Well, i can only speak to my experience. And i know that the twitter thread has sort of brought all these different people together. And ive heard from friends of friends that have heard from their friends of friends or their families, did you see this persons tweet . And the then they shared their immigration stories about how much their family sacrificed, or there was one about this man who read my tweets to his grandfather who escaped from nazi germany when he was 8. And there was another about a father who read it to his daughters. And he said, im so proud about this moment, to be able to explain this moment to my daughters. I think that thats why it was so successful. I think thats why it resonated with people. Can i ask you something . So if someone asks you, who is gary lee . What do you say to them . How do you answer that question . I am. I think he is this chubby, 90s, r b and hiphoploving guy from albuquerque, new mexico, that is just like everybody else. And i think that no matter where you grew up i think that thats really what this all speaks to, don, is that we i think that there is more partisanship, and we are more divided than weve ever been. And the reason for that is there is a lack of empathy. And what president obama used to say is theres more that unites us than divides us. And i think no matter where you grew up, you listen to boyz ii men and mariah carey and Whitney Houston and you watched full house and fresh prince. And you care for your parents and you care for your kids. And i think that we have forgotten that. I think that what we need more than ever is the same thing that president obama brought in 2008. I think thats what we need the most. I think thats hope. Gary lee, thank you. Regards to your family. Thank you, don. This is cnn tonight. Im don lemon. A little past 11 00 on the east coast, live with new developments tonight. A Government Shutdown looming, four days away, as hopes dim for a compromise deal on daca. But where does all this leave more than 700,000 d. R. E. A. M. Ers who were drot to this country as children . More on that in a moment. The maryland pastor who from the pulpit called out President Trumps vulgar comments about immigratii immigrants, with Vice President pence in the congregation. Ill talk to that pastor tonight. The latest on what could be a Government Shutdown and what it could mean for a daca deal. Ron nearing, former National Spokesperson for ted cruz, thanks for joining us. Cnn senior political analyst jennifer granholm, democratic former governor of michigan, thank you for joining us as well. Jennifer, governor granholm, just a week ago, the president seemed eager to get a deal, even to compromise on immigration. Watch this and then well discuss. If we do the right bill here, we are not very far away. Weve done most of it. You want to know the truth, if we do this properly, daca, on urnot so far away from comprehensive immigration reform. And if you want to take it that further step, ill take the heat, i dont care. Then this afternoon the prospect of compromise seems to have dimmed with the president saying, senator Dickey Durbin totally misrepresented what was said at the daca meeting, deals cant get made when theres no trust, durbin blew daca and is hurting our military. Who do you see as responsible for blowing the deal and why governor . Well, if the deal is blown, and i think its not a done deal yet, if the deal is blown in some way, it will mean that there is a Government Shutdown, potentially. Unless paul ryan, unless they can get the votes on the republican side. And who will get the blame for that . Its the republicans. I previeded when i was governor over a couple of shutdowns. Believe me, it is the executive that gets the blame for that, no matter how much time he tries to deflect, everybody is not stupid. We know who controls. Can i just Say Something . You had that beautiful guest on just a minute ago, mr. Lee. And it just im an immigrant myself. When you raise your right hand and take the oath, it is such an unbelievably powerful experience that so many people who have been here for decades just want to be able to do that. When i woke up this morning, on the front page of my local paper, the free press was the story of a 39yearold man who this morning, on Martin Luther king day, who has been here for 30 years, was at the airport being ripped from his family after he had never been convicted, not even a ticket, had paid his taxes, was a landscaper in lincoln park. There he was with his wife wailing, being ripped from his family. Really, really, is that what makes America Great . Is that what we are so afraid of, is somebody who has been a lawabiding citizen who just wants to be with his 12yearold son and his 15yearold daughter . Jorge garcia is an example of one of the 700,000 or 800,000 people who will be affected by this if there is not a deal. 15,000 people have lost their status i think thats the urgency of why they need to get something done, governor. Im glad you told that story. I need to bring ron in. The president is blaming democrats and the shutdown, says they refuse to negotiate on military budget, refusing to budge from the socalled d. R. E. A. M. Ers, a quote from him, the hundreds hundreds of thousands mentioned there. Do you see any way past this impasse . Sure. Certainly the events of the past couple of days make a deal tougher its not over . Its not over. There may be a shutdown, i dont think there should be, i dont think there will be already ultimately on daca, you have a republican president , President Trump, who ran on the most harsh antiimmigration language of any president weve had in modern times, who has said hes willing to sign a deal to legalize the status of Daca Recipients provided hes able to get funding for securing the bored exert like. The democrats should take that deal. They certainly should take that deal, because number one, they will achieve the policy goal which they say they want, number two, the democrats claim theyre for a secure border, then lets do that, properly fund a secure border, a wall where necessary, other enhance manies elsewhere, get that done. I think thats where the president is coming from and the democrats should take that deal. Do you see that, governor . I totally see that, but this shouldnt an twostep. First of all, youve got all of these people who are losing status every single day. So theres an urgency about the first part which is the daca deal. And the only bill thats available right now is this funding bill. So youve got 83 of americans who want to see daca resolved. 68 or Something Like that of republicans who want to see it resolved. So there you go, youve got democrats who want to see that happen, a lot of republicans, youve got republicans who want the funding bill, and a lot of democrats. Why cant those two happen first, then once the crisis is over, then you do a comprehensive bill which can include a lot of the things that you describe. I dont know why we have to shove all of this, 20 pounds of poop, into a fivepound bag. We can do it step by step. So listen, ron. I thought this was very important. I saw this. This is the head of the National Hispanic christian Leadership Conference issued a statement saying how, how about move forward on immigration . He said this, every Single Person is created in the image of god, without exception, therefore as it pertains to immigration, we must provide a legal avenue with no rigorous vetting that enables individuals with rigorous vetting i should say, that enables individuals from both norway and nigeria, from holland and haiti, to come to our nation if they embrace our values, commit to selfreliance, to enriching our collective american experience. Is that a sign of just how damaging these comments, these shole or shouse comments, have done . No, i think the larger issue here is that, at least from the republican side, is that theres no compassion in allowing to have an insecure border, to continue to perpetuate. We do not have a safe, secure, modern border. I live in san diego county, in the county i live in southern california, weve had an explosion of homelessness in that county and in california. Because of these meth labs, these super labs in mexico that are bringing drugs. The very same networks that bring Illegal Immigrants into the country are used to bring drugs into the country and money and guns back into mexico. You think a wall will fix that . Where its necessary. The california, arizona sectors, thats important to accomplish. Not far from where i live there are open section in the border hundreds of feet long if not thousands of feet long. Those should be closed. People would be shocked as to the current state of the border in that area. A wall is necessary in those sectors and other sectors, then technology and other barriers were speaking about a wall in mexico but were not talking about the comments the president made, thats different, he was not talking about mexico i assume but hes already said how he felt about mexicans. Certainly the comments that have been reported makes a deal more difficult on both sides. What senator durbin has said and the like what mike shields said is correct, by exacerbating this, you make a deal less likely, rather than putting that aside, putting policy first, getting the deal done. Governor, well continue the conversation. Thank you both. Dr. Kings son, Martin Luther king jr. Iii, compared President Trump to George Wallace today. And he said the president s heart can be changed. Is he right . Before the auditorium is booked and the press is notified, before the chairs are unstacked or the fancy snacks are set out, before the tech blogs make wild speculations and then other tech blogs contradict those with other, even cooler speculations, theres Something Else an underlying breakthrough that makes it all possible. At qualcomm, theres less fanfare and the only finger foods are from a vending machine. But we are leading the world to 5g, ushering in a new era of seamless interaction that will make the internet of things, the thing. 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In the wake of the firestorm over his vulgar comments about african dun trees President Trump continues to insist hes not a racist. Tim wise, the author of white like me. Cnn comment later marc lamont hill. Good to have you all on. Tim wise, the president is once again having to come out and say that hes not a racist. Take a look at this. Im not a racist. I am the least racist person you have ever interviewed. That i can tell you. So people who arent racist dont typically have to respond to questions about whether theyre a racist, right . This is sort of like the person who just got their seventh dui telling you that theyre not an alcoholic. I mean, there comes a point when someone shows you who they are, believe them. If they show you 25 times and you still dont believe that theres a problem, then the problem is actually with you, not them. Yeah, most of the time people dont have to be constantly on the defensive claiming theyre not racist. Its the kind of person who says, im not a racist because i have black friends. I dated an asian woman once. I have a dream catcher in my rearview mirror. My great grandmother was a cherokee princess. At some point the denials become evidence of the thing. And i think thats what we need to be looking at. There is a pattern of behavior. There are people who are not racist at their core who occasionally do racist stuff, just like there are guys who do sexist things who are not misogynist at their core. But donald trump has gone well beyond, on the issue of misogyny and on the issue of racism and white supremacy, and he shows himself every few days. Tip nina telly, George Wallace stood on the steps of the capitol and said, segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever. He was asked similar questions like this on met the press, 1968, watch this. Are you seeking support of racists . Well, of course i dont know what your definition of a racist is. But im certainly not a racist. Well. That could have been during the campaign when he said, no david duke, its similar. Theres a coda to that story, which is what happens a decade later when he admits, George Wallace admits he was a racist. Acknowledges the bigotry that motivated him in the 60s. And seeks forgiveness. In fact, when he died in the late 90s, john lewis of all people explained in the New York Times why he forgave George Wallace, because he believed George Wallace sought redemption. So the wallace story is a fabulous example of someone, a racist, who said he wasnt a racist, who later acknowledged he was a racist and then sought forgiveness. Marc, i want to add well, go on. What do you think of this . Then ill ask you a question. Well, first, Donald Trumps a racist, let me just get that out there, i think we can all understand and agree with that. To tims point, at some point the evidence becomes overwhelming and the only question is why people wont accept it. From his housing practices as a land lord, to things he said on the campaign trail, to his references to haiti and africa. Donald trump is unequivocally, indisputably racist. The only question is why we need him to confirm it. I think one difference between him and George Wallace, among other things, donald trump as narcissist. There will never be a moment where hell ask for forgiveness or acknowledge he ever was wrong on anything, much less the race question. The taken isnt so much in whether or not hell respond, the danger is how this plays out in Public Policy, how this affects the vulnerable. George wallace, listen to Martin Luther king iii, he compared George Wallace to President Trump. Watch this. We got to find a way to work on this mans heart. You see, think about it. George wallace was a staunch racist. And we worked on his heart. And ultimately, George Wallace transformed. So dont tell me we cant transform. Weve done it too many times. Were not working hard enough. So you say no, marc. Marc just said no because hes a narcissist. So marc, i know what you think. Tim wise, what do you think . Go, marc, all right. Real quick. Its not just that. I dont care about donald trump i apologize, sir. Theres a time delay. I said, i dont care about Donald Trumps heart. Its not why is it black peoples work or anybodys work to convert donald trump to not being a racist . Its not our labor, thats a labor expenditure we dont need. We should be trying to get food, clothing, shelter. I dont care it was Donald Trumps heart, he dont mean that much to mery my concern is jus did it. How do we create Public Policy that isnt informed by Donald Trumps racism, or the racism of the senate or the many u. S. President s that have called places shholes and used the n word in private quarters. Im not asking i have to stop asking whether hes a racist. I had the conversation with the nephew because he said he used a strange term about right. Sort of made yeah. Racially ignorant. Made excuses for it. Go on, tim wise. Its not the job of black and brown folks for sure or anyone concerned about justice to save Donald Trumps soul or his heart. If he wants to start working on that, he could resign tomorrow and get to work on it. We can get him all the best therapy in the world. Hes a billionaire, im sure he can pay for it himself. If not, ill chip in. We have to get busy. We have to get busy about the nations business. This is not about saving one man, just like it wasnt about saving george wall has. I think the issue here, this is a guy who says hes smarter than the smarters cpa, he know