About good news, this is my opportunity to congratulate you on your new book. And also to say thank you for sending me a copy. You are very welcome, i wanted to make sure that you got, it is one of those gifts that is, like, its nice but its also a little pushy. Well, the push is received. Be on the lookout, an invitation is coming. Very good, thanks, jonathan, i appreciate it. Thank, you rachel. Tensions are high in the United States and around the globe tonight, with crises unfolding on a number of different fronts. From the ongoing Hostage Situation in the israelhamas war, to the humanitarian crisis that is unfolding in gaza, to the war in ukraine, to putins Cozying Up To china. To the republicanled house approaching its 21st day without a leader. There are threats to peace and stability everywhere, and yet it is worth noting that former republican congressman liz cheneys assessment about what is the most dangerous threat america is facing. I think donald trump is the single most dangerous threat we face. He cannot be the next president , because if he is, all of the things that he attempted to do but was stopped from doing by responsible people around him at the department of justice, at the white house counsels office, all of those things, he will do them. There will be no guardrails. And everyone has been warned. After january 6th, after our investigation, after all the evidence that well out about all of the steps in his multi part plan to overturn the election, there could be no question that he will unravel the institutions of our democracy. It is not hyperbole, donald trump indicted by special counsel jack smith for his efforts to overturn president bidens 2020 election victory, and stay in power, is now waging proverbial war on the american judicial system that is for the first time in his life holding him accountable. On friday, judge Tanya Chutkan who was overseeing special counsel jack smiths 2020 election case against trump temporarily paused the limited gag order that she placed on trump to prevent him from attacking jack smith and his team of prosecutors. With the gag order paused, what did trump do today . He went right back to attacking jack smith, of course. Calling him, quote, deranged, claiming he is a weapon of the current president and accusing him of planting a story about trump in the New York Times. The times is reporting that it has another unique data danger that donald trump reports to the country. The report details secret recordings of conversations between trump and Anthony Pratt. An australian billionaire who is looking to curry favor with the thenpresident. The times reports that on those recordings, quote, mr. Trump described mr. Pratt described mr. Trumps businesses as being, quote, like the mafia. According to covert recordings obtained by 60 minutes australia, and shared with the times. He also speaks admiringly about how mr. Trump learned from his mentor, the lawyer and fixer roy cohn, how to walk up to the line of illegality without crossing it. He has got incredible balls, mr. Pratt says. Trump says, would you go and tell that guy over there to steal from me . And so he can say, i never told the guy to steal. And things like that is how trump gets away with it. Pratts attempts to curry favor with trump were first reported earlier this month, with the details that trump revealed secrets about Americas Submarine Fleet to the australian billionaire. According to protests count, as described by the sources, pratt told trump that he believed australia should start buying its submarines from the United States. To which an excited trump, leaning toward pratt, as it to be discreet, then told pratt to pieces of information about u. S. Submarines. The supposed exact number of Nuclear Warheads they routinely carry, and exactly how close they supposedly can get to a Russian Submarine without being detected. Trump is denying these reports on social media and calling Anthony Pratt a, quote, Red Haired Weirdo from australia. Anthony pratt could be one of 80 possible witnesses that jack smith calls in the upcoming trump documents trial. But the story is another example of why trump can never again have access to americas most sensitive secrets. With these photos being a crucial first example. Here is liz cheney on trumps untrustworthiness. The other thing to remember about donald trump is that he reportedly shared Israeli Intelligence with the russians very early in his term. He also, as we know now, from the indictments that we have seen from jack smith, shared highly classified military documents, apparently relating to, as you know, military action against iran. He shared that with mark meadowss ghost writers. And Political Consultants it seems according to the indictments. So i think it is simply the latest example of why donald trump is not fit to be president of the United States. Donald trump is the single most dangerous threat america faces. Liz cheneys party is about to vote him back into power. Trump was in New Hampshire today, Filing Paperwork to be on the ballot in a republican Primary Field that has so far proven unwilling or unable to stop the trump threat. There is more to play out on the Campaign Trail and in the courtroom. But in the words of liz cheney, everyone has been warned. Joining me now, msnbc legal analyst joyce vance, former u. S. Attorney and a professor at the university of Alabama School of law. Bradley moss, a National Security attorney who represents people who work in the intelligence community. And democratic congressman Eric Swalwell of california. He was an Impeachment Manager in the second Impeachment Trial of donald trump, and he is a plaintiff in a civil lawsuit, a civil suit against donald trump for his role in inciting the january 6th attack on the capitol, thank you all very much for coming to the last word. Joyce, trump almost immediately brought back the deranged jack smith attacks with his d. C. Gag order on pause. What is going on here, and how will judge chutkan respond . Well the judge, i think, is building a record for appeal and for any further discipline that might need to be imposed on trump for his lapses here. Look, lapses in general are a generous term. Because what we are talking about his efforts to prejudice a jury pooll. And possibly even to inflame passions against prosecutors. Trump knows that his words carry power with some elements of his base. So the judge, i think, is dotting her is and crossing her ts. Trump is appealing, she suspended the order temporarily. But her conduct while she has been suspended will do nothing but fuel the case for imposing it in the court of appeals, and that is the next step here. Also, joyce, do you think trump wants a confrontation with judge chutkan over a gag order . Does he want to force the judge to prove it can be enforced . Well, trump isnt afraid of confrontation. And this is his long term style when he deals with the legal system. He loves to their judges to treat him just like anyone else. And in the past, many times the legal system hasnt been up to the challenge. I think in this case, though, judge chutkan has crafted a very limited, its not a gag order, its a limited restraining order, it survives the legal tests in this circuit. I dont think she will flinch if trump crosses the line. Brad, there is no gag order in the jacksons Documents Case, how do you think australian billionaire Anthony Pratte plays in that case . That will be interesting, i dont really anticipate him being involved in the d. C. Case, but the Documents Case . This could be interesting from the factual background. Not necessarily as a superseding indictment, i dont see jack smith going for another indictment, but i do see it in terms of showing the pattern of how donald trump was reckless, not only while in office, he knew what he did what he was in office, but he had that legal discretion to play games with less information. But once he left office, what he kept doing to information that he kept recklessly giving to people who were not authorized to have it, to go along with the fact that he still had possession of all of these classified records and he wasnt supposed to have them. He was obstructing efforts by the fbi and norad to recover them. Lets look at the factual background. Congressman swalwell, after sydney powell took a plea deal in atlanta on friday, from post on social media that powell, quote, was not my attorney. And never was. In all caps. Is that plausible . And regardless of whether or not it is true, could be a crucial error for trump . Because in theory, nothing they ever spoke about would be protected by attorneyclient privilege, what do you think . Was not my attorney is the name of a lot of attorneys who have gone to jail having worked for donald trump. So that is not a good thing to be labeled if you just look at the past and you see that prologue. Also, to go a little bit into the weeds, because i know thats where your viewers are so educated, and thats where they thrive, yes, if donald trump is going to disabuse the notion that he never received legal advice from sydney powell, then there is no claim that there is Attorney Client privilege, and then she can completely give of the goods on donald trump. Now, the lawyers that i deal with for donald trump are in the House Of Representatives, and when i see every single day with the Insurrection Law Firm that is the Judiciary Committee led by jim jordan, is that they are going to continue, as long as these trials play out, to use the congress to do anything to assist his defense. So he is going to attack the judge on the inside of the process, and on the outside they are going to try to taint the jury pool on his behalf. You know, brand, what do you make of that move by trump to claim sydney powell, sorry, it cracked me up. But trump saying, well, basically, sydney powell, i have never heard of her . Yes, its just another coffee boy or coffee girl as you would have it. This is trumps playbook. Its what he does every time someone close to him gets caught. You know, Michael Cohen when he first got nabbed by the fbi. Oh, michael has tons of clients, he just doesnt work for me. You, know this is his standard thing. But for me from a longterm perspective, this is what the congressman was hinting at. It is a really dumb legal move, because it raises any issue of potential attorneyclient privileges, and it exposes any type of Record Information to be freely provided by sydney powell now to the georgia prosecutors to say nothing of potentially jack smith. And there is no potential attorneyclient privilege at play for trump to invoke. Joyce, something that came up that i did not realize when i interviewed neil catyall on my show on saturday, the saturday show. Sydney powell, as part of her deal had given Videotape Testimony to prosecutors as a part of this deal. Correct me if im wrong, joyce, but so did kenneth chesebro. The other guy, the other person who took a deal. Can you talk about the significance of that. Of them already getting Videotape Testimony to prosecutors that will be played at some point during the big trial . Sure, so jonathan, this is a pretty standard move for prosecutors who are negotiating a plea deal with the defendant. Whether it is Videotape Testimony, or an oral prosecutor. The way we used to put it in my office was, as a prosecutor, you dont want to buy a you cant give a deal to a defendant who comes in and says i have great testimony, you have to hear the testimony. You have to know the substance. You have to see if you can corroborate it. And if when you stare that defendant, who will become your witness, in the eye, if they are believable and they can hold up to pretty vigorous crossexamination, which is what you typically do in that context. So nothing unusual here. And of course, if there is testimony at trial, it will be live, because defendants have a right to confront the witnesses against them. However, this suggests that fani willis knows precisely what she is getting an exchange for the plea deals that she offered. Yes, Congressman Swalwell i want you to listen to this from liz cheney. I think what we have seen over the course of, you know, the last almost three years now since january 6th has been almost, without exception, almost without exception, the judiciary has just been stalwart in terms of recognizing and understanding the threats to the republic that is posed by Donald Trumps past behavior. By what he did leading up to january 6th, and frankly what he has continued to do. So i think that it is really important that people recognize the efforts that he is putting in to try to tear down every institution of our democracy. Congressman, swalwell prosecutors and lawmakers have been calling it what trump is. Doing using the courtroom as a stage. Motions as delay tactics, et cetera. Will any of it work . Well, i will tell you, it doesnt have to work everywhere. And that is the tactic, right . Joyce, and brad are familiar with it. The Shotgun Approach or throw the spaghetti against the wall and see what sticks. That tactic. And so he only has to be successful, you know, in one of these trials that he will declare, you know, victory. Even if he hangs the jury. And the prosecutors have to be perfect. And also what he is doing in the congress, look, it was just a handful of chaos agents that have brought the United States representatives to complete paralysis. We are not functioning because a few trump chaos agents just a handful of them brought the house down. So if he was ever near power again, all it takes is just a few judges that he would need to appoint, just a few people who are dirty enough in the cabinet and more loyalists in the congress. And he, you know, could ensure that we lose our democracy in 2024 we would be the last free and Fair Election we ever had. The consequences have, you know, never been greater for an election. This is the series finale. We are gonna get it right or democracy is gone. Joyce vance and bradley moss, thank you. Congressman swalwell, please stay with us because still ahead, as republicans fail repeatedly to pick a new House Speaker, their latest list includes six republicans who voted against certifying the 2020 election after the january 6th insurrection. Capitol hill Police Officer harry dunn has written about his experiences being in the middle of the trump mob that day in a new book. He will join us next. With hiv, i didnt know who i would be. But here i am. Being me. Keep being you. And ask your Healthcare Provider about the number one prescribed hiv treatment, biktarvy. Biktarvy is a complete, onepill, onceaday treatment used for hiv in many people whether youre 18 or 80. With one small pill, biktarvy fights hiv to help you get to undetectable and stay there whether youre just starting or replacing your current treatment. 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