sort of the president's bag man, you know, traveling around, you know, trying to hatch these various schemes going on? >> yeah. this is one -- this is the thing that worries me deeply about the whole scandal, aside from the content of it and what we're investigating and learning. is the message it sends around the world that maybe the state department doesn't really speak for the united states foreign policy. maybe mike pompeo doesn't really have the influence and can speak for president trump. now i don't think that's true, but that's sort of the message. i'm sure foreign leaders are scratching their heads wondering should we schedule a meeting with giuliani, is that the way to get in good with donald trump, or is that just a more efficient, faster way than going through the state department bureaucracy? and it hamstrings our diplomats around the world. whether they're career foreign service or political appointees, they're reporting american foreign policy -- representing american foreign policy interests. no matter what country they're in, they're being undermined by the scandal. >> it seems there's a third role there, elena, that admirable