Transcripts For CNNW New Day With Alisyn Camerota And John B

Because youve been through this. During the clinton impeachment trial there was an agreement between Senate Majority and minority. Theres no agreement now. Thats one difference. Another difference is we dont have any idea what the process is or what the rules will be because Mitch Mcconnell hasnt told anyone yet. Why do you think that is . What does he gets out of that . The fact we dont know is a problem. The fact that the house managers dont know is a big problem. They had to start as early as wednesday to present their case. They dont know how much time they have and they dont know how to break that up. Its a combination of things, i think. Mcconnell is still trying to figure out in his caucus how far he can push this. He wants to shut this town as quickly as he can. The other is he wants to mess with the gears of the democratic machine trying to present this. He wants to make it as hard as possible for them to present their case, and he wants, i think, to make it as hard to watch as possible. Thats why you hear about 12hour days. No one can sit through a 12hour day, unless youre an absolutely committed partisan or journalist. Unless its your job. We will all be sitting through 12 hour days which will be more like 15. Buckle up. A lot of things well see and the fact we dont know anything yet, and for democrats it keeps coming back to witnesses. The question posed to republicans, should there be witnesses. General cakasich, the case democrats make is you cant have a fair trial if you dont hear from witnesses directly. Do you think this would be seen as fair if there are no witnesses. Right now were in a political world. Fair, not fair, is going to be depending what position you have or who you are. Ive always been a believer of having more information, not less. So the democrats are going to push and where are we . Going to need four republicans, call witnesses, that will be decided after the first presentations both by the democrats and then by the republicans. Them well see where the votes are. Its just going to be that simple. Are there four republicans this think its imperative you call those witnesses or are they just not going to say we should do it. Thats going to be up to the United States senate and members of the senate. They will have to be held responsible for what they do by the voters. But in terms of fair, unfair, you know, its sort of like watching a football game. If you get a good call you think the referees are great. Futures a bad call, you think they are not. Its not that complicated. What pressure do you think those four republican senators or people looking closely, Susan Collins, murkowski, mitt romney, cory gardner, what kind of pressure do you think they feel, governor . Well, i mean, first of all, the question is are they using their conscious. I happen to know a couple of them. I think they are going to use their conscious. Secondly, theres some on the razors edge and probably works to their benefit to say we should call witnesses but its highly partisan. If you come from a red state its easy to say were not calling witnesses. If you come from a state more balanced you feel pressure to figure how to maneuver unless you let your conscious be the override. Thats the way it ought to be in politics. Days twist and turns, days come and go, but end youve got to determine what you feel best about. Joe went through impeachment, i voted on impeachment. Its a matter of what does your conscious tell you. Theres political ramifications then youre playing a different game than i played. How much do you think and whats your sense of how much that game has changed . I think its changed radically. I think while then representative kasich and former governor at the time, we were on different sides. The whole process was taken more seriously. I dont think there was anyone who viewed it as purely political. There were democrats that took it seriously. You remember during the starr investigation, a lot of the pressure came from democrats in the house to get the president to deal with this. In the senate 1000 vote on the rules. Tom daschle. Now its very trumpian. Its absurd. Theres a circular thing. Has he bill barr saying the president cant be charged with something criminal but cant be removed by impeachment unless its criminal. It makes no sense. Even Alan Dershowitz and ken starr, you can go back in 199 and see clips in the open places. There was a seriousness back then that no longer exists, and i think it comes from the president. You just see that he doesnt he sees everything through a personal lens rather than the presidency and something. Lets go back. Lets go back. What i would add to this, however, and i hear what joe is saying, we not only have been drifting. But over the period of the last since i left the congress in 2000, we have been running into this unbelievable partisanship, and its been growing year after year after year with either leaders, on the republican side or democrats side, not really wanting to calm it down. It has the implications for affecting this, of course, but theres so many other issues that go unattended to. High priorities that we should be bipartisan on where democrats and republicans ought to say, yeah, this is really a clear and present issue, present danger, we need to get about it, and were nowhere now. Its reflected in impeachment but exists in so many other areas which has profound negative implications for the United States of america. Were starting to get a sense of how they will present a defense. Alan dershowitz claiming he does not represent the president but he is. He was out saying the president didnt commit a crime. Unless the president commits a crime, a statutory crime, he or she cannot be impeached. But you know who disagrees with that . Alan dershowitz. This was the harvard law professor during the clinton impeachment process. Listen. Certainly doesnt have to be a crime. If you have somebody who completely corrupts the office of president and who abuses trust and who poses great danger to liberty you dont need a technical crime. Suppose thats one of the risks of bringing Alan Dershowitz and ken starr, may get different views than they want to project now. It shows the lack of seriousness of their legal argument. You saw the sixpage memo, an attack on the process. Again, no defense of the president or his under lying fac facts. I think the president wants to make this about who is making the argument, not what the arguments are. A fox tv production rather than a serious legal idea. Mitch mcconnell is trying to weigh whether he can get away with it or not. Hed love to. I think as governor kasich points out, there are republicans, a few with a conscious and a few that will face the voters and they have to decide. We saw martha make her decision last week, which is an interesting way to make an announcement if youre against witnesses. Thats what it was, full on in with trump. Well see what cory gardner and Susan Collins that have a different set than Lamar Alexander who is retiring. Shes an independent. Republicans tried to keep her out of office. She won as a writein. Theres no allegiance to the party. Well see what they decide. Governor kasich, real quickly, the other push hass ben on timing. The president wants it wrapped up before the state of the union. Is trying to push it through you think what republicans want to be known for, just trying to shut this down period . I think optics matters. Theres an idea they ought to vote to dismiss off the bat and thats not flying. I think its a lot about optics. How does the public feel. For me id like to have as many facts as possible and get it over with and move on. Governor kasich, joe lockhart, thanks for being with us. Appreciate it. God bless the work of Martin Luther king and all those great and tremendous patriots who rode and drove civil rights from the bottom up so we could have a more fair and balanced society. Long way to go but made a lot of progress. A picture of the Martin Luther king memorial in our nations capital. Governor, thank you so much for remembering along with us. Joe, thank you as well. So we still dont know what the proposed rules will be for the trial of the president. We will speak to one of the senators who will be a judge and juror next. Does your broker offer more than just free trades . Fidelity has zero commissions for online u. S. Equity trades and etfs, plus zero minimums to open a brokerage account. With value like this, there are zero reasons to invest anywhere else. Fidelity. This rounds on me. Eat. S to invest anywhere else. Hey, can you spot me . Come on in. Find your place today, with silversneakers. Included in most Medicare Advantage plans. Enroll today by calling the number on your screen or visit getsilversneakers. Com we all use our phones very differently. We need a Great Network all the time. vo everyone in your family is different. These two are always gaming and this one is always on facetime. vo so verizon has plans to mix and match starting at 35. And up to 700 off the latest iphone. The network more people rely on, gives you more. I need all the breaks, that i can get. At liberty butchumal cut. Liberty biberty cut. Well dub it. Liberty mutual customizes your Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Quitting smoking is freaking hard. St, like quitting every monday hard. Quitting feels so big. So, try making it smaller. And youll be surprised at how easily starting small. Can lead to something big. Start stopping with nicorette country roads, take me home theres a booking for every resolution. Book yours at any price, at booking. Com before the u. S. Senate. It begins in earnest tomorrow. But as of now, we dont know how that trial will play out, what will the process be. We dont know because the Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell has yet to share with the senate or American People. Joining me now is one of the 100 u. S. Senators hole be in that room for the next one, two, maybe three weeks, who knows. Democratic senator Debbie Stabenow of michigan. First, john, its great to be with you this morning. If you step back a second, we have essentially the head of the jury saying hes working with the accused and his attorneys and do everything he can to block relevant witnesses that would get at the truth, emails, documents. Now he wont even tell us what the rules are. I think they have been scrambling for some time to try to figure out how to make this happen as quickly as possible and how to avoid having relevant witnesses. People in the room, people on the emails, sending the emails. The relevant documents, all the things the American People want. I know people in michigan, they just want us to step up and list listen, hear the truth and not be part of hiding the truth. Which are the witnesses you would like to hear from most. I think senator Chuck Schumer has laid out before most relevant witnesses, certainly john bolton, but we need to her from acting chief of staff, who was head of the office of management and budget mick mulvaney, his staff person. The others that were essentially either on the call or involved in what now is very clearly and illegal act, the independent arm of the federal government, called the Government Accounting Office has made it clear. They didnt say maybe they beroe the law, they broke the law. The folks that are involved in doing that, and we know from emails there are others in the office of management and bunl, others in department of defense, very concerned that, in fact, that was happening. Those are the people that we need to hear from. I notice you did not mention lev parnas, who we have now heard from in interviews and newspaper articles talk about his role in pressuring ukraine to investigate the bidens. Why didnt you include lev parnas in the list. This is certainly the list of four people we put forward. We certainly want to focus on those four. I would not be opposed at all to his coming in. I think he adds some context and color from what we know from the house. Hes clear from the house what were talking about here in terms of withholding the aid and basically leaving a young new leader of the country in a war with russia out there having our support for them in the past be so critical and holding that up for political purposes, basically, holding the money hostage unless they would do what he wanted. Do you have questions about his reliability . Its really not that. I would be happy to hear from him. So this is just more of a question of are we going to be able to move forward at all with the four basic witnesses that are relevant. One of the proposals we understand the majority leader might come forward with today or tomorrow when we finally hear what the rules are is have 24 hours for opening argument for each side but condense those 24 arguments into 12hour days, which would be a much shorter time period and much longer days than took place in the clinton impeachment trial. How do you feel about the possibility of having these 12hour marathon days . Well, john, for those of us who work 12 hour days, im certainly willing to do that, my colleagues are. This is really all of the process of trying to rush, rush things, hide things, you know, try to use maneuvers and rules rather than operating in a fair and open way. Thats what people want. Thats what people in michigan want. Whether they support impeachment, dont support impeachment, Everybody Knows when you have a trial you have witnesses. You bring in relevant documents. You show the emails. Where are the emails. The fact they are trying to rush it through in a way that would minimize it i think really does a disservice to the congress, and it does a disservice to the American People. We did hear from the minority leader Chuck Schumer, your democratic leader last night suggesting he might use some maneuvers. Thats a word you just used. Maneuvers early on in the process to get some votes. So what maneuvers from Chuck Schumer would you support . Well, i would say rather than calling it a maneuver, its really his right to offer an amendment. So the way the rules are established under the constitution, theres certain basic things. The leader of the Senate Offers a resolution. You would hope it would be bipartisan to move forward on what the rules for the whole process are and the trial, but thats in the fog to happen here. So instead of that, the leader of the minority, senator Chuck Schumer, has the right to offer an amendment. What he will do is offer an amendment or amendments that ask that we have relevant witnesses and documents. What do you anticipate it will feel like being in the sna Senate Chamber with no phone, not being able to talk, only being able to send notes up. Whats that going to be like . First i have to tell you, i admit im addicted to my phone and ipad and just spending an hour or so last week at a time, i was constantly looking down to look at my phone. So i think this will actually be healthy for all of us but be a challenge. Most importantly, from the moment the house managers brought the impeachment articles over, i dont think ill forget the clerk of the house coming in and reading the fact not the documents but the impeachment articles, impeachment of donald john trump, president of the United States. When they got to that part, president of the United States, i just felt just a wave do across almost every democrat, by the way, was sitting there as they were bringing them in. I only saw one republican colleague sitting on the other side in addition to senator mcconnell when they brought the articles to the senate. But we were there, and you could just feel a wave of somberness. This is a very sober moment. Its a part of the constitution. Its what makes us separate from russia and other dictators around the world, people around the world, governments around the world are looking to us to see whether or not we really believe in our constitution, whether we believe in checks and balances, whether we have the courage regardless of the outcome to stand up for what we believe is right and true and that sense of responsibility really came over me. Senator Debbie Stabenow from michigan, thanks for being with us this morning. Youre welcome. The New York Times Editorial Board endorsing two candidates for the democratic primary so why not just pick one . Well ask next. We made usaa insurance for members like martin. An air force veteran made of doing whats right, not whats easy. So when a hailstorm hit, usaa reached out before he could even inspect the damage. Thats how you do it right. Usaa insurance is made just the way martins family needs it with hasslefree claims, he got paid before his neighbor even got started. Because doing right by our members, thats whats right. Usaa. What youre made of, were made for. Usaa oh no, here comes gthe neighbor probably to brag about how amazing his Xfinity Customer Service is. Im mike, im so busy. Good thing xfinity has twohour appointment windows. They have night and weekend appointments too. Hes here. Bill . Karolyn . Nope no, just a couple of rocks. Download the my account app to manage your appointments making todays Xfinity Customer Service simple, easy, awesome. Ill pass. With just two weeks to go to the Iowa Caucuses New York Times Editorial Board restreelg i revealing its endorsement for the primary. In this moment radicals werent serious, for this reason we are breaking with convention and putting our support behind not one but two candidates, Elizabeth Warren and amy klobuchar, each of whom articulates a different path forward. Joining me deputy