Through the senate, it would end up with the veto from joe bidens. Will leave this here and go live to former i had Us Commission expected to talk about ways to improve child earned income tax credit speaking at an event hosted by the Bipartisan Policy Center. Live coverage here on cspan2. I want to take the opportunity to acknowledge h r block, Robin Hood Foundation and with other support, research and dialogue today would not be possible. Todays event is probably virtual coffee encourage active participation via live stream. American families offset high cost of raising children and workers with lower moderate wages. They been extended multiple times is the backing of both parties given the track record of reducing poverty. We worked tirelessly the past few years around tax Credit Report and since our report last year that provide a roadmap for policy makers to permanently reform the ctc we focus on ways to improve uptick in administration. On behalf of my coauthor andrew and william and proud to release the Newest Research today the dives deeper into this issue of administration and offers concrete recommendations to consider. Significant dents, administered of barriers in a variety of factors including program complexity, widespread nonfiling, lack of awareness and benefits administered through the tax code and language barriers contribute to the incomplete makeup. Persistent levels of improper payments going to both programs and while some are broad, men are honest mistakes confused by the intricate rules. Approximately one in four dollars each year might either go to people ineligible to perceive more than they should by law which is often due to childrens helpful tax purposes governed by complicated regulation. Policymakers have responsibly too address these challenges. The reforms today could not only increase among eligible americans but combat and humanize the process at the same time. Among reforms, six include irs administrative capacity for social benefit programs and improve Customer Service and staffing and funding. Increasing coordination between all levels of government and private nonprofit sectors while streamlining state and local versions of both the atc. The Technology Resources people used to access Public Benefit programs, committee irs to certify and regulate tax preparers, modernizing public and eligibility requirements and data sharing practices between all levels of government, tax authorities and third parties specifically those with eligibility. Investing in irs Customer Service throughout this process including the income taxpayer clinics. We recognize its on the heels of debating these programs and the inflation protection act provided fundamental investment of 80 billion in additional funding for the irs. In this context we look forward to a robust discussion about the role of not only both parties of the executive and legislative branches, state and federal government and private nonprofit sectors who could Work Together to improve administration of the Child Tax Credit and earned income tax credit. Id like to turn over to a woman who knows what is like to wear all those hats. President and ceo of the National EconomyPublic Administration. Im honored to have you introduce our keynote speakers today. Thanks to everybody for joining us today. On the president and ceo of the National Academy of Public Administration and delighted to be here to promote the partnership between Academy Center and Governmental Partnership and Bipartisan Policy Center and to support their work on this important topic. For those of you who may not know center for Governmental Partnership academies resource into promoting improved government, munication and collaboration at and across all levels of government. Todays event is perfect example of that. Tax credit such as the Child Tax Credit and earned income tax credit are vital bipartisan mechanisms alleviating poverty in the united states. Despite the support from across the aisle many challenges keep credits from achieving full potential. The recommendations will ensure the credits are assessable to all equitably distribute it and managed from the administered of auditing perspective. To speak further on some challenges around the tax credits, i like to introduce don, and academy fellow and former commissioner of Internal Revenue services, dedicated lifelong Public Service spent over 45 years working to support Good Government across agencies in all levels of government. In addition to his time at the irs, he worked as the city administrator for district of columbia, Deputy Director for management at the office of management and budget and chairman of the board director. Thank you for being here today. Thanks for the introduction. A summary of my employment career in the public sector, im delighted to talk about these important programs. I would note that the start Bipartisan Policy Center report coming out today is a detailed d analysis recommendation i think everybody should look at. These are two critical programs people are aware of but designed encourage low and moderate income workers to work and reward work designed to be tax credit refunds tied to the money earned by the taxpayer and children they had. These are large programs, two of them together at the irs issuing 100 billing a year in credits and refunds. 1 billion here and there and then you are into real money. The challenge for the irs and the program, im going to take a drink of water here the challenges to get enrollment increased and at the same time make sure the right people are getting the right amount of payment. The report notes and irs has been working on for some years take up for one is large and 90 of eligibility for Child Tax Credit and family supply and 80 earned income tax credit eligible people apply but it leaves millions of eligible taxpayers who want to participate in these and taking advantage. One of the great ironies is these social welfare programs designed to combat poverty are administered by the Internal Revenue service most people of this service if it think about it at all recognizing it tax enforcement which is important the irs for trillion a year for the amount of what the government does across the board. Then people sometimes are familiar with the irs and other significant functions, Taxpayer Service trying to help taxpayers become complaint. If youre trying to be compliant, the irs is anxious to help you but most people dont think of the iris is a welfare organization. Recently the system is payments the iris paid out, the irs almost has the same amount of money is the Security Administration did with a smaller budget so its an important part of the irs operations and sure both the number of people applying, the percentage is as high as possible and its going to the right people in the right amount. Part of this program is it bipartisan in nature. People on both sides make reference they are income tax credit with the Poverty Program and i think that explains why even in the face of high improper payment ratios the Program Continues to receive bipartisan support. Improper payment ratio for the Child Tax Credit is about 14 , still high but more manageable. The earned income tax credit, the percentage is 24 and not all his being stolen was the reason people are somewhat comparable as when it does go to the right sector of the population, perhaps not the right people specifically in the right amounts, the iris has been focused on this trying to deal with it for some years on the general accountability high risk that doesnt help in every time i testified at various times id be asked about why we cant do better about it. Weve made progress in a lot of ways while i was commissioner and we were talking before we started one of the areas in which weve made progress dealing with Identity Theft and refund, we created the irs Publicprivate Partnership with tax preparers like h r block and others state Tax Commission is on theory irs couldnt deal with Identity Theft by itself so we had a working partnership called Security Summit and while i was commissioner, the percentage or number of victims of Identity Theft went down by over 60 and told the number now is down by over 80 so a lot of taxpayers embedded in a by that. We spent time to increase take particularly on the image income tax credit and make sure the right people at the right payments and we made almost no progress no matter what we did. I had a seminar bringing in a Government Accountability office and advocates and people who knew something about this, i challenge them to figure out what we could do for it particularly on improper payment. I said that they come up with Something Better than my suggestion . Reduce the statutes. At the end of the two days nobody had a better idea and part of the problem is its almost impossible to figure out how to apply for the credit to whom the credit should go. The statute understandably and appropriately tries to make sure the people taking care of the child get the credit but the problem is Everybody Knows these are public it family situations and a lot of times you have singleparent working and supporting the, grandparents and uncles, aunts, neighbors, a lot of people taking care of children who move around to some extent so it seems even if you try to semper fi how you figure it out, its going to be difficult and part of the reason sometimes with the same child they are taking care of that child for significant part of the year to my suggestion then and continues to be i dont think we are ever going to be able to sort through statutes how to allocate appropriately the credit so if youre married december 31, youre married the lawyer and file jointly, it is a matter when you got married during the year. Generally for a long time but if you take care of and have a child december 31, you get the payment and then you would let the family sort out whos putting in time or effort or Financial Support for the child and each family will be different and make their own judgment and determination but would make it easier for the taxpayers, prepares working with the taxpayers and certainly the irs if the standard were simplified significantly it would increase participation because part of the concern for people thinking about applying is the statute, they are concerned they may not get it right if they dont, they will be audited by the irs. Recently thanks to the decline in number of employees generally and in particular decline in the number of employees will to enter the phone, fewer than 20 of calls are answered and some estimates only 11 of the calls were answered so if you are a low income taxpayer and you want to call somebody to get help, the last couple of years have been impossible to get somebody so as noted, the irs has 8 billion provided in the next eight to ten years to make improvement across the board in one of the first places they were made was to hire more people to answer phones to answer the questions and i think that would help but also what happens is you have taxpayer low income particularly are going to preparers to get help and not going to h and r block, they will go to somebody who sets up shop in a parking lot or a relative who may or may not know anything about the earned income tax credit. We saw some preparers with signs saying ill get you a refund and a lot of times on prepared preparers with file for refund greater than the taxpayer was entitled to in the prepare would disappear if they would take this doesnt look right and the taxpayer was left on their own. So one thing the Bipartisan Policy Center recommended we recommended strongly as the irs began in authority to require mineral standards by all repairs. The regulation in the preparers is the question of making sure every year they demonstrate understanding and the basic rudiments of tax law particularly low income areas, they understand how to apply for the earned income tax credit clients and Child Tax Credit. If we could do that, i think would eliminate significant amounts of improper payments to the extent taxpayers have more confidence the person in a local Community Center knows what they are doing, they might be more willing to say ill take my chances. The way that i could go out that i am entitled to his credit. They are critical programs, 25 million or more americans benefit from these programs and support on both sides of the equation on the report notes and a short everyone is eligible and applies for them appropriately and we need to make sure as they apply improper payment is down and the system is made with the irs providing as much service as possible to the taxpayers you have and often times they come from their prepare will have a situation. Its almost impossible with the additional funding, i would hope we are about to see a significant change in that regard as well. We have a panel with a lot of different icons and perspectives so like everybody else, im delighted to see what they have to say about these important programs. Thank you for those insightful remarks. It is an honor to have you speak to us today. The former will will join us in a bit but for now i would like to bring in our panelists bring rich and diverse expenses with expertise. Practitioners and experts across the nonprofit sectors. First we have andy phillips, director of Agency Industry relations and tax services at h r block. Highly qualified team of experts, attorneys, cpa and enrolled agents who study h r block to support its network and tax preparation products. Next we have gabriela joined us from Houston Texas is a senior policy advisor for the office. She was part of the team that created the hairs county program that leveraged american plant on low income families access Free Tax Preparation Services benefit from the expanded ptc in 2021. Lets welcome rebecca thompson, Vice President of the Partnership Network building prosperity now where she needs effort to engage in diverse arrays of stakeholders that make up Prosperity Network at large. She previously had quotients in central and northeast florida that included a coalition of sites that prepared 20000 tax returns and northeast florida annually. I also want to work on physical, economic special present Colorado Public Health and child health program. She identifies implement strategies to improve stability and mobility colorado families including strategic state and Community Level partnership, Services Support economic wellbeing and improve outcomes. Thank you for joining us today and as a reminder, we encourage you to submit russians via live stream the live and engage with twitter handle at bp underscore bipartisan. Lets get right to it. The commissioner, former commissioner alluded to this and i did as well throughout the course of our research, one of the primary areas was the fact that the irs has been up for a number of years and we need new funding. The inflation protection act passed last month provides 80 billion in funding to address longstanding concerns over tax enforcement and Customer Service and Information Technology is the commissioner remarked. Now that we have policymakers focused on these services i was hoping you could speak to the funding and from your perspective the levers of government, where their resources should be directed in these administrations. Maybe andy we can start with you and then the remainder of our panelists. Thank you so much my fellow panelists commissioner for joining today and all the work that went into this, its a fantastic product. I think some others, all the others talk more, ill speak more tax and demonstration if you will. Starting with opportunities of the credit and modernizing the experience on the irs side. Its much more efficient and accurate for the irs and its much faster. When errors are discovered during this process, they can be addressed in the time their fashion every year, a large number of taxpayers have a tax return that would otherwise qualify for Electronic Filing but not able to do so because they experience reject from the irs. I want to talk about what we are doing today. With these claims for dependent, in opening remarks, that can be due to id theft in the independent. Confusion around the rules, it may logical filers to disagree about the outcome to claim that defendant. So let me go to what happens there. They are able to claim the defendant on their tax return for family related benefits and while electronically. Files are rejected and they have to submit to the irs that results in a delay and in the amount it takes to get there refund and process the tax return. Many times legitimate filers are the ones that are rejected particularly in situations where its an honest mistake, bad actors rush to file beat them to the punch so the legitimate filer has a manual long process to prove they are eligible to claim the dependent and associated benefits, it can cause Economic Hardship while waiting for the tax refund. In addition the iris because the first return, the illegitimate return was filed electronically, its possible the irs has processed the return and issued refund payment through that is very hard to correct. Looking at opportunities to enhance electronic cake of tax returns for irs is better for tax of administration from the irs perspective and better for the taxpayer. On the audit sub filing process referenced in this, and this is referenced in the report, over 160 million hits go to the irs and the refund application every year, others helpful information in there for taxpayers, if you are getting flagged and has questions about the refundable credit, you may have no idea until the notice comes in the mail so expanding whats available and where the refund taxpayers to know what and why if they are snagged and the paper, i dont think the paper talks about notices in the ei tc audit so the digital capabilities continue to expand Services Available on the online account to deliver digital notices to allow taxpayers an effective way to address from the irs as a question about the credit of the items on their tax returns. For psaki of time ill let others speak. Thank you. Id like to pose the same questions to the ranger of our panelists. You are helping a number of families trying to understand changing tax laws so would love your perspective on where you think the irs should be focusing on. We took advantage of the American Rescue plan funds we received of the county and leveraged those at 500,000 into a program to conduct outreach and reach the hardest to reach individuals. I think the expanded under our belt was special circumstances because of the population of people eligible the various lowest income people are the hardest to reach, language barriers, time barriers and when people are available to get the services so we had to take it to the people approach to remove as many of the obstacles as possible so we invested in largest nonprofit providers to have them go to public clinics and schools and churches and other places of worship and target this and said coach we knew there was the lowest take of Tax Preparation Services try to reach those people and go there over and over to people they could come back next week and what papers to bring the language barriers, making sure there was hotlines with multiple language is, english, spanish, viennese, chinese and preparers who spoke the language is. We had Great Success more than anticipated from 13 million in tax credit in a sixmonth program so we were excited to see that so we saw it as a test or pilot or what else is needed to reach the people who dont get the services what are the barriers in ways we can help . They can help in these instances, having federal funds and other funds can help, especially for mueller jurisdictions where there might not be a large presence of preparers and like Harris County with massive chest rotation barriers, we are very diverse county, a lot of individuals with different backgrounds, language background so being able to get the funding needed to support expanded access was helpful. Id love to hear your perspective, the state of colorado, where irs should be focusing. It is great to be here. From the state health the permit focused on connecting colorado filings to improve, rubbing and we have networks and programs to Public Health and Human Services programs and partners that benefit and help get the word out about what we see on the ground outreach and training for painters and navigators and what we hear from income tax partners in the filing is intimidating and drives tylers to not file at all, it is a barrier. We see lack of awareness of ability and fear of engaging with the irs if they file incorrectly and other benefits they have might be impacted so anything can be done to typify the process and provide clear less intimidating information from the irs and state department of revenue would be helpful if multiple linkages. With the caveat of acknowledging Administration Challenges we dont know about in detail as advocates, is it possible to do Something Like sending refund payment or tax bills and sorting it out after the fact that there is a dispute . And all the hurdles is to provide hurdles with good for america to help people get their stimulus and Child Tax Credit could really help. The number one click and filing on the Campaign Landing Page is free doityourself Online Software so how can that be supported and be expanded to be accessed in public settings like libraries . I also want to call out the navigator care related work with, Human Services, county offices and be at First Talking about taxes and making referrals even though they refer to other benefits like wic because they are giving that information. They worry they might be liable for Incorrect Information we want them to refer to tax filing like do for other support, often asked about custody and dont know the answers and even though we stress and training care coordinators you dont have to be a tax expert possible iris help would be helpful. Addressing concerns of potential filers that it doesnt affect other benefits. Wonderful, thank you. You are a woman who i think when thinking about these issues through multiple sectors of the economy trying to reach households with your background and expertise, id love to hear your thoughts on where the irs should be focusing. Good afternoon and thank you for bringing this panelist to discussion today. I have a list in the areas in which i think the funding should be useful for the irs. The first thing i would say is one of the key aspects is it is multiyear in nature working in the nonprofit sector, its important to have molecular funding because a lot of times what needs to be done cannot be accomplished within 12 months so its wonderful multiyear only allows profits to begin to continue through completion within the irs. I want to piggyback on what my colleagues said about improvement in the processing, important for returns to go through and make it through the irs needs to come into this age in regard to their system and the quicken probably longer than i have so it is important our Government Agencies and irs particularly is operating systems that are current and consistent with what they are using. Another useful resources in hiring, we have heard about the challenges with answering the phones, millions of americans taxpayers when they call irs after receiving the letter or inquire with happening, returns they cannot get through the phone line so its important irs steps up hiring and i know they are hiring and have been trying to hire throughout the year to deal with the backlogs so it is in porn they have public capable staff competitively paying to answer the questions to answer the phones and be able to respond when they come in. One other thing i was thinking about was what happens when the return is out and it has to be a return. The photos of paper returns and paper that the irs individuals have to manually go through and its important the funding improves the process paper returns. Not sure who will ever completely move away from paper because uncle bill are insistent upon filing paperwork returned in some situations that do require the paper return for six months, nine month process, probably a year now processing to get the returns process to you too late to go and ease the burden until we fix this of the piece in this filing. The last thing where the resources would be helpful is the hiring of specialized qualified auditors to audit high Income Network individuals who have avoided paying their fair share of taxes and will lead to closing the tax cap in our country and alleviate the pressure that i think we will talk of the audit process on low income payers. That leads to my next question because i want to bring up the issue of state tax preparers and the fact that three quarters of tax preparers or individuals training requirements and ethical standards, competency tests like the former commissioner noted. We know presents issues of quality that disproportionately affect lowincome individuals utilizing state preparers at higher rates so we know irs lacks authority to regulate tax preparers and one recommendation we made in our paper, the irs authority has strong bipartisan support from both outside and inside congress but congress has yet to take action so i was hoping to speak to your expanse given that you do represent intricate levels, touch points with taxpayers how this issue in particular has contributed to the issues they face in providing the irs could help reduce improper payments and improved the audit compliance process so rebecca, do you want to start with your beautiful segue . I will bring in the panels perspective. Thank you so much. We have long supported regulation of preparers consistent with support for the program, i could say for certain the accuracy rate consistently has been above 90 even during covid years. We may have dropped 90 their present but 98. 6 accurate on return, i have yet to see staff that gives good accuracy rate for preparers. The last was around 60 so we know is a lot happening with preparers but doesnt necessarily limit accurate returns. Often what we see are single shots but set up during the season with an enrolled preparers and you can go through and look at this and check off about six of those four things not to do and what preparers shouldnt be doing. I often think about nail shops, i like to get my nails done. Nail shops and barbershops. Every time i go in and take my son to the barbershop, is a certificate hanging on the wall that shows the ground through necessary training, certified by the state to deliver this service. It baffles me preparers have the ability to be an enrolled and they dont have to go through a similar process particularly when handling financial matters in a financial interaction with federal government, it does widening the tax cap. Support the regulation of preparers, its something for irs should have the authority to do take the time to enact regulations against the preparers so we can reduce improper payments coming out. I want to turn to you, gabby to get your experience given the credits in 2021 with your program and how tax preparers have the. Thank you. Rebecca got up good points, its understandable i think so many families and households work with preparers who are on enrolled because who are you going to trust . Especially low income without that much money and your cousin says i can help you with your taxes, a trusted entity especially for marginalized individuals or folks with language barriers, they will go to someone who can help them instead of trying to reach out to organizations they may have never heard of what they dont know if they speak the lingo door can trust them with personal information so twofold, absolutely would be helpful to have oversight and resources for tax preparers to get information they need but also making sure folks have different options and are aware of resources they have so nonprofit that 60 of tax services in the county were seeing the same 98 of customers for the same year after year, the same people aware of them so yes it was a one time when your program to take advantage of the Child Tax Credit but also an opportunity to get up to work, you dont need to rely on your cousin, there are other options and you dont have to pay money. You can get solid work out of the Nonprofit Organization that can speak your language. A lot of individuals undocumented may not know they can file taxes. I think the flipside is someone who isnt properly trained is helping, there are consequences for immigrants if they misrepresent something on their tax return effectively committing fraud on a federal document so that could have unintended consequences even if not intentionally so a trusted provider to talk to them about their circumstances is important in some communities so letting people know they have multiple options are set of providers in making sure preparers are as trained as possible and as oversight. I couldnt agree more. I know this is a topic you have done work on throughout your career. A leading voice to educate taxpayers and tax preparers. The licensing and training requirements for someone to cut your hair, very important for most people aside from myself is higher than what it takes to handle what is the most important financial transaction for taxpayers of the year but first there may be an opportunity to pay more detailed comprehensive data on this topic, maybe an updated study. Much data today is anecdotal in nature based on surveys, targeted secret shopper so i dont know holistically we understand population, everything that entails and what opportunities may exist. Standards can include continuing education requirements and a subtopic of this, your tax Identification Number you have to get to with the irs, theres no training or continuing education required but its how they identify and they lack an effective mechanism for preparers that target different subsets of taxpayers intentionally commit fraud or are totally trained so a subset of preparers able to continue filing fraudulent tax preparers often times with states as well or on enrolled preparers making honest mistakes because they are not required to stay up on continuing Education Training so theres plenty of opportunity looking at training requirements but what others said, around 700 or so preparers, they do stay up on training and passionate about serving taxpayers. Often they live and work in the same communities of them in may be family so its important to not vilify all preparers but tailor the solution to the problem to address. Thank you. Id like to address the question of what we have received from the audience whether or not regulation on this issue, what opportunities can states take on . Thank you. All outreach efforts are impacted by fraud and potential filers can tell the difference between legitimate services and preparers who dont have uptodate information or are actual doctors. There are opportunities to answer the questions from the audience for states to take action around this and Advocacy Partners in legislative orders who care about improving the tax code and making it easier and accessible for people to file taxes and i could see the agencies have a part to play as well because we care about similar objectives supporting resiliency and Financial Wellbeing of colorado and. To echo rebecca promoting and expanding this including volunteer recruitment would be helpful from the irs, advocacy and state organizations making Service Organizations that could support volunteerism, we have had Great Success partnering to build the cap volunteerism and Service Programs are now. Wonderful, thank you. I know you wanted to share perspectives as well. My guest. Ill brief and let him hit a homerun. Several states i think are doing this, one thing is that they very, is it registration, testing, continuing education . Increasingly mobile will for Tax Professionals and taxpayers across the country i think it was gabby who spoke to us, Tax ProfessionalCustomer Relationship is something grounded in trust particularly with the yearoveryear relationship, it doesnt go away because Tax Professional customer taxpayer moves to another city, you have situations and we have advent expedited with the pandemic of all of these tools, zoom today and other things like that that allow us to communicate and be facetoface hundreds of miles away in the safety of our homes during the heat of the pandemic so when you have a patchwork of regular should across many states, its a lack of cohesive inconsistent rules and sometimes lack of awareness on tax preparers of where they need to register so certainly opportunity to take burning from the states but a more effective process if its one unified set of rules tax preparers are expected to follow. The discussion has been good. Points are well taken what you worry about when you get individual state regulation or minimum standards, you get passport in some states wont have any and some will be good and sophisticated difficult for preparers to work their way through so my hope would be that it might motivate the government, federal government, congress to safely need single standard. As i have said, it doesnt have to be touched is regulation which has people think of an arm of government leaning on you, it can be requiring minimum standards and make sure tax preparers are qualified and prepared. Then its hard to argue the standards doing whatever they can and the support for the irs, its better to have some minimum standard as we go forward. I would say one thing ive taken from this is to get different perspectives, valuable ones, it does mind me trying to Work Together too deal with Identity Theft and fraud, on both sides of the issue with getting people enrolled in this program but also making sure improper payment rates go down, its an area and it makes reference to that, it is good area for cooperation coordination in a partnership between the federal government and Internal Revenue service and state and local government advocates to Work Together because you hear the reports and experience that there are important work being done in various ways but it would be helpful for National Minimum standards if we have an organized way of dealing with that easier to communicate with the irs and Lessons Learned and practices across. In many ways if we increase this rate 80 , there are good ideas and what we need to do is have a more Effective Press we had the itc awareness and Public Events around the country and everywhere but it didnt make much of a dent in the process so it does say we would probably make more progress if we can get the organizations represented by the panel working together on this. I couldnt agree more. I know we have only a few minutes left so i would love to take the remaining minutes on optimism, to understand from different perspectives who represents here today and state and local governments, Public Private nonprofit sectors, where our best practices happening . Where is the optimism on the ground . Especially understanding this uncovers longstanding challenges to explain these, where do you see the optimism existing . We have found cost promotion state agencies in these programs has been surprising success. They can reach a lot of people quickly. Partnering with the department of revenue or tax expertise and data support has been amazing. Other agencies that address social needs from cross promotion with them, one specific example would be placing a link to tax campaign and links to file colorados unified benefits platform where people can enroll in wic and snap and all kinds of benefits so in two weeks it rose to the top level refer source immediately after we placed it. Flyers and Energy Assistance program placed on the website for the online application page, all programs houston different state agencies. We worked with Health Insurance marketplace to train the moment the sisters to talk about briefly tax filing tax credit and a lot of it is helping navigators feel comfortable making the referral without getting bogged down and attacked in conversations they dont feel comfortable. There are ways to feel the comfort since it is a complex system. I am optimistic partnering, working, working with new partners for Public Health and other agencies to connect people. Inka. You exude optimism when we talk about challenging topics such as this. I dont think anybody would disagree covid19 pandemic has been for our country but there have been a few bright lights that have emerged particularly with regard to the irs. They were tax with disturbing Economic Impact payments and Child Tax Credit payments as well as expanded Child Tax Credit payments and they did so not without a few bumps for hiccups but they got the job done and part of the reason they were successful was because they partnered with other agencies like the Social Security as well as the va and local partners as well. I am optimistic about the fact that we have set a standard and we know we can get things done in the irs can administer social Service Benefits and its built upon Publicprivate Partnerships they have and establish new Publicprivate Partnerships that help get the word out to those in underserved communities to i am optimistic about the continuation of partnerships and what we will see coming out of the partnerships in the years coming. I am optimistic and excited about something i heard last week at the prosperity summit, the irs is extending services of the Taxpayer Assistance Center once again too reach out into the underserved communities, leveraging the partnerships as well so we see irs will reach more people just by going out to the people, meeting them where they are extending services to them so it makes me excited. A couple of other things, the vita program seems expanded and extending itself during the pandemic to new ways of delivering services to the online process so thats wonderful. And the irs has taxes for staff and hiring people to answer the phone so once we get those open, i am excited about what is to come. Thank you so much. I love leaving conversations on a high note. Expected by the end of the year. Watch the hearing life beginning at 1 pm eastern on cspan three, cspan now or anytime on demand at cspan. Org. Live sunday on indepth, author, tv host and abrams media founder and ceo dan abrams will be our guest talking about us legal history and the american legal system today. Hes the author of including lincolns last trial, kennedys avenger about the trial jack ruby in his latest alabama versus king, Martin Luther king and the criminal trial that once the civil rights movement