the hardware devices. they can make them work in any number of ways. instead of having the defaults right now built to enable app developers to maximally addict you, they could actually change the design to be about maximally empowering people and protecting people, a more humane approach, and i think parents and kids will want this. >> concern is growing. especially when it comes to kids. and now even parents in silicon valley are spooked. >> okay. jesus, what do we go after 5? >> eight. >> eight. >> this is waldorf. >> we keep going. four. >> a school in the bay area where students are learning math not with calculators but with yarn. >> nine. very good. >> what are waldorf's guidelines regarding technology? >> we don't use technology in the classroom until probably