i mean, social media apps, they're apps. people download them on their phones. why do they do that? it has to be a reason why a third of the world's population enjoys using these apps. >> back in '94 when there was a similar moment with testimony for big tobacco, right, back then a third of people around the world were smoking. so there is kind of a compelling comparison. >> yeah, absolutely. there's questions of do we actually enjoy all the time we spend on our social apps. especially opening instagram and waking up maybe half an hour later and realize you spent all that time scrolling. i think nick kleg argues people use it. of course, facebook is an important vital communication tool for billions of people around the world. when they went down yesterday, i couldn't what's app my family in canada, and so it's very important, you know, this company does provide a lot of value. but i think the arguments that the whistleblower frances is making is not that facebook should go away completely, but that the company has grown so