Reopen america and put this great nation back to work. Thank you. Thank you very much. Mr. President . [inaudible conversations] elizabeth okay. Okay. This is the im elizabeth macdonald, welcome to the evening edit. The Coronavirus Task force just now wrapping up. Okay, heres whats happening, we have more than 50,000 in the u. S. Now dead, 26 million out of work. Oil is rebounding. Jpmorgan chase is telling Small Businesses, hey, apply with other banks because theres fears of fresh funds from the new program money that just came in will run out. Lets bring in former cia station chief daniel of match. He is basically hoffman. He is basically former station chief for afghanistan and pakistan. Sir, first i want to jump to this its great to have you on. Governor cuomo is now saying the World Health Organization was too little too late, that its basically that the critics have been saying that the who is in the back pocket of china. This is still an underlying controversy. Your reaction to that . Well, i think for me at least as a retired cia officer, ive always felt we need to rely on our own collection, that means our forwarddeployed intelligence community, in this case medical professionals and diplomats to track whats really going to on in china. Make no mistake, the chinese are trying to conceal, have tried to conceal [audio difficulty] of the coronavirus, the pandemic from their own people as well as the rest of the world, and theyve tried to make the who complicit in that process. We need to, of course, mistrust but verify those International Institutions and organizations with which we partner. Theres still value for having them. China, right now, is trying to increase their influence in who, and i think it would be in our interests not to allow that to happen. Elizabeth yeah. China is now increasing its donations to the who. You know, but its still a fraction worth of what u. S. Taxpayers have have given it. So so this is the debate, this is the controversy, the focus should be on how china has been accused of being reckless, of not having the proper Safety Standards at its biolabs where it was researching vaccines for things like aids and hiv. The cofounder of the hiv virus has said this is an industrial accident in chinas labs. They were studying the hiv vaccine. Hes been criticized for this. Heres what he is saying is going on inside china, that they have been woefully reckless in how they do their Laboratory Work and basically people are are getting infected inside those laboratories and walking out and infecting the population. You saw that in 2004 with the sars virus. So do you feel like this is given enough vetting here in the United States, that the focus should be more on china instead of fingerpointing inside the country . Well, i can tell you, again, from my own background having focused on hard a targets like china and iran and russia among others, look, the chinese system is a communist country. They try to really conceal the truth from their own citizens. They use staterun media not to inform anyone accurately, but rather, to disseminate propaganda in an effort to control their own population and whitewash their reputation overseas. So i absolutely think we need to be Holding China accountable, for sure. They need to pay a price for that not only with their reputation worldwide, but also we need to take some concrete measures like ending the supply chain that goes right back to china. We should be leading the way with our european and other partners to insure that theres a safe place to purchase essential goods. And, hopefully, that starts in the United States with. Theres an opportunity for us to come out of this with an economy that could grow at the expense of china, and i think that would obviously be a good thing. For our National Security and for elizabeth okay, so there is the a backlash, a global backlash. Its not given enough Media Attention here in the United States. We track the overseas headlines. Were seeing a global backlash, a breakout against china. In europe theyre saying the relationship now between the e. U. And china is, quote, toxic. Certainly hearing that out of germany, out of france. Youre hearing it not just in taiwan, youre hearing it in south korea, in singapore, in malaysia. Youre hearing it in places in south america. Now people are standing up and saying, china, you are to blame, we cannot the world cannot go through another pandemic that comes out of your borders. So are you seeing that too . Were seeing social media lighting up around the world saying, china, youve got to stop, youve got to take accountability. Yeah. We can say that all we want. I think what, you know, the bottom line though is we need to take some action to make china pay for it. And the way we make them pay for it is by conquering them, whether its countering them in the South China Sea or their death trap diplomacy where theyre offering countries this opportunity of a belt and Road Initiative which is really just a china benefit and not at all for those countries who are involved. I think we need the talented team over at secretary pompeos state department to reed the way diplomatically, to shine a bright spotlight on chinas nefarious behavior and then lead the way with our partners in europe and asia to show that, look, chinas not a reliable partner, and theyre out to take care of themselves. Ive called this coronavirus and covid19 xi jinpings chernobyl. Its very similar to what happened in the soviet union during that horrifically bad nuclear stent in 1986 where the soviets had no idea what happened, and the people were put at risk. I think the Chinese People understand that. Its an opportunity for us to use voice of america and our other institutions to make sure that the chinese get the truth and understand how corrupt their government is and how little they care about human rights at home and abroad. Elizabeth yeah. Chinas basically triggered humanitarian crises and emerging market debt crises around the world. Thats the next shoe to drop. Weve been following that. Youre going to see countries on the margins going deeply into bankruptcy and insolvency. Daniel hoffman, former top cia official, thank you so much for joining us. Come back soon. Thanks, my pleasure. Elizabeth next up it was great to have you on. Next weve got arkansas governor Asa Hutchison on what the states are doing to reopen and the raging battles behind it. You wont believe what were finding out on whats going on on both sides of this growing controversy. Stay right there. Dont go away. I have always wanted to be a teacher. Ive been teaching for over 20 years. With everything going on, weve had to alter our classroom settings. We have to transition into virtual learning. On the network, we can have teachers facetoface with a student in livetime. They can raise their hand and ask questions. They can type questions. We just need to make sure that the education is continuing. vo at verizon, were here and were ready to keep students and teachers connected to the world. Thats why verizon and the New York Times are offering 14 Million Students free Digital Access to times journalism. Ibut youre not alone. Apart for a bit, were automatically refunding our customers a portion of their personal auto premiums. Learn more at libertymutual. Com covid19. [ piano playing ] elizabeth welcome back. President trump just wrapping up a very quick Task Force Briefing at the white house. Lets welcome arkansas governor asa hutchinson. Great to have you on, sir. Always good to be with you. Elizabeth governor, the president said 30 states now have plans or are moving toward plans to reopen. Thats half of america is moving to reopen. Big controversy though, you know, the other side of the aisle is saying dont do it, youre going to infect more people, have more cases. How do you feel about it . Well, it shouldnt be a partisan divide on this. We both should be listening to our Public Health experts but also keeping an eye on the economy. And here in arkansas were taking a very measured approach. Were not going to be opening everything up at once. Were going to be looking at restaurants as to when that should be open, but were not going to make that decision even until the muddle of next week the middle of next week, and then were going to sequentially look at other things that have been closed for Public Health reasons. Were one of those states we didnt close our economy down to begin with. We didnt have a shelter in place order. We had a targeted approach that focused on stopping the virus and the spread of it through restricting our state parks, through bars and restaurant being closed, casinos being closed, other things, and were going to very gradually look at what we can open up, keeping an eye on the data and the Public Health recommendations. We clearly have to open up, but were keeping an eye on these statistics. We still have some outbreak areas in arkansas, so we want to see those numbers get with under control before we fully open up. Elizabeth heres what americans are seeing, we see minority leader in the house Kevin Mccarthy criticize the democrats for delaying on the next relief bill, 484 billion, saying, you know, youre costing jobs, nancy pelosi, for not moving faster. Kevin mccarthy criticized Majority Whip Jim Clyburn for saying the pandemic, quote, presents a perfect if opportunity to restructure things to fit our vision. Weve got governors like Governor Whitmer of michigan basically saying im going to extend the shutdown because of protests and lack of social distancing. And also we have people like aoc, alexandria ocasiocortez and other democrats saying lets use workers jobs as leverage to get unrelated things in future legislation. You know, so americans from where they sit, 26 million are out of jobs, and they see all of this going on. From where you sit, how do you see the lay of the land with this controversy and this fighting thats going on . I see the governors continuing to try to lead with the unique circumstances of their state, and i think theyre doing an effective job, all doing it a little bit differently. Its interesting that when we started this pandemic, our country was so united as to what we needed to do. And the longer it goes, it does seem like theres a little bit more division which is very distressing. And certainly, you should not use a pandemic in order to accomplish broader political objectives. Lets keep the focus of what the needs are for the Public Health crisis, for stopping the spread of this virus and also keep from getting our economy back going. That has to be balanced, and i think the governors are in the right position to do that. Because every state is peaking at a different time, they have different circumstances, density in population, and that impacts your Decision Making process. So im grateful, and ill just say that congress has focused on getting money to our businesses, our Small Business owners, our entrepreneurs, that is the right approach, and thats where the federal resources should go. Im not as excited about an immediate bailout of states. Whenever you look at arkansas economy, were going to have to tighten our belt in our state budget, our revenues are going to go down, but were going to have a balanced budget. And we just cant put an unending stream of federal money that is unlimited back to making sure that every states budget challenges are met. I think we have to really go slow elizabeth you know on that last part. Elizabeth yeah. Youre now in this big, big fight between new york Governor Cuomo and the maryland governor, hogan, criticizing senator mitch mcconnell. He has said, listen, maybe states should file bankruptcy. He was talking about congress use of 150 billion in direct help for states and localities, senator mcconnell doesnt want federal taxpayers fixing states own out of control spending and their pension problems. Where to you stand on that . Because were hearing half a trillion dollars is what the National Governors association is now demanding to help out the states when the states didnt run their own shops in the right way. Your reaction to that. I dont like that because that puts the burden on the next generation to pay the debts for today. And West Virginia already put trillions weve already put trillions of dollars of federal money, our grandchildrens money into9 economy. Into the economy. And that was needed, thats giving business help. But we cant just bail out every state. And whenever you look at the fact that we might have to give some support to states down the road, but it is too early because you dont even know the true budget outcome in each state as to what the shortfalls are going to be, how well they can manage it. Thats where youre going to hughes a opportunity of federal money lose a ton of federal money if you start pouring that money out to the states too early. [inaudible conversations] i dont think bankruptcys the right language to use. We want to help the states, but weve got to keep an eye on the tush and not burden the next generation with too much debt. Elizabeth governor hutchinson of arkansas, thank you so much for joining us. Come back soon. T good to be with you. Thank you. Elizabeth same here. Have a good weekend. Coming up, ohio congressman and doctor brad wes strip with more on the battles brewing among so many states fighting and the protests, this is about reopening. That fight next. Technologies advisor. Me too. Me too. 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Download the xfinity my account app today. Muck. Elizabeth lets welcome ohio congressman and dr. Brad wenstrup. Congressman, thanks for coming on the show. Its great to coe see you. Yeah, my pleasure. Good to be with you. Elizabeth before we get to the antilockdown protests, the president just rapidly wrapped up the White House Coronavirus presser. You could see that he was visibly angry with reporters yesterday. He had misspoken about saying we should, you know, that doctors and the medical community should look at the use of disinfectants and, you know, injesting disinfectants and uv lights, hes saying it was taken out of context. Your reaction to that controversy. Well, i think at the end of the day that the medical community is going to decide whats working and whats not working and itll have to go through the fda. You know, i think the president has been trying to be upbeat on a lot of occasions and looking at possible solutions to slow this whole virus down. There certainly are things like dis infectantses and sunlight that seem to be slowing it down and not necessarily something that you would ingest. But i think most people understood that were looking for ways all the time that can slow this process down and liberate the American People from the virus. Elizabeth congressman, lets talk about the protests that were happening outside the michigan governors home. The michigan legislature, the state legislature did schedule a special session today for creating an Oversight Committee to review Governor Whitmers coronavirus orders, basically residents are in an uproar, theyre draconian, talking about also possibly stripping her of some of her powers there. Your reaction to that. Well, you know, my military and congressional experience ive been around the world, its hard to govern three people, but i wouldnt want it any other way. Its also hard to take freedoms away. Were government of the people, by the people, for the people. When you do things in your position of power that restrict peoples rights especially, you have to make them understand why youre trying to do something for their own good, and you should have some bedside manner with that. I dont think weve seen that. The question comes to what are her powers. Ive served on the board of health in cincinnati, and we shut down restaurants, but there were very good scientific reasons for what we were doing, and people understood that, and we had that authority. We see in some states where governor say im going to do this and shut this down, and theres been pushback, and then they say, well, you know what . I may not have that right, but my Health Director does. And so i i think were going to have these debates. And, you know, the American People, you know, they want to have, they want to have a reason as to why theyre being asked to do certain things. You need to make sense of why you put out an order. You have to be a little parental about it, not dictatorial. And the American