And when you were sick you went down. Thats what every industrialized country in the world has done except the United States. We decided we would try this individual mandate business. And well see how it works. I think well ultimately come to a single payer system. But thats myelief about the ultimate course of this. Because i dont think when you stop when you start fighting erybody being in, you are simply saying, you want some people to get it for free. And thats not fair. You call this the fairness act. Well, it is not fair for people to get it free if they have the ability to pay. And if you have the ability to pay, you should be paying. And thats i think thats the only way its going to work. Mr. Young, hes arguing that republicans designed this plan. Now hes saying, well, this plan doesnt have everybody in but isnt it true they have penalties for those that choose not to get in . Thats right. The plan was designed for everybody not to be in, which he claims is the frailty othe syem. Thats right. Thats what our Supreme Court has characterized as as a tax. All were doing in this bill, its a matter of fairness. And youll hear that throughout my testimony here. The president has proposed offering some relief to businesses, Large Businesses with respect to the employer mandate. And we just think that the same sort of tax relief, especially during these down times and great uncertainty about implementation of this law, the same sort of relief ought to be offered to individual working americans. And so despite all the otr issues that my good colleague whos thoughtfully presented and quite passionately, wont surprise folks that we dont agree on every one of tho points. But netheless, my testimony here is going to be focused fairly narrowly on these two pieces of legislation, not the Broader Health care debate, but instead the equity, the fairness of allowing this delay which incidentally i think is appropriate for employers at this point but allowing it for employers but not allowing it for rank and File Americans. And im open to and i suspect ill hear some counter points with respect to that in the course of this hearing. And thatshy we do these things publicly. So i think that will be healthy. Mr. Mcdermott, why did the president announce that they were backing off this implementation . I think it was his judgment after listening to business complain i mean, once again funny to me is the Republican Party is against the president asking or responding to business. Business complained about having to report. The president listened to them said, all right, ill give you a year. But youre going to have to start doing it next year. I dont know why. I was not privy to those conversations. I didnt listen to them. I think that there is obviously starting any social program as big as this, thats to affect 30 million people, is not going to be without its glitches. There will be glitches, i dont care what we do. When the republicans started the drug benefit, part d of medicare, there were glitches all over the place about people getting in and did they know how to choose which program and everything else. But we got it up and running and its running now. And its working just fie. And thats the way this bill will be. Its going to go into effect. I think the thing that i understand why the republicans are troubled. They know that this is going to start on january 1 no matter what we do on the floor of the house. The individual mandate will be in because the president isnt going to repeal it. The insurance reform, guaranteed issue, is already in children are covered to the age of 26 on their parents. Weve already got Insurance Companies giving rebates to people because they are not spending all the money they take in on health care. Theyre doing it for theyre making more profit. We are all kinds of ways in which this bill is already in effect. And there really is no way for the republicans to stop it at this point. I understand the frustration on your side. But i think that this is a very poorly chosen one. Because it goes at the heart of whether you really want anything to work. Because if you take away the individual mandate, youre really saying you dont want anything to work. You know whats interesting is, i think that the American People recognize it isnt going to work. And i think business had a loud voice. It sounds like to me that the American People that, this president has not been listening to them. And its not surprising when you do the things where you quit listening to the American People, its amazing the things that gentleman mr. Young . All right. Just briefly, mr. Chairman, to build on a remark you just made, i think its good that the president listened to business in this case. And so i do want to commend him for that. I think procedurally there was flaw in the fact that heidnt work with congress. And thats why were sanctioning that act in the employer mandate delay bill here. But with respect to listening to the American People, rank and File Americans that are hurting during these difficult times, a recent poll suggests that 12 of americans support obama cares e individual mandate. So i wish the president , i wish this entire body and folks on both sides of the aisle im hopeful this has a bipartisan vote but i wish we would listen to that that are not happy with the individual mandate. Ms. Fox . Thank you, mr. Chairman. Theres a lot that needs to be said about the comments that have beemade here today. But theres so little time. You know, ive looked at this statement of administration policy. And i find it petty remarkable that the president himself wants to delay the mandate for businesses and then says that hr 2667 is unnecessary, that hr 2668 would raise Health Insurance priums and increase the number of uninsured americans. My understanding before obama care was passed and we had pretty good data on this, that there were approximately 10 million americans whoanted insurance but could not afford insurance. I know the numbers that were bandyed about were higher than that. But when you broke them down on the number of peoplewho are eligible for medicaid, eligible for insurance through their employers, the number of people who were illegal aliens who were not americans, when you took those out ofhe mix you really came down to about 10 million americans. When mr. Mcdermott talked about how many people are still uninsured, would be uninsured under obama care, i remembered i had read that cbo said that under obama care 30 million nonelderly americans will remain without Health Insurance in 2022. Its an article in cns news. And mr. Chairman, id like to put this into the record if i could. Without exception. So before obama care, there were approximately 10 million americans who wanted insurance but couldnt afford to get it. Under obama care, that number goes up to 30 million americans. And theres another article in the washington post, june 7, 2013, it says analysis by the Journal Health affairs. And one of the coauthors, stephy woolhandler said even if the law were fully implemented there woulhave been 26 million uninsured people under obama care. So i find some of the statements that our colleague from the state of washington is making pretty remarkable in terms of saying how many people are going to be covered, how many people e going to be not covered. I also wonder, mr. Mcdermott, if you just consider the whole congress irrelevant. Because thats what youre saying. Yo know, the president cant pick and choose which laws he wants to implement and which ones he doesnt. He has been doing that. And weve been dealing with that on a casecase basis. But for you to say that 2667 is irrelevant tells me you think youre irrelevant and that the congress is irrelevant. Im not sure why youre still here if you think the congress is irrelevant. I dont think the congress is irrelevant. I think article 1, section 1n the constitution means something. I believe the founders intended for the congress to be the most powerful branch of government. And i think that most people think that. Anyou say everybody whos looked at 2667 says it doesnt matter . Well, im here to tell you not everybody thinks that. And i think youll see with the vote that we have on the floor that not everybody thinks that it doesnt matter. You talked about the employer mandate wasnt really essential in obama care . That it would leave only 5 of the people were not covered . Well, youve made my point about the fact that very few people who really want insurance in this country are not being covered by insurance. So you made that point for us. Youve also said the whole thing rests on everyone being in the system. And thats the kind of mandate thats not appropriate in this country in my opinion. And you also talk about Fire Insurance. And i find that analogy one of the most curious analogies that could be made to obama care. Because ive often used the analogy of Car Insurance and Fire Insurance. Why we dont need the federal government involved in health care. Because Fire Insurance, Homeowners Insurance, thats handled at the state level. Not a the federal level. And i point out to people, if you look at the rates for Homeowners Insurance and Car Insurance, Car Insurance handled also at the state level, is it those rates havent been going up 12 , 14 , over the last several years. In fact, in many cases those rates have gone down. So to make an anagy that we have to have mandated health care at the federal level because theres mandated Fire Insurance . I assume you mean Homeowners Insurance. Theres just no comparison there. Those things are handled at the state level. Where they should be handled. And your last one of your last comments about the fact that theres a black hole somewhere between here and the senate . That is just too deliciousot to comment on. Because there is a black hole. And the black hole is the democratcontrolled senate. Because we pass great bills over here, and they do go into a black hole. And that black hole again is the democratcontrolled senate. So i think youve made our case here today for why we shouldnt have obama care to begin with. Because it isnt an appropriate thing to be done at the federal level when you talk about Homeowners Insurance and you talk about Car Insurance programs that are very good programs that protect a lot of people. But theyre handled at the state level. And their rates have not gone up significantly. And theyre very wellrun there at the state level. So i would say again that the comments that youve made go against all the things that you and your colleagues have stood for on obama care and the mandate that we do these things at the federal level. And again, i would say if you think youre irrelevant, you might want to think about why youre here and why you are engaged in our activities here in the congress. I dont think were irrelevant. I think again the founders intended us to do our work. And i think its totally inappropriate that the president thinks that he can be congress and president. Because hes overstepped his bounds, i think, in this area. Now, we may by passing this delay in the mandate help out our constitutional problem here. But its not because we want to help the president. Its because we in the congress should be doing the right thing. That, mr. Chairman, i yield back. Thank you very much, gentlemenwoman from new yorks recognized. It may be relevant here or not to point out that the reason we did health care is that health care was almost 20 of gdp and rising. And we simply could not afford it anymore. And what this plan has done and everybody kept saying nobody knows whats anytime. The democrat caucuses read it three times line by line. We know it is going to save money. The hospitals are already changing in many cases th way they provide care. They are all for it. They are all getting ready. Many people with preexisting conditions, and i know ive mentioned before the woman that i met in the campaign who had had cerebral palsy, born with it, and had never in her life, as a mother and a housewife and doing the driving and the cooking and all the things, around sharp objects and everything she did had never been insurable because of her preexisting condition. And until she got to be 65, she had never known what it was like to have any Health Insurance. And i think thats very important. People who ran into a lifetime cap because serus head injury could let you do that very quickly, and people who ran into the yearly cap, and one of the most important things ive done, as was alluded to, is 85 of the premium dollar now has to be used for insurance. And, frankly, while ive not been terribly offended because i want people covered, but you pointed out that each of us pays 1,000 a year more in uncompensated care. That would all begone. So i what in the world is so frightening about this bill . I dont know. But my state, im happy to say, is movg along, getting ready. Weve got Insurance Companies and doctors and everybody out doing hearings all over the place and explaininging it to everybody. Its going to work in new york like it works in massachusetts, and it has weve had a good experience in massachusetts. How well its worked. But for some reason theres sort of a 19th century mind here. I seriously think that, you know, we have trouble with science and other things, that were moving backwards. But the idea, i honestly think i could say this ive held, done most of the rules on the 37 votes so far. I could just put one of those statements on repeat, press the button, and leave the room. You know, were here, and our job is to be here and to do this, anthis will be the 38th and the 39th time. And we will do the best that we can to try to explain it, but for goodness sakes, there must be Something Else this country cries out to see done and taken care of that the house of representatives can get around to. Thank you. Gentlewoman yields back her time gentleman from utah is recognized. Gentleman has no questions. Gentleman from florida is recognized. Mr. Chairman, i agree with what was said. I done think anything any of us says is going to move the needle in either of our favors. I do find a few statements that dr. Foxx made to be rather astonishing, and i suggest to you, dr. Foxx, i do not know about North Carolina, i really do not, but there are four of us that serve on the rules committee from florida, and on the subject of Homeowners Insurance, and i might add and Car Insurance, ive owned a home off and on, maybe rented for a while, and then i owned a home and a double wide trailer, then a home, and i had to have insurance in each instance. And i dont know of a single year over 50 years that ive lived in ft. Laud eerdale that insurance has not gone up. I do agree with you that it is has not gone up 12 or 14 in some instances, but if we were to take Car Insurance, most of the people and mr. Webster would be better to this than i since he served in the Florida Legislature and i did not. But a whole lot of Insurance Companies after Health Insurance andrew just plain old skedaddled and werent around anyre. Then we created something called citizens. That taxpayers are paying for, and theres a substantial deficit and even citizens has had to have substantial increases in order to meet that test. Automobile insurance, the same thing. People that operate businesses operate for the purposes of having a profit. And toward that end, they look wherever they can to get that profit. And a lot of times it is that they dont want to run the added risk. Senator graham and i long before former congressman klein and others came to congress, fought the battle of wd insurance. I dont understand what part all of these people in this congress do not understand that disasters are going to occur everywhere in america and around the world and that we need a specific committee in this congress that deals with it so that we dont have to wait for long periods of time to address floods or famine or any of the issues, earthquakes or fires, that we are confronted with on a regular basis. I do have, mr. Young, not knowing you, and hoping that i do get to know you over the course of time, i done know what you did before you came to congress. And would you be kind enough just to i would, indeed. I was a Management Consultant for a couple of years for an indianabased company. I would go in and redesign business processes and try and i worked in particular with state and local governments so that we could provide more value to constituents at lower costs. Something i think we ought to be focusing on here at the federal level and youd agree. I was a small town attorney for a number of years. A part time, very part time deputy prosecutor in a rural community. And i was an officer in the United States marine corps. So i have a variety of different experiences, and ive studied a bit of mieconomics in my time, too. All of those experiences inform this legislation. And you had Health Insurance all those times that you were in business and certainly when you were in the military . You were covered by the programs in the military, but just as a young attorney, and the other things that you did, youhad Health Insurance. My recollection is is that for the vast majority, at least, i had did you have any the vast majority of the time. Did you have any time unless your Insurance Company provided an exception or a high deductible, did you have any time that your insurance went down .