extraordinary things such as impugn the judiciary. you know, it's not unusual for a president to say, i disagree with the court decision. it's quite something else to sort of try to delegitimize the judges in the judiciary. >> and say they're politically biased. >> nothing they can do is right because they're against me. >> i want to get to that point because obama did, at one point, criticize a decision. i want to get to that in a moment. but david, first, what about what i pointed out there, right? when he's making this about politics, right? judge curiel ruled in favor of him. his own appointed judge ruled against him. i gave those examples simply to point out that politics is not what drives our judiciary. >> well, look, i wouldn't say that politics doesn't -- isn't a part of judicial philosophy and i think that's why we see different judges appointed by democratic and republican presidents. what i would say is, this isn't the first president to criticize judicial decisions. i think what makes this different and why roberts felt compelled to speak out is because the president's criticism of the judiciary and