The book is called Marijuana Legalization what Everyone Needs to know. Publish bid Oxford University press. One of the coauthors, editors, is Angela Hawken, a Public Policy professor at Pepperdine University, where we are on location. Angela hawken, is this book pro or antilegalization of marijuana . Neither. That is what makes isnone of us agree with each other on Marijuana Legalization and thats the genius of Oxford University press, bringing together different opinions and figuring out the evidence. The issues around marijuana there are such strong advocates that the public have no idea which direction theyre being pulled in. The idea to get people who disagree on the legalization to agree on the facts surrounding marijuana. Where do you stand personally . I was hoping you wouldnt ask that, but now that you did in chapter 16 of the book each author was required to publicly declare their position on the subject, and for many of us who academies threat a very uncomfortable thing to do because you dont want to show your hand inch research we provide an unbiased as were able to and in this case we were asked to show our hand. Of the four authors i was the one most in favor of Marijuana Legalization, commercial legalization, which i think was surprising for many because of my pepperdine affiliation. Host why are you in favor . Guest well, as i said as i acknowledge in the chapter, my drug of choice, im a cradle ang beelike can, my first drink of whine when i was 13 during communion and aim a regular consumer and safe consumer of wine so my drug of choice is alcohol. For others their drug of choice is marijuana and potential social harms, the social harms s of alcohol by far dominate the social harms of marijuana. The policy want to see the laws handle substances more equitably. Didnt seem to there was a strong case to be aggressively antimarijuana use in the face of very relaxed or surrounding alcohol, given the risks of alcohol use and the harm associated so much greater for alcohol than marijuana. The question they didnt ask in the, which cnn did to my colleagues, is, well, have you used . Are you a user . Youre the pro legalizing one. Youre clearly the marijuana user. My team had been working with the state of washington as theyve been drafting the states regulations, and we get asked at the question a. , are you a use center who is advising the government . And for a while the position taken by the team was simply not to answer the question. Theres no good way if youre a researcher to answer the question, have you used pot or are you a pot user . Im willing to tell you light right now today that in spite of the fact im one of the four are authorizes most in favor of Marijuana Legalization im not a year. I do come to this without a horse in the race, and just somebody who is looking at the data and quite concerned about what ive seen. Host with the accept ablity of marijuana use in the United States and maybe even just near california. Guest i think this is why we have seen such strong momentum surrounding marijuana and how political rhetoric surrounding marijuana is changing. The latest pew result i saw theyve changed. Pew reported findings from summer of 2013, looking at where the public is on the issue, and at the moment, at that time it it has changed by now but 58 of americans were in favor of legalizing marijuana. When you have a majority of the public supporting Something Like that, politicians have to pay attention. Politicians tend to be rather fickle. The language surrounding marijuana use is changing. And california did not pass Marijuana Legalization when voters went to the polls in 2002, 2012 2010. Wait not passed. By a very narrow margin it lost. The two states who passed it we planned the release date around the time and we were surprised. My coauthors thought that werent sure i predicted they would have at least one, possibly two states tip, and we did. Washington and colorado move in the direction of legalization. Host when is it on the ballot again in california . Guest i believe that the real big player is looking to california in 2016, and in fact for a few years now its been the chatter that the big push for marijuana in california would be 2016 and that would be an important Election Year imim surprised if other states dont move in the meantime, dont move in 2014, so that california will be a lagarde state in that regard. Host who smokes marijuana in the United States. Guest a stunning amount of people smoke marijuana. Globally the prevalence of marijuana use is three to four percent host three to four percent globally. Guest globally. Americans have a much more aggressive taste for marijuana than that. Were running at three times the global number. Host 10 percent. Guest in the last year, 15 million americans smoked marijuana. Most of them, about a third of those, would have been people who were called the experimenters, somebody who will really think of it as being something radical, they have a drag, they smoke also built of pot, and wouldnt smoke again in a year. So a third of that is people who realyear the unusual experimenters, not a way of life for them. Then we have a relatively sizable share of the population who are social smokers. They smoke once in a while because they are with a group of peers who are smoking. Its really not a way of life. Then another group of people 20, of marijuana users, for whom this is really a way of life. They smoke every day or every couple of days, and some of them of course will good on to have issue with abuse and dependency. Marijuana is different from the other Illegal Drugs in terms of abuse and dependency. I if you look at people who are regular consumerrers of marijuana, use every two days or daily, about a third of marijuana users who use that much meet clinical criteria for abuse or debeen dense si. Cocaine, 88 meet the criteria for abuse or dependency so the typical heavy user of cocaine is dean dent on cocaine, the typical user of marijuana is not dependent on marijuana. That differentiates marijuana. Host how does that compare to alcohol abuse . Or use . Some ways alcohol and marijuana in terms of use are relatively similar. It would be a similar many people use alcohol every day or every few days, every couple of day is have a glass of wine. I dont make any criteria for dependency. So theyre similar for marijuana and alcohol in terms of how many people will have problem use. Thats not to say that it problem heroin use is a trivial use. Some people meet clinical criteria. Theyre unsuspecttive, not able to get things done, selfdisclose of having tried to bit and not managed to quit. The people who do meet the clinical they host Angela Hawken, with the medical marijuana laws, is that a way around legalization and punishment . Guest it is very much depending on the state youre in. In california, its essentially if you went to venice beach is nor toous you could look at a long list of ail. S theyll tell you what to complain about and youll leave with a recommendation in a few minutes. So, since we have become a very easy environment in which to obtain essentially legal access to marijuana, but the legalization of marijuana into commercial legalization is very different from medical marijuana in that it allows commercial production and sale of marijuana for nonmedical use, for recreational use. In the book im very i describe medical marijuana in some detail mitchell concern for medical marijuana according to the california model, theyre put with these doctors have really made a farce of there are some people who have serious medical issues that are turning to marijuana for relief. They turn out to be a tiny, tiny percentage of the total number of medical marijuana users. About five percent have what would be considered a diagnosis and a recent for carrying the medical marijuana card. One in 20. The majority of people using marijuana, Everybody Knows with a wink and a wink. Im in favor of legalization, so i have no reason to be really unhappy about that except i dont like that somebody who is willing to lie to a doctor, and obtain a card, has no problem enter acting with the law, and someone who doesnt want to make the false statements does. I create as really uncomfortable system. I have some real concerns how medical marijuana has played out in some states. Obviously other states have a tighter operation than california. Host what kind of tax revenues has california garnered from medical marijuana and what are the early results from colorado . Guest colorado has been its been fascinating to watch. We have seen taxation results released in the last few months. Advocacy groups from the beginning were touting massive tax benefits and many states, when the states were so pressed, budgets tight, looking for an additional source of revenue was appealings. Some of the states with Marijuana Legalization, revenue can be diverted to k through 12 education sounded appealing. The initial estimates for colorado, most of us thought were too high. That the tax revenues would not be nearly as high as the advocacy groups implied. Then the results came out and they came out in colorado and the tax revenues were much higher than any of us predicted. So, it was like, is my team that wrong . And if you look closely, what happened in colorado, in the early when the process was made legal, there was a quite this supply and demand will tell you if you have reduced supply people came to colorado to use because it was the first movement, some excitement around it so a lot of people came into colorado to use and there was limited supply some the prices skyrocketed. An artificial blip surrounding a change in law. That will be suppressed. Colorado issued statements the projections for tax revenue in produced, running a business there are natural costs involved in any Business Operation that will keep the Prices Higher than we might have suggested in our book. One number we host is there an association with crime in marijuana . Guest oh, its so interesting. The association between drug use and crime is muddled. No one can show a true causal relationship between drug use and crime. Its a pinch of correlation. There are many reasons why people might be involved in crime and drug use at the same time. Some people commit crimes to finance their drug use. Marijuana isnt especially expensive to economic motivation for committing a crime for marijuana use isnt especially compelling argument. Some people might commit crime because of the physiological response to the drug. Makes them more aggressive or more likely to commit a crime. The evidence on that isnt very good and the drug that comes closest to that is methamphetamine, and even with methamphetamine, the physiological relationship is flat. The best way to test is in the Laboratory Experiments with mose. They load up the mice with methamphetamine and you have to give mice near lethal doses to turn them into mean ms. , and they essentially dont behave all that differently. With marijuana use there is very little address, and much like heroin use, the guy in the corner going sleep. So the causal connection between drug use and crime are little complicated and often where the criminal element does come in surrounds the trade related to the drug rather than the drug use itself. Now, of course, drinking and driving, or driving under the influence, is a crime, and will Marijuana Legalization plead to an increase in drug driving in a very important question. Someone like myself, who said i might be willing to see the test for marijuana play out, legalization play out, would very quickly change my mind if i see results fro washington and colorado and they show an increase in drunk driving or, more importantly, if the results show that marijuana and alcohol are used together. If an increase in marijuana use is accompanied by an increase in alcohol use i will fundamentally change my mind on Marijuana Legalization. Thats a result we still have to learn and well learn in the next few years. Many who are academics studying the marijuana issue want to see that result. The other issue is very controversial, for men decades, the relation happy to between marijuana use and other Illegal Drugs this. Fact that more people will be consuming marijuana, going to lead to more higher rates of use of other Illegal Drugs . That could be a concern. Or is the on possible. That an increased use inform marijuana, because its legal, might suppress the use of other Illegal Drugs. This is all searchable questions well know the answer to in a few years so theyre saying, lets take a look at this. We might learn a stunning amount. Back to drunk driving. Often i get the question asked of a parent it is better for me have my child drive stoned and or drive drunk. The answer is, none of the above. And is more dangerous to drive impaired by alcohol than impaired by marijuana but much more dangerous to drive drunk and to drive drunk and stoned. In other words, driving under the influence of marijuana and alcohol is much more dangerous than the sense of driving are in either one of the two in isolation. So the relationship between marijuana and alcohol is very complicated one and we have to learn a lot about it before we really start to understand where our policies should be, and the issue of misuse is huge. A stunning fact we talked about, prevalence. 44 of american 12th graders have used pot. Six percent or them are everyday users. So marijuana use has been around for a long, long time and has been used in large quantities. How we manage our regulations to try to suppress use. We know very little about the influence of marijuana on the growing brain. Out in that we have these states, will allow the Brain Science to catch up and we can really learn about what stages in the Brain Development cycle is marijuana influential in a negative way to be concerned about. That science still has to be done. Host Angela Hawken, is the marijuana sold in colorado domestic product . Guest most of our marijuana is brought in from mexico, some highgrade from california so the really high grade, commercial grade is Single Digits thc level. The highgrade marijuana is up to 17 . They have stories in the media about thc levels of 40 and marijuana will kill your grandchildren. We hardly ever see those cases play out. Most of the marijuana confiscated is commercial grade, and its low level thc, and that is coming from mexico. Host is that the medical marijuana as well . Guest a lot of medical more here would be produced locally. Host its a more high thc. Guest and that is often grown to try to make sure that not only is there a known thc level but also ratios between other important chemical compounds in marijuana. For example, in thc tends to get all the attention but theres other important chemical within marijuana called cbd and that reduces anxiety level associated with marijuana use. The trend is being to increase thc, russ cbd, which is why you can see more emergency room appearances because people are using marijuana at much higher leveled of thc than people are used to in the past but the cbd, you can have those anxiety effects and you start to see emergency room entries increase. Host as part of our series here at Pepperdine University we talked with bruce, Public Policy professor as well, longtime he said he has been smoking cigarettes for 62 years and today it would be easier to smoke marijuana in california than a cigarette in public. Guest i dont think thats true. Bruce is a fun personality but it is. Its astonishingly easy to obtain a prescription. These are not prescriptions made by doctors. If they were they would be held accountable for a higher standard of diagnosis before providing recommendations. I wish there was a prescription requirements because doctors would have to behave more ethically. Instead its a recommendation that a doctor recommends that marijuana might be useful for your ailment. But it is astonishingly easy to secure a expression very easy to find. Host angela hawk en, again, this book, what Everyone Needs to know about Marijuana Legalization do you take a position on Marijuana Legalization in this book . Guest well, all four authors were required to actually chapter 16 to publicly state our position on Marijuana Legalization. In the book i say, authorize it. Im of the four authors most in favor of Marijuana Legalization for some of the reason i suggested. The costs to the Justice System, half of our 12th graders are using the substance and were making criminals out of our children. A better way to deal with this than threw the criminal Justice System so i am in favor of Marijuana Legalization. That said im also someone who is strongly in favor of evidence. If the data from washington and colorado shows this experiment was a bad one, ill be the strongest advocate for turning things around. So depends on the data. Host how does the is sit in with the rest of the world. Guest we were the first movement. We have seen decriminalization no other states. People talk about the netherlands netherlands and portugal but these two states were the first jurisdictions on earth to ever allow the commercial sale of marijuana, which makes us the first uruguay right now has also followed suit. What is interesting is that this is left the International Community in a scramble. We have treaty conventions and the u. S. Government as