>> legally, there might be something wrong with it. but morally, do you think is there's anything wrong with like -- you're essentially breaking into an information base? >> yes. >> i'm not doing anything. i'm going to go in, look around, see how things work and i'll leave without disturbing anything. would most hackers say that's okay? >> yes. >> it's in the service of knowledge? that's okay? >> okay for most the hackers in our communities. i was lucky. i got into a very big hacker community here in shanghai and met a lot of great mentors. >> you started in business at 21. >> in factory. >> quite an accomplishment. >> i didn't go to college. >> you didn't go to college? >> i didn't go to the college. >> why not? >> most of professors are way behind the development speed of the communities. >> why? your country is so advanced in so many other ways. why in this area? >> the network problem here in china, we have gfw, the great firewall, and it blocked a lot of important information