Race and media and i interviewed to rosie virginia native, you worked in investment banking. That was my first job. Also exa magazine in mexico. You started working on Hidden Figures in 2010. And became a New York Times number one bestseller. Spawned a movie that was oscarnominated, Margot Lee Shetterly everyone. [applause] so, i heard that you gave an amazing speech last night we talked a little bit about charlottesville and race. Keep give us a taste of what you talked about there and how it compares to what you talk about in the book . Yeah. The thing that we talked a little bit about what i started out doing, which was working in investment banking. Out of school. Really, when i was growing up, that seems like progress and the future and very protagonist way, life you know it career to have a very powerful. And history for me, it was something that always felt you know i think as an africanamerican, always so heavy and connected. It is usually taught in schools as Martin Luther king and now of course there is obama. This very long but extremely narrow part of history. And so, during the course of writing Hidden Figures, what i really cant understand is how powerful it is to be able to tell a story. And to write a story. And to tell your own story. And to be the protagonist in your own story as opposed to telling a story with there is a recipient of history. And so, i live in charlottesville virginia. I went to the university of virginia. I recently moved there. And you know this entire, you know, issue of the statues and the white supremacist marches, that stuff has been happening since i and you know i think for me, we are very focused on the presence of the statues and the meaning of the statues. You know what they have come to symbolize. But i think part of the issue also is that the statues, they also represent an absence of a counter narrative. That there is the slavery narrative, there are these confederate statues but in terms of a diversity and a richness of africanamerican stories, there are very few. And there are very few in which africanamericans are protagonists. St and the stories in which you are allowed to be a protagonist matter. Each of us is the protagonist in our own life. We see ourselves as people with agency. And i think that is why we love stories about superheroes. And kings and you know these stories make us feel powerful. And so, i think that is really, it is about the presence of the apartheid in the presence of the racial terror and the slavery. But its also about the absence of the counter narrative. I really see that one of the jobs of, bridging some of these divides is bringing forward these stories that have always been there. The people have been there. The history is nethere. The stories are what we need to tell now. Well, for people who may have been under a rock the last year or so, Hidden Figuress amazing book about these black women who served as human computers, working for both the agency that preceded nasa and for nasa. With all of this complex numbers that were used first to develop the aerodynamics for airplanes and then later for spaceflight and now, you said this is not hidden history, it is unseen history. And i know you said everybody asks you, why dont we know this . But im going to ask you, why dont we know this . [laughter] and why is it unseen . Are we afraid to look at it . Were we too busy why was this unseen . I think the primary reason why this history has been unseen is because this work was womens work. And you know, not just at nasa. There was this group of africanamerican women working at nasa. They were part of a much larger cohort of women from all backgrounds doing the work at all of the different nasa centers. There were Women Computers working in the army and the navy. They were working at which was the precursor to at t and basically founded the communications revolution. Virtually, everywhere he found Technological Progress that required numbercrunching, there were women they were living excel spreadsheets. And this work was considered professional work. It was very necessary but literally, the woman at nasa were classified as sub professionals pay which meant they were both clerical employees. They were not as high in the hierarchy as the men who were engineers who were considered professional employees. And so, i think that that is a large reason why this work was invisible. They were kind of the equivalent of our computers sitting on our desk doing the work today and yet, without them, all of these advances would not be possible. Im interested in how you decide to focus on this. Because i know of course he was surrounded by these people when you were growing up. And you know, ive done panels were talk to people and i go will have this idea, and i made a reality by doing x, y and z. And i think wait a minute, i want to hear about how you had the idea. Because that to me e is key. Deciding there were plenty of other people that grew up around these people and in your neighborhood where you will growing up im sure everybody knew these stories. What made you decide this was worth a book . I told the story before. Its interesting. The moment, there is a very specific moment when Hidden Figures, what would become Hidden Figures came into existence. And interestingly, it came out of a moment between the two most important men in my life. My father and my husband. And so, my husband and i have gone back to hansen and were visiting my parents for christmas. Seven years ago now. We had run into a woman who worked at nasa many years as a computer. And you know it sort of spark this conversation of my dad sort of going into this speech about what she had done and the other woman and Catherine Johnson who calculated the launch window for the astronauts and in a very casual way [laughter] wait a minute that moment where the needle slips off of the record. Yes but i did not have that moment. I did not hear the needle slips off the record. You know because i had heard a lot of the stories before and i were i had gone up there. I knew them as my parents columns and friends. But the needle definitely slipped off of the record for my husband. Who is not from hansen. And he said can you please replay that for me . And why havent i heard that before . It was a moment looking at the community, the people, nasa. It is very extraordinary kind of place that i had grown up and that was also extremely normal and ordinary. But being able to see past what was normal to me and say, that is pretty remarkable. Was amazing to me about this book is that the level of detail that you are able to bring forth about these peoples lives. I mean i feel like when dorothy is walking to teach at the high dschool i am walking with her. Because youre able to describe what the journey was like. How did you get that level of detail . How did you find the research to say what the place was like and the landmarks . Doing the research, i loved it. I mean i loved it. And i really, the kind of book that i wanted to write was a kind of book that i loved reading which was really detailed narrative nonfiction. You are so immersed in this dream and this life that you lose yourself. You going to this time machine and so, i mean the sources, there ffwere 70 different kinds of sources. First of all, interviews with people. Catherine johnson, just turned 99 years old. Really amazing. I was very fortunate. Teraji henson. Yes [laughter] i got to spend a lot of time with her and talk to or not is about her life but during the for example. And the relationship between the dorothy and the woman that worked for her. There were employee newsletters starting in 1942 for the Langley Research center which is called the Langley Aeronautical Laboratory back then. Black newspapers. Amazing source of information. The description of Mary Jacksons wedding dress. In the book, it came from an article in the norfolk journal in guide. The level of detail in the black newspapers, it was amazing. Absolutely extraordinary. The nasa history and the Langley Research center has done a spectacular job in preserving wind tunnel records, research reports, phone books, photos of offices and workgroups, teams of people. So i really love that part of it. And if i did not have to eventually turn in a book i would probably still be doing that research. [laughter] i heard that you sold the rest of this to be made into a movie. While you were writing it . I am scared of you. [laughter] you hadnt even finished writing the book. I had not actually even started writing is the [laughter] whi want her agent who is her agent . [laughter] [applause] i will save, i have a very wigood literary agent. Her name is Mackenzie Brady watson. Young and very smart. Excuse me she was the one who represented my book proposal. And sold it to harpercollins. Then she you know was the one who basically facilitated getting it into the hands of donna who is the producer for Hidden Figures. And donna read it and she immediately felt a sense of mission i think. She really made her job championing the story as a movie. She made it her mission. I mean, it is not a usual or, it was sort of a Lightning Strike set of circumstances. That happened with the book and the movie. Wow what i love about the book in addition to all of the great detail about these wonderful women is that you are able to talk about so many Different Things within that narrative. One example is the way in which we always have these periods where there has been progress in civil rights in america, often because americas threatened. World war i, world war ii, the cold war. And then these periods of backlash where black soldiers are coming back from the war and they get beat up. This attempt to put people back in their place. Talk about how those things worked in Hidden Figures and why it was so important to make sure that when a sense of this history in that way . I think again, a lot of this came from my interest and my preference with these epic narratives. And i wanted to, this woman had epic narratives. It was not enough to either to share their lives or simply show the history. I wanted their lives directly connected to this history. Anything about these women is that in so many ways, their lives were connected to the big history. And not just for them working at nasa starting in world war ii. But for example, Catherine Johnson was one of three black students to integrate the west ate school in virginia. Dorothy vaughn worked as a math teacher before she went to nasa. She worked at a school in farmville llvirginia that filed lawsuit and was eventually incorporated into the brown versus aboard of education sui. That School System was shut down by the state of virginia rather than reply with the board decision and integrate. It was, he really was fascinating to me to look at this history and see the opening for all of these women happening during world war ii and because of the need for labor. And because of the external threat. And that we would d see these periods of backlash for example when after brown when virginia closed at schools. I wanted to understand how the big picture circumstances affected the individual lives of these people. And how they responded to those circumstances. Yeah, yeah. I also love this idea of looking at for example, during the cold mpwar when all of thes companies were fighting off the oppressors and the that it brought on america to show that hey, we are not really that bad please join us instead of going with the communists, india or liberia or cuba. And you are able to also show how that fit into their stories which i thought was nice. Yes, i mean 1957 when the soviets put sputnik, their satellite, into space. It really kicked off that space version of the cold war. It was a fascinating time. I mean this was a time of mccarthyism, it is a time of sputnik obviously, the excitement of going into space, the fear of maybe the russians are spying on us. It is the time that little rock happened in 1957. One of the most, i mean just one of the most unbelievable documents i found that i put in the book. That sort of connected those two things. The russians would always publish a timetable of where the sputnik satellite was over flying. During younes or the orbit around the earth. And so, i found this Washington Post article that showed that the russians published when it was flying over little rock arkansas. So you know, there is a direct connection between the turmoil in the United States and this International Global battle between the United States and soviet union. And this idea that because of segregation, because people were oppressed that america was holding itself back. Maybe one reason the russians got sputnik earlier is because they gave women more agency as engineers in the soviet union. Yes, there were many more female engineers and an Engineering School there than there were here in the United States where women were still having problems even getting admitted to engineering programs. So yeah, i mean i think one of the things that was very clear during the research into Hidden Figures is that the story is so important. The stories that we tell ourselves, the stories that we disseminate inside the country, outside of the country. All of these things affect the decisions that were made. In a very real way. The government was involved in shaping the stories both internally and externally. Now, your book covers a lot of history. 1943 all the way through to the Space Program, Hidden Figures the movie did not do that. I went through the whole book looking for Kevin Costner and i did not see Kevin Costner [laughter] i know that you said you do not have a problem with it but we surprised hoat how they chose t tell the story . It seems that the kind of crunched a lot of circumstances together to make the narrative more compelling. Yeah, it was an interesting experience of this whole Hidden Figures thing. While i was writing my first book, learning how to do that. Your first book. Her first book [applause] oh my god. You know, i was also getting a crash course in what it takes to adapt a book for film and how you tell a story to film and how you tell a story, sort of difference between fact and truth. You know, there are a lot of facts that are dissuaded in the movie. But what i really appreciated about the final product of the movie is that it is very true. It is very church the nature of the women, it is very true to the circumstances, very true to nasa and that sense of what it was like during the early days but it was really hard for me because first of all you know about this book from 1943 to 1969. I was able why cant she make a movie . It goes from 1943 to 1969 . Or a t. V. Show chris yeah, that was hard. I think it was very much the right decision to make a compact narrative focused around this very traumatic moment in Catherine Johnsons life where she lays the trajectory for john glenns flight. It was difficult to see certain elements of a Story Initiative from one characteristic to another or see things that were created like, i am sure anyone who has seen the movie probably did figure this out but yes, there was no Kevin Costner character who sledgehammer ehcolored sign. [laughter] i was looking. I was in the index [laughter] you know so it was, there were moments where i struggled with some of the decisions and one of the things that struck me for example was that in your book you say that they basically ended segregation and 1958 . [inaudible] they are saying this is to be segregation but they already stopped that. Yes. The department was not segregated at the time. Exactly. But in order to bring together these two very traumatic things, which is john glenns orbital flight and Catherine Johnson doing the calculations and the end of segregation, they were you know, conflated in terms of timelines. Was there a mom or dad to break that outo you . I had to say i know that people have written books and made them into movies and different opinions. At a very positive experience with this. And the producer really kept me in the loop. Every once in a while it would be like 3 oclock in the morning and ill be up working to try and finish this draft so i can turn ipit in. Then the script would pop up. You know . Like latest version of the script. And so, they really did an amazing job i think of keeping me in the loop of honoring my suggestions. You know, really listening to me. And doing all they could to understand and preserve the authenticity of the story. Which i was very happy with. Right. So the movie comes out and it is very successful. I think it was the highest grossing movie amongst all of the movies that were nominated for best picture of the year it came out. Your book was in the New York Times as a bestseller. And one year later, you have White Supremacists marching through virginia who feel like they have been supported by the president of the United States. What do you think . I mean, on the one hand this esstory comes on people are so hungry for this history and they are so worried about how people have been oppressed and history has been oppressed. And when your leader we have people who would be right at home upholding white supremacy. Watching them in the middle of the streets in the town that you live in. What do you think of that . You know, i mean this is america. There has been a lot of commentary after charlottesville. Both the town and the state and the country that this is not who we are. We are. Ho you know america is a complic