During the mueller probe. Well take you behind the saens scenes of cnn stake outs. Where do we begin . With the number one book in america. The Mueller Report. It reveals a house of lies. A wlohite house of lies. Lies like nothing this nation has seen before. I take no joy in saying this but deceit is the story of the trump age. Its the story. Past administrations have bent the truth but Trumps White House breaks the truth in half and then lies about breaking it. Its broken us in half or maybe into thirds. Some americans are sick of the deceptio deceptions. Others have become immune to it and others have accepted it. If you backed trump you made peace with the lying or you convinced yourself that people like me are lying about him. You convinced yourself that the media is the real enemy. Thats one of the reasons why this report is so important. Its a detailed description of who, what, when, where and how. The lies are listed in clinical detail. Will it change minds . Maybe not. Its important nonetheless. Its important to have the historical record. It reaffirms so much of the reporting from the past two to three years. Reporting about trump and russia. About all those ties. Footnotes. Mueller mentions cnn, the new york time, the washington post, more than 200 times. Thats a whole lot of real news. Trumps fans have been conditioned not to trust well, anyone but President Trump and the outlets he approves. Well get into that later. My two cents is Pay Attention to the big lies. I know some folks are exhausted by the daily deceptions, the small lies from trump world. Trump and his allies are telling big lies. The most popular one is no obstruction. No obstruction at all. The attempts to obstruct are screaming all the page. I guess my point is, theres no conspiracy found in the Mueller Report. Theres no integrity either. Whats the role of the press in this broken environment . In part, our role is to keep collecting facts. All the facts so citizens can make up their own minds. I think its also our role to stand up for decency and morality especially if others wont. Jou journalists work with a code of ethics. We try to enforce standards. When we fall down, we try to learn from those mistakes. Just listen to what one of the president s lawyers Rudy Giuliani said to chris cuomo the other day about morality. Here is what rudy said. If were going to start making moral judgments about everybody in public office, well have nobody in public office. We can do better than that. Jou journalists can help lead the way by talking about morality and ethics. If t if the people in charge arent. Here to break it down, katy roge rogers, vox cofounder. Tim, let me start with you. Its easter morning. I think sometimes the media has a hard time talking about morality. Talking about ethics. Its not in our language the way that law, basic things like law are. How do we make morality more of the conversation now that we have seen this 448 page report with so much immoral behavior . I think you start by saying were awe all flawed. Then you ask what kind of character, what kooinind of stad of character do you want in someone who represents the flag and the country. As someone who ran a president ial library, what struck me most painfully in volume two in the obstruction of justice volume was the number of times President Trump either himself or instructed others to create false records. False Historical Records that would mean in the future people wanting to understand our government would not be able to. To my view, thats one of the most egregious and dishonorable things to try to create a false record. Theres four instances where they were able to determine the president ordered someone to do it or did it himself. To my mind that makes the president unfit because if hes not willing to let us understand how he uses the power that we granted him, then why is he our representative. I think this thing is just starting to sink in, 72 hours lat later. Theres a reason why its number two and number two and number three on amazon. The details werent the first surface headline. You have to really digest it to understand. Katy rogers, with that in mind, i was arguing earlier that lying is the through line of the Trump Presidency and the Mueller Report has new examples of this. Do you think journalists there at the New York Times and elsewhere have figured out how to cover the deceptions and dishonesty . I think that journalists have been covering the deceptions and dishonesty since the beginning of the Trump Presidency. I think the report confirms a lot of that reporting either through witness, through government officials and theres like kind of an exhaustive paper trail there. I think that the opportunities Going Forward is to stress the nuances of this report in terms of the 140 or some communications the Trump Campaign had with russian officials or wikileaks. Thats not a legal term but thats certainly excitement as detailed in the report. Excitement, enthusiasm, a willingness to accept information from what is an adversarial government to the United States. Youre right, as the pendulum swings back to these more detail summaries, the public will have more opportunity to see what 140 odd commune kaications added up. Lets look at the last two years of reporting. The press has been leading the way. The Mueller Report confirmed a lot of whats been reported. This headline says journalists were right. At the same time there was way too much speculation in attempts to equity dconnect dots that di connect. There was stellar reporting and too much speculation. They said Michael Cohen wasnt to prague which wasnt proven to be true. Buzzfeed saying trump told cohen to lie was not confirmed. Muellers report says while there was evidence the president knew cohen provided false testimony, the evidence does not establish the president aided or directed cohens false testimony. Different law officials came up with different interpretations. All this is a long way of saying was the media vindicated by Mueller Report with some exceptions . The immediamedias recording vindicated. I think theres two questions one is what is easier and what is harder. The l there are two things the Mueller Report asks of us. How do we think about reporting on the Trump AdministrationGoing Forward . The Mueller Report is thick with examples purposefully, repeatedly lying to reporters. Going to them and listening to Sarah Huckabee sanders or adding their folks in for comment when you know they may straightforwardly be lying to you is tough. Its a challenge to our deepest protocols. The other thing is something we have not quite reckonned with. The first half is about whether trump coordinated with russia. Theres not evidence of that directly. It should raise the question for us. We knew the emails were hacked. What happened here, is there was a crime committed to steal information from the Democratic National committee and launder it through the press. We cooperated with that knowing what it was. I dont think the media is doing all that much selfreflection about the role that we played in making russias operation successful. Were looking out ward quite a bit but not inward nearly enough. Im talking about the Trump Administration being unethical. Theres questions to the press to think about what youre saying. The reporting involving hacked, stolen documents. What do you think should happen next time . Lets play there out is out in. Whats the right answer . I dont think i have the right answer. You know you dont always get good information from sources that are pure in intention. The thing that scares me most about this report beyond donald trump, not just that we have a lawless and dishonest administration now but youre seeing a play book. Youre seeing a play book other countries will look at. Russia has been rewarded for. It was very successful for them. The pay off of turning american governance in your direction is very big. Its worth doing it to make that happen. The press is an actor in that, we need to think about what that means. We need to think about what our role in that is. One that we know with the relatively high degree of confidences that what were getting is part of a crime. On the other hand, what way is that different from opposition research. Its not easy. This wont be the last time. We know it wont be. We know people are working to do this kind of thing right now. We need to think about what our ruberic is. Its about ethics, right practices. April, lets finish this first segment with you. How do you think journalists should be standing up for morality and decency when covering a white house that breaks all the norms . We have to cover the story. We have to see the fact for where it is and call the lie for where it is as well. In this white house, we hear what the spokesperson or the principal has to say and we go and get all sides of the story and dig for the truth. The credibility is lacking in this white house as we have seen from the Mueller Report and over the past two years and go into the campaign. If behooves us as reporters and journalists not to take a slant and just accept what is said at this point. We have to dig deeper and look for the fact. Its about all sides of the story. Its not just about he said, she said. We have a lot more to get into with the panel. Well get a quick break and get everybody back in a moment. I want to share a few questions i have heading into the new workweek. Number one, when will we hear more from Robert Mueller . Either in testimony or elsewhere. Number two, will the redacted portions of his report come out . Number three, will more democrats move to start an impeachment process and whats going to come of right wings media demand to invest ga gatti investigators. Mueller referred 14 investigations to other offices. 12 of those were totally redacted. What are those . When will we find out . Number six, will polls show any minds were changed by what we learned in this report . Were just getting start. The next question is why does Sarah Sanders still have a job . Is it time for her to just walk away . Much more in a moment. Safe drivers have to pay as much for insurance. As not safe drivers ah that was a stunt driver. Thats why esurance has this drivesense® app. The safer you drive, the more you save. Dont worry, im not using my phone and talking to a camera while driving. Im being towed. By the way, im actually a safe driver. 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He literally looked into the phone and started dancing well, he was already dancing locked eyes and continued dancing. Every now and then, im like, wait, did that happen . gasps ive got photos of it, it must have. vo get more music on us with verizon up, the rewards program that gets you vip tickets. Plus, get a free galaxy s10e when you buy one, and 400 when you switch. Only on verizon. My name is bailey and one day cj had to move away. Let us know where you wind up. Bailey, bailey when you come back the next time take care of cj. And then i was back. And i had a promise to keep. [ bark ] with each new life i would protect cj. [ bark ] where did you come from . Loving people is my purpose but bringing them together thats my journey. This holy week has been scarred by violence with multiple churches attacked during Easter Services in sri lanka. Several hotels were bombed. At least 207 people were killed. Troupely a sickening day in sri lanka. Cnn has crews on the way to location. Well have continuing coverage. That brings me to this next tweet of the president of the yie United States. The president learned about the bombings and tweeted 138 Million People have been killed. He left the tweet up for more than 20 minutes. It was a really embarrassing error. I guess nobody around him caught it or fixed it for more than 20 minutes. Its a typo, whats the big deal . Accuracy matters. It matters when youre sending condolences to a grieving nation. It matters for a government just like it matter for a news room. If someone cant get the little stuff right, it makes you wonder about the big stuff. It makes you worry about the big stuff. It makes you wonder about the president s sources of information. His corrected tweet said that more than 600 people were injured. At the time no major news outlet was reporting the number 600. I dont think anybody is reporting that number now. What was his source . This is one of hundreds of examples of the president s sloppiness or his misinformation. I bring it up in the context of whats going on because in the wake of the Mueller Report, the lies from the white house have been making headlines. Its no wonder why trumps aides dont think twice about making stuff up. Its because tone starts at the top. Witness Sarah Sanders who admitted that her may 2017 claims about countless fbi agents wanting James Comey Fired was not founded on anything. It was a slip of the tongue, she said, but it wasnt. She made similar claims multiple times or two different days. She has no credibility left. Yet in trump world, that reality might help her because when we point out that shes making stuff up, it makes the president hold onto her, support her, stand by her because shes taking it to the media. Thats how twisted the eed this become. April, lets start with you because you have called for sanders to be fired. Whats the likelihood, you think, that she actually is going to be out as a result of these lies . Well, you know, i dont know. I say the reality is, its about credibility. We are seeing this nation talk about the credibility of Sarah Huckabee sanders at the poeds y podium. In the clamoring continues, something will happen. I hear the white house is upset about this moment, these conversations about Sarah Huckabee sanders and her tenure at the podium. Here is the issue. Under oath, she acknowledged she lied. Under oath. Thats not the only lie that has been told from that sacred room to the American Public and the world. The reason why this is so important is because everything is in the balance at the white house. We are all touched by what happens and said said from the white house. War and peace, life and death are written and spoken from that podium or from the oval office. Shes the president s mouthpiece. Her credibility is shot. We got that one piece from mueller. We understand that. Also, theres a list of things and more. Ill detail another one about the payment to stormy daniels. That was a lie. Also that propaganda video against our colleague jim acosta. A propaganda video against jim acosta. This is the United States not russia or china. Credibility is a huge piece of the puzzle. Her credibility is shot. You said that Sarah Sanders head should be lopped off. Her father said you were inciting murder. Were you trying to incite murder . Do you have the whole transcript of what i said . I do. You were saying she should be fired. She should be forced out of the job and head lopped off in the rhetorical sense that everybody understands. I said it as they. Not me. About the firing acts. We talk about people being fired. Heads will roll. I do not push for orsupport any type of violence against anyone. I said what i said. It was not about violence. It was about the chopping ax or the head rolling as far as the job. Lets clean it up and say, she should be fired. Period. End of story. Katy rogers, Sarah Sanders job has changed over the past couple of years. She used to be holding briefings almost every day. Right now its been 41 days since a White House Press briefing on kara camera. If she hits 42 days, that will be a record. What does she do now . What is her job every day now . Well, sarah is well liked among the staff in the white house because she takes a lot of incoming. She is trusted by the president. She has a Good Relationship with him. In a white house that is run like the trump organization, her loyalty and her connection with him counts for a lot. She does answer questions from the press and given this latest story about her credibility called into question, i dont know how often but she does do her job. She has a place, but she doesnt do briefings. Those have kind of gone by the way side. That is because officials in the white house know that a lot of the things they might say to the public will be immediately undermined by the president or changed course by the president. Thats not actually unique to this white house. Were not going to invade grenada and the invasion occurred the next day. Jay carney took flak for what he said that was misleading about the Affordable Care act. Its not uncommon but this i