Welcome. Im the executive director of the the Strike Center and im honor ode begin tonights program by introducing two individuals whose vision and generosity made it possible. First, someone whose name we all recognize, john striker, former president of Temple Immanuel and a donor who has allowed his edge miss family main sake. This is erica. Then be followed by dr. Marsha, a member of the tampa abort of trustee. Of you want to submit a question for speakers do so using the zoom chat function. Ill ask also to remind everybody that right now in the chat function well put a link for you to purchase the copy of the book if you have yet to do. So lets begin. Thank you very much, and thank you john. I hop that even though we cant see him, he can hear us and to all of you for being with us. It is my honor to introduce tonights extraordinary guests. Two men whose voices have brought so much public understanding and debate in europe and the United States about who we are, where we have been and where we are going. Bernardhenri levy is one of the most influential intel electrics our time. With the publication of his book in 1977, also launched an unprecedented controversy over the european complicity with the toll tar tarean jim. Hi come bin path of writing, underground active jim and support for democratic right has never wavered. Beginning with his property and presence on the battlefield during the lib briggs in bangladesh in 1971, continuing to anwar, afghanistan, and israel and more. Today after over 30 published works of philosophy, political essay, fiction and theater, hundreds articles and on on yesterday, four opeds and reporting from the front lines in syria,ian and more. He has turn his mind to the moment were currently enduring. Returning to the concept of the medical gaze he asks that we think critically and protect Human Society from our a threat of the future. His approximation i have to say i have been awaiting into english with the virus in the a aim of madness i believe offers a crucial if not vital reflection on the multiple meanings of a lockdown. The most perverse and dangerous pitfalls of what it means to confine ones thinking and ones gaze towards the other. Yes, to being safe and responsible, but no to the consignment of our minds. Tonight he will discuss with Thomas Freedman one of americas leading newspaper columnis his insights captured in this new become. Mr. Friedman began reporting for the New York Times in 1981, served as the beirut world chief, the Jerusalem Bureau chief, International Economic correspondent, and since 1995, is is Foreign Affairs columnist. Three pulitzer prize, Thomas Friedman is the author of seven New York Times best selling books. The timing of your book in this conversation could not be better. I see the participants climbing as we sit here. That is a great credit to you and the number of people who want to hear your insights. I thought maybe we would begin by just asking you to summarize the book, take five or seven minutes as she would like. Maybe come back with my own take on the pandemic. And then lets iterate back and forth and see if we can drill down to a real bane of understanding for all of our listeners here. Over to you. Guest thanks, for this conversation with you. For me it is a treat. At i am very happy for this occasion. To make a very difficult, but what do i mean by which is translated in a slightly different way in america. In times i said this virus takes us mad. There are two sorts of madness induced, created by this virus. The first one on which we will agree, you and me, is those who denied the virus. Those who do not want to see the virus and those who put a mask on the reality. And to fall into like children in a sandbox seeing which is like the reelection exposed, reacting in a crazy, stupid, and criminal way. Meaning with all of the respect due to your country. Meaning your president , some of his entourage, some of his affect is him and others in both brazil and many, many others, they react with madness to the pandemic. On this im sure we will agree. So i will not spend seven minutes on that. To be mad which is the way we react to this pandemic. You have of course a lot of people who react and act with the wisdom for sure. But you have also a pandemic of hysteria all over the world. And selfishness. I believe for example the way we are giving power to the doctors who dont wish it, who do not wish so much as if we are lost, and when you are lost to act in a sort of rather crazy way. Too much the doctors know they are to be respected. But they are not gods. In their knowledge is not power, it is never ever called world. If we consider for this opportunity. This is a way to be mad. Another way to be mad is to consider, i tried to listen to the world. My job, my specialty but it is how people express. In some of these sentences, which spread in our world, i cannot help hearing some things which bother me. For example, social distancing. Of course it is necessary. Of course we have to accept it for a while. We dont know if it will be months, if it will be a year. If it would be a few years for sure. But for myself, i accepted as a terrible in sad obligation. [inaudible] but what i see in europe and in america, is a lot of people accepting a sort of new normal state. As for myself, and most, we spend our life fighting for social distancing. Social distance is precisely what we are fighting against. To this conversation by all possible ways but social distance means inequality. Means despised and so on and so on. There is a word to accept it as a new normal way of being which is a sort of panic. When i hear dr. Anthony fauci. Saying as a sort of evidence that shake hands will not combat for very long and it is okay like this. Again, but what is happening, shake hands. Of course to very big thing. It is a very tiny symbol it is a sign of peace, it is a sign of fair contract, it is a sign of equality. It is a way which humans look at each other with mutual respect. Instead of the previous time when one looked down on the other and so on and so on. And so in this way of consenting accepting, may be cherishing these symptoms of this moment, i take an example and then it will be to you. The confinement as we say in france, looked down as you say america. Consists with people. In a sort of moment of self focusing. Digging in of one self, going back to what is supposed to be the truth which is the complete opposite to the real duty of the man, of the jewish woman or man especially, which consists getting out of yourself. Getting to the other. Transforming yourself into a host for the other. Her transforming yourself to the other. The misery of the other. So again it is another example of this sort of bad affects or side effects which i will accept in the limited time. But to which appeared to me as it had to be consistent with the new normal state of things. This is the second madness and the main idea. Sue went just a few thoughts of my own, a very important point i think you raise, it is about what is called in the language of american Popular Culture today, safety is in. Because you really ask a very fundamental question, and previous pandemics, we go back to 1918, there was a rather tragic view of the human condition. The coming and going of pandemics. And it was if a pandemic happens, some will die. But we will not lock down the whole economy to save to try to save every single person. There is the much more tragic kind of sensibility, life was nasty, brutal and short. Literally lifespans were shorte shorter. You have raised a point in some interviews as well. Why did that change . That sense, we have approached this pandemic very differently from previous ones in history. And what role may be did the internet plan that . Guest what has changed is probably realize on metaphysics. Our conception of what is the meaning of being a human being and so one. There are two truths, one which is good and one is. [inaudible] the good sense is life is much more sacred than it was in 1918 and 19. At the end of the day, remember that was the end of the First World War which was a butchery, which would be unacceptable today. This is a time when four wars for example, even if we dont really get zero dead. But the death of into merrick and soldier, a front shoulder, if it happened so much it was not at this time. [inaudible] things which were in the order of nature today our scandal. But, tragic means another thing. And this is is less, is not as good. We are in the moment of our destiny where we think that we can really topple, we can really get rid of the tragic. That we can really get rid of of inevitable loss, lack, whatever you call it. At the end of this process there is the idea you can triumph again. You can win against death itsel itself. That you can start to get a new humanity where we will be as gods as the famous french writer said. Which we get rid of a tragedy, to put tragedy far from us means that. Means this dream of humanity, getting rid of these of itself. And i think that it is very dangerous to answer into that. But the experience of the. [inaudible] , of the last centuries tell us that if we go too far in these anti tragic dream, if we really cross, if we decide to delete as in a computer program, not convenient, we get much worse or harm. So on one side we consider life as sacred. On the other side, we feed the dream of the humanity getting rid of death. Which might be a way of creating. [inaudible] this is what changed naturally after the beginning of the 21st century. Host so an interesting point in your book, it is a good place for us to segue, let me share with you my perspective. Because it is actually the point where we meet. But i get there, from a very different route. You come at it from a very philosophical perspective. And i would say in many ways european. I actually get there, i got there through a different way. Actually by looking at Natural Systems. And so, your book is such a wonderful framing of perspective a a philosopher on this. And i actually come at the pandemic from the perspective of an environmentalist. But we are going to end at the same place. So let me share with you, and brief how i got to the same conclusion. My daughter, natalie is executive producer of all Things Considered weekend on National Public radio, so i never miss a show. And on easter sunday, they did a round up of pastors sermons from around the country. At the height of the pandemic. And my favorite was pastor Michael Curry from the national cathedral. Easter sermon by singing a little song. Hes got the whole world in his hand s got the whole wide world in his hands hes got the whole world in his hands hes got the whole world in his hands now if you just substitute, bernard, she for he, you will know where i start with the pandemic she got the whole world in her hands, this is the first time for our generation of human species that we have all, at the same time, simultaneously and in the grip of Mother Nature. Unless you are 103, this is basically the first time all of us have been in the grip of what i call one of Mother Natures festivals. To put it in american baseball terms, Mother Natures throws pitches that is, she throws fastballs at us they are called viruses, they are called hurricanes and tornadoes and floods and droughts and forest fires. They are all of the things she throws at us. To sort out the fittest. Who shall get their dna into the next generation and who shall not . Now with Mother Nature throws her fastballs at us, she, actually does not reward the strongest. She doesnt reward the smartest. She only rewards the most adaptive. That is who she rewards, that is what darwin taught us. She actually only rewards three adaptation strategies. She basically asks in the internet every individual, every collective three questions. First of all, are you humble . Do you respect my virus . Because if you dont, i will hurt you or someone you love. Second, she asks are you coordinated in your response to my virus . Because i evolve my virus over millennia to find any crack in your immune system, your individual immune system or your collective immune system. And lastly she asks is your adaptation strategy, to my virus, built on chemistry, biology and physics alone . Because if they are built on politics, ideology and election gallantry, not chemistry biology and physics, i will hurt you or someone you love. Because i come Mother Nature, i am just chemistry biology and physics, that is all a. M. You cant talk me up, you cant talk me down you cant say Mother Nature having a bad recession could you take a few months off . I will do whatever chemistry, biology, dictate and to put her to get them american baseball terms, i always bat last, and i always bat 1000 bird ive not lack control lost a duel and 4. 8 billion years. So that is where i start. And its actually were might tragic sensibility comes from. Because when you are up against Mother Nature, tradeoffs are always built into the scenario. They are inevitable. So, to me the key mistake that we made in america, our president made. I am not going to turn this into a trump bashing session. We all know what he is. Trumps great failure, analytically to begin with of many, but the central one is he does not look at the world through Natural Systems were the only looks through markets. His only look at Natural Resources as golf courses prepare he could triumph over nature because he actually builds a waterfalls for his famous for building waterfalls on his golf courses. So we thought he could triumph over nature. You may recall early in the pandemic, he gave a disastrous speech on the next day change policy, amended it in the market went up a Record Number of points. He actually took a screenshot of the market rise and he sent it to a man name lou dobbs and that knucklehead, showed it, term autograph the market going up and lou dobbs, that knucklehead showed it on the evening Business News of fox tv. While they were doing that, the two of them, Mother Nature was silently exponentially and mercilessly spreading coronavirus from coasttocoast. So the central challenge, and this gets to me to the core of your tragic points, im going to come out of through nature, is from the very beginning. We had to have a twopronged policy that the right policy from the very beginning was how do we maximize saving lives and livelihood at the same time in a pandemic where you are up against Mother Nature. You had to try to maximize life and livelihood. Because if you just walk down everything and crush the economy, so many more people will die over time, taps of despair from lost jobs, homes, businesses and hope that will ever die covid19. Answer the challenge is how do you do both . Now we saw three basic models around the world in that. Then i will end with this. We saw the chinese model. Chinese model was actually as a state surveillance system, china has developed to control its people. To try to control the virus. They were super efficient. They didnt just flatten the curve they crush the curve. But they did it using a huge state apparatus to test back in trace people with the virus. We have democratic variants of that, france had once, singapore, hong kong, south korea, germany, although had democratic variance of that. Depending on the culture and the efficiency of the government, some worked better in some worked less. The second model is a swedish model. The swedish model says were actually going to balance lives and livelihood by keeping part of the economy open, part of the School System open will close other parts of encourage social distancing. We will actually go for her immunity. The chinese wanted to crush the virus and wait for the vaccine to get hurt immunity, the swede said lets enter do it by letting the young and healthy go out, acquire the virus, overcoming to get natural hurt immunity. In the last model is the american model. Which was to talk like were going to do like china, to act like were doing like sweden, to prepare for neither and to claim to be superior to both. That basically is the trump strategy. And it has given us this incredible that we are neither maximizing lives or livelihood. So that is how i come to the tragic sensibility that you arrived at. But its coming there through the root of looking at the problem as a Natural Systems problem, and what happens when you are up against mother natur nature . Guest okay. Again, very interesting. We reach the same point. We start from a different point. About trump in the state of america, i would love to disagree, i would love that its too pessimistic, but we agree one 100 . In this, for me, for a european who believes so much in america, it is heartbreaking. As i often say, i belong to this category who arrive without the american sacrifices. And to see other agenda american the state that is today is just catastrophic. But let me elaborate on a brilliant point i thought you made. That we are, from a european point your sin, almost back to a prechristopher columbus, lovely thought. Guest we europeans, for the first time in the ages we dont expect anything from america. Before he had anti americans, you had true americans, but at least americans was on the tabl table. America was a fascination of love of hate, it was in the center of the game. In europe, no expectation for america. For the rest of the world, and this especially holds to the state of the new powers like new empire like russia, like china, like you ran in pakistan, they are moving, they are stepping in as if america did not exist. This is what i mean about a prechristopher columbus world. And that is what is absolutely unthinkable a few years ago. That the world of america does not count. In americas not taken into consideration. For the western we will agree on that. We agree on all that you said at the end. Where we disagree, i think im going to stress on that. Because we advanced more by disagreeing than agreeing. You said what Mother Nature was asking at the beginning. The questions, i agree with all of those questions. There were other questions that she addresses to us. Mother nature asks also, if you arent home stay at home. This is a model. Okay. Do you have a proper home . Do you have a place in which you can stay . And Mother Nature knows there is a huge difference between having a house and where you can stay during the pandemic and to be homeless. Mother nature asks, do you have someone aside with which you can spare. Money with which you can hold on for months or years. Or are you a daily worker like in bangladesh who would maybe disappear with time from hunger if there was one week without work. Mother nature asks, do you have, do you belong to a Healthcare Network which allows you to go to hospital when you feel symptoms or dont you . And do you have to transform your legal home into an annex of the hospital . Do you have to be condemned to hospitalization . To becoming hospital or your home which is quite another thing. Mother nature asks, do you have the chance, are you lucky enough to be born nevertheless despite what he said in america or europe which are democratic countries where you are part of society protects when the president is too much crazy. Or do you belong to a country with a dictator and where that is used as an argument to look down people in your own sense of the world. Mother nature asks these questions also. And Mother Nature asks in complicity as the main actor of social darwinism. Modernism makes the separation between the lucky who survive and the unlucky who will die. So how have we to react to these questions of Mother Nature . We have to react. And this is my points. We have to react by those of intelligence and knowledge. We have to be much more sophisticated, intelligent, than heard. We have to be more wise than he. We have to connect all possible knowledge is available. For example, trying to find a vaccine, we have to match the level of walking, ins sweden, america, south africa, we have to declare a scientific emergency for all women and men of goodwill connect and work handinhand in order to reply to the challenge of Mother Nature. We have to have Mother Nature ask in a way, very differently. She shoots him blindly and not exactly blindly, the weakest are those who do not have healthcare and so on and so on. In so we have to act exactly as we do when we are. [inaudible] remember the good move was to say we remain faithful to our values. We dont accept these moments of emergency. We dont expect to these of emergency to have a consequence, to forget our values. Remember. The good reaction to these blind questions addressed by Mother Nature is to remain more than ever faithful to our creed. The creed for example that the other one is more important than myself. The creed that the life of the lady in bangladesh is as important as the life of a student in yale university, which help me publish my book. This is the values of which we have to keep faithful, more than ever. Because Mother Nature is humiliating with values. With a cherish them more than ever. And what are the values we have to cherish is the values of what we have called for the few centuries, humanism. And what is humanism . It is, in a way, accepted or not. But to prevail over Mother Nature. To be stronger than she is. To accept her, but to add to Mother Nature this part of sophistication, intelligence, spirit which humanity owes. And these, by the way, we are speaking under the temple of emmanuel, this is a jewish wisdom, just consists today. To say, for agers Mother Nature dictate her role, we are going to respect her. But we decide that if we respect her too much it is adultery. And there is something which is his god, roles of noah whatever you call that, something which only the human being can produce, and what has to be stronger. But, saying for example, but to save a body is not enough if we are not able to save the spirits and the values which is the reason why. This is one of the chapters of my book. They say so often that the best. [inaudible] this is a stranger saying. Because they treat the body they treat the human being as a body. The body is a peace of Mother Nature. We use Mother Nature and forget the sort of strife of life which makes a woman a woman, a man a man, and mankind mankind. This is our difference. I think. Sue and im not sure of the difference. You describe all anime categories you have to be coordinated. In your response. In one reason sars, covid one actually did not become the pandemic was actually because shiner Southeast Asian countries, america europe, were actually coordinated ways they arent today. Further coordination is also providing a safety net for the most disadvantaged. I think the big question that will come out of this, one of the things that we have learned most from this crisis is it was actually the people at the bottom of the pyramid socalled bottom of the pyramid who have been the First Responders saving us and this place unlike 911. Effects obvious of the doctors, nurses, healthcare workers of the true First Responders. But the people actually stock in the grocery shutters, drive the trucks unloading the trucks, working in the Grocery Stores every day for minimum or near minimum wage, probably living in conditions they cannot social distance in. Probably having minimal or no healthcare. The real question is after this pandemic is over, that we will understand that what we are doing an emergency, now hopefully to help them, amazon giving raises and whatnot in the moments, how do we make that permanent . How do we understand that the value that they have been bringing to all of this. All of that falls under my category of being coordinated. Coordinating just means we cooperate. Coordinates were elevating and protecting the very people who are doing the most to protect you. He raised really interesting question about the lockdown being used by the kaczynskis and this new sort of authoritarian populace. Talk a little bit about that from the european perspective. That is something americans might not be so aware. How this info use the putins, using this crisis to actually reinforce their kind of majoritarian politics. Im going to come to that just a minute and your sense about those invisibles who hold from the food, hold on the world during the pandemic and what theyre doing. I completely agree on that. They were really supporting the rest of the earth and of the globe on their modest and humble heads. And again, there is a. [inaudible] and of course you know we trust wife said the world was sustained those humbles that theyre doing in their thought, those who studied it. Managing the world you prevented the world of deep creating itself. Today, those who prevent the world from de creation, there is a creation, those who prevent the world from de creation are the social workers. And so on and so on. And this is, i agree, so much on that. And the more we can be aware of that, the better. Those who take advantage of the pandemic, it is you are for sure. I happen to know him a little. And in 30 years i met him 13 years ago. The main difference of today is the young care, he cares about life he does not care about the life of the migrants or the life of what he considers an old hungarian. But he takes, this pandemic for him is a divine surprise as a french fastest said in 1914, a divine surprise. It is the help of god. This is the way he considers it. God is whispering in his ear and allowing him to make more heady. So putin the first reaction of putin was to take this situation in order to make himself or maybe the rest of his life. And you have even worse out of europe. You have some countries, like for example in nigeria, the country which i happen to know a little i went there recently. In nigeria, now it is not any longer. But this had to be fact checked exactly. But you had frankly comparable number of deaths from covid and from Police Military and Police Taking advantage dead shooting people for example when they were starving and getting out of houses and so on. Another example of that, which is so sad, it happens again with the end of the french containment. I went to the greek islands, it is a place where a lot of refugees from suit on arrive when they tried to reach europe. They stopped and they are lockdown. There is a camp which is organized for 2000 maximum people and has 20000. And what is so despicable and horrible is that the greek government, that is a democratic government for sure, one of the things they did was to decree a lockdown from this huge camp of 20000 people. They are really in jail. It was decided the local lead step out because of covid. Covid became an argument to implement what was the dream of a lot of people which was to lock completely these people. I visited the camp one month ag ago. I made the story a few weeks ago about that. It is no longer a camp, it is a jail. It is not even a jail, it is a hell. This is an example of what you are saying. Of the way in which some democratic powers, because greece is the beginning, the way in which the viruses instrumentalized in order to take from really on fair and not criminal of course. But on democratic, on humanistic decisions. This is another example of the more striking. And honestly, i spent two or three days in this camp. And it was to see how Mother Nature was taken hostage by a democratic government. There is the common plan of europe. And they decided with the refugees who are now, which is a disaster. Because brings so much for your. Now they are considered in covid helps that. Host said the big question that i am pondering here of course is how much of the madness we have seen in our country, will be with us if and when donald trump is no longer president . God willing. I wrote today about what is probably for me the most of a long list of disturbing things that have been evidenced by this pandemic. Disturbing behaviors in america. And for me it really comes down to the politicization of the facemask. The idea that. Guest i read your text. Host wearing a facemask be a cultural marker, a political statement. And a society that can politicize a facemask, it might as will be ace each belts. A society that can politicize that, can politicize anything. Physics, rainfall, it can politicize anything. And one of the most disturbing features of the last, not three and half years but even before, is the inability that we have lost our, what my friend rena gorgas calls are cognitive immunity. We havent just lost our physical immunity, we have left a jet lost our cognitive, our ability to embrace and act on shared truths. Weve lost our Cognitive Community thanks to social networks attacking them. Foreign powers attacking it. A president decrying anything he doesnt like as fake news. In the loss of our cognitive immunity on the eve of this pandemic has only made the pandemic worse. So we cannot agree again on the facts of whether a therapy is even effective or not. And we cannot agree on certain just fundamental principles like a facemask. I find that deeply threatening to our democracy. Whether joe bidens present Donald Trumps president right certainly prefer joe biden he will not fuel that fire. I am curious pride one of the things that strikes me, is that no one else in the world is behaving this way. No one else is politicizing facemasks at the scale that we are doing. From your perspective, what the hell happened to us . Guest trump. Trump. If you had the proper leadership. If you had a president able to give the example and consider it as a possible example, it would not happen. Because to be very clear, as for myself i obey. I did wear the mask during the peak of the pandemic. And in the places where it is required. I am one 100 disciplined but, i feel it as a disagreement. I know that if we met, you and me with masks it would fuel the relationship. I know we speak with our eyes but also with our mouth. You know, all that belongs to the faith, means so much. The faith is such an ethical, reality that it is true that to bear a mask as a sacrifice. It is a sacrifice. But there are some moments you have to make some sacrifice. When she lacking america required in the great times of sacrifices. A leader who says it will take some time. It will not be forever. But for the moment you have to, even if its hot, even if you breathe a little less. Even if it feels bad. Even worse you speak, you have to do it. What you lack is a leader. At least hes considered by the french people he is an incredible example. Okay we have to. We had this temptation of politicization. But we did not we put our handcuffs on coral and we obeye obeyed. Because we had the leadership that showed the narration. This is what you dont have. And america which is free spirit, we dont believe it can lead to this was like a crazy competitor saying during the most crazy idea which is honestly but accelerated by social freedom. Keeping my on the questions as well how is being in europe pretty want to take advantage of you being there, how do you think france in europe will be changed by this and how the role in the world would be changed by the pandemic. Guest it will not be challenged by the pandemic. It will be changed by political will. And by reconnecting yourself or not with the american creed. It is not the question of the pandemic. I refuse the idea to give too much importance, too much history to this pandemic. I think it is not unprecedented, and i think there is not before and after. I think we will prevail over the pandemic. I hope. I hope that will be less deadly. But it dont think as it self it will change the world. Except, the consciousness that a proper democracy has to have some proper hospitals. Has to have a Proper Health system, one of the worst iniquities is what i said before, to those who have excess, those, this hopefully will change. For the rest, i dont rely. I dont put my hope in the reaction to the pandemic in order to reveal the bigger work. When the pandemic will be over , the world before risk. [inaudible] with the same people on the two sides of the barricade. Those who are happy with the world as it is. And those who are honestly genuinely trying to repair the world. It is where we start, lets make that. And the real point for america , is that america will have to reconsider its self as a land of great values, of the creed of the founding fathers. And so on. What is happening with you work, is not due to the pandemic. Europe is trying to take in the hands because we discovered for the first time, that the American Protection might not exist any longer. And for the moment, it is something terrible happens to europe, for the First Time Since one century, america will not come to our rescue. With the pandemic it is trump creates the state of political and europe some of us take into consideration, they really think this new world, they really try their best to respond to the new challenge created by the retreat of america. And of am in italy now. You have some people of the left and right who are happy with that. And are ready to make a deal, dear deal with the worst to shoot the migrants and so on. This is dividing in europe. But the dividing line is not america pandemic. I resist for myself for the temptation to give too much story goal, importance to this pandemic. At the end of the day, it is a tragic disease. It is a little virus but it is a virus. And as they say in the book, a virus is pure death, is a concentrate is a sort of coagulation off of poison. But it is not misdirected. It is not an agent of history, it is a message to those, i tried my book to resist this way of considering the message. Theres one thing i disagree with you on. I think it is the messenger. I think mostly stars one encoded to our messengers that we have expanded urban areas into wilderness areas. We have killed the apex predator in those wilderness areas. We have left behind generalized species of bats, rats, primates who can live and destroy the ecosystem. And we have gone in and even hunted those. And they evolved in the wild with their viruses. Like the coronavirus. We have gone in, we have hunted those, we have extracted them, we put them into wet markets which is where covered one came from and wuhan for covered two, they have jumped in some way we dont fully understand from these species to other humans and other mammals. And i do think it is a warning to us. That when you press on Mother Nature too far. When you go to these extremes, you will get these deeply offended responses. And i do think this is a warning on climate that if you do go through the same extreme on climate, Climate Change has a couple of differences with sars covered one encoded two. Climate change does not pique. Viruses pique, Climate Change is not pique. If we melt the arctic ice, it will be gone forever. It will never reflect the sun again. The ocean will rise and we will live with the implications of that forever. Not only does not pique, there is no herd immunity to Climate Change. Theres just the endless pounding on the herd. There is one difference. It is that there is no vaccine for Climate Change. Which is dramatically rude duly seeing co2 emissions. That is something i disagree with. I think there is an important warning here about going to extremes of nature. Weve a couple minutes left ac. Benjamin Netanyahu thought he had slade this dragon and now its come back to bite him, triggering massive protests against netanyahu. Take your lens from the book and apply ito middle east before we close. Before we close. I want to say that on climate ce change we are on the same page. Im with you. I think i read most of your pieces about that. I agree 100 . It is an emergency. There are maybe not or at least few more pressing political questions than Climate Change. Im sure of that. I used to say that we live in the first time in history in Human History where the idea of the end of humanity has become the predictable historical event. In the old ages, it has always been taken into consideration, but as an impossible event, how would i say, as an for the first time in human you have disagreement where its one century, five centuries but theres an agreement to say that the end of humanity, because of Climate Change, will happen in the time of Human History. This is huge. About the virus. Ow right that the coronavirus is the product of the description you do, but the virus of the spanish flu, the virus of the coughing of fifth century before christ, before Climate Change, it was before globalization. So what i would say is a little different thing. In are some so many viruses, as many viruses in humanity that as skies stars in the sky, okay . There is a lot. Some take advantage of the overpower of Mother Nature when they are omni pent. Some viruses will come and some take advantage of the mankind. I dont now to describe it. Maybe some scientist will do it one day but im sure there is a table kept might be a difference between those who attack when Mother Nature is strong and those who attack when Mother Nature is ready but the two are as killers also the others. But the middle east. It depends. I was recently in kurdistan. Israel. Kurdistan. I dont know if is the main problem of israel today is coronavirus. Im not sure of that. There are there is a real problem about the debt any of sigh destiny of zionism, of giving a new breathing to the great dream of zionism, which is for me one of the rare wellachieved revolution of the century. Will it die . Will it survive . Will it revive . This is a real challenge for israel. Is the covid the big challenge . Im not sure. Ill might be a mask. It might be a mask for those who dont want to raise the real existes stenshall question. Even if you look at the figures. So, my reaction is really to be humble and careful, taking the countrys, the situations in the world case after case and probably not i try to prevent myself from generalizing too much. This has been a treat to be in this dialogue. I urge earn to go stay automobile, click amazon doom doom. Buy the book, the least you can do and its ban a treat for me, anytime. I always enjoy our conversation. Great treat for me, great honor. Great honor for now. Thank you for being with us tonight. On our Author Interview program after words word former Deputy Assistant attorney general in the george w. Bush administration weighed in on president ial powers and the u. S. Tugs. Heres some of the discussion. I started out wary of pressured. Wasnt a supporter of his in the 2016 election and the thing that worried me he was a populist and the constitution seems designed to stop populists. Its fairly antidemocratic in nature, like the senate and judiciary and the electoral college. I was worried when trump came in as populist who wants to achieve an agenda that he feels he received a mandate for, that he would strain against or goon the constitutional restraints of his power and i was worried he was doing that in things like the travel ban, threats to build a border wall without congressional approval, and that earl piece i urged him to try to use his president ial powers primarily nor National Security and Foreign Affairs and instead to understand in Domestic Affairs that his role is really to enforce the law and then to work with congress to get legislation passed. What hand since 2017 to today is that i found his critics have become the ones who have i think gone too far and n trying to stretch the constitution because i think trump is so outrageous and they launched attack after attack on his legitimacy. Its trumps critics who talk but getting rid of the electoral college, talk about packing the Supreme Court to add six new members to get to 15, who want to return to us a world with permanent statutoriry protected independent counsels which i think criminalize our politics. Want to nationalize our economy for a green new deal. If think the effect has left trump, who is undeniably using the constitution more as a shield, to pursue his on selfinterest, but that leaves to him the field of relying on more traditional enter takes of the constitution. So i argue either intentionally or unintentionally he has become more of testifieder of the traditional constitution than his critics. To watch this program, visit our website, click the word word word tab near the top of the page to find all previous episodes. Welcome to todays virtual program. Im aimee al litson, founder and president of she the people, a National Network dedicated to elevating the police cal power and voice of women of color and im so thrilled to be your moderator for todays afternoon program. This program is part of a commonwealth clubs virtual series that we loo like to thank or members and sponsors and supporters for making this and all the other programs possible. Were grateful for your support and hope that others
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