Council or Foreign Relations since 2003. Today were here convenes to listen to Richard Haass the prolific author and academic who just came out with yet another book entitled not very ambushesly as he said, slightly ambushesly the world, a brief history in 300 pages. He calls it a little bit of a departure from his previous books. I want to start because it was only after you turned in the manuscript that the world was confront by the covid19 pandemic, and in the roughly two months since that happened, this crisis has highlighted so many of the themes and concepts you tackle in the book. So i wanted to just ask you outright, what does the pandemic tell us about the world right now . Well, thank you, juju, thank you for doing this. Thanks always to everybody on the call. Hope everybody is well and safe as we all get through this one day at a time or as ive said, one groundhog day at a time. What i think the pandemic tells us first and for most is that the world matters. Thats perhaps an obvious thing for a member of the council on Foreign Relations but i dont think its an obvious thing for everybody. The world matters, what happens around the world doesnt stay there. In this case it was small city in china in would you haun wuhan a virus broke out,ed the to china and the United States and elsewhere around the world. On 9 11 it was terrorists train in afghanistan. Other various times it was what we have seen with Climate Change coming from everywhere, financial contagion, from this or that country. So what this should tell us is that these two oceans on the atlantic and the pacific are not moats. Theres no draw bridge to pull up. Sovereignty, whatever else it is, is not the same thing as security. We are affected by what happens in the world. Foreign policy in turn is how what we do affects the world and theres a loop, but the most Important Message to take here is the world matters and isolationism, denial, sticking our head in the sand, whatever you want to call it issue is not a serious or viable strategy. You talk at length about the interconnected this of the globe and enter dependence, how that the american response to this Global Crisis reflected some of the things you bring up think notable absence, for example of the u. S. In the european convening to tackle the vaccine for covid19 . This has not been a good experience, shall we say, or demonstration of u. S. Connectedness to world. Begins with the fact were connected like it or not. Globalization is not a choice. How we respond is a choice but globalization is a reality and we chose not to participate in the european led effort to pool resources, intellectual and familiar to work toward a vaccine. Seems that probably reduces the chance that after itself will succeed or succeed quickly it also means. I it were to succeed, we would about very hard pressed to make the argue. We ought to be towards the front of the queue. Europeaned will say you werent there when we needed you and now you need this. Why should we favor you over others . That has hurt us. I think even more what probably hurt us has been the example we have set. Such an important part of Foreign Policy, not what diplomats say or do or what soldiers say or do as important as those are. Its the example we set. The functioning and describe bran si of our democracy when vibrancy, when our economy grows at a healthy clip or how we respond to a foreign challenge, and no one around the world gets up in the morning and says i want to do this just like america. Really respect how they are doing it. Inconceivable that sentiment is being expressed. What bow, again, another chapter in your back, the role of multinational organizations like the world Health Organization. President trump has repeatedly threatened to withdraw funding at a time when people like bill and Melinda Gates have doubled down and increased funsing. Thoughts. A lot of thoughts. One reality of this world is this enormous gap between global challenges, Climate Change, pandemics, terrorism, the digital cyberdomain and global arrangements. An enormous gap. We use this phrase in our business, International Community and there isnt one. World Health Organization like most International Organizations, struggles to try to narrow that gap ten the challenge and the response but no stronger than the major powers will let it be. The United States now has pulled out funding. China has essentially ignored its requests. So, what this tells us, we see this time and time again, is whether its the u. N. , security council, the world Health Organization, global governance, global arrangements are only as strong as, again, the United States, china and others will allow it. So we have to improve it after the crisis or i would say we need to find ways to supplement, to work around, to come up with other wives pooling our efforts. The other lesson thereof he world, isolationism is a dead end. The other i think fundamental lesson of the pandemic and a Foreign Policy is that unilateralism is also not a viable approach to the world. You mentioned china and its role in this pandemic. Theres been a lot of criticism of intelligence and lack of transparency. But also what is the role that china has played in this crisis, say, about its role in the glen right now . The first thing it reminds people, is a if we needed reminding what an author tearon chine is and no mistakes war pointed out and those pointing them out were silenced. China now continues to push off requests for any sort of investigation. So the first thing is its a reminder of what the nature of china is. It has not met it International Obligations to cooperate fully with the world Health Organization. And cooperating fully with our response to it. That to me is the basic message. Alves while this is going on, china has been doing some pretty nasty things including repressing democrats in hong kong, just to mention. One other thing. At the same time this isnt necessarily a rationale. Probably have this. The United States take it up and say we need to place hostility to china at the center of our Foreign Policy. Yes, we need to push back and criticize china where need be and we can talk about that but also wouldnt it be a much different and better 21st 21st century if on occasion we could persuade china to work with us. For example, against future pandemics. For example, against Climate Change, for example to reign in north koreas missile ambition. The real Foreign Policy challenge, one way to think about it, how to we push back against china where necessary and also how to deprotect pockets of cooperation where it serves or interest and theres. That will be a major challenge to the next generation of dip plots in beth countries. You talked but how the pandemic is has similarities to other global crises, for example, Climate Change or cyber terror. What way does those challenge the order or disorder of the globe. The similarity is it doesnt matter where the things start. They spread everywhere and dont respect borders. You can deny them but you cant insulate yourselves from the consequences. Climate change, one of the interesting reactions is how in this country, the rejection of science and experts, we see it on the pandemic, see it on the Public Health front, also see itingly on chining anding one thing Climate Change, one thing im hoping comes out of this greater respect for facts, greater respect for scientists and experts, the wide respect for dr. Fauci is a welcome development. The basic lessons are the same where we began. Global challenges. Cant ignore them. And you cant solve them by yourself. So again, i keep circling back to the rejection of isolationism and the rejection of unilateralism and one other thing. The first part of the book is about history. What is so interesting is how much of the last few hundred years of history were about great power jobbing and it get out out world and had world war i and world war ii and the cold war. Well have competition with china, obvious differences with russia. What i think really defines this era were living in define this 21 until center and makes it different is i predict the major challenge this year are not so much greet power competition, the familiar challenge. What i continue to exists but the bigger challenge could well be how you contend with these global challenges. Just 30 more seconds. Imagine were successful at pushing back against china. That still doesnt provide an answer to Climate Change or future pandemics. Youve know and i know theres going to be covid19 25 or discoach 25 or covid 30. Doesnt deal with terrorism. One lesson of this is thats its not sufficient. I just want to highlight my very dogeared and highly highlighted copy of your book. Its called the oworld a brief introduction its now on amazons best seller, ranked 53 among books. Know you took great satisfaction in edging out Good Night Moon for a moment. Although that bright shining moment passed. Its number two in world history, number one in international and World Politics and yet you said dish must say one of the most fun aspects of it for me is just seeing you pop up, him cook style in d hitch cook hitchcook style. You have written 15 others. What is is 14 but who is counting. Host i tend to exaggerate. What made me write this more than anything else was a concern that, the world so fundamentally important. I if youre a young person in high school or college, that means you for born around the turn of the century and if you have the kind of long life span we hope for, that means your life will be a 21st century life. What is so striking to me is how many young people dont have even a rudimentary knowledge of this world. That in maybe ways could make or break their lives, whether its professionally, personally, physically. This book came out of a day where rarely enough for me i was out fishing of all things. Not something im known to do and i met a young man going from this junior to senior year at stanford and what a Computer Science major. I said with what do you study when you dont study computer. Said how many history cores you have had and she said i havent had any. I said how many economics cord,. Thousand officees eand we went through the liberal arts click him and this is a really intelligent young man who will graduate with a very narrow intellectual foundation and when i came back to council i noticed was that this was not an exception. You can graduate from virtually any college or university in the country and avoid these courses. They offered virtually everywhere and thats different. Theyre not required. So what made my want to write the book is so many americans, young and also not so young, its seems to me lack the foundation, lack the knowledge, in order to among other things hold elected representatives and officials to account. How can people walk into a voting booth in november if they havent read up on the position of the candidates, and if they havent said that doesnt make sense or why is nat my interest . I want people to get empowered so they can become better informed and as a result more active . Citizens. Youre fight thing illiteracy, in the Foreign Policy illiteracy. I take exception to the fact you had to mention my alma mater of standford. When is would there ising i took few history classes and part of the joy of reading this and why i highlight it, were in an era of specialists, where you can take nothing but asia history or african history and mills out on what the early chapters of the book does which is highlight the global perspective on it. Im a great believer that history is extraordinaryily valuable, mark twain says history doesnt repeat itself but it rhymes and it does inform our decisionmaking, inform our analysis. Ive been lucky enough to work for four president s and in every one of those of educations history was brought into the conversation. Not like anything else. History can be used or abused but just as a background, its really helpful in order to make since of the flood of stuff coming at us. When you think about it, between the internet, television, radio, newspapers, what have you, theres just such ad in of information and what i thought people needed was a filter to make better sense of it. Im a big my son is going through ap history testing and i was age able to help him. Put i would recommend it highly, clearly. Give us a sense of your writing process . Because you are we know you have day job and there are few crises your handling. How do you write, when do you write, whats the process like . This book was different in the sense that i had to think really hard what went into it, because if you want to write a brief introduction to the world, by definition you have to rule a lot of stuff out and also the whole idea was not to write a book that assumed anything, not to assume anyone had taken these courses, not to use any jargon. I take a lot of long walks around central park and thinking about it and then when i sit down at the keyboard im ready to write. Write most morning pretty early for a few hours and i my only advice to wouldbe actors is never to accept working breakfasted. Theyre the killer. Spend few hours, the days the telephone standards ringing and emails later. If inning get a few hours in the morning and then a few hours on weekend, im lucky. I can write quickly. Thats pretty much the approach, and are you rite writing before or after the morning joe. I do it after. The other advice for recall writer, dont think of writing as a sequential process. First you do allor your research and then all your writing. Start writing. My wifes an editor and she always tells aspiring writer what you want to do is think not not justure conclude but the review you would like to have written of your become, start there dont start at the top and then build the book from the bottom. But think a lot where you why youre doing it, your readership, what reaction you want to have and what youre trying to accomplish and then do it before you get buried never details. I read a number of reviews of to the. , the New York Times there was a quip that was long elines of, haass takes departure from his usually cautious didactic style and weighs in on the isolationism or interventionist position. You did make a calculated choice to do that. Why tiptoe into it and why so fundamental to you . I wanted to write this book in a way that wasnt an argument. Wanted people whether they were up in end zone or the other plate clay issue wanted those be a book that was foundational. The purpose of the book is not to tell people what to think. Whether to sport this policy or that, but rather to give them the background and the tools to come to those conclusions by themselves. Also i read what i had written i realized that certain themes were so intrinsic or fundamental to the book, criticism of isolationism, criticism of unilateralism so i thought i would come out and basically say, we can argue all the details we want about, say, what our goal should be and what tools we should use. Thosees legitimate policy argue. But i didnt think there was an argument about ignoring the world or think he being the Foreign Policy was a game of sal tear. I thought those two points a game of solitaire. I had to come out of the closet on them. If you were i envision you coming out of the which is it. I if you were in the state Department Today what overreaching advice would you over arching advice would you geoff on covid. On Foreign Policy in general i would make a big push for diplomacy, make a big push for working with allies, allies are force multipliers. I would make a bigger push for explaining american Foreign Policy to the american people. For covid, more the other thing i would do is put a great emphasis an recreating the foreign service. One of the real historic strengths of the country. People are essential, whether theyre soldiers or people in the Intelligence Community but we need diplomats and people who are trained to represent this country around the world and also to advise the president sitting in on in washington but on covid, its ateband beyond the purview of state department argue what the governors or mayors or president should be doing domestically but noton their purview to participate in check see if science ticks, dealing with antivirals and vaccines, noton the purview of the state department to be designing the economic help that the United States would coordinate with others in order to help other countries, both get through this and then recover afterwards. Its obviously not beyond the purview of the it is the purview of the state department to focus on the other problem. Were focused on covid. Get it. Its understandable. Theres no giant pause button out there in the world. History has not stopped. North korea is still developing Nuclear Weapons and missiles. Iran is gradually moving to getting close her to he ems of the 2015 agreement. Its reduced the warning time. We would have if in fact it did choose to make a dash for Nuclear Weapons. Venezuela is still hemorrhaging people. Russia is still occupying crimea and eastern ukraine, china is expanding its friend in the south china sea. My points we need the Statement Department to stay focused on the rest of american Foreign Policy and National Security, indeed one thing i tell you but the crisi