Hi there. Its 4 00 in new york. Buckle up. Witness number nine in the people of the state of new york versus donald trump was unlike any moment of this trial weve seen so far, unlike any witness in this trial weve seen. This is a trial thats seen twists and turns and drama. On the stand today, hope hicks, the Silent Trump Insider who was by Donald Trumps side for years from before he ascending down the Escalaors At Trump Tower and during the president s time in white house. A visibly and nervous hope hicks who began to cry as crossexamination began. Hope hicks described the Meltdown Inside Trump world over the release of the access Hollywood Tape. She was the first person in the campaign to know about it when she got an email from a reporter with the Washington Post. He was seeking comment from her. Hicks sent the email to other staffers including Kellyanne Conway and steve bannon. One, need to hear the tape to be sure. Two, deny, deny, deny. Hope hicks said there was consensus the tape was damaging and it was going to be a crisis. What was trumps first reaction . Well, that it was not something he would say, but later trump said it was, quote, not anything to be so upset over. He said it was, quote, pretty standard stuff for two guys. Nonetheless hope hicks recalling the intense reaction, enough to completely overwhelm Press Coverage of a category 4 Hurricane Bearing down on the united states. The Trump Campaign battered by criticism from the highest ranks of the Republican Party. In the coming few weeks, the campaign had to contend with allegations of more inappropriate behavior on trumps part. And that trump was, indeed, concerned about how these stories would impact his standing with female voters. When it comes to the two women at the heart of the criminal case, Stormy Daniels and Karen Mcdougal, Hope Hicks She First heard of Karen Mcdougal four days before election day when she received an email from a Wall Street Journal reporter. She heard of Stormy Daniels a year before when, quote, guys on a plane were telling a story about Stormy Daniels attending a celebrity Golf Tournament what participant who played with donald trump. Hicks said the Trump Campaign hoped the story would blow over. Then prosecutors began to ask hope hicks about her time serving in the white house. She said that donald trump told her that Michael Cohen paid Stormy Daniels out of the goodness of his own heart. Trump said that actually. To protect donald trump from false allegations. Hope hicks told prosecutors that trumps story was inconsistent with the Michael Cohen she had come to know, quote, he is a kind of person who seeks credit, hope testified to. An insiders insider bringing the highest levels of trump world to light today in Donald Trumps first criminal trial. Thats where we start with our most favorite reporters and friends. Christie greenberg, an msnbc legal analyst and former Criminal Division deputy chief at the Southern District of new york and sue craig has joined us from court. Shes a New York Times investigative reporter. Plus, democratic strategist and director of the Public Policy program at hunter college, basil smikle joins us. Vaughn hillyard is outside the courthouse in manhattan. Vaughn, im going to start with you and the hope hicks of it all. We know she was in the room where it happened, when it happened, all the time, as it was happening and she was exactly as you describe, professional, courteous, managed to keep herself held in high regard regardless of the sort of gutter that trump dragged the country into. This was too much for her at a point today. Talk about your reaction to watching this testimony. Reporter emotional, teared up literally within the first minute of her crossexamination from Donald Trumps attorney. The court had to take a pause as she was given the opportunity to regroup, collect herself there. Then upon walking out, our team described her looking just solemn on her way out of the courthouse understanding this was an emotionally difficult day. What she described in the courthouse was a relationship that began with the trump family in 2014. This is is a decade long relationship. She testified it has been cold since 2022, at least cold to the extent she hasnt talked to her former boss since the middle of 2022 after the tapes of her testifying to the january 6th came out in which she described on January 6th Warning donald trump that his legacy was on the line because of the attack that day. So for hope hicks to come in here and publicly testify just short distance from donald trump, somebody who gave her not only a terrific job at a major corporation, but then ultimately let her become the Campaign Press secretary for the president ial campaign that would go on to win the presidency and give her a job as Comm Director inside the white house all by the age of 30 years old. In no small part did donald trump have an impact on her life. You heard her describe what the prosecution knew from her what she previously told congressional investigators about her experiences in the 2015 and 2016. Then she provided insight when it turned to 2018 after the Wall Street Journal reported about the Stormy Daniels 130,000 payment from Michael Cohen in which she says that donald trump explained to her that, boy, Michael Cohen, such a charitable act on his part to do that for me there. You could see here, you know, almost by testifying to this, providing an insight into one applied skepticism but then for somebody as she described herself to be so in the know about the campaign and the Trump Organization, clearly there was a lot that she, from her own testimony, did not know, that she was not privy to, that donald trump and Michael Cohen kept away from her and so much of this bearing out for the public through this criminal trial that she was asked to take the stand. You two were in the room where it happened. Tell me about it. It was a remarkable moment. Lets go to 2018 and the Wall Street Journal has a story and more details on the Stormy Daniels payment. They mentioned it in the 2016 story with Karen Mcdougal. Theyre surfaing a lot more information about it. As a result of that, Michael Cohen issues a statement to the New York Times, whos doing a story on it. Hes saying he did it on his own. He made this payment on his own. Then he tells hope hicks about this. Hope hicks is pretty skeptical. It doesnt sound like the Michael Cohen he knows. Hes not a very charitable person. Shes very skeptical about it. The next day, dont know where it is, but she has a conversation with donald trump about it. This is the moment that was sort of the whole courtroom was, like, wow because shes talking to donald trump and relaying the conversation she had with Michael Cohen and donald trump says, well, better to be dealing with it now. It would have been bad if it came out during the election. Just, i mean, the courtroom was just quiet and then the government ends their questioning of her. The cross starts. Donald trumps lawyers ask a basic question. Tell us what year you started working at the Trump Organization. Then suddenly i thought she just lost her voice. I thought he was reaching for water. She just started crying. She had tissues came out and the judge said well take a break. It was unbelievable. Were never going to we can put together what happened. I dont think it was the governments question about when she started working at the Trump Organization that triggered it. Trumps lawyers asked that. I dont think it was that. It was just the overwhelming a felt like a confession that she came forward and said this. Its the heart of their case. If in 18 he said, yeah, i paid for it, but thank god it didnt come out and influence the election. It was this moment. She was tearing up as the crossexamination continued. It was an emotional moment today. Yeah, and what i would say is you cannot overstate just how significant this testimony was because there is no document. Theres no other corroborating witness. Its just hope hicks and donald trump having this conversation. She didnt have to share it. She clearly didnt want to share it. That was obvious. Yet, she went up there and told the truth. She said, yeah, this clearly mattered to him. It was about the campaign. As you said, thats the whole ball game here. Its interesting because leading up to this, she was being very careful with her answers. There were a lot of i dont recall. She was asked about the conversation she had with Michael Cohen. I dont remember. Shes refreshed a few times with other grand jury testimony. Oh, sitting here i dont remember today. Back then, yes, i suppose. Shes been very careful. Im thinking is she playing games here. What are we doing . Then it leads up to this. It was the mic drop moment the prosecution ends with. She says, yes, he understood this mattered. This was about the campaign. She didnt have to do it, and she did. I think its so damaging to this case. You can attack david pecker as a sleaze ball from the National Inquirer. There was nothing to attack here. She was a young woman who got on to his campaign four years out of college and clearly looked up to him and cared about him. She had many moments where she was saying wonderful things about him, and then this. Hes so good at multitasking. Hes so good at message. Thats how it started. Right. You really felt her affinity for him. She was a little nervous when she started her testimony. Then i thought really did a good job. She was even. She was i thought the jury very personable. Then, as were leading up to this moment where she starts to cry and makes this i felt like it was a confession. She became very anxious on the stand and you could feel something building as she got to this moment. What does a jury make of a witness that delivers i mean, this is the bottom line. This is the whole case. Was the fraud committed in service of an underlying crime . This was it. This was the Bombshell Testimony that proves this was it. This wasnt Michael Cohen, their problematic witness. This was hope hicks, who literally her testimony is littered with compliments for donald trump. So, if im the prosecutor in the closing, i mention i would mention the fact that she cried. Look how hard it was. You saw. You saw how hard it was for her to make that statement. She did it because she had to tell the truth. I would absolutely draw on that and take them back to this moment because the jury is not going to forget this. This is the friday before theyre going home for the weekend. This is going to be in their minds for days. Vaughn, theres so much hope hicks fills in that i think wasnt known to those of us covering the 2016 campaign. Let me bring back to you some of her testimony about october 7th when she gets the email from the Washington Post. She gets ask, when did you first find out about the access Hollywood Tape . The afternoon of october 7, 2016. How long before the general election . A month, a little less. Prosecutor, how did you learn of it . I received an email from the Washington Post asking for comment. I was in my office on the 14th floor. Then they have the email she received. They put it up. Urgent, Washington Post query. What was your action . I was concerned, very concerned, concerned about the contents of the email. I was concerned we had a transcript and not a tape. Did you forward this to other . I did. Who did you send it to . Jason miller, Kellyanne Conway, steve bannon. It said the priorities are to get the audio tape and second audio quote. Deny, deny, deny. For all of her credibility, vaughn, for all of her reflectability, she is contaminated with the trump dna of deny first, ask questions later. Reporter if you view hope hicks through a respected professional operative sympathetic lens youll see somebody that through the course of this testimony here today in response to the Access HollywoodStory On October 7th and then the Wall Street JournalStory On November 4th detailing the karen mcdual ago National Inquirer arrangement, you would view her as a sympathetic character, took the advice of her principal and other advisers to him. She testified the initial urging she gave to the other trump Senior Campaign officials on october 7th when they went up to the 25th floor of trump tower to talk directly with him about the tape, the words were deny, deny, deny. If we believe hope hicks that the first time she heard about the allegations from Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels was on october 7th, she was really kept away from these damaging stories and put in charge of communicating to the American Public on behalf of a major Party President ial nominee mistruths, falsehoods and lies. This is what the testimony here today provided. We were wondering whether she was actually privy on august 2015 at that trump tower meeting to the conversations around the catch and kill scheme or whether the october 28th phone call contained conversations with Michael Cohen about Stormy Daniels. None of her testimony provided any of that. She provided testimony to this jury that she working through the capacity of the campaign, that her and other Campaign Members understood the gravity of what they were dealing with and the stories about the access Hollywood Tape were going to be damaging to the campaign and they were having conversations about how this would impact women voters and then celebrating that effectively nobody was covering the Karen Mcdougal story. If you take hope hicks at her word as a trusted operative, youre dealing with somebody who told the jury she believed her boss donald trump when he made the statements to her that he had no awareness of the arrangements to silence the stories about him and extra marital affairs. In the end, basil, what you have is another woman, a beautiful young woman, who doesnt walk away when she learns that the transcript that she sent to her colleagues to deny, deny, deny, is completely true. The Prosecutor Says its difficult to deny a tape when theres a full transcript. She walks up to the rest of the staff and vaughn has reporting on what was going on in this room, i do as well, jason miller, Kellyanne Conway, steve bannon, jared kushner, steve miller was in there. They were rehearsing for debate prep. Prosecutor says where was the debate taking place . Hope hicks said in the conference room. I motioned for jason miller and others to come out. Trump asked us to come inside the conference room. Its my understanding he was easily distracted from debate prep. And share what they were discussing. I shared the email with trump verbally. We were trying to get a copy of the audio to assess the situation further. We werent sure how to respond. Prosecutor, did you read trump the email . Hope hicks, yes, i have a vague recollection of reading him the transcript and then he finished reading it. Prosecutor, what did he say . Hope hicks, he said it didnt sound like something he would say. Prosecutor, did you get the actual video . Were you with trump when he saw the video . Hope hicks, yes. Prosecutor, fair to say he was as mad as youve ever seen him . What was your reaction . Hope hicks, stunned. It was concerning. I had a good sense this would be a massive story and make the news cycle for the next several days. Were you concerned about the effects on the campaign . Yes, it was a damaging development. It didnt feel like the kind of story that was helpful. There were a lot of layers to it that complicated where we wanted to go with the campaign that were going to be hard to overcome. Did others feel the tape would be damaging . Yes. There was consensus this was damaging and a crisis. Were you concerned about female voters . In that moment, no. Maybe a couple hours l