making american foreign policy over there? why is he deciding whether, you know, this aid goes through or not, whether the president of the united states meets with the president of ukraine? every witness that has come forward so far has said that those were the real objectives of american foreign policy. >> and the president multiple times said oh, go talk to rudy for the details on this. he even said that to zelensky, talk to rudy. >> talk to rudy. and rudy, according to rudy, was just a defense lawyer, not an american government official. >> carl, the president, quote, wanted nothing less than zelensky to go to microphone and basically say investigations biden and clinton. that's what george kent testified to. that's pretty clear. >> it's not only clear, what this is about is a conspiracy driven by the president of the united states with his lawyer to undermine the american electoral system through the intervention