primary fight for 2016. he may be out of touch for the american people on this issue but not out of touch with the energy and the base of the republican party. and that fight is going to go on straight through the republican nominating process. i mean, michael knows better than i do that division within the republican party is real and what rick santorum is doing now is staking out ground early on the issue of gay marriage. >> i agree with that. >> the people in your party who are the crazeiests, the mourdock, the aikens. they are the emblems more and more of your party. you can't say these are my crazy aunts in the closet, don't open that door. the democrats are going to open that door. i know you're laughing. they're going to say, look who's in here, it's rick santorum. >> they're not crazy people. why is it that people cannot have a conviction that is genuine and real to them that even though you disagree with it, it doesn't mean that they're crazy -- >> because they're running for national office. let me ask you this. do you think it helps to have