Wants to bend every part of the federal government to his will. Then, prove it. Former u. S. Attorney general donald air gives jack smith the argument Election Interference Case against donald trump. And desantis in disarray. He is already planning a campaign reboot. It looks like more of the same failed ideas that have been sinking his president ial hopes. Im Ayman Mohyeldin. Let us get started. Tonight, we start this hour with a dire warning about a second trump presidency. A scenario that is still a very real possibility. Despite Donald Trumps ever growing legal chaos because if he gets back into the white house, the changes that he would make arent just about republican priorities, not policies. The changes would be designed to protect and empower donald trump like no president before. According to the new york times, trump and his allies are plotting to drastically increase president ial power should he win the 2024 election. A Second Trump Administration would order criminal investigations into his political rivals, if trump gets his way. It would and the postwatergate norm of Justice Department independents. Whats more, quote, mr. Trump and his associates have a broader goal. To alter the Balance Of Power by increasing the president s authority over every part of the federal government that now operates, by either law or tradition, with any measure of independence from political interference by the white house. As the economists note, the combined effect of appointing only loyalists and counting the bureaucracy would be a move would be both to remove constraints on mr. Trump and to ensure his wishes are acted on more often. That is the future, if trump wins next year. Lets be clear about that. He has been plotting this course for months, according to historian and friend of the show been india. Quote, trumps plans are consistent with the 21st century playbook for authoritarians. Tell the public how you will set up an authoritarian state well before you get into office. Frame your intended expansion of executive powers as a mere streamlining of the government. Dont forget to repeatedly praised dictators as brilliant and topoftheline people so they will be no surprise when you act in a similar manner. What your followers appetite for destruction of existing norms by advertising how you will purge the sikh Political Class that hate our country from government. In the unspoken truth that makes this even scarier . Congressional republicans wont ever stop trump from doing this. They would be eager coconspirators. Look at the evidence this week. After trump announced that he had received another Target Letter from jack smith, what did he do . He called Kevin Mccarthy in republican conference chair stefanik, urging them to rally gop lawmakers to defend him. Not the law. Then, there is news from politico That Mccarthy and donald trump have an understanding. That mccarthy would actually hold a vote to expunged trumps two impeachments from the house record. Because republicans want to whitewash trumps past actions all to protect him in the future. In 2025, trump went to question bloodless and every agency, in every position. He would turn the Justice Department into an investigation machine, targeting his perceived a bit as. He would have the gop cheering on his autocratic impulses to Dystopian Nightmare that, sadly, could be reality in this country in just 18 months from now. Joining me now, cutting him an embassy b. C. Lamb and legal analyst and former federal prosecutor and pell arrivals, msnbc contributor and author of finding latinx. Its great to have all of you with us. Carol, i will start with you. This political report About Mccarthy and trump, how speaker reportedly agreed to expunge trumps impeachments before the august recess. Does the house have the Legal Authority to do so . Is there any significance to beyond pr . When it comes to impeachments, eamonn, what congress decides to do is the law. Its such a political process and it is by design a political process. It is not a Legal Process at all. So, can they choose to, quote, expunge an impeachment . Who knows they probably can because there is nobody but congress that makes the rules there. I think it is a bit of a Bargaining ChipThat Mccarthy tried to use. He is trying to walk this very delicate line between separating himself from donald trump and not separating himself from donald trump. As we get closer to the election, it is going to be very [inaudible] that that is an impossible line to draw. Paula, its beyond belief that a twice impeached, likely to be a thrice indicted man, is the runaway leader of the gop primary. It keeps getting stronger. Is it even crazier that trump is leading to such an extent while openly signaling that he wants to effectively destroy the federal government as we know it . Its not. You started the segment by saying that there is a warning sign. Besides Warning Signs in 2015, the man. I saw the line between who donald trump is in the sort of latin american authoritarian figures that i grew up around. My father was a journalist like us, thrown out out of cuba because he asked hard questions. He was thrown out [speaking in a nonenglish language] because he has hard questions. He was thrown out of Donald Trumps conference in 2015 because he was there asking hard questions. Theres nothing in the return figure is more scared of than someone who is challenging their power, that abuse of power. We dont have to guess what he will do. We already know what he will do. He is going to destroy the independence of the media. He will destroy the independence of these agencies. He will destroy the constitution. To bring it back to how we try on the panel, what chavez did when he was raised power, they destroyed their constitutions. They change their constitutions to reform the structures of governance that would then allow them to become who they were. That is one weapon that donald trump has. This vision that he has. The second thing he is doing is the psychological damage that he is already affecting in this country where he has this Blinds Devotion of people that will follow him. Until this fictitious story plays out. Brittani, from your perspective, why do you think republicans have turned so aggressively against democracy on our system of checks and balances . On the rule of law, is it just that the party is following Donald Trumps lead . Is there something bigger at play here and they know that this democracy would effectively, as it grows and continues and the electorate changes, is the demise of the party and democracy has to be stopped in order for them to continue their existence . You are asking the proper question. This election is all about whether or not we want to walk a pathway to ward up multi racial democracy. Democrats know that. Independent. That republicans know that. They know that because they understand that a true multi racial democracy actually threatens the power that they have been hoarding and building for generations. This is why desantiss Rewriting History Books to say that slavery was beneficial. This is why nikki haley defended the use of the Confederate Flag on our states capital. This is why this Party Continues to try to rewrite what happened on january 6th and every single day before it because they want to make sure that they can preserve their power at all costs. This is part of the reason why these many legal challenges that trump is dealing with are so much bigger than those specific trials. This is about ensuring that there is accountability for somebody who, unfortunately, learned well have to make sure that he doesnt have accountability from the first time he was president. Here he is, running again, based on the last four years that he had and say, heres what i would change to make sure that they can have an absolute rule of law and that i can be the kind of dictator that i want to be. We have to campaign very, very carefully that trump is the leader in this moment, but this is about something much bigger play. This is about the protection of power that has been important for generations. The dismissal of the idea that a multi racial democracy actually is well deserved. Carol, lets talk about the difference between what is law and what is tradition in this country for a moment with our federal agencies. Lets say that trump wins in 2024. He moves to get the doj, the fbi. All of the three littler agencies that he deems insufficiently loyal. How could these actions be challenged in a court of law . Is the independents of these agencies built into our laws . Are they the norms and conditions of our politics . That is such a good question, amen. The answer is, the Constitution Talks about the three benches of government. The Executive Branch, headed by the government. The legislative branch and the judiciary. It does not say a lot about how those three branches interact. That is largely the results of a lot of tradition and history, as you know. Also, very hard lessons learned. My concern would actually not be so much that he would gut the fbi and the doj as it is that he would step them and such a way that they would go only after the people that he perceived to be political opponents. That is the root of authoritarianism. That is the most frightening thing. Its almost as if once a generation, the nation forgets how fraught the relationship can be between the department of justice and the Executive Branch when it is the president or those close to the president who are under investigation. It is a very, very difficult situation because the Conflict Of Interest is obvious and weve tried independent counsels. Weve tried special councils. It is always a difficult situation. Maybe no more obvious and example bend the saturday night massacre. But the attorney general and the Deputy Attorney general resigned their positions rather than do what president nixon was telling them to do, which was fire the independent counsel that it was investigating him. So, you are right. There is not a lot of Legal Protection against a president. Taking the kinds of actions he wants to take. Its the legislature is going to back him up on that. If the courts back him up on that. The odds are that they cant and they would, if they are step by the president. Yeah, im going to say. If youre talking about a congress that was led by Kevin Mccarthy, is it is a safe bet. Going to follow him all the way to the end. Caroline, thank you very much. Brittani and were gonna see later in the. Our next, what special counsel jack smiths team would need to prove to get a conviction in the Election Interference Case. First, jessica lane is here with the headlines. Hey, ayman. Stories were watching for you this hour. In greece, wildfires are raging for the fifth day, forcing massive evacuations there. Local authorities there say thousands of people have fled the island of roads. One of the countrys most popular summer destinations. So far, thank goodness, no injuries have been reported. South koreas military said north korea fired several rounds of Cruise Missiles into the city. This move appears to be in protest against the deployment of u. S. Nuclear arms submarine that was sent to south korea. It also comes after an american soldier flat across the border during a tour of the joint security. U. S. Womens National Soccer team has opened a 2023 womens world cup with a win over vietnam. Megan rapinoe martyr 200th International Game and her final world cup before she retires. Team usa will play against the netherlands on wednesday. Im jessica layton. More ayman with me Ayman Mohyeldin after the break. Hen we metamorphosize into our new evolved form, we carry that spirit with us. Because you can take alfa romeo out of italy. But you best believe, you cant take the italy out of an alfa romeo. Hi need new glasses . Buy one pair, get one free at visionworks how can you see me squinting . I cant im just telling everyone . Hey buy one pair, get one free for back to school. Visionworks. See the difference. My husband and i have never been more active. Shingles doesnt care. I go to spin classes with my coworkers. Good for you, shingles doesnt care. 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Youve seen his tweets begging on his supporters to stronglys capital. You have washes the January 6th Select Committee Laid Out A Damning Case against him. Now, with a third indictment against the ex president funding for those efforts to interview in the 2020 election, we are left with one question. What will federal prosecutors need to prove in court in order to convict donald trump . Well, just days before trump himself broke the news of the doj target but, or a group of experts with decades of ex bird laid out their ideas in a model prosecution memo, walking through a road map for the case of the United States versus donald trump. In the january six interference investigation, including admissible evidence potential charges impossible legal issues. Their conclusion . Quote, theyre likely is sufficient evidence to obtain and sustain a conviction of trump for his three step plan to overturn the election. So, how did they reach that conclusion . Lets watch discuss with one of the authors of that memo. Former Deputy Attorney general under george h. W. Bush, donald air, he is a u. S. Attorney under president ronald reagan. Its great to have you with us, donald. First, i want to get your reaction to what was inside that Target Letter. You have the three federal statutes you statutes mentioned, including deprivation of rights under color block, Conspiracy To Defraud the United States, and tampering with a witness. How does that measure up with what you and your colleagues predicted . Well, its pretty similar. Its similar in one major way. That is that we were concerned in our memo that clearly a good successful prosecution is going to have to somehow or other managed to deal with a huge amount of evidence and need to present it in a way that streamlines and simplifies what is being alleged. We suggest three specific statutes be used. Two of them are mentioned in the Target Letter. The third one thats mentioned in the Target Letter is a little different. One thing that the Target Letter doesnt mention is the idea of prosecuting donald trump for insurrection. I think it is a little hard to say. The other thing we have to say is that jack smith on the Prosecution Team is not bound by what is in this letter. Of course, i dont know anyone has actually seen the letter. So, really speculating quite a bit when we talk about this. When do you believe we can see a possible indictment in the case . What is the timeframe or what is the process frame, if you will, in terms of steps between someone receiving a Target Letter and