We have adapted to the Current Situation and had to adapt again. So we are bringing you the things we love the most. We also are offering Curbside Pickup which is scheduled to resume on this coming saturday. You can order scotts book and pick it up starting again on saturday or if you are anywhere in the country you can have it mailed to you. We are happy to be able to begin our series virtually. We hope you enjoy this event. And we hope that you support scott anderson. It is what keeps our series and going. It is what keeps our doors whether they are open its what keeps us getting new books. You keep your money here in st. Louis. And it helps us to be a better bookstore. I think you all so much for your support. I am shane mullen. We produce hundreds of author events each year. We will be taking questions from the audience so be sure to take your questions and in the comments. From the bestselling author. A gripping history of the early years of the cold war the cia covert battle. In the tragic consequences which still affect america and the world today. At the end of world war ii the United States dominated the world seen as the victor over tired and the champion of freedom it was clear to some that the soviet union was already executing a plan to expand the resolution around the world. The strategy and a response relied response relied on the secret efforts of a newly formed cia. The exports of force. The former football star. A sophistic german. A brilliant ad executive. Before he ran the covert operation around the globe. Parachuting commandos in eastern europe. In directing wars against communist insurgents in a job. Time and again their efforts went awry. Thwarted by a combination of stupidity in rigidity and more profoundly the decision to abandon american ideals. By the mid 1950s. They have a strangled hold on eastern europe. The beacon of democracy was overthrowing it. Democratically elected government and earning the secret of much of the world. It would lock the cold war into place for decades to come. Anderson brings to the telling of the story a Major International bestseller. It began it a the common purpose of defending freedom. Stricken by the moral compromises they have to make ones that can be the destructive american spy. One would be so heartbreaking dash mike broke and he would take his own life. It is also the story of how the United States at the very pinnacle of its power managed to damage moral standing in the world. In the sweeping vivid beautifully observed book. The devastating secret history of how the United States lost during the cold war. On the twisty Colorful Life of four legendary spies. There was a larger geopolitical issue. With the idea of the power. It was one hell of a book. It still resonates powerfully today. It was the finalist for the National Book critic circuit award. A veteran war correspondent. The corresponding writer for the New York Times magazine in tonight he will be in conversation with julian. He has worked at publications including vanity fair is the author of the upcoming nonfiction book. About an exposition. Im so happy and thrilled to be able to welcome scott anderson. Today is the publication date which is a very exciting day for authors. If everyone at home would have please help me in celebrating that by giving both scott in julian hardy round of applause wherever you are. Thank you so much for everything. And for everybody to meet in. Scott, this is such a critical time of history that you are covering. Even that it is a couple decades that you cover. So much goes on during that time. You dealt with it by focusing on people who were influential. How did you settle set on those four guys. I grew up in east asia. And south korea. It is a real thing. I have always wanted to explore that in writing. And starting to do a little bit of research i came to the conclusion that so much of what was peak come. Almost 50 years. So much of what was to come. Was in the mid 1950s. In 1944 theyre talking about world war ii being the end of it. The dismantling of the british in the french empire. And america was good to be this harold democracy. Then you go 12 years on. And now the United States is pain for the maintenance of the british and french empire. We really wanted to find out how to do happen. What also occurred to me was the kind of history i like to write. People on the front lines. Its not generals or statement. Really the frontline soldiers if you well. They helped fuel the armories. The process is finding these things. Unfortunately in the time frame. Two of the men were somewhat wellknown. The other two were not at all. I wanted to find people who have the big stuff that happened to them during this timeframe and then who were changed by it. They left the paper trail showing the change in them. It was kind of the proverbial the last surviving member of the cia. Speaking of the paper trail. They are writing the history. I assume that you will find that amount writing reliable stories. How does a california and have a hand in redacting. It was definitely redacted. There is censorship. But fortunately and tends to be uncommon. There had been a page redacted from nature. Are you can see how many letters were in the name they redacted. You can also triangulate information. And this happens all the time. Two men and a topsecret meeting. And they both wrote memorandums of that meeting. It will be almost all blacked out. In the case of Michael Burke he actually wrote an autobiography and because he was in the cia. It have to go in the review board. They completely gutted his book. It was published but all the best parts have been exiled. It was actually a cia official. There is a copy of the manuscript. So sure enough. It went to Boston University and there was an unredacted manuscript. I can fit in all of the details. See mike in the case of peterson shell. There were a few others who struck me as people who couldve made great characters to focus on. In the cases and i believe you spoke to one other 90yearold. Was it tough to get them to agree to talk about this. Or was he just waiting for someone to ask. Or was he just waiting for someone to ask. Heavily somewhere in between. The guys who are still around. They live under a lifelong not a man. There were certain things they cant talk about legally. But what i really wanted to talk about was what was it like. He was the station chief in berlin. At the end of world war ii. He had been in the ground zero of the confrontation. I want him to tell me more war stories eventually. What was it like. He just told me some amazing stories. One think it is very clear about was about how clueless the americans were going up against the soviets in the deception and disinformation. It went down to a fine art. The other thing i shod add a sign of just how complex of the the American World is. When peter showed up in west berlin in 1945. There was certainly hundreds of not thousands of soviet spots. He have just turned 24. He told the story in 1946 that they were running chains all through east germany. They were all being run by former German Military operatives. It is that temple typical german arrogance. He talked about how one night when guy disappeared and within 24 or 405 hours. Everybody is appeared. They have their chance. We tell the story. They kind of got emotional about it. Throughout that time that you talk about. They have their act together in the way that america never did. It seemed like america was winging it the entire time. They have to get smart levels in the sting operation. Is that still the case. That they have their docs in a row . Are we living through the consequences or the continuation of the time that you are talking about in terms of the relative effectiveness and agencies. I think it was two things. I think you still see it today. Even before world war ii. The soviets understood that the next enemy was the west. We were absolutely going to be adversaries. And you see that from stall and all the way down. And the americans were very slow to understand that. Truman had just come in. And for a couple of really crucial years. He imagined the Wartime Alliance would be the same. These are two crucial years. They were demilitarized. By the soviets or taking over all of eastern europe. The second thing is. The soviets the things that they would do in the field of espionage. To the western mind its kind of unbelievable. In fact theyve done this very recently. Its a dangle across to the west. How come across and say i want to defect. Into build up his own issue. He will rat out other russian or soviet agents in the field. Sometimes if it was an important enough operation. One of them could read out the rest of his colleagues. This was a coldblooded nest that they can be coldblooded in other ways. No western Intelligence Agency would conceive of. You make the case that that mentality spends from the pathology of one man. From stalin. The whole idea. That the paranoia that it takes to behave that way. And the ability to treat people like their expendable. Is that an exaggeration. To say that the kb gml. And the ruthlessness of the soviets at the beginning is an extension of his own ruthlessness and paranoia. I think the figure of stalin added to the feeling of paranoia. Already when they recorded what was going on. The cia didnt have a mall. Not even in the fifth layer. Let alone high at. On top of that give you figure like this. Who is a paranoid sociopath. And how do you ever predict what he is capable of doing next. The geopolitics. Its basically the story of the plan of the crime. And all hell breaks loose. I really think that so much of the kind of struggle thats coming next. Revolves around this. One area where you think it seems like the cia and the soviets as far as i can tell is it correct that they werent doing on the level of the americans. Tell me about that story. He was one of the four that i follow. He was operating in asia almost exclusively. He was in at executive. And san francisco. He came out to asia at a time when a lot of insurgencies were just starting up in the philippines he have this very simple concept. If you want to defeat the communists. If you want to win over the populace. You to give the local population a government they can believe in. Thats really where it first went. The country has been ruled for decades by a very corrupt oligarchy. His idea was you need to reform the government. You need to put in some of his that out to rob the country. As far as the actual fighting against the communist insurgency. You need to get them out of their barracks. And not just to fight the communist. But to do good among people. Build schools, build bridges. Not singlehandedly. But he have a huge role in defeating the communist insurgency. He was so successful. By 1954. When vietnam was kind starting to pick up. And famously the director. Said go do the same thing you did in the philippines. He goes out there. And he actually tries. He comes close to being successful. Like he did in the philippines where he kind of handpicked the president to come in he handpicked the Prime Minister in vietnam. Any became has whisper. And how you form the bureaucracy. Unfortunately, it got so big. It was kind of a small subtle signups. They got swept away by the huge military. One thing i will add on that. In 1964. He ended up the First American military mission to go in vietnam. They were the only gang in town for two years. Of course been followed by almost 3 million more. And you talk about that. There was a near intervention. Or what couldve been at intervention in vietnam. And how that might have let out the crisis. You mentioned several other possible ideas that could have confused the cold war. Tell us about those. Moments where things couldve gone much better and ended the war. I will mention two of them. One of them i mentioned roosevelt in 1934. His idea was the resolution of world war ii. He dies three weeks before the end of the war. Truman inn is in way over his head. He first meets stalin. That summer of 1945. He says to stalin. Hes honest. Hes smart as hell but i can deal with it. He has a selfassuredness. And hes in these pretty much run on all counts. I think thats where racy this moment. The death when it came. Was this awful fork in the road. Even just one more year. He wouldve known how to deal with it. He wouldve reacted to the soviet union. In a way where truman to my mind is a deer in headlights. The other great turning point was where i kind of and book on. It was a spontaneous resolution people rose up from the streets. The hungarian military joins the revolution. And there was this key moment where one night. They said. We cant put this down militarily. So the tanks were leaving. And then the very next day over the course of the night. They change his mind. The americans can do anything to help the rest pollution areas. The cancer will spread throughout eastern europe. And we will lose all of eastern europe. They had been talking about the rollback against communism. And finally what have happened. And then all of a sudden they went and we cant do anything there. All of the guys you talk about. The morally right abstaining savior. And all of it went. Shaped. They ended up with some pretty horrible things. Backing up dictators and letting them legitimate movements. Did you end up judging the men that you like to write about. I see it as its very easy to do. Was 70 years of hindsight. In the judgment of people. I think also what happened to almost all of these was very gradual. It is a gradual process. Say in germany. Right after the war they start working with the former German Military intelligence officers. They know whats happening. And then it becomes people that are members of the nazi party. You can go on and on until you are working with bona fide nazi war criminals. The other thing is i think for all of these. They saw the cold war. This was a crisis. And hemming, these. They were all world war ii veterans. To come into the new concepts. I think they all kinda felt the end is just part of the means. All for those were very politically liberal and very socially liberal. I think they all reach a point where it would be wonderful if we could do that. But things are crashing so fast. We dont have the luxury of time. I tried to resist passing judgment. I think all four of them were obtained by the moral decisions they have to make. One thing you talk about is what is going on in the homefront of america. The reaction to the red scare. That the enemy of the cia. Was assisting in the witchhunt. It was the hunt that ended up leading nowhere. That moment of the origin in american society. Where you stood on this question for example of the hicks case. The fifth column of soviet spies in america. Where you stood on that question determined where they would be liberal or conservative. Its very true. As the first great schism in this country. If you bought into this idea that there was a state department. Your politics when a certain way. If you thought joe mccarthy was full of it essentially history was shown on. Then your politics went another way. Politics are largely inherited. We tend to be fairly close. From that schism in the 1950s. You can kind of march along in time. Theyre they are the same people whose children were against that. They were probably voting democratic in this election. This was really the great schism in american politics. And it have a direct reflect. He was kind of in charge of it all over the world. Like he was can become the next cia director. Its like he was get to become the director. They launched another investigation with the remaining woman. This was a recurrent pattern he was investigated by the fbi virtually his entire life. Its kind of an amazing story. He have seen so many of these things. All of these operations. Partisans behind the lines. So they reached a point where he just started going from the operations. The success rate was zero. The more operations he canceled the officers that were sponsoring this program wanted him to go forward. The more they got angry. And wondered why he kept that operation. Along with what was happening. There is always a thing of working over their shoulder. They could be investigated as an american. They actually missed the spy that was operating there. For example they have the grit that we trusted the most i guess. Time again. What hoover would do its kind of funny. In 1945. This woman courier came in and confess to. She named all of these names. With the special agents on this case. To trail people. The fbi had a dress code. Theyre all white. All men. They are tracking bona fide spies. They were being tailed within eight seconds. They were just all popping up. So they were constantly chasing the wrong people. And that is the pattern that you see. Cement to get back to the failed attempt at nation building. You mention what mentioned what happened in the philippines. Was there any sort of successful american intervention. In politics that were nationbuilding around the world . Its a great question. At the end of the day. Some of the countries in east asia. That said, certainly during the years i was up there. They were hardcore military dictatorships. They didnt become democracy from any pressure that the americans put on them. It was very organic. I think you could probably find a few examples around the world. All of the places where they infuriated the local people. It triggered 25 years of the bloodiest dirty war after it. We are still living with that today. If you were to see a movie be made. Who would you prefer. That is a great question. It was a dramatic story. That is a tragedy. Michael burke is kind of a comedy. I described as james bond. When he was running the program they were operating out of rome. They have this cover. He called himself a film producer. He was hanging out with the italian film set. They would sneak off at night. Just a fabulous character. Was some the interactions between them. It is a fantastic book. The thought occurred to me. I think it was a pre call. I think i was a little bit younger. You have the decade. Thanks man. Thanks for writing it. If you have any questions you can type does after the comment. And a reminder in the book is available for sell. Your support is what keeps it going. You did mention a continuation. Are there any pages in the playbook. That maybe shouldnt be in the playbook still that are. Do you know anything more about that. It might still be a tactic that they are using today. Not so much the cia but what is amazing is watching how much but how much they have taken up the playbook the game a misinformation. And deception that americans have been bombarded with for at least the past for five y