>> listen, do they know better than that? we all speak for a living. that's what i do for a living. at times you screw up. so i like to give people grace when they speak for a living. especially he has a podcast. i'm not sure how long it is or how long he goes. you're just speaking off the cuff. but one would think you'd do your research if you're talking about topics this important. but do they know better or are they just speaking to the people in their audience and just sort of capitalizing on that thinking that's what they want to hear? do you understand what i'm saying? >> sure, absolutely. and i don't think those things are mutually exclusive. i think on the one hand you're absolutely right, they're speaking to their audiences, they're jinning up a kind of resistance and a kind of anger at look at this guy talking this kind of stuff, and blackness is much more complicated and look, by the way, he's lighter than us or darker than us and therefore he's not really black. come on.