corporations like g.e. don't pay any taxes? >> g.e. literally doesn't pay any taxes or it didn't two years ago. did a little better last year. i don't know if that's jeffrey immelt as ceo working with president obama. they upped it a little bit. effective tax rate for corporate america depending on how you calculate it runs anywhere from 12.5 to 26%. >> bill: that's reasonable, right? >> that's reasonable. >> bill: flat tax it and knock out all the loopholes or keep the loopholes and they pay 12 to 26. >> exactly. another little factor in here never discussed. that is american corporations aren't paying a back tax. the european countries,. >> vat. >> right, value-added taxes. >> contribute more than they contribute to theirs. >> in taxes, certainly. >> bill: american corporations have a pretty good deal. >> they have a pretty good deal. you have payroll taxes to add to that but to get into that