James lewis former state Department Official and seven security expert serving as Senior Vice President center for Strategic International studies and as organist this week. The topic is cyberattacks and cybersecurity on the communicators. What proof is there any that the russians are behind the recent cyberattacks quick. At this point theres three kinds of proof of forensic evidence found by the commercial company. If you back into a computer something is left behind that points to the perpetrator berger like a footprint in a lead back to moscow. The second source of evidence is the intelligence agencies to be fully confident of the russian government using their own sources and technology. That smile he has not denied this. So that evidence is solid. How did he get this information . How did that happen quick. It is pretty straightforward. Most people still suffer from the illusion that the email is somehow private when it is like a postcard. So to secure the date of their own networks. As they got in to a fishing email then to get control of the network over a period of time to extract the data including debt email. Joining our conversation today from reuters one. My and understanding by the way that the Intelligence Agency the gain evade the leaders of the Intelligence Committee but this past summer about one year ago that this was going on. For quite some time to speak to the people of the Democratic Front party they say they were approached some months maybe one year ago dundee fbi was very opaque the way they approach this. So theyre asking questions that you have then had. And they did not even realize they were hacked. That was larger april. And the Clinton Campaign still denies although i had heard to have their personal emails fact that it literally they got 50,000 that is enough to go every day between now and election the favorite tool for the russians is wikileaks there is some questions with assange he cannot be called the unwitting agent he knows where it is coming from but with a confrontation with russia that also did want to compromise intelligence to get the deal with syria. It sounds from your conversation that they had been hacked. How does the fbi knew that had a time . They knew well before they told the dnc because they had intelligence and place. That is different from my experience because they came and told us we have been hacked by the russians there are pretty forthright about who was responsible. They have their own sources that they monitor with the victim not knowing for months is commonplace i know there were very explicit to the hilt some months ago. But the reasons behind it is to say be were very confused isnt that unusual because russia hacked into the campaigns of 2012 and 2008 with the release of the data. With any male donor list of the Campaign Strategy that is the third time they have done that but what is different now is the overt political use. At 01 to be to this piece said he said the fbi came to cfis to say you were hacked. Was cfis surprised to learn this back. The first mi. You had the knowledge it was happening . This is one of the interesting things. So to be vested in the world prior to these incidents to be very discreet to be very determined one of the things the was cellmark of russia was not to see them do things. So that was not a polite one still Vice President biden brought up talk about the cyberattacks on russian. Pdf. Day have gone through a lot of scenarios. One was records as a of the Vladimir Putin of Vladimir Putin but talks treatment were pictures of his girlfriend or bank account. You will not embarrass Vladimir Putin and said we should unplug the network and the probably wouldnt work so perhaps some part of covert activity of the infrastructure. The white house is not said anything about this sotho have the swearingin of them anticipated swearing and. Have like to see those boat talks pictures laugh laugh. Host is the was conducting a regular basis cyberwarfare for lack of a better word against other countries . Evidently place you could call it cyberwarfare is the decision to use cybercommand begins isis that is where you could say the military is engaged so that is unusual and unwise so in cyberspace because that is pretty pathetic but said the state department has said up fairly extensive effort to encounter that messaging and antiamerican efforts and to be counterproductive and to be way ahead of the government. We have always been baghdads propaganda. Cow much is that with cybersecurity cyberintelligence quick. The last number sow was 40 million that includes Network Defense they probably interest to me the intelligence. Is a well allocated quick. And how much can we tell these companies and must do something leading to in a next to have a hard time for that. So i did remember the mel to suggest it is forged midwinter of 2015 so honestly. Sedan to say what they thought of it. I am not even sure with the document is what those consequences are so to get the sacred document and the days later after this email a you get more emails from the state department that Hillary Clinton knew from the situation in benghazi by around the time of the attack. In some pride that i can tell and there is still no evidence i reported within hours of the attack of the paris attack of the film that went out and that stuck with us to tell a different story. But that would be a badge of honor to have the trolls go after you idol think that is necessarily a bad thing. Will literally anybody outside that circle. One part the did not have as much mention is the russians with the hundred of not a few thousand to go on to the web sites are the newspapers to put these Vladimir Putin antiobama comments is their russian yuri trump supporter. And to work on the post debate polls but in terms of the majority and that was a new kind of conflict. We have not seen that it has not been released. Seth and to have references of the russian intelligentsia service. Those that point today identity of the attacker. To find the computers that the attack was launched that those point to the fsb. With the pathways leading back to moscow. But in that sense those that were involved of those original discussions with the Edward Snowden but in the company of this woman to have the talkshow it dont get money from the russian government to go through the middleman. All of the information that we are seeing with the u. S. Postal service in a sealed letter is that illegal to publish that could. Given that the russians and others have an opportunity they did not have before to think about the internet elections there would have to spend dozens or hundreds of agents with bags of money and easily detected. By watergate style breakin see you can pack and get data to cover your traced to some extent it would not have worked without the internet. And we have not seen the court but whatever has happened. I certainly have been reporting that myself but the literally it is tiny by comparison. That is a good question it is clearly illegal and the argument is that wikileaks is receiving stolen goods. Talk about those tax returns is probably not illegal one of the complications to determine what is the appropriate and to be very careful that would not appear to compromise their first and underwrite. Why could you not shutdown . We could shut down the internet but senior policy makers say are you sure it is them . And the second question tell us how you keep this emasculating out of control. So the president of russia a stable actor from chem of north korea to do something violent or unpleasant and does not lead to a greater conflict. But our concern is a real . But with the United States government be careful there could be fake documents planted in their. But so far is what i have seen with wikileaks and the emails is a russian tactic. And to be selective so that mitigates those meanings. So most of the scenes to be in context through the email archive. And that was not taken out of context. And at this point is that the attacking of the voter phial quick. Probably not one in vantage liz the disorganize federal system is dozens of factors 50 states plus the district then thousands of counties to have different systems it is a very hard target to change the vote count. But you can mess up the ability to vote on election day but it will not turn out the one candidate will have 98 percent. But our system is too complicated but the politics is such 21 themselves to this type of destruction and that this point with the zero evidence the voting systems have been compromised but plenty of voters state registration bases that they have attacked eq. Can see if they show up to the polls is there legitimacy to have complications or delays. The republicans have a history to openly engage in the efforts to increase voter identification with Voter Registration hurdles suggests oppression efforts. But to be fair i think they have identified the patterns of american politics and dont think it is one party or the other that cooperates with the russians. Have the republicans then hacked . Uh care said they were attacked in the two previous president ial elections they do say multiple have been hacked somebody from the trump and campaign was tacked the only evidence that i know of offhand that was made public is some emails i believe belonging to or relating to Lindsey Graham there not friendly to donald trump. There does seem to be a pattern. I do believe the republicans have been hacked probably for other purposes but no evidence that there is anything like this of of publication that is happening to the democrats. Going back to this house is did the fbi knew before the organizations that were hacked . What is the evidence that they saw specifically what. In some instances they have the authority to monitor some networks, not only is in the u. S. But a Russian Network to say the ongoing traffic. You could monitor with the help of nsa some Domestic Networks to see if they were hacked but it is hard to explain in the open and setting but if you knew what they russian attack looks like you could look for that attack on the network then trace that back. If you weeks ago there was a story in the New York Times of a young man who has a set of servers in his office and was very open. Is like a switchboard. The dutch or you name it. He is just the mailbox. Does a lot of traffic going through a camera this type of traffic quick. The russians are good. That use multiple individuals like that around the world that they have used in the past and that was one thing that appointed them to be responsible this time is that, they do not call themselves fuzzy bear. That is something that was made up but i cannot imagine these guys to say they have the names fuzzy bear but they do have units and a Collection Program with the global scope that goes after politicians that emanates and that was part of it. If you go after 30 countries it is worth noting that they have allegedly cutoff assange access to the internet because he is hanging out at the Ecuadorean Embassy in london. But the t11 twitter fetus still going and he is the Sole Proprietor of that and it continues to publish the rest of the emails to suggest one way or another he has outside mechanisms to do this to have servers since we dinner many of their places. Or sweden. But. With them of limits of the law the risen to what we can do to assange weekend sees his devices without one and be legally justifiable. Would attack against russia be considered an act of war but. That is a political decision it is not a legal term to be an armed attack that has your inherent right to selfdefense and nobody can define an architect. It would be up to Vladimir Putin to decide that. Probably the use of force causes destruction he could be justified to call that an act of war it is a political decision pardon me when United States allegedly packed the Iranian Nuclear facility they chose not to call in act of war with the russians act the german Blast Furnace they chose not to call it an act of war. It depends on much you want to have a fight. Also the u. S. Constitution was not drafted to account for the issues of cyberspace particularly the United States government recently in a slightly different context they believe the constitution of the United States in dealing with cyberissues is outdated and obsolete. And they try to figure out ways to convince the courts to help them get around this issue. He has the authority he needs for what he wanted with those military authorities he has the authority to do some type of retaliatory act but the politics of whether to do that. I am talking more about surveillance activity. Our guest this week Senior Vice President of the center for strategic and international