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donald trump right, but she also didn't explicitly mention president biden. what do you make of that? was it a missed opportunity for her and for the white house? >> no, i don't think was a missed opportunity. i think it was a conversation that she had as part of a broader interview. and look, simone is exactly right. the campaign, and i am sure that they are talking to michelle obama's team, we will certainly be working with her to activate her on the campaign trail. she is one of the absolute top surrogates, and she's actually the top surrogate with a certain type of voter. she is seen as somebody who is relatively nonpartisan, who is kind of above the fold when it comes to politics. and i think that is one of the reasons why she is expressing her nervousness. she will activate, there is no question, there is so much at stake. she is obviously very close with president biden, with the first lady. and then obviously with the vice president as well. so i have no question, and no doubt that she will. and i think we will be hearing a lot more from her in the months ahead. >> and to both of you, too i might add, -- you will be on the show for