And welcome to cross town where all things are considered im Peter Lavelle the media environment is bleak if you disagree with the official narrative youre called a conspiracy theorist never mind many official narratives actually are conspiracy theories and is big tech and war with populous. To discuss this and more im joined by my guest george samueli in budapest hes an author and the you tube read the gavel and in moscow were joined by dmitri bobbitt she is a political analyst and editor and knows me internet Media Projects are gentlemen go. Some proof in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate it i mean when i got an email here in moscow as i said in my introduction if you disagree with the official narrative somehow youre a conspiracy theorist but over the last few years and particularly i have in mind russia gate ukraine gate even go further back with saddam and weapons of mass destruction the theres plenty of official conspiracy theories that have been thoroughly debunked but many of the conspiracy theories that i consider can vary theories in the official discourse are theres no even attempt to acknowledge that they can be debunked go ahead oh well youre absolutely right 2 because look just starting from july facebook. Even due to the shut down hundreds of thousands of accounts of people connected to what these companies declared to be conspiracy theories organizations and all i wont name them not to give as a dozen to them but everyone knows these names you know the Mainstream Media reports about them every day and if you look at their theories for which these groups were paralyzed are biased basically every one of them has some. Kind of shadow in really get like ok its a Conspiracy Theory that the western rule or world is ruled by paedophiles who are iranian you know child safety child sex trade yes thats a Conspiracy Theory but Jeffrey Epstein exists that and he is circle exist and is a circle included people from there what we can call high society so why cant people just you know make their own conclusions and go further than. Thats absolute in april. And the program with the conspiracy Conspiracy Theory has spread have to by the Mainstream Media is that theyre not based in reality and whole theyre based on ideology for example. You know Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction he was a maniac who wanted to destroy the world that was a huge Conspiracy Theory but no one shoves down New York Times twitter accounts no one says you i to us how many times did New York Times report that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction found so for hours and sometimes tens of thousands the minute got those say its not a Conspiracy Theory and mr trump is a lie you should be labeled as the New York Times would continue business as usual right i know im going to find peace and they compute surprises and the promotions and they and they were just kicked up the ladder 1st spreading their false narratives here you know this is the limit george i mean. And this is all the medias fault i mean that lets us look at cove it i mean you can look at a one hour one hour of primetime and go to every single major cable station and they have their with their panel of medical experts but they all say Different Things ok i mean what are people supposed to believe and because they cant believe the official narrative theyre going to try to make conclusions themselves thats only natural and let the over the last couple of days the way social media platforms of behave no wonder people start thinking unthinkable and sometimes unreasonable things because they feel theyre being lied to. Thats absolutely right because theres the there is 2 basic purpose which is use the media your opponents as they is of Conspiracy Theory and so you say oh these people who are ridiculous there is if there is. Joe biden was involved with rolling ukraine an influence peddling and trying to get applause thank you the fiat because you want to protect his son back because there is a theory. When you say that barack obama was spying on the Trump Campaign thats the Conspiracy Theory but as david pointed out. Them on hussein had weapons of mass destruction and even more seriously that he was involved in the 911. 00 terrorist attack that apparently is not a conspiracy there this is the claim that martin may have. Fixed the 2016 election for d donald trump which the media have been claiming i think they do it to this day thats not a Conspiracy Theory. They claim that 100. 00 bidens laptop or the emails that have just recently emerged. A product of a russian this information thats not a conspiracy so so thats where you are you are allowed to put forward your conspiracy theories was me airing your opponent as being a Conspiracy Theory. If you look at the New York Times how many times use the word Conspiracy Theory all day every day innumerable stories used to it is there is it there about whom about the people that they politically donald trump is a puppet or a conspiracy but no no weve been your private not to do when we say that but im a budget controls every single thing in the well thats not a conspiracy very good you know demon you can compare this is a controversy surrounding joe bidens son hunter and then we can compare it to to rush again so rush again is based on Anonymous Sources exclusively minima sources and. Flimsy and even fabricated dossiers ok that were paid for for and they all had that and the dossier had a political aim ok to discredit and thats called opposite Position Research and happens all the time. But opPosition Research that isnt usually used to impeach someone ok but in the case of the the main the bike family i mean there are calendars there are people that it made it that they met him my. He transfers and you know i mean theres a lot of you know me you know all those bones to talk about but russia again was all up in the clouds built you know i counsel floating in miraculously in the clouds here but you know once a Conspiracy Theory and the other one is debunked i mean you know and then where the journalist in the whole of the not i mean it was a pretty ugly car so in the quads thats quite a spade a spade i think people should be named and shamed in this case i mean christopher a steals dorsy a claim that russian prostitutes or any of them sounds on drums had when he was in moscow and that was completely below you and there was nothing behind it. But you know these dossier is still mentioned and the Mainstream Media not only in the United States by you know. Media outlets i guess spiegel magazine in it in germany all i know more and in france they continue saying that russians stole their American Election by placing ads on facebook for them out of 100000. 00 or less you know so these are just absolutely incredible lies i mean allies simply dont make much as i told you you know the socalled popular conspiracy theorists you know there are many conspiracy theories about coronavirus well because the theme who looks absurd specious thats why you have these yes nice sometimes about corona mafia or corona craziness corona grease in nature all 2 that people create such theories that conspiracy theories of the Mainstream Media are based on the ideology like poetry and poison not only i dont think so because no one else was interested in poisoning hume well i mean there were several very strange deaths or. Western politicians you put it your sense in the last few years like im just a leper who was called polish who cannot get home to god so depressed that he hanged himself when he was on mars and i want to ask him questions you know your kaido who was who was the black sheep of european politics you know the you convened wise mens meetings to see how he is in france could be contained and then he just drove his car badly and walked into an accident and i. Was interested in this of course no one will buy it will not bother me yes all the pushing was interested in that well beyond if you could do it so this is all based on ideology this is all based on demonizing certain people like you say a lot of bad things about some foreign leader and then something happens and then you say who else. Well you know i mean but this is laziness as well ok i mean if there is that its open to the many of these people that have a default position that theyre not really interested in facts ok they theyre interested in how you can perpetuate their political agenda here in georgia its like you know another one that keeps circulating around even though into the debunked is the bounty hunters. In afghanistan where you had the highest serving general American General and you had gone public and guess now its about 3 or 4 weeks ago saying that he has heard nothing up there is there is he has no knowledge of this but but still in the u. S. A Political Campaign the president ial campaign its still being circulated i mean so even if you go to the very source ok its soldiers being killed by how a band that are being paid by the russians of and they whittled it down to someone a soldier a former soldier or someone someone associated with the Iraqi Government that is one other percent depended on the United States and trump wants to get out and so all of a sudden this story gets circulated and then it gets down to well maybe you shouldnt leave afghanistan when the American Public overwhelmingly wants that to happen but see that conspiracy continued to support the flow because it has political advantages for some. Yeah thats exactly right and and you notice that even the in last weeks the town hall debate biden again came up with this nonsense about the the bounty and of course the moderator George Stephanopoulos did nothing to correct him none of the Fact Checkers did anything to correct their Senate Tammy Duckworth just about every day tweets out something about our how many days of pasta a person had about the bounty is only u. S. Soldiers and still donald trump hasnt said anything about it so it just has momentum of its own it doesnt it doesnt matter that its been debunked apparently its perfectly reasonable to peddle this sort of nonsense and in fact the whole russia gate is still people still peddling this thing about how russia is interfered in the 2016 election on behalf of donald trump and then you know and that somehow the 26000 election result was tainted by russia no evidence has ever been presented i mean every single thing that we have learned since when you 16 as sure that there really there was no russian intervention except for it what it did prove though were going to go to a break real quick what it did prove is that this was a conspiracy ok but they didnt prove it ok so instead of coal when we debunk it were conspiracy there is when when they were refused to rebut us you know that they they believe that their narrative hows about you because they wont they wont debate around that jump in here gentlemen when you go to a short break now lets or break well continue our discussion on some real estate with arkie. The world is driven by. In a day or. Week to ask. Welcome back to crossfire where all things are considered on Peter Lavelle to remind you were discussing some real news. Ok lets go back to here in moscow you know in looking at what the. Whats happening to the internet in these platforms critically facebook and twitter and then we can throw in google here we have seen particularly in the last weeks the last few days last week where they have very very stridently interfered into the political process and were talking about the growing scandal and allegations around the Vice President former Vice President s son. And we have seen facebook and twitter actually acknowledge their involvement in this and theyve kind of pulled back a little bit but i mean whats really quite amazing to me is that again weve talked about russia gave in the 1st part of this program all of that was based was not based on any verifiable public sourcing and they let it go on and on and on and on and then when they have a case here and were all 3 of us are saying allegations im not a lawyer im not looking at the direct evidence myself im looking at reporting on it and i will judge for myself but even that they dont want you to do thats what makes this very very serious and very very dangerous. People dont Say Something and be heard it will become a trend go ahead jim. Well basically if you look at some of the it was a chance against the socalled conspiracy theorists theyre just very strange almost laughable i mean im quoting look you go here the Conspiracy Theory school aim that there is a criminal organization involved in the clintons a bomber and they use vestment banker george soros who are doing something bad to the world well everyone who has access to newspapers can see that maybe there is no secret organization but they share the same ideology the Clintons Obama and soros they supported the same eagle coos in georgia in yugoslavia in ukraine you know and they all the supporter in the same works in the same ways for the same reasons and its Public Knowledge so it 8 policemen were killed in 2014 during the socalled peaceful my done before the legally elected president was toppled and instead of apologizing these people say the crash invaded ukraine out of nothing. Without any pretext so. When they. Accuse someone they excuse either their opponents or the messenger you know there was no one of a little bit of that you do tremendous you need it is bad but you know for example the s. P. O. Magazine. Called saroj event name me one of the facebook phoned us saying that something i called something should be done because social networks now operate in like Chemical Industry in the 1950 s. And their poison everything their own themselves they grab huge profits and are not and theyre refusing to have any control over them well just recently weve heard. On facebook and for all from american politicians nobody mutations on the internet should be imposed in china in russia you know the congress well basically in russia there are almost no need to. Read Foreign Press you can read people queen and the boys and to know how an ancient not prohibitive its not labeled we dont know whats actually being us or you know even something at least i havent seen it in russia ive seen it hundreds off in the american internet so its a very strange story. And just not strange its very easy to explain i think youre george i mean isnt it you know the interesting thing is that if we look at ghent at the controversy surrounding the former Vice President s ok with these Major Social Networks are doing theyre putting up. Barriers on all sides ok and what they want to do its an instrument to maintain the status quo this is what this is all about humane change the people in power ok and anyone that rents that status quo of the ruling and leads will be challenged and because of then the nature of the technology you can beat disappear i mean youve just gone from the ether ok and its ideologically driven but its also you know in a sense class driven to ok to protect. Peoples. Assets and properties and things like this where they want to give this ruling class wants to reproduce itself ok based on their ideas of merit and they dont want anybody else coming in and you know what these Internet Companies are perfect for these people to maintain their power in does ition ok the fascinating thing is that we always think about technology is evolution in changing. Clinics true blue should all that right now no ds people are stuck on status quo people go ahead george yes thats right and he goes back to 2016 i mean 2016 was a profound shock to the globally. Shocked victory in the United States the bronx its a referendum in the u. K. And from that moment own oppression a group only Internet Companies because up until then the Internet Companies were basically you know they let them have a pretty much a laissez faire attitude. Because it seemed like most of the obama isnt would go on forever and from that moment on theres something in the politicians the media stuff that doesnt mean it is your fault you did it you allowed hootin to manipulate you you allow trump and wholly conspiracy theorists around trying to manipulate you you allow the bricks that is to manipulate you you better get to shape up or you will be in trouble and the Internet Companies who are more powerful than any company that has ever been in the history of the world i mean sound at all 80 and see where nothing of powerful is Google Facebook and twitter i mean they control the flow of information throughout the world. That thick power and once they