Right now with money that we already have. I dont want to see a shutdown. Shutdown would be a terrible thing. Regardless of what i do, we already have as you know a lot of money where were building existing wall with existing funds, but i have a lot of opgsz. A border deal. The president would need to declare a national emergency. It wont be a perfect deal but it will be a good deal. I say to people ill support the deal for what is in it, dont judge it for what isness in it. The president is inclined to accept the agreement, move on, try to find money elsewhere and most likely declare an emergency. And that is where we start today. Breaking news on funding the government. President trump, the man behind the art of the deal, could be ready to settle for a deal, one he says hes not actually happy about. The president said just moments ago he does not want to see another shutdown, will review the latest bipartisan spending proposal from congress. This with just two days left before we could hit another Government Shutdown if things dont go the right way. But the president has not actually seen the deal yet. We do know the deal offers roughly a quarter of the money the president was asking for in border barrier funds. Lets just clarify that really quickly. Border barrier funds, and a wall are not necessarily the same thing. There is a very good chance its fencing and the president has had lots of different iterations of what he considers a wall. We also know that the republicans have a victory that they can claim. The new agreement has a provision that could allow the Trump Administration to increase the number of slots to shelter detained immigrants authorizing Homeland Security to fund about 40,000 beds for detainees. Joining us now is the New York TimesNational Immigration reporter caitlyn dickerson, because she actually follows this stuff very, very closely and knows all of these distinctions. I guess the issue here is this has been hard fought. We went through 35 days of a shutdown for it and both sides seem to be claiming something of a victory. The president which by the way, that is how it normally works. This is an opportunity to press your bipartisan horn. We have to make this really clear. Politics in the last few years, we are in this all or nothing, i, we, and i abuse you. In business and in our personal lives. Compromise is what you have to do. Compromise is the way a deal gets done. Two sides think they have something except the president s own side who has been making noise hes not happy but indicated he might sign t. What is your valuation of who got what . The biggest take away with this deal is there is actually little discussion about the border wall happening, right . The focus is all on immigration detention, who has been paying attention which we havent been talking about. We havent, since all the nations attention has been on the wall, has been on children who died in custody, has been on asylum seekers. Immigration detention has exploded. Its at the highest level its ever been. There was a focus on that right when President Trump came into office because we saw these huge increases in arrests. Those have sustained. As our attention veered elsewhere those arrests are still hang. Close to 50,000 people . 50,000 people more than ever. Republicans and democrats are spinning the latest number which is ultimately a slight increase. Theyre both claiming successes here and their goal, for democrats, is to lower the number of people in custody. And for republicans its to increase it. Theyre meeting at the middle. Its a slight uptick. For the american people, for all of those workers who would face being furloughed, not getting paid during a shutdown, its a win for them and its also a win for people who want increased Border Security because at least were doing something. This is true. I think, you know, the downside and something that perhaps federal workers might be looking at, people who were nur lowed for all this hull a ballou over the wall, there was no progress made and really this is sort of a distraction. You didnt get your pay for 35 days because of that and youre saying, this is the outcome . Why couldnt this happen in december . Correct. One of the questions, its great having you here. You have a big view of immigration. People with a great view of immigration, does what does success look like . More immigration detention or less . So, i think the question is, you know, what is the goal. I think the question is who should be detained or not. The challenge right now is that the president has instructed immigration authorities to basically arrest everybody in sight, including people who dont have any criminal record. Anybody who is here without legal status or has violated the terms of their visa should be arrested and detained until they can be deported. As we talked about before, that might not happen until a couple of years. Because there is a big backlog in who deals with them once they are detained. Put them through the process. There is a huge backlog in the courts. We see these Detention Centers filling up. I. C. E. Has now more people in custody than it can afford to hold. So under president obama, his view and Many Democrats think that folks who dont have violent criminal records, who arent considered to be flight risks, who are likely to show up for Immigration Court, they feel like those people should be allowed to rome freely and await their day in court. Is that with an ankle bracelet . Typically it will be an ankle bracelet a few months and youll be enrolled in a Probation Program where youre checking in with someone every week or every month to make sure you show up for court. President trump views this differently. One of his favorite things to talk about is catch and release. He and other conservatives is everybody should be in custody. They look at this rate of people who abscond from Immigration Court and theyre not okay with it. They want to make sure everybody shows up to court. The only way to do that is keep them in custody. Now, we have already heard from some members of the freedom caucus. Weve heard from some conservative pundits. I think Laura Ingraham called it a lousy deal, sean hannity called it first he called it garbage then he seemed to be a little better with it. Same thing with Laura Ingraham. She has dumped all over it. But nancy pelosi said shes giving no money for the wall and she gave a billion dollars for the wall. Thats not true. Nancy pelosi and the democrats havent agreed to give a single red cent for the wall. Border security and a fence. Will the president get enough push back help me with where im getting. Are we counting our eggs before they hatched . It was this day before the last shutdown when things went south. Irv thought it was good, the president was going to sign it. It was all the noise from the right he said forget about it. Do you think were closer to no shutdown can i read the president s mind . I have no idea. As you pointed out correctly, you can think youre very, very close, have bipartisan support, and the president decides to blow it up. Hes going to be listening to Laura Ingraham. We elected you because you said you would make changes. It is a status quo. Its a tiny change from what we currently have in place. A lot of conservatives are going to be frustrated by that. It depends whether the president ultimately decides to bow to that pressure or he decides we cant go through another Government Shutdown. We need to lock this up and move forward. Caitlyn, we always appreciate you helping shed light on this. Its a much more complicated issue than everybody has made it out to be. Well talk more than about the wall and southern border. All of these issues are so co complicated. All right. Thank you, caitlyn. Thank you. Moments from now a hearing gets underway and i have reached a point where i couldnt get my question out and you could feel me and you knew what it was. Called a partnership right there. It works well. See that . She wants to i like sending it to you. Wanted to point that out. Former Trump Campaign manager Paul Manafort, plus were going to talk about why President Trump could soon be dealing with a new russia investigation. Youre watching velshi ruhle on msnbc. That rocking chair would look great in our new house. Ahh, new house, eh . Well, you should definitely see how geico could help you save on homeowners insurance. Nice tip. Ill give you two bucks for the chair. Two . thats a victorian antique all right, how much for the recliner, then . Wait wait. How did that get out here . That is definitely not for sale is this a yard sale . If its in the yard then its. For sale. Oh, here we go. Geico. Its easy to switch and save on homeowners and renters insurance. And i dont add trup the years. S. But what i do count on. Is boost® delicious boost® high protein nutritional drink has 20 grams of protein, along with 26 essential vitamins and minerals. Boost® high protein. Be up for life. All of you. How you live, what you love. Thats what inspired us to create americas most advanced internet. Internet that puts you in charge. That protects whats important. It handles everything, and reaches everywhere. This is beyond wifi, this is xfi. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Xfinity, the future of awesome. Welcome back to velshi ruhle. Just moments from now, a sealed hearing involving former Trump Campaign chairman Paul Manafort and special counsel Robert Muellers team will begin in washington d. C. This as comments made during a separate sealed hearing hinted broadly at what muellers team may be sinking its teeth into. Meetings between manafort, his deputy rick gates, and russian political operative konstantin kilimnik. According to the Washington Post, manafort and gates met kilimnik at the grand havana room a few blocks from Campaign Headquarters at trump tower in manhattan. Prosecutors believe it was at that meeting that manafort and kilimnik may have exchanged critical information relevant to russia and trumps bid for the presidency. Now, prosecutor Andrew Weissmann told a federal judge during last weeks sealed hearing, quote, the encounter goes very much to the heart of what the special counsels office is investigating. Joining us now, nbc news investigator and former special watergate prosecutor. What is the significance of manaforts sealed hearing, the one that is about to go down . Basically this is going to kind of wrap up the debate theyve been having thats referenced in the story that we did, the Washington Post did about what manafort may have lied about that dissolved essentially this plea agreement that they were able to come up with and the Cooperation Agreement they were able to come up with in september of last year. Today the judge will look at a few more tack torz, a few more instances where prosecutors from muellers office say manafort lied and at that point theyll shell come to a conclusion, likely in a written order. We may not find out today what her conclusion is, whether manafort did lie, how many times he lied to the special counsels office, but we should get a written order at some point, likely this week, where the judge will at that point say, you know, i find that he did, in fact, lie. We can incorporate that into his upcoming sentencing and theyll go forward from there. So this is just kind of to get to the heart of the issue. The judge has raised some questions about muellers teams arguments. On the other hand, shes raised questions about what manaforts team asserts are not lies, challenging them and challenging the facts. Theres been a bit of back and forth. The reason this hearing is sealed, normally this would play out in open court and we would know about it. It pertains to the Ongoing Investigation being led by robert mueller. She wants the attorneys to speak freely. Well get a transcript, the one we reported on last week, certain parts will be redacted. Nick, first of all, i want to express appreciation to you and tom wearing the same tie today. We coordinated. To toms point, according to the posts reporting, the mueller team flatout said that the meeting between gates, kilimnik and manafort goes to the heart of the investigation, which is fairly loud signalling of Something Like this. For those of us hearing this, the senate says they didnt find any collusion, this is an important message. It is an important message. You have to ask what is the heart of their investigation. The heart of their investigation has already come out in the sense there are two indictments outstanding against russian intelligence operatives. Keep in mind, kilimnik is a russian intelligence operative, according to the fbi. One of those indictment relates to the use of social media, to micro target, potential Hillary Clinton voters to keep them from voting, to micro target trump voters, to get them to vote. And the other conspiracy relates to the breakins to the Democratic National committee to steal emails and documents and to stage and release those during the course of the campaign to help trump get elected. So, if you look at it from that standpoint, this meeting at the cigar bar is super important because, one, youve got manafort providing kilimnik, the russian intelligence operative, with very special polling information. Its not just 10 for clinton and 20 for trump. This is really granular information that goes to very specific geographic areas. So if you want to micro target, this is the kind of information these russian operatives needed. With respect to the whole business at the breakin at the Democratic National committee, they were talking about this socalled ukrainian peace plan, which is a euphemism for dropping the sanctions on russia. Right. Which is what the russians wanted out of this deal. There are a lot of euphemisms out of this deal. This is the quid pro quo for using the emails and documents to assist the Trump Campaign in getting elected. We knew about this back on december 1st, 2017 when general flynn pled guilty to lying to ambassador kislyak, the Russian Ambassador about sanctions because what happened was president obama, on december 28th of the prior year really through a Monkey Wrench into this whole deal by coming out with more sanctions on the russians. That created a whole line of communications among, in between flynn and maralago and flynns assistant k. T. Roland, and others in the Trump Administration, ultimately leading up to flynn lying about it. And if you look at his guilty plea, he admits that the materiality of that lie materiality is a critical element the government must prove to convict on a false statement count. He admits that the materiality related to the fbis investigation into the coordination between the russian government and the Trump Campaign. So, the only thing that could relate to is a quid pro quo, a promise to drop sanctions, just like they watered down the sanctions at the Republican National convention relating to ukraine. You said k. T. Roland. I think you meant k. T. Mcfarland. Mcfarland, sorry. This is the brother please portion of the interview. Richard burr from the Senate Intelligence committee slams Michael Cohen for now delaying when hes going to testify. His lawyer, lanny davis, goes on msnbc today he has shoulder surgery. Hes now taking medication and hes not able to go because he is under the weather. Hes healing. Hes healing. That interview is fascinating on a number of levels. The inaccuracies and misstatements lanny davis made. Those are also known as lies. Exactly. Lanny davis said Michael Cohen was under indictment. Thats not true. He said if it wasnt for Michael Cohens name being Michael Cohen, if he was Michael Smith he wouldnt have been investigated for this home equity loan. They had ten times the funds or whatever. What am i missing in calling him Michael Smith . He wouldnt been investigated, but because hes Michael Cohen, that he was investigated. And the problem for lanny davis is im holding the document. Thats life in the big city. You want to be famous and influential and cheat on your taxes or whatever it is, youre going to get attention. Lets take it a step further. How about federal prosecutors, im holding up their sentencing memorandum. They said he misled banks on several occasions about how much debt he had. And interestingly, prosecutors say, after it became public that Michael Cohen was the subject of a search warrant, he calls up one of the banks and says, here are my statements and here are my documents according to prosecutors. It does strain credibility a little bit. Some of the things lanny davis said during the interview. We give colleague Hallie Jackson credit for pushing back on some of the points he made. But when you have somebody that is making that many inaccurate statements then follows it up and says, you can rest assured my client is going to testify three times in the next how next two and a half three weeksz as hes preparing for jail. It raises significant questions. I think we could rename our station or network, it does strain credibility. Youre saying the same thing in a different way. Everybody g