Katy Tur hosts coverage of national and international news, including breaking stories. Something extraneous to the facts of the investigation just to get them to lie. That is clearly not whats going on here. Mueller has 100 valid reasons to want to talk to trump. What we have here is a perjury risk. Its a great risk. Thats because trump isnt capable of telling the truth, and particularly when he knows he is in trouble if he does. So if itts not a perjury trap, which is a technical term. This audio leaked of devin nunes, its not surprising he is carrying water for the president , but it is surprising he would say on the record out loud, out loud to a number of donors, that it ultimately Doesnt Matter What Mueller comes out with, that sessions Wont Unrecrews Ause and its j. Its just up to us to protect the president. Thats saying if Robert Mueller comes back and says we found conspiracy, we found whatever, it doesnt matter for the republicans . Is that a widely held belief or it is an unprecedented level of corruption around this president , around this presidency, around washington, d. C. Unprecedented in the modern era. I do think that human beings have a tendency to think we are live in the best of times or the worst of times, and we lose historical perspective. But the amount of lying, his daily incitement of, his scapegoating of minority populations, his creation of a great victim class that thinks there is the victims of a conspiracy in the aforementioned scapegoated minority populations, all of these things that were seeing play out every day are not normal, and they are, frankly, unprecedented around the office of president of the United States. And they are unprecedented in any healthy democracy anywhere. Getting back to Rudy Giuliani and the president s strategy specifically when it comes to Robert Mueller, take a listen or take a look at what aaron blake and the Washington Postis writing about today. Warning that a prolonged investigation is potentially going to reflect poorly on mueller. The prolonged nature of the whole thing has also some potential Strategic Value for the trump team and negative consequences for mueller. Polls suggest that americans are gradually growing impatient with the investigation and in some cases are warming to trump and his allies arguments against the legitimacy. The longer this goes on the more the feelings have a chance to fester and the more people might begin to doubt that mueller has the goods. Now take this reporting from Axios On Giulianis Media Strategy for the mueller probe. Giuliani is publicly setting up mueller with expectations. He must know mueller cant meet them. There is no way mueller is wrapping this thing up by September 1st and there is no way mueller will agree to an interview with trump on the condition he wont ask two of the critical questions about obstruction of justice. By claiming them as reasonable acts when mueller ultimately
doesnt deliver by labor day, he helps fuel the bases rage through the midterms. Phil, does that line up with the reporting that you are gathering and what you are hearing from inside the white house and inside this legal team . Yeah. And thats absolutely right, katy. That is in line with the reporting i am hearing. There are a couple of things going on here. On the one hand, trump and his team are trying to say its time for mueller to put up or shut up and tell the American People what he found, what he hasnt found, clear the president , close up shop and move on. Mueller needs that interview with the president. The Special Counsel feels a need to question the president about these events not only during the campaign, but obviously the Special Counsel wants to talk to him about actions he took as president , which are the most sensitive in the mind of trumps lawyers. And trumps lawyers are slowing this down. They are not they are rejecting the terms of muellers interview of the therg dragging it out and calling for it to speed up and be over, and that
just doesnt square. I am hearing from trumps allies they are going to be making an Impeachment Argument in the midterm elections, warning trump voters if you dont vote in november to keep the house in republican hands, the democrats, if they take over the majority of the house of representatives, agenda item number one is impeachment. Impeaching president trump. They are making the case that the midterms are all about protecting the trump presidency, which is what you saw in that devin nunes audio. Mimi . I wanted to point out something in that Washington Post article. Its not the longer it takes, the more we question Whether Mueller has the goods. The longer the investigation takes, the more likely it is hes finding things to keep investigating. Robert mueller is not going to be wasting his time with 13 or however many investigators it is, and fbi agents, working on
this if there is nothing there. I am not saying ohow many peopl will be indicted. There is clearly real conduct for them to be looking at, as has already come out. They are facing a president and his team and supporters who are continually hammering the investigation and trying to undercut it. Look at the Favorable Unfavorable numbers for mueller. 32 favorable. 36 unfavorable. Steve . Lets talk about the political strategy here. Its a desperate political strategy. When you look at the special election in ohio, if it was president marco rubio, this republican would have won by 15 points. But because its president trump, the republican barely beat a democratic candidate. And so all of the signs point to a blue tsunami coming, but in a fight. There are only two ways to win. You can bring your opponent to submission. Think germany and japan after world war ii. Or you can break their will to fight. Think of the United States in the vietnam war. The strategy is fundamentally one about exhausting and wearing out the will to fight and resist of democratic voters by inciting the base. Trump needs that basin cited. He needs it to turn out to hold back as best as possible this blue wave is coming, and the degree to which they constantly lie, its disorienting. People cant get their heads around the facts because people arent used to responsible political leaders constantly lying to them. So when you talk to democratic voters, you talk to democrats, you talk to people who oppose trump, one of the main features that they will tell you is how they are exhausted by all of it. And so exhaustion of your opponent becomes a fundamental strategic aim of the constant lying, the constant gaslighting, the constant scapegoating. Any diminution of republican turnout is going to be fatal, and will simply increase the
size of the majority. Of course, impeachment will polarize the electorate, but it will drive turnout favorably for deputies. Its a very dangerous strategy for this president. Its a Strat Zwri Egy to divd fall, if thats of course. He has never made any pretense about being president of the country. He is the first president of the United States who is the leader of a faction. A leader of a minority faction that is increasingly at war with the rest of the country. Steve schmidt, you are staying with us. Phil rucker, mimi rocca, thank you so much. Next, chris collins, scott pruitt, team trump has a corruption problem. Do voters care . But on the inside, i feel chronic, widespread pain. Fibromyalgia may be invisible to others, but my pain is real. Fibromyalgia is thought to be caused by overactive nerves. Lyrica is believed to calm these nerves. Im glad my doctor prescribed lyrica. For some, lyrica delivers effective relief from moderate, to even severe Fibromyalgia Pain and improves function. Lyrica may cause serious allergic reactions, suicidal thoughts or actions. Tell your doctor right away if you have these, new or worse depression, unusual changes in mood or behavior, swelling, trouble breathing, rash, hives, blisters, muscle pain with fever, tired feeling or blurry vision. Common side effects dizziness, sleepiness, weight gain, swelling of hands, legs, and feet. Dont drink alcohol while taking lyrica. Dont drive or use machinery until you know how lyrica affects you. Those who have had a drug or Alcohol Problem may be more likely to misuse lyrica. With less pain, i can do more with my family. Talk to your doctor today. See if lyrica can help. My gums are irritated. I dont have to worry about that, do i . Actually, you do. Harmful bacteria lurk just below the gum line. Crest gum detoxify works below the gum line to neutralize harmful Plaque Bacteria and help reverse early gum damage. And, now theres new crest gum enamel repair. It gives you clinically proven healthier gums
and helps repair and strengthen weakened enamel. Gum detoxify and gum enamel repair, from crest. Gums are good, so is my checkup crest. Healthy, beautiful smiles for life. Are you ready to take your then you need xfinity xfi. . A more powerful way to stay connected. It gives you super fast speeds for all your devices, provides the most Wifi Coverage for your home, and lets you control your network with the xfi app. Its the ultimate wifi experience. Xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. Associates are shaping the v. A. This is on top of the gaggle of former around Current White House officials under fire for lavish spending because who could forget scott pruitt or tom price . Then there are those in trumps orbit who have been charged with lying to investigators. His former campaign chairman, his former Deputy Campaign manager, his First National security advisor, his former Foreign Policy advisor. As msnbcs first read puts it this morning, the party of trump has a corruption problem. Will the voters care . Back with me msnbc contributor Steve Schmidt and joining us is msnbc political analyst elise jordan. They are the mosts of the new podcast words matter, which debuted this week. Congratulations on the cast. Thank you very much. Thank you for that wonderful intro. Of course. I cant wait to listen to it. So i could have gone on with that intro. There were things we left out. Thats whats remarkable about this. There were a ton of things we left out. We could have gotten into the
trump d. C. Hotel. We could have got into the emaluments. But this level of corruption, what does it say about this administration and those donald trump surrounds himself . Its Donald Trumps main goal has been to enrich himself. Its always about donald trump. About his personal self interests. The most disturbing trend is in Foreign Policy where we arent sure the decisions being made, say to cozy up to saudi arabia has anything to do with Jared Kushner and his family. By being so blatant about their own personal interests, it enables everyone else in the Trump Administration to follow the lead and the tone thats set from the top. Weve seen it from the private planes to the Stock Trading by a member of congress who is one of trumps earliest supporters to now the v. A. , to members of
president s personal club who are overseeing the second largest bureaucracy in the u. S. Government. Steve, there is a poll taken by the Progressive Center for American Progress action fund that the Corruption Message is gaining traction against the gop. 54 of voters across 48 republican held congressional districts said republicans are more corrupt than democrats compared with 46 who said democrats are more corrupt. And even higher number of independents hold republicans responsible for corruption. 60 . Seems like this sounds like another election that we went through, i dont know, in 2006 or going back to the 90s . Small potatoes corruption. If you go back to 2006, you look whats going on in washington, d. C. Today, the culture around the lobbying community, jake abramov looks like a piper compared to these people. I mean, this is full on Banana Republic stuff. This doesnt happen in healthy
liberal dem ocracies. Its utterly lawless. The greed, corruption. Who is more corrupt, republicans or democrats . It speaks to a staggering failure on the part of the Democratic Party and its leaders to prosecute a case against this lawless and corrupt administration because what this administration is doing is ripping off the American People, and its not penny annie ripping off. Its wholesale stealing. Wholesale corruption. It is a level of disgustingness and behavior that is not ever been seen in the modern era in this country. Could it be hard for democrats to find one thing to target . They target so many things that the message just gets lost . I use this analogy. Its not perfect, but i like it. Donald trump is a man who has a stain on his shirt, a hot dog
mustard stain. Instead of changing his shirt, he gets ketchup on it and relish and hot sauce and grease. You end up looking at the shirt and saying, oh, thats the way the shirt is supposed to look. Thats a really dirty, nasty shirt. It needs to be boiled and put it with a bunch of bleach and stripped and cleansed. Thats what i think. And i think thats what the democrats message should be that this more as of corruption is intolerable and thats what they should be campaigning on. They shouldnt be talking about treason. They should be talking about how taxpayers are funding the personal enrichment of donald trump and his family and his cabinet. And they should put a plan forward to clean it up. If donald trump is voted out of office, are you going to rejoin the Republican Party . Are you going to feel better about the Republican Party . Not if they are putting money towards to Child Molesters in alabama like they did last year. Not if they are Funding Candidates that have credible
allegations of sexual assault. Not if they are, you know, the head of the rnc finance has been accused by many, steve nguyen, before he resigned. Unless they clean house, too, i dont see myself going lock step and barrel behind the Republican Party again because its just wrong. Thats not to mention the baby internment camps, the indecency, the cruelty, the meanness, the lying, the complicit nature of this republican majority with an attack on the country thats launched by the russian federation. So the Republican Party of Teddy Roosevelt and john mccain and Ronald Reagan and george w. Bush is dead. Its over. It doesnt exist anymore. It has been taken over lock, stock, and barrel. For there to be any redemption of a right of center Conservative Party in the United States of america means the party of trump must be destroyed politically. Its like a fire. Fires are a part of the
ecosystem. Part of the natural progress. And when the forest burns, its purified. There can be new growth. For there to be new growth of a conservative movement, of a right center party, the one that i joined in 1988, it needs to burn to the ground. And this is what we are going to be talking about on our podcast about how we do that, how we wrest away the ideals of personal liberty and individual responsibility and a Strong Defense without ballooning the national deficit. Yes. Words matter. Elise and steve, great to see you in person. Always good to see you. Up next, there is a storm brewing. The fact is, there are over ninetysix
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