valid religious reason, by then, or be fired. but when it comes to passengers, there is no-such vaccine mandate, yet. writing in the atlantic, ju juliette kayyem favors the idea. suggests that unvaccinated people are being ordered around arbitrarily. she argues quote, what is actually going on mostly is that institutions are shifting burdens to unvaccinated people denying them access to certain spaces. requiring them to take regular covid-19 tests. charging them for the cost of that testing, rather than imposing greater burdens on everyone else. americans, still, have a choice to go unvaccinated. but that means giving up on certain societal benefits. juliette kayyem joins me tonight, along with cnn political commentator, mary katharine ham. juliette, this question is obviously one that is causing a lot of controversy and division, now. explain why you think a vaccine requirement would be a good idea, specifically for -- for airlines, given the risk