very early in september, 1945 and the u. S. Sort of instituted or made the regovernment come into existence. Thank you for your research. Host thank you. He goes back to the start of the century. Guest history is very interesting as you know. In 1905, there was a settlement of the russojapanese war, in which Teddy Roosevelt played a mediating role. As part of the agreements there was a secret agreement between the United States and japan, in which the United States would acknowledge japanese suzereinty over the entire Korean Peninsula and in exchange the japanese would not interfere with the american role in the philippines. The japanese very quickly turned this into a colonial situation. They declared they annexed korea and declared a colony. They even tried they did impose the japanes