Main stream outlet. Natalie joins me now from lisbon. Portugal. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, thank you so much. Thatd be very right coming on. So lets just kick off your view of uh, how the retaliation from iran is being covered in the us media the the media landscape view inhabited before the starting redact. Yeah. You know, its confounding. Of course we all see that, but whats confounding me the most is how the United States continues to spin. Whether or not israel not having civilian losses in the rons retaliation just several days ago. Say lets, lets see that a as a wind and deescalate it seems as though the United States has its puppets off their lease. These puppies are off the lease. They dont, theyre not in control any longer. So this, then, it just doesnt make any sense anymore. Unless youre only just joining the conversation right now, because the last 2 years have shown that the United States doesnt get their way. They spin things in a way that doesnt make any sense at all less, like you mentioned in your introduction that zalinski now expressing support for the genocide and gaza. What does he care . He supported the genocide in the don bos for the whole of his presidency. So clearly, that doesnt bother him. Taking the champion that was the lensky, and now resigning him to 2nd seat. You know, its just clear that Foreign Policy in the United States is inconsistent and it has nothing to do with the respect for life. And i dont denied you cover conflict, but it says if conflict are only successful from the viewpoint of nato nations, if they kill lots of people, i suppose so. But i dont think that even nato leaders believe what theyre saying, because they continue to move the goal posts. We see them doing that in ukraine where 2 years ago it just was very fashionable to support ukraine, give you kind whatever you wanted. As you mentioned, i live in western europe, and when the conflict came out, it was all over the place, how fashionable it was to save ukrainians, whatever you can do, taking a ukrainian refugee, i donated a car seat and some extra antibiotics. I dont know where the heck those things when it was just all the wept out mom groups. What can we do . Were so her ro x because were saving ukraine. Well, just a few days ago, zalinski signed into law. The most are connie in draft la. Weve seen in modern history the conscription of even people who are no longer physical fit physically fit, he will be dragging them back into medical exams to see if they are in fact a someone that just a warm body. They can put on the front lines to serve the fact that they will be asking people, i mean, in the United States, we had a split over the papers, please law in arizona. We apparently dont mind that it will be happening in ukraine. So, you know, this idea that ukraine is a democracy worth saving, that we need to continue to go into debt for and support so that other people die, but we dont have to. Well, its a joke, and you can see that need of, they dont believe it. They are just saying it because theyre paymasters require it. Yeah, i was that lensky a. Im signing up teenagers and because he abolished the elections. But then when you see how, i mean, im going to say personally, when i was in london before coming out here, it was clear people was supporting ukraine because they were told to do so. Then im the how are you finding the pivoting that even New York Times in washington posted in those math pieces already trying to soften up public opinion. But at the same time, the bible continuing to say, ukraine is as important as ever, with a few new ones. Back tracking elements. A great, i was shocked to see David Cameron dusted off for this very purpose to do a tour in the United States to sell the idea of continuing to support you crazy. Thats why you went to the trump in merrill, olga. A possibly possibly, and you know, of course, id be disappointed with any leader who continues to support war and ukraine because not just because of what it does to the american budget and my taxes. We just, you know, a few days ago had our tax day and, but that felt like a kick in the pants because i know as we were paying our taxes as americans. Well, heres a home are that will do nothing to achieve any goals other than just continuing to kill innocent civilians in ukraine. And i think that youre right about the idea of yeah, i was in london recently to and i saw ukrainian flags up in peoples windows and i still see them on social media profiles and whatever. I see that i just think you literally have done no research on this. Youre just doing what the bbc wants you to do. Its shocking. And i cannot, i feel like, okay, either im going to engage with that person and were going to talk about, you know, the history of ukraine, at least starting back as 2012 or were not, were just not going to have conversations about it because anyone who actually studied, you know, theres a great, a academics that ive been reading all of his books since about 2010 called gilbert dr. O. And hed been warning about this and publishing books. Hes an American Academic talking about how russia is warning us, that we are provoking them, not just with nato expansion, but with, by moving into ukraine and ukraine, torturing the people of the don boss that theyre fighting so hard to get back. I think most people just dont know that they just refused to study. But another book that i had read oh, about 2 or 3 years ago called borderlands. And this is a very pro ukrainian book. It was a woman who just had ukrainian ties and wanted to write a book about ukraines recent history. And she had said that the leadership in ukraine, one of the things they were the most afraid of is losing the don boss region because its so wealthy and resources the minds there for your cranium and other things. Well, thats exactly what happened. So theyve been, were furiously worried about keeping this region well, also torturing these people. And i think just, yeah, youre right. The New York Times has been reluctant to cover that. The with around the read, the very clear it was, are a simple for the war, but then how easy is it . How easy will it be to filter down to the public use all of those ukraine flags still, then all using would unprovoked as often maybe. And now we have a leak regarding the and the other nato, a nation back war. Even guys, a New York Times, apparently sending a memo to stop saying stop using the word genocide occupied territory. Dont use the word palestine. Ive seen that for saw, its that clear from editorial. That was it your experience when you were working in so called Mainstream Media that you get these memos telling you not to use certain words and how easily will the publics be persuaded to change the views say, with regard to grain and continued just about genocide as with the gaza. Well thats a good question. I dont think that the Mainstream Media is ever going to admit that they were wrong on ukraine, that they were swallowing a line that basically support for war. And ukraine was tantamount to believing weapons of mass destruction. And i dont think theyre going to do that. I dont know if you saw the recent article in the free pressed by the n p. R. News editor euro 3 or a berliner was his name, where he talked about how he always knew that n p r, which i think we can extrapolate best to any, maybe one like the bbc in the United States. Yeah, yeah. Yes. Yeah. So if you know any, maybe once well respected media outlined outlet like the New York Times or uh, cbs news. Uh but this n p r news editor, what he said was, i always knew n p r was left leaning. You know, subaru driving, white educated democrats, but we always had at least a Fair Distribution of our audience, but its shrunk. Its so much and has become so much an eco chamber for our echo chamber, sorry for it. Just basically view. And i thought, why liberals that its trunk their audience because of it because their Editorial Staff has dug their heels in on certain coverage such as around palestine around cove. It around hunter, bidens laptop. He goes point by point around George Floyds desk. He said these were opportunities to do real journalism and n p r decided not to, but instead they held all these diversity meetings. They started tracking their source is based on diversity. So youre not even trying to tell the news. Youre only trying to paint a story of virtue signaling and it, he says it just eroded right out from under me. What he did was he went to his bosses and said, this is the problem. We have no republicans working in the news room. So we have no diversity of thought, nobody is actually trying to see the side of the audience thats leaving us. And the ceo said, oh yeah, its interesting ill, ill take your meeting and then cancelled it and never rescheduled because they just felt like i guess for whatever reason i dont need to hear that. And thats very much my experience because i never saw this kind of refuse refusal to look at stories when i was a journalist, i dont think im, i was as shocked as everybody else. I was already independent by the time the pandemic it. But this lack of curiosity about where cove it came from, whether the vaccines were safe or not, whether people were actually being harmed to buy them. Whether that cobit numbers, they just, they lacked curiosity and were all in on punishing people who work curious. And that for me was a big turning point. Its not about pushing the narrative. Its about asking the questions, even if you dont want to that and then the war and ukraine where i, you see, theyre lying there too. Whos lying there pretending like ukraine just popped up out of the blue like lead. And so in fan design money i made for myself, there was money to be made many commercial stations funded by pharmaceutical companies. In fact, as to the cobit story, theres no money to be made. I suppose stokes defense stocks, the popularity of shows like redacted, his best image of the fact that the people on interested in watching all those kind of fake news stories in so go Mainstream Media, but then i understand, i mean were being hit similarly. They the Silicon ValleyIndustrial Complex as a way of trying to destroy your audience, accessing your show. Yes, they do. Im sure youre familiar with the cast review, which is b n a test story. The n h s, the National Health service and the u. K. Launched a year as long study showing how Little Research they have around transgender children, and specifically the sex change surgeries and the cross ex hormones that they give them at the very young ages. And the cast review was fantastic. I spent a whole weekend reading it. Thats why i didnt get any coverage on comcast. Sky news in britain. Right. Really . I yes, yeah. And my piece on it on redacted was hit with them. Well they, they at least down ranked it. And so i was really disappointed because this is an academic paper, but it is me covering it and validating it makes me guilty of wrong think. And this kind of thing happens to us all the time. And its, its really discouraging. And there are times that are like, why do we do this . You know, its, its really terrifying to speak freely on these platforms. But i guess anything thats easy while everyone would do it right. So someones gotta do something hard and im still alive. So thats why we do it and we have 3 kids and i dont want to look at them and think, well, we didnt try our best or try and create the world that you deserve. So yeah, i do want to make that point though you, you mentioned about the near times, not saying palestine. We dont use that either just because they, those people have not been given a country yet. Its not really a place and recognized by some pretty big. Yeah. But natalie, more as ill stop you that more from before my m s. Nbc and current current co host will be used to will show redacted. After this break, the, [000 00 00;00] the, when the Worlds Largest democracy votes the rest of the planet watches in an emerging multi polar world, indias voice matters. But who will be the power behind watches, almost 1000000000 people decide and billions more, react the the welcome back to going, ill be going. Im still here with read that goods. Natalie morris. Thank you for having me. Natalie. You enjoy hearing about the fact that youre still alive, context of that sense to ship it to let you know its an ongoing story. This reauthorization of vice, a warrantless wire tapping. I dont suppose youre going to tell me all about the fact that your, you and your husband about the bugs you buy us at ortiz, but it passed the house, the waiting senate approval, Edward Snowden, tweeting from moscow, where he has been co for safety. How, how scary is the reauthorization of this wireless, why its happening or does it know methods to do it unless realize in the us that under surveillance by the Security State all the time as well. I sort of assume that were always being watched because of that, i did read Edward Snowden book and i found it terrifying. But i dont think that this is the make or break moment of censorship. I think that this as showing just how complicit our leaders are by allowing it, but even if it had not passed, even if there was no supporters of it, you know that these Government Agencies are still going to continue to casually dip into whatever they want. And help themselves to whatever bits of your life that they want. And so i think that its more insidious than that. Then just this one bill. And i think its going to take much more of an overhaul then just, you know, one, the, one of the things that i think it is so interesting is that these different Government Agency is now they just keep popping up and being born c sub a c i s a is a new one from the state department that terrifies me. And the way that theyre using these different non Government Agencies to do the bidding of down ranking or punishing people on social media or reaching in the social media and taking what theyd like. And one of the things that we know is that these agencies dont necessarily talk to each other. So the n s a might buy some data with our tax dollars. I might add, its april, thats top of mind. So the, and i say might buy some data and then oh, you know, the c, i a is buying that same data, but they actually dont know. The same thing happens with the 0 day exploits, these Software Bugs that they can get in and watch you. However, they want and so its redundancy. So you see on redacted we always have this National Debt clock. Well that, that is happening for so many reasons, but made worst by the fact that these different Government Agencies are buying the same a Digital Assets in duplicate and they just dont know. So even if one agency were told, hey you, you kinda gotta stop that, or at least you have to start getting a warrant. That doesnt mean the others wouldnt. Its, its bigger than all that. Unfortunately. Maybe its because the infrastructure is already paid for in the United States. They dont need the money for you, do you . But you personally miss the United States, even though from a far you can tell just by statistics about the levels of poverty inequality in the infrastructure spending, i know that you have one redacted, a different view of what happened with that bridge catastrophe recently in the United States yeah, absolutely, and you know, theyre still so many things to be learned about that, but it does seem like its very much a subterfuge. Thats something that claytons been covering my husband at length. But, but it also just feels like a, a crumbling and you know, it feels even if it, even if its not a cyber attack, it does, it does feel symbolic of a lot of crumbling infrastructure in the United States, which makes me sad. I mean, clearly it was dangerous to talk out against cove it because authority said oh, it was about the locked downs. And so and how dangerous did you both feel and your team feel . When you were questioning the narrative about headless babies be headed babies on october, the 7th, and claims of mass rape. And so on. October the 7th, which, you know, weve had guests on saying that this was of use to justify what the redacted and were going underground coal to genocide to powered via us u. K. U nation weaponry. So i would say israel is the scariest. Its much scarier than ukraine was, and we felt terrified covering ukraine for a long time. And we got on some scary lists from people who are very pro ukraine, who said that we were traders or russians stooges, we had that a lot, put an apologist. Um, now youve joined how much awesome you joined him off. Right. Really . Yes. Yeah. And i, you know, im trying to think was, i is scared, covering all of this and ukraine over the last 2 years as i have felt about going up against a zionist government. And i dont know, im scared a lot. So i, im not sure, you know, if i think you had the little arrow and you show we did, we did. Yeah. Mind us. What happened to them . Right. Yeah. Someone who was not protected by the United States government was thrown in jail and died there from neglect, apparently. And its much different story then alexi and of all me who splashed all over the headlines comically at the oscars actually the night. But in the fall and he died, i was in dubai, and i couldnt take it watching all of the coverage of people lauding him as a hero. And i thought you dont know youre not studied. So it was one of my more successful pieces that i sat down in our hotel room. And i told the story of all of the things that were not told about and of all me. And yet, he still showed up on glossy magazine covers after his