>> elizabeth, some people think it went too far. the problem is this particular provision where the ruling has said he's going to sever that provision from the rest of the health care reform bill, as gloria suggests, can it exist without this provision? >> you know what, i don't know how you pay for the entire thing without insuring these healthy people. there's tens of millions of healthy americans that don't have insurance and they are like a cash cow. they're just sitting there. >> this is a mirror of many other countries, northern european countries for instance that have some degree of universal insurance. the point is everybody has to be insured? >> right. this is sort of universal insurance. i think what they were trying to do, the obama administration is sensitive about socialized me medicine so they didn't do it quite the same was as europe but said you've got to have insurance. you can choose it but you have to have it. if you choose not to have it we're going to penalize you with this tax. that's a huge amount of money either from the tax or from the