but it is fraught. and ultimately, even though they might know where groups of individual americans are, now the issue, obviously, as oren was pointing out is how on earth do you get them from where they are not just through taliban checkpoints which for american citizens are reasonably benign but away from this terrorist threat. which at the moment means all the ways in -- the official ways into the airport are now blocked. and there still are people there. there are still people so desperate that they will ignore afghans i mean afghans will be ignoring, in large numbers, these threats from isis-k because they are already so fearful of the taliban, anderson. >> and, sam, what about your journey out of afghanistan? >> well, it was long and hot. i was on an american c-17 with 451 other passengers. almost all of them, afghans or -- or americans being flown