and when you make the investment, you realize it doesn't always go well. >> larry: were these mostly mortgages? >> no, no. not all of them, no, no. you could do a derivative on just about anything. in some markets around the world, they do derivatives on or place bets on who is going to win the world series or who is going to win an election. >> larry: but they knew they were bad loans? >> yes, they knew they were bad loans. >> larry: that's the fraud accusation. subcommittee members from both sides of the aisle were pretty much on the same page in their characterizations of goldman's activities. take a look. >> you are the bookie. you are the house. you have less oversight and less regulation as you all began this wild, wild west of tranches, waterfalls, equity tranches, residual, warehousing, as you began all that, you had less oversight than a pit boss in las vegas. >> i think most people in las vegas would take offense at having wall street compared to las vegas because in las vegas actually people know that the odds are against them. they play anyway. on wall street, they manipulate the odds while you're playing the game. >> larry: is this going to change? >> and can i add to that. and we now guarantee your