this is getting reinforced now by rudy giuliani. other lawyers around him previously were giving him a different set of advice. that's not what giuliani is telling hip. trump believes his biggest risk is not necessarily from mueller, but may come from possible impeachment, in democrats take the house. there is an element where he believes this is a public relations battle and he needs to discredit mueller in case the investigation finds anything. and sort of lay the groundwork that as he likes to say, this is a witch hunt, collusion is not a crime, and he did nothing wrong. but again, i have to say, we don't know what we don't know. we don't know what maybe didn't happen on the campaign, but happened when michael cohen worked for him, all those decades and now that michael cohen has flipped, that's a risk, for instance. >> there was a sea change in the things that people close to him, and you talk to many more of them than i do, there was a sea change in what they thought about the president's potential guilt on the question of collusion. they always thought, he's too incompetent to have colluded with russia, he couldn't collude