It is a lot more nuanced. It is more visible to us this past on monday. Yesterday. For the commencement of passover. There was a satyr. And those are, thats an incredibly interesting display of why it is important not to display this as monolithic or as even two sided. I think there are. It is multifaceted. Certainly. There are people on so many different dimensions. Identityies. It can be very dangerous sometimes when we attempt to generalize. Also attempt to make it simple. That is what spectator can do. We catch every element. That is why honestly, it is essential reading in this moment. Thank you so much for everything you are doing to cover this topic. That is our show for this evening. I turn now to my colleague, Lawrence Odonnell with the last word. Good evening. We have senator Elizabeth Warren joining us tonight. When we change the subject from defendant trump which well be discussing. Fantastic. But, the big news in this room tonight is that eddie is back. Eddie timborski, the floor manager, the boss of me in the room. Is back. And he has been on paternity leave. And alex, the good news is i havent heard him say a word about the work we do here or this show. Every single thing he is saying is all about his new Baby Daughter which is exactly the way it should be. Priorities. Priorities. Exactly the way you want it. I know because eddie is back, that you your already beautiful show will be that much more perfect so i cant wait to see the hour. Eddie is back. But he is not paying attention. Okay . Not at all. We are on our own. I have to run this. I have Remote Control to run the camera myself. I cant wait to see it lawrence. Thank you alex. Have a great show. Thank you. Well, it happened again. Stormy daniels quashed donald trump. The breaking Defendant Trump News of the night is that Stormy Daniels has humiliated donald trump once again and while she was at it, she humiliated his Criminal Defense Lawyers. Tonight, judge juan merchan granted Stormy Daniels motion to quash the subpoena of donald trump demanding a vast range of information about the making of a documentary film entitled stormy. The judge denied the trump motion saying this request is overbroad, seeks general discovery and is not limited to the Subject Matter of this case. Judge merchan had already quashed a subpoena for essentially the same material from nbc universal. The producer of the documentary. The ruling by judge merchan came at the end of the day that began with a hearing. About the District Attorneys claim that donald trump has violated a gag order that prohibits him from other things, saying anything about jurors in the case. Prosecutor chris conroy told the judge about a social media post we reported as Breaking News on this program last week. Donald trump rewrote what jesse waters said and added to that so it was not actually a quotation of someone else. The District Attorney conroy told the judge this is a very troubling post at 5 46 p. M. The defendant published a post on his truth social account that stated they are catching Undercover Liberal Activists lying to the judge in order to get on the trump jury. That whole thing is in quotation marks. Its attributed to somebody named jesse waters. What mr. Waters said was they are catching Undercover Liberal Activists lying to the judge, period. So it is a hybrid of something Somebody Else said together with something the defendant added on his own. I think the link to the jurors in this case. I think it is clearly a violation of your order. Judge merchan. It was posted on april 17th at 5 46 p. M. And it says in quotes, they were catching Undercover Liberal Act lists lying to the judge to get on the trump jury. Closed quote. And it is attributed to jesse waters. Is that in fact what mr. Waters said . Mr. Blanche . He said they are catching Undercover Liberal Activists lying to the judge. And then, not at the time, i dont believe he said in order to get on the trump jury. Judge merchan, so, your client manipulated what was said and put it in quotes am i right . I was. I wouldnt use the word manipulation but the rest of the quote is not part of the quote. This is not a repost at all. This is something that was said on tv in your client had to type it out. He had to it is there. Use the quotation marks, the shift key and type everything out. And then add those additional words so your argument that these are reposts and therefore they are not a violation. That does not apply to exhibit number 10. Is it . Mr. Blanche, number 10 is not a repost. Agreed. So what is your argument as to exhibit 10 . The argument as to convict 10, it is ambiguous whether this statement violates the gag order. The gag order said donald trump is prohibited from making or directing others to make public statements about any respective juror or juror in this criminal proceeding. Donald trump cannot make any statement about a juror. No statement at all. That Gag Order Wording could not be more clear. Donald trumps Criminal Defense Lawyer insulted the intelligence of the judge and everyone else in the courtroom when he then said, quote, President Trump is being careful with your honors rules and the judge interrupted saying you, mr. Blanche, you are losing all credibility. I have to tell you that right now. You are losing all credibility with the court. Now, you can spend years in the courtroom and never hear a judge say anything like that to competent lawyers. The judge said that he would rule on Donald Trumps violations of the gag order at some point after todays court session. And after donald trump left the courthouse, he put in writing a lie that he said when he arrived at the courthouse today. The in Writing Version is more coherent than the version trump said into the microphone this morning so we will go with the written version. Thousands of people were turned away from the courthouse in Lower Manhattan by steel and police. That is an absolute lie. I have walked down there several times. Traffic is free flowing in and around the courthouse. Pedestrians. Traffic is not hinders in any way. There was a large gathering area where i saw exactly three Trump Supporters gathered there yesterday. Reports today said only one trump supporter showed up. While the 85,000 trump voters in manhattan completely ignored what was happening at their local courthouse. Absolutely no one has been turned away anywhere in Lower Manhattan. It is actually much easier to approach and stand outside and gaze at trumps courthouse than it is to see the Rockefeller Christmas tree in december where police and barricades do restrict access. Vaughn hillyard delivered the best response on twitter saying trump just claimed that the police have shut down the streets around the courthouse for blocks and his protesters cant be here. Not true. There is one pro trump person here and the main street along the courthouse is open to traffic and Vaughn Hillyard included this video showing you just how easily vehicles move around. And how much of no one is actually there. In support of donald trump. The truth is Trump Supporters do not care that donald trump is being prosecuted. They have made that very clear. He has begged them to show up and they have refused. Yesterday, donald trump said America Loving Protesters should be allowed to protest at the front steps of courthouses all over the country. So, there is donald trump. Summoning Trump Supporters in idaho to go to the courthouse in boise and stage a big protest for him. Or in north dakota or utah or alabama or texas or somewhere there is a vast majority of voters for donald trump. Any courthouse in america, florida, anywhere. And no one, no one anywhere in the country showed up at any courthouse to protest the criminal prosecution of donald trump. 74million trump voters said absolutely no. We will not protest Donald Trumps criminal prosecution. We do not care. They are not the only people who dont care. Donald trump is the only criminal defendant i have ever seen who cannot round up a Single Family member to sit in the front row of the courtroom in support of criminal defendant donald trump. His third and current wife isnt there. Neither of his daughters are there. None of his sons are there. Not a single personal friend has shown up as a show of support for donald trump. Not one. Serial killer and sometimes cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer had his family in the courtroom every single day. Donald trump has less familial support than Jeffrey Dahmer had in the courtroom. Leading us off, someone who has been there. A fellow at justice security. Also, andrew weissman. Former chief of the criminal division. The cohost of the Podcast Prosecuting donald trump which just won this years webby award for best crime and justice podcast. Neil joins us. Former active general who argued over 50 cases before the Supreme Court. Neil and andrew are both msnbc legal analysts. And adam, from inside the courtroom today, we had a chance to read the transcript and there is stuff that looks pretty hard hitting against todd blanche with the judge. Whats the experience in the courtroom today . What can you add to the dramatics exchanges we have seen . What you can see right off the bat was blanchs reaction after that devastating thing. Very after the break. When he is saying that line that you last all correct. What can you see with this lawyer . A tremendous amount of frustration. But, at that moment, he is trying to recover. And, when the real misery of that takedown really became apparent was after the recess. And, we always see how trump is glowering when he leaves and enters the courtroom. This time he was up staged by his lawyer on the misery quotient. It was because it was about more than that one moment lawrence. This was a drum beat. There were other moments throughout that organizement. This one is very representative. He was asked if he had any case law to support his proposition. And so, the judge asks him, so tell me. What case law do you have to support that . Blanche i dont have any case law to support that but it is just common sense, your honor. How can it be that President Trump is prohibited from violating the gag order through his words or casting another person to Say Something he was saying, the judge interrupts, all right. Which is a big difference under the First Amendment of the constitution. All right, where does it say that give me the case law . Blanche, your honor, there is none. So this was just one kind of Representative Exchange and this was a brutal and even one could say bloody. We are on day two of the trial. It is very difficult to a lawyer to be told that they lost credibility on the courtroom of the second day of what is expected to be a six week trial. Donald trump is at home tonight thinking about that. And wondering can i use that as an excuse where i fire todd blanche and the defense team because the judge has, you know, says they have no credibility. Stop the trial by firing my lawyers. The criminal law has figured that out. Every defendant would be, it would be like sheherazaade. You would be constantly firing your lawyer and never going to time. To be once you are in the case, you file what is called a notice of appearance. The judge has to do it. The client cant just say this is not my lawyer. The lawyer cant say im off the case. Once you file that notice of appearance in a criminal case, you are in. Until the judge says otherwise. Here, first of all, the argument is going to be todd blanche is doing his clients bidding. He doesnt have a judge problem. He has a client problem. And what he is not doing is what appears is you know, when you are a lawyer in a case, you may have clients on both sides. Whether it is the prosecutor or the defense. You are an officer of the court first. And so, what the judge is saying you are an officer of the court. When i ask you a question, you have to be candid. It is both the right thing to do and it is strategically the right thing to do. So i mean what we are seeing play out is a client problem. Neil, i want to read you a point the judge merchan made where he referred to the possibility of being overturned on appeal on this issue of Contempt Of Court by donald trump. He says the fact that the people did not come running in here immediately when your client started reposting things or that the court did not decide to find your client in contempt, a decision that probably would have been overturned on appeal. Is not probative of anything you said. You know. Maybe we have gotten too close to the line. I think that you should have, what you should have done is probably said you know my client is thinking of reposting some things. It is not really clear to us in the gag order whether that is allowed. Is that allowed . But that is not what you did. You know i want to go back to that phrase where he said a decision probably would have been overturned on appeal. So that is his response to certainly some comment on why is the judge not acting more swiftly and summarily in reaction to some of these things donald trump has done. Yeah. The way i read that is trump is scared that this gag order that he has quite literally violated it and the penalty for flagrantly violating it is not just A Thousand Dollar fine that the District Attorney asked here but the possibility of 30 days of time in jail. So at every term, the trump team tries to remind the judge, if you seek real sanctions in terms of jail time, we will try to take an immediate appeal. That is how i understand that word salad but i do think watching the transcript, they made a little headway on the point. The judge is worried if he does impose jail time on donald trump, that it will lead to an immediate appeal. That is his concern. I think the other concern is that the jury has already been empanelled at this point. And even though if this were any other defendant who flagrantly violated gag orders like this, they would be jailed. What do you do . Keep the jury sequestered for day after day while trump serves his other sentence . Have him jailed at night i guess. It is all a kind of mess. I think the best thing to do is for the judge to issue a Jail Sentence now. But to suspend it. And to say to donald trump, look. You know. You flagrantly violated this. Every other person would go to jail. For you what i will do is wait until the end of the criminal trial. And if at the end of the trial, you behave and dont act like a toddler and comply with the gag order i will consider not having you have to serve this sentence. What i dont think should be done is give A Thousand Dollar penalty to donald trump for such flagrant violations. A thousand dollars might be a lot to him. It is still a slap on the wrist. Andrew, an awful lot of criminal defendants in that courtroom are living on Rikers Island in jail while they are on trial. That is where they spend the night every night. Where they spend the night awaiting trial so there is no logistical struggle with that in theory. But the judge knows anything he would issue there would be appealed. I think neils ideas is a good one. He can say even though theres truth socials and theres direct media. There will be a monitor. If you could say susan necklace. You are now responsible for it so there are steps he could take short of saying there is A Thousand Dollar fine. He does have to do something. On the other hand, you know, donald trump desperately wants the story to be he was jailed. Because, you know, what happened today was david revealed this was an entire scheme about fake news. This just went so to the heart of everything he was saying exists is really with him. And so, he just does not want the story in the trial to be the facts coming out. We are coming right back to those facts after we squeeze in a break. Everyone will stay with us. We will get back to the evidence of the case heard today. Well be right back. Today. Well be right back. Because Liberty Mutual customized my Car Insurance and i saved hundreds. Thats great. I know, right . Ive been telling everyone. Baby liberty. Did you hear that . Ty just said her first word. Can you say mama . Baby liberty. Can you say auntie . Baby liberty. How many people did you tell . Only pay for what you need. Jingle liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Baby liberty. I wanna hold you forever hey little bear bear. 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