In federal prison cohen told abc news trump was aware of hush money payment made to Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels and he personally directed those payments. He directed me to make the payments. He directed me to become involved in these matters. Including the one with mcdougal which is really between him and david pecker and then david peckers counsel. I just reviewed the documents in order to protect him. I gave loyalty to someone who truthfully does not deserve loyalty. He was trying to hide what you were doing, correct . Correct. And he knew it was wrong . Of course. And he was doing that to help his election . You have to remember at what point in time that this matter came about, two weeks or so before the election, post the billy bush comments. So, yes, he was very concerned about how this would affect the election. To help his campaign . To help him and the campaign. Hes talking to George Stephanopoulos. This is as nbc news confirms trump was in the room during the august 25th meeting with cohen and National Enquirer chief executive and close trump friend david pecker during the hush money discussions. Cohen said he is done being loyal to trump and done lying but the president is not done lying. Lets listen. The special counsel did say that that he that you were doing your best to tell the truth about everything related to their investigation, everything related to russia. Do you think President Trump is telling the truth about that . No. And are you still cooperating . If they want me im here and willing to answer whatever additional questions they may have for me. So you are saying there are certain areas you cant get into because you are still cooperating with them. Correct. And out of respect for process. And Robert Mueller issued a rebuke of another cooperating witness in his probe, former National Security adviser michael flynn. He will be sentenced next week after pleading guilty to lying to the fbi about contacts with the russian ambassador. In a court filing this week, flynns lawyers noted that he was interviewed without a lawyer and wasnt told that lying to the fbi was a crime. In a memo to the court muellers team argued agents followed protocol, arguing nothing about the way the interview was arranged or conducted caused the defendant to make false statements to the fbi and fly flynn chose to make false statements and the incoming Vice President and other members of the president ial transition team. For more im joined by Texas Congress woman Sheila Jackson lee and former fbi official frank flag uzi. I want to start with the law, frank. This guy is not a perfect witness but he resembles to me, he reminds me of john dean in watergate. Nobody likes john dean but he had a great memory and it turned out he was telling the truth and they proved out with the tapes from the white house. Dean had nixon nailed. Tell me about this guy, im calling citizen cohen. So first, people need to understand that the feds dont make criminal cases on the backs of boy scouts and sunday school teachers. They flip people who have committed crimes and have information of value. For whatever reason those people who have information of value decide and become motivated to do the right thing and help out. So in my opinion, while were all focused on cohens tremendous value to the Southern District of new york case and the payments to women and all of that illegal structuring of those payments, even perhaps placing trump in the room with david pecker from ami and coen when that and Michael Cohen when the criminal acts were discussed. I think the value of cohen will play out over the years and his history the history will shape his legacy and that will be his cooperation with mueller. Dont forget, mueller issued a filing saying that cohen has provided significant assistance at the core of the russian inquiry. Ultimately while were all focused on a felony right now and sdny and possible impeachment implications, i dont think the senate, twothirds of the senate, will bite on that. I think what will turn the tide is the russian case and coens help with that, corroborating what mueller has, is critical to that. Congress woman, talk about that. Because youre on the Judiciary Committee but well informed on foreign policy. Tell me how you think the russian piece of this as cohen continues to talk as hes in prison for three years and keeps talking about the russia piece. Well, chris, as you well know, the Mueller Investigation started on the russian piece. It started on the question of how much the russians interfered with the 2016 election. So the remarks are accurate. It is the pinnacle, if you will. But what surrounds the pinnacle is all of the other additions of bad behavior by the president of the United States now confirmed by his counsel mr. Cohen, citizen cohen. We want the Mueller Report to be finished to trace the dots as to the relationship between the meeting held in trump tower, the claim to want dirt on Hillary Clinton, and how that impacted the campaign. But at the same time, mr. Cohen has indicated mr. Trump was in a meeting dealing with david pecker to make sure you catch and kill right before the election. So i would say the Mueller Report is a top of the mountain. But what mr. Cohen has brought about reinforced the president s continuous ability to lie. I think that is well said. Let me ask you, jason. Because what i like about cohens testimony there actually conversations with George Stephanopoulos who got him to talk. I thought it was interesting, we know it is about the election and a Campaign Expenditure and the 130 and the 150 to pay for the womens silence was a Campaign Event and an expenditure because it occurred after the access hollywood ta tape and when he was in doo doo and he says these things about women that he pays them off with impunity. And that he gets other people to help him pay those people off with impunity. What i thought was interesting about what cohen had to say, there is only one small slither of a way and white house tried to pull this off of suggesting we knew it was wrong. The only way the president could weasel out is to say i knew it was wrong but i didnt know it was illegal. And coen could say he knew it was illegal and wrong. So the president is surrounded by people more than capable of telling him to bre to break t law and he directed them to break the law any way. And that is why you hire a lawyer. And since the sentence, President Trump and his republican alleys have allies argue that cohen shouldnt be believed. I get back to the fact that cohen is a liar and i dont draw conclusions when somebody lies to congress. This is someone who surreptitiously recording you and now known as a criminal liar. Terrible. And yet this is someone in your inner circle. Look, it happens. I hire usually good people. But it just happened. The fact that you are giving credence to someone who is a convicted special counsel has it in the court documents. He is a self admitted liar. You all know that. And senator grassley and this is flackery. When you have nothing to say except the boss said this, ditto. And here is how Michael Cohen rebutted those claims today. So why should we believe you now . Because the special counsel stated emphatically that the information that i gave to them was credible and helpful. There is a substantial amount of information that they possess that corroborates the fact that i am telling the truth. Frank, go over that again about how people who flip are not the most pleasant people because they are flipping for a reason, for self preservation and yet when is the green light go on and you say i believe him now . Well, when there is corroboration. Your viewers should know that nothing is brought on in terms of charges on the word of one person. Right. There is a massive investigation. There is corroboration. And i think that is really cohens value, to corroborate what is already known, fill in some of the blanks that other people have shared and then it all comes together and you have that human that human face put to it by Michael Cohen. Dont forget, when it comes to russia, there is classified intelligence. There are human sources, and technical sources, what mueller needs is someone to come into the room and go, yeah, that is right. I was there for that or i heard that talked about. That helps tremendously and that is what his value is. Why did i know George Stephanopoulos asked if he would keep lying about russia and they left it at that. Why would he be hesitant to say what the president is lying about in particular on russia . Well, first, i think he is respecting the process. I think hes been read the riot act by the special counsel team that he should not and quite frankly even this interview with abc is probably problematic and causing some consternation. But he doesnt want to spill what he knows, what he doesnt know. Remember, hes going to prison for three years. At some point he may decide hes had enough of the inside of a cell and needs to come forward even more and cooperate even more and i think hes trying to figure out what his role is going to be and when that will happen. Congressman, youre very high ranking on the house Judiciary Committee as you come in with jerry nadler as chair and you are two or three down. Do you think youll be as member i know you cant make the call but do you expect to call cohen as a witness up there on the hill . I think we absolutely need to have mr. Cohen as a witness. Already some of the committees have made invitations. I expect the Judiciary Committee will likely consider doing the same. But let me also speak to the point of director mueller and his investigation. His silence is golden. His silence is only evidence by the patter of feet into the courtroom and the sound of the gavel saying guilty. Hes not going to be talking about what cohen has given him, what flynn gave, except for flynns great missteps today. Hes only going to make sounds by the constant indictments. And therefore cohen is going to be vital in affirming meetings, along with remember now, the enormous amount of tapes that were taken from Michael Cohens law office. They are still going through. So i can imagine, like john dean, that final tape that ultimately got Richard Nixon to resign, there may be that smoking gun tape. And mueller doesnt want to blow it. He wants to give us a report that congress will have the responsibility to do its duty. I hope my republican friends will begin to see the red, white and blue flag before they see the party flag. Well, that is june 23rd tape where you had nixon ordering the fbi to pull back from a case because of the cia operation. Any way, President Trump and Kellyanne Conway are defending trumps alleged role in directing cohen in the hush money payments by arguing they werent a crime. Lets watch this flackery. Michael cohen pled guilty to something that is not even a crime. Wait a minute. These are Campaign Nobody except for me would be looked at like this. Nobody. You have federal election commissioners, former ones and you have people who are election law experts saying that just because people who said they were asked to commit a crime here, there is not a crime. One guy said today that Michael Cohen pled guilty to something that is not a crime. The problem they face here, the trump finds is that david pecker said it is a crime. David pecker and Michael Cohen and his lawyer said he was committing a crime. They told him it was a crime. And ask john edwards. It is not like we dont have a precedent for people being investigated. John edwards got investigated under the Obama Administration for this kind of behavior. So the president cant claim that he doesnt know how this operates today. I think it put it together, the circumstance of the ive said this before. As we say in washington, what goes around comes around. That access Hollywood Tape of trump put away billy bushs job and trump got through it but he continues to chase him because that is what he was covering up, that misbehavior. And he knows perfectly well this isnt the ome time. These are the two people weve heard about. Who knows how much catch and kill have to go back to the congress woman. You have texas colleagues or republicans more than you like. Your surrounded by republicans. When you sense they will when do you sense they will crack like they did with nixon . Well first of all, chris, the Judiciary Committee is going to be moving forward on basic factfinding just because we have the responsibility to do so. Mr. Cohen will be part of it. Some other actors in this process will be part of it. Trying to build toward understanding more of what occurred both in the Campaign Finance violations and certainly in matters that are constitutional that dont believe or are not a impeach. Inquiry per se. But what i would say to my colleagues and when they might crack is, again, there is such a long litany of the lies that the white house has told, there are so many actors that have already been indicted. There are companies indicted that have surrounded the Trump Campaign and there are 13 russian on its indicted that surrounded the Trump Campaign. They did the democratic hacking. And the only thing i would say is to do a little reading, find that final smoking gun that i truly believe among the tapes that mr. Cohen has, that mueller is now reviewing and i think that that is going to be the step that will move us toward making a decision to respond to the American People and that is to hold those accountable that have broken the law. That is a simple premise. It is not witch hunting or partisan politics. It is holding them accountable and making sure that the white house and the presidency is held with great integrity. Well said. Thank you all. What an Important Program tonight. U. S. Congress woman Sheila Jackson of texas and Jason Johnson and jack flag luzzi. And were at six trump operations under criminal investigation. The Trump Campaign, the trump transition, the trump inauguration, the trump administration, the Trump Organization, and the trump foundation. How dangerous are all of these investigations coming from six dictions at trump . And following weeks of voter fraud allegations in the race of North Carolina ninth congressional, democrats and republicans are faced of a possibility of a doover for the primary and the general. Well have the latest on that from the chairman of the North CarolinaDemocratic Party. And Celebrity Apprentice chief of staff edition, after a chaotic search for number one, trump announced via twitter tonight that Mick Mulvaney, the current director of the office of management and budget will become his catch this his acting chief of staff. Isnt that redundant. Theyre all acting. And a moral echo of what happened on this day six years ago and we must remember it. This is hardball, where the action is. Rch, read earnings reports, looked at chart patterns. Ive even built my own historic trading model. And youre still not sure if you want to make the trade . Exactly. Sounds like a case of analysis paralysis. Is there a cure . Td ameritrades trade desk. They can help gut check your strategies and answer all your toughest questions. Sounds perfect. See, your stress level was here and i got you down to here, ive done my job. Call for a strategy gut check with td ameritrade. Spread a little love today spread a little love myy way spread a Little Something to remember philadelphia cream cheese. Made with fresh milk and real cream makes your recipes their holiday favourites. The holidays are made with philly. 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So when i say, drivers who switched from geico to esurance saved an average of 412, you probably wont believe me. Hey, actor lady whose scene was cut. Hi. But you can believe this esurance employee, nancy abraham. Seriously, send her an email and ask her yourself. No emails. No emails. When insurance is affordable, its surprisingly painless. This is moving day with the best inhome wifi experience and millions of wifi hotspots to help you stay connected. And this is moving day with Reliable Service appointments in a twohour window so youre up and running in no time. Show me decorating shows. This is staying connected with xfinity to make moving. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Stay connected while you move with the best wifi experience and twohour appointment windows. Click, call or visit a store today. Welcome back to hardball. The president ais ending the week under siege fighting a war on multiple fronts. We know there are six, six operations connected to the president under investigation. The Trump Campaign, the trump transition team, the trump inauguration, the trump administration, the Trump Organization, and the trump foundation. All under criminal scrutiny. The six pack of investigations are said to include a number of alleged illegal activities like Campaign Finance violations, accounting fraud, tax fraud, conspiracy, obstruction of justice and lying to the fbi. Four people linked to the Trump Campaign itself have already been indicted by the special counsel. And one of muellers key operating witnesses Michael Cohen told abcs George Stephanopoulos today that Nothing Happened in the Trump Organization without the ceo that is donald trump himself, knowing about it. So the fish rots from the head. Lets watch. Hes saying very clearly that he never directed you to do anything wrong. Is that true . I dont think there is anybody that believes that. First of all, nothing at the Trump Organization was ever done unless it involved mr. Trump. [ technical difficulties ] and david k. Johnson, founder of d. C. Report. Org and author of the making of donald trump. I want to go with the trump whisperer. Like the great bill clinton was worrying about monica and doing health care and still operating as if everything is calm. Has he got the kind of temperament to handle six investigations, what we call a six pack of problems . No. Donald is not a high energy person. You know that because he denounces other people as being low energy people. And this is going to distract him a great deal. Hes going to put a lot of effort to figure out how to distract other people and muddy the waters and try to delegitimize this investigation and it is going to grow well beyond these six. I think we should start thinking about the shoes that will drop and that Robert Mueller is a legal centipede. Julia, what do you think of objectively, if there is a objective role, six investigations. Only one or two have to make it through the line. He doesnt need to be impeached six times. One would be enough. Even if he doesnt get impeached, it sure doesnt look good. If you remember the Republican National convention and how everybody including Rudy Giuliani and donald trump were banging on about law and order and they are the party of law and order and it doesnt look like it now. And he also said what it would be like if hillary won. Right. I think it was going to be a bad four years any way. But, yeah, this is seems unprecedented. Gene, i dont know how many lawyers he has, but he needs a team of lawyers for each six fronts. Were way beyond look good or bad at this point. For all but the most dedicated trump base and then there are people for whom he can still do no wrong and being persecuted and he feeds this sort of narrative and there are people who buy it. But everybody else, i think, is getting a portrait, this mosaic that paints a really ugly picture of this guy and the way he does business and the people around him. And it is going to fill in and it will be become clearer and clearer and unavoidable. And no, he doesnt have enough lawyers. He doesnt have enough lawyers in the white House Counsel office. He has his outside counsel of uneven quality, shall we say. With Rudy Giuliani is one of them. When does he start selling the boats and furniture to pay for these guys. Throughout the Campaign Trump warped voters warned voters if Hillary Clinton were elected she would be under investigation for a long, long time. Lets watch and listen. If Hillary Clinton were to be elected it would create an unprecedented and protracted constitutional crisis. Havent we just been through a lot with the clintons. Hillary has engaged in a criminal massive enterprise and coverups like probably nobody ever before. Her current scandals and controversy will continue throughout her president ially and well make it honestly, look, it is virtually impossible for her to govern. Hillary clinton will be under investigation for a long, long time. For her many crimes against our nation and our people and our democracy. Likely concluding in a criminal trial. What do you think of that, joey . It seems like that all of the and there is asymmetry here. All the right had to do is pound the table and say words like whitewater which nothing was there or benghazi and nothing was there but they say the word over and over again, it meant something to them. And emails, remember. Where is the crimes here. What i think is ironic is that as the same day that you had news breaking that there is a federal investigation into trumps inaugural committee, the hill republicans on the hill are still having hearings about the clinton foundation. It is beyond ironic. Let me ask you, david, about the way he does business. We heard from Michael Cohen tonight. Ban bank thanks to the interview with stephanopoulos. Everything went through mr. Trump. It is mr. Trump. Hes the big man. Hes the boss. Everything goes through him. Now he has the problem of everything will be blamed appropriately on him. You cant say well some underling did it or some lawyer did it and the big shot approved everything. That is a problem for him in the courtroom. In the courtroom it is a big problem but in the public sphere donald will do what hes always done and say other people made mistakes and didnt follow the directions or didnt know they were doing that, in an effort to evade responsibility. Remember, this is a guy in the past beat four federal grand juries and got out of some other legal trouble by ratting out other people. Those options are no longer open to him. Who has he got in the room with him. I ask who is in the room . Gene, does anybody have reporting . You have colleagues and always watching the white house. I dont hear any other voice rudy. That is about it and im not sure hes in the room with him. There are there are some friends, acquaintances from new york who are in touch with him, but i dont think theyre necessarily in the bunker with him. They call and give i know one person im thinking of who calls and gives advice that the president doesnt follow. But keeps that line of communication opens in case maybe hell take the advice. It is a nice place living upstairs in the white house. Ive been up there once with president first bush and if you are up there all alone and just melania with him and ivanka give me a break. And fox and friends. He calls up fox. That is who he watches, that is where he gets his information from. And giuliani is not there. Hes in the gulf drumming up business. The gulf. The gulf. Out there somewhere. When i what i have heard is that at times when hes really freaking out about this and in a rage, really ivanka is the only person who can talk to him. So i think youd have to say shes inside. She can go in and sort of calm him down. But where is the value added . Oh, i dont think there is. That is what i mean. You want somebody around who thinks differently than you and smarter than you. And objectively jared and ivankas advice has been 100 wrong or bad. Get yourself a good tact is before you have bigger problems and deal with it now and i dont know he has six problems on his back. What a weekend hes got. Joey and eugene and david, thank you. Up next, after weeks of voter fraud allegations and unresolved midterm race in North Carolina is still unsolved. Democrats and republicans are pl planning for a doover because nobody well the winner doesnt look too clean, does he . This is hardball where the action is. At fidelity, we help you prepare for the unexpected with Retirement Planning and advice for what you need today and tomorrow. Because when youre with fidelity, theres nothing to stop you from moving forward. Because when youre with fidelity, havi is not always easy. 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Join over 250,000 patients who have chosen humira. Ask about the 1 prescribed biologic by dermatologists. Humira. And go. From capital one. Nd i switched to the spark cash card i earn unlimited 2 cash back on everything i buy. And last year, i earned 36,000 in cash back. Which i used to offer Health Insurance to my employees. Whats in your wallet . Im ray and i quit smoking with chantix. Smoking. It dictates your day. I didnt like something having control over me. I wanted to stop. The thing is i didnt know how. Chantix, along with support, helps you quit smoking. Chantix reduced my urge to smoke to the point that i could quit. When you try to quit smoking, with or without chantix, you may have nicotine withdrawal symptoms. Some people had changes in behavior or thinking, aggression, hostility, agitation, depressed mood, or suicidal thoughts or actions with chantix. Serious side effects may include seizures, new or worse heart or blood vessel problems, sleepwalking, or allergic and skin reactions which can be lifethreatening. Stop chantix and get help right away if you have any of these. Tell your Healthcare Provider if youve had depression or other Mental Health problems. Decrease alcohol use while taking chantix. Use caution when driving or operating machinery. The most common side effect is nausea. For me chantix worked. Boom. End of story. Talk to your doctor about chantix. Welcome back to hardball. It is five weeks since the midterm elections but the race for North Carolina ninth Congressional District is still undecided. The board of elections is investigating allegations of absentee ballot tampering on behalf of republican mark harris who appeared to defeat his challenger dan mccready by a slim margin. A political operative working for harris has been linked to past Election Fraud allegations and in the interview today harris confirmed reports it was his decision to hire douse for the campaign but at no time did he think he was doing anything illegal. Well the state board of elections must decide if a new election is necessary. The Republican Controlled Legislature in North Carolina passed a bill that would require a new primary election giving republicans a chance to run a different candidate other than harris. For more im joined by wayne goodman, the chair of the North CarolinaDemocratic Party. Thank you for joining us. This is a tricky situation. But i have to ask you, have you ever heard of this gimmick where you you write in for a sample ballot for people that dont know what is going on and show up at their house and ask for the ballot. Have you heard of this harvesting operation before . No, this is a new thing to me. And ill tell you, this is a disaster for democracy and a disaster for the republicans in the ninth Congressional District and we are in unchaert ub chartered territory. Do you know if the Republican Organization was behind this particular act of betraying the rights of voters by harvesting if you will, grabbing their absentee ballot and filling it out themselves or destroying if they dont like how it was filled out . Well day by day, we hear more and more evidence drip by drip and this mccray dallas was worked for republican candidates for years and his criminal background and the other misbehavior and activity of his like this goes back many election cycles. Mark harris should have known. And for him to finally admit he hired this fellow despite that, that is quite an admission. What do you make of the idea of paying a guy a bounty on the basis of how many absentee ballots he could bring in successfully. Hes not paying to vote or walk around money, this is paid for results and not efforts in an election. I never heard of that before. You get paid by bringing in the vote and that means you will bring it in and this guy has brought in like 97 returns on that countries situation. This behavior, the statistics alone show that it is impossible for it to happen without some sort of criminal activity and the word now is that he pocketed 800 ballots he was holding on to once he vote what the vote totals were from absentee ballots. So we were hearing this is a game and a crime and mark harris needs to answer for that. We need to know what did m wht did mr. Harris know and now hes a toxic candidate for the Republican Party. What do you think about having a general election and a primary election so the republicans can get rid of this guy you call toxic . As a candidate . Originally the Republicanled Legislature didnt want to have a new primary but after a photograph emerged of mr. Dallas being tied to the hip literally sidebyside with mr. Harris, it popped into a piece of legislation that passed. That is an admission by the state Republican Party here in North Carolina that mr. Harris is a toxic candidate and theyre looking for somebody else. That is an admission. If harris knew about this hanky panky and this corruption and stealing of votes, should he go to jail . Somebody is going to jail. I dont know exactly what mr. Harris knew specifically but if he knew. If he knew, and if he directed it, then i do believe Law Enforcement authorities should question him. But ill tell you, we must have this evidentiary hearing and it is set now for early january and we will know a lot more then than now. But mr. Harris has a lot of questions to answer and i believe mark harris is in trouble and certainly mccray dallas is in trouble. Somebody is going to jail. Is this Good Government for North Carolina, to do over the primary and the general without mr. Dallas involved. Wont that be a good result for your state . Well, we want to have an election that is free and fair where we know the truth and that the results reflect the voices of the voters. And of course ive said as the chair of the North CarolinaDemocratic Party we needed a new election from the getgo and the election rigging and tampering goes much deeper than that and this is fraud and if the authorities believe there needs to be a primary, then so be it. But it is imperative that we have a new general election because mark harris and his campaign and mccray dallas broke the law. Well with someone who proudly went to unc, i root your state well and i hope to clear this baby up and look better for North Carolina if you get finished up with. Thank you for coming on tonight. Up next, President Trumps Celebrity Apprentice style search for a new chief of staff coming to an end. Apparently a dead end with the president announcing over twitter tonight that the name of a new catch this acting white house chief of staff. What does that mean . Watching hardball. burke parking splat. And we covered it. Talk to farmers. We know a thing or two because weve seen a thing or two. We are farmers. Bumpadum, bumbumbumbum with Retirement Planning and advice for what you need today and tomorrow. Because when youre with fidelity, theres nothing to stop you from moving forward. Because when youre with fidelity, [narrator] meet sharks newest robot vacuum. It powerfully cleans from floors to carpets, even pet hair, with ease, and now for cleaning surfaces above the floor, it comes with a built in shark handheld. One dock, two sharks. The shark ion robot cleaning system. The zip code youre born into can determine your future. Your school. Your job. Your dreams. Your problems. indistinct shouting but at the y, we create opportunities for everyone, no matter who you are or where youre from. For a better us, donate to your local y today. Welcome back to hardball. After a dramafilled search for a new chief of staff, President Trump announced in a tweet that he has picked Mick Mulvaney from the office of management and budget as his figure this one out if you can acting chief of staff. Nbc news reporting mulvaney asked for the acting title and he wanted to enter the position with a safe exit in place. This is like colin powell. You have to have an exit strategy. The reporting is that mulvaney told us as late as thursday night he wasnt eager to take the job and didnt think he would get it. President trump was desperate to kill the story line nobody wants to be his chief of staff. Just a few minutes ago he tweeted for the record, there were many people that wanted to be the white house chief of staff. Over the past week the president seemed to enjoy hyping up the selection process. Lets watch how he did it. Were interviewing people now for chief of staff, yes. How long is that [ inaudible question ] five people. Really good ones. Terrific people. Mostly wellknown but terrific people. But he couldnt seem to decide if he wanted spl some organize his presidency or be an enabler. Watch. I want something that is strong and i want somebody with my vision and at the same time im open to ideas. As the a. P. Put it, it had the feel of an unfolding reality tv show. Jennifer rubin and Jonathan Capehart and White House Reporter for the associated press. And this isnt like picking a contestant. This is like a contestant picking a moderator. He wants somebody to be his moderator but he wants to do whatever he wants to do but someone to say you cant do that but dont tell me that too often. He told people at the beginning of the search he didnt want to recreate the first few months of john kelly when he did curtail access to the oval office and put up restrictions for the president and did some things to stream line the policy process in the building and eventually trump chafed and they had a falling out and began to clash by the end barely speaking e. Did want someone in there and he likes mulvaney experience and he likes the idea hes a former congressman and he knows he needs better relationships with the hill Going Forward and although mulvaney not most popular. Does he want a chief of staff or a concierge. Someone who will do things for him and fix all of the problems. Fix the plumbing and the toilet is stopped up. Can you do that or get my napkins. That is the best word. Not a chief of staff but a concierge. Someone who will do what trump asks him to do. And it is not what what you are talking about what john kelly tried to do is impose regular order on the white house. The president doesnt want regular order. This is not a normal white house and so the fact that he chose someone to be chief of staff is what is so surprising because we were talking months ago about the fact he very well could try to run the government without run the white house without one. Jake, get in here. I want some of that apple pie we had for lunch today. It is 4 00. Is that what he wants. This is the way he is acting in the title. They are all acting. That is why it is absurd and they serve at the pleasure of the president. It is interesting that he had to choose someone on a friday evening because the story was becoming embarrassing. You kind of cringe for him the storyline on meet the press. He didnt want to be more of this guy cant find a chief of staff. But the bottom line is he couldnt find a chief of staff, could he . A number of top candidates pulled themself what did Chris Christie pull off yesterday . If he didnt want the job. He doesnt want to maintain the relationship with the president and he might want to move into the building at some point in the tenure and he has a boom coming out and want tos to promote that and make years of money after service and there is the Jared Kushner issue. Hes would going to make his soninlaw chief of staff . Who pushed that through. That was floated around. Mbs push that one . But kushner if asked, he would serve but not something he wanted to do. He feels like hes in a better position to help the president where he is now and remember chief of staff could be a thankless job for this president. There is no need for kushner. And we know washington pretty well. One guy wants david bossie and i like the guy. Hes a cowboy and outrider and volunteer fireman and then the ultimate inside washington guy that knows all of the right plals places at night and that is wayne berman. They dont make any sense. Because he doesnt have a normal set of criteria. He wants the guy who looks the part or says the right thing that is wayne berman. Or decides that hes compliments him the best. His decisionmaking is not the process of a norm president. Why didnt he pick urban or a tough guy. Perfect. Hes in pennsylvania. Perfect candidate. Why not . Too tough for him. He felt he does get along with mulvaney. He said he wanted to have a personal connection with the chief of staff and hes in the oval office frequently to brief him. And that wont last. And Michael Cohen sent a clear message to the president telling him he no longer has his loyalty. Talk about goodbye. Lets watch. You lied for him for a long time. More than ten years . Why . Out of loyalty. Out of loyalty to him. I followed a bad path and hence how we started this conversation. I had my freedom and i will not be the villain as i told you once before. I will not be the villain of his story. Accord ill call him citizen cohen because he said ill work for the country now. No longer worker for trump. Hes been saying that for a few weeks if you read Emily Jane Fox and vanity fair that he feels so betrayed by the president after going saying to her i would take a bullet for donald trump and then when everything fell apart, and he is sending Smoke Signals and flares, where is my pardon, Say Something to to hang me in the to keep me in your corner and didnt happen and so Michael Cohen goes out there and he cooperates with sdny, with mueller, he does interviews where he makes it clear we are done here. And that interview with George Stephanopoulos today is like the final nail in the coffin. I will i am no longer loyal to you. You were not loyal to me. And so were going to have it out. John and then jennifer, who has he stuck his neck out for yet . The president. Very few. Hes defended ivanka, his daughter and Jared Kushner. But that is it. With this president , loyalty extends within his own family and not much further. That is always the case. The romanov. And doesnt get much in return. Why should somebody stick the neck out for them and if he doesnt for them. You have to be reciprocal. If you are going to gang together, you gang together. The reason people do it is for all of the normal reasons. They want it on their resume or the power or access to power. The problems with all of these people is that trump never expected any of them to turn. He has this view of himself as loyal. He has this view of himself as we want to continue to continue the analogy, the manager of the hotel and all of the people love him. They all love me. They all love me. So when someone turns on him, i think trump is genuinely shocked. But this guy wants personal and moral redemption. His life as a lawyer is over. This is how he regains i think his own self respect and standing within his family and the people who know him. He also needs to make money after he leaves money in a few years. Why do i keep thinking tony curtis when i see this guy. He looks like tony curtis. And the round table is sticking with us. And up next theyll tell me something i dont know. Youre watching hardball. He h, your roof struggles to support the heavier me. [laughter] whoo. [crash] and your cutrate insurance might not pay for this. So get allstate, you could save money and be better protected from mayhem like me. Mayhem is everywhere. So get an allstate agent. Are you in good hands . Who doesni do. Ve a deal . Check out the united explorer card. Savin on this savin on this savin in here. Rewarded learn more at the explorer card dot com. She pretty much lives in her favorite princess dress. But once a week i let her play sheriff so i can wash it. I use tide to get out those week old stains and downy to get it fresh and soft. You are free to go. Tide and downy together. [narrator] for powerful suction, you need a shark. With two swappable batteries, at maximum suction the shark ion f80 has more run time than the dyson v10 absolute. Or, choose the upright model for whole home cleaning only from shark. Or, choose the upright model for whole home cleaning were back with the hardball round table. Jennifer, tell me something i dont know. Its friday night. There you go. Republicans are desperate. Republicans who didnt support trump are desperate to find someone who would challenge him and who is raising his profile. Larry hogan, the just reelected governor of maryland made a big speech and a nice splash at a conference this week of never trumpers. Wrote an oped for our paper on climate change. Hes going to be meeting with some pretty is Charlie Baker going to run . Hes even more popular. I havent heard his name. Listen, i think youre going to see a little bubble. Always look at people who win in bad times. Jonathan . Were all marveling at the photo from the White House Holiday Party of john kelly and reince priebus. News out, priebus, with the help of defense secretary james mattis, is joining the navy as a reserve officer. Reince priebus is . He comes from a family of naval isnt there i mean, gary hart was another one who was a reservist late in life. There are possibilities of the federal government shutting down. Tomorrow night, hosting at the white house, the congressional gala, the christmas party. There could be some talks there. Although, Senate Minority leader schumer, expected incoming House Speaker nancy pelosi, dont expect to be at the party. The press pool, we are supposed to be there. We expect to hear the president talking about what he wants to see before does he set up one of those lines where he and the first lady shake hands with all members of congress . We could see. He did not do that every party last year, but there is an expectation. Hes never done it for us, has he . Not for there was no there was no media Holiday Party last year. Barack obama, george w, theyd stand there with four hours one time. The print people, tv, radio. He doesnt want to meet us, does he . He had an event last year with no handshake line. So much for the fake media. Doesnt look good for him. When we return, ill finish with the moral echo of what happened on this day six years ago. Youre watching hardball. The greatest wish of all. Is one that brings us together. The lincoln wish list event is here. Sign and drive off in a new lincoln with 0 down, 0 due at signing, and a complimentary first months payment. Only at your lincoln dealer. And a complimentary first months payment. Welcome to tide pods talk with gronk. Im gronk these are tide pods. This is not. Even this entire bottle cant beat tide pods. To recap ugh. Tide pods. If its clean, its got to be tide. You might or joints. Hing for your heart. But do you take something for your brain. With an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in Clinical Trials to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. With Retirement Planning and advice for what you need today and tomorrow. Because when youre with fidelity, theres nothing to stop you from moving forward. honking when your craving strikes, you need your wing nut. no one can totally satisfy a craving, quite like your wing nut. So shark invented duo clean. While deep cleaning carpets, the added soft brush roll picks up large particles, gives floors a polished look, and fearlessly devours piles. Duo clean technology, corded and cordfree. Let me finish tonight with a moral echo of what happened on this day six years ago. It was on december 14th, 2012, that 20 first graders and six teachers were gunned down at Sandy Hook Elementary School in new town, connecticut. Remember . Of course you do. Heres president barack obama that day addressing the country. They had their entire lives ahead of them. Birthdays, graduations, weddings, kids of their own. Among the fallen were also teachers, men and women who devoted their lives to helping our children fulfill their dreams. So our hearts are broken today. It is important to recognize that today, those lost first graders at sandy hook would have been seventh graders. One of the questions we should ask each of the 2020 candidates for president is, where do they stand on gun safety . We already know what this president stands for. Himself. Thats hardball for now. All in with chris hayes starts right now. Tonight on all in. Nothing that the Trump Organization was ever done that was not run through mr. Trump. Walls are closing in. At least three federal criminal inquiries enveloping trumps business, his inaugural committee, and his campaign. I was doing a lot of Different Things when i was running. Tonight, Michael Cohen on the president s lies. The man doesnt tell the truth. And why the mueller team believes him. Theres a substantial amount of information that they possess that corroborates the fact that i am telling the truth. Then ivanka is very much involved, and shes been involved. The