To 2 00 a. M. Fims are really not fair for them to be working. The i appreciate your time tonight. Thanks for doing. This we need to shine a light on this. Thanksgiving is being eroded away by middle class americans because they have to work for the retail giants. I wish legislation would be done to reverse this so we can respect peoples time off and time together with family. Thats the ed show. Politics nation with reverend al sharpton starts right now. Good evening. Thank you for tuning in. Tonights lead, Michael Brown sparking a national movement. Nearly 48 hours after a grand jury declined to indict officer Darren Wilson. We are witnessing protests from coast to coast, and were hearing a growing outcry from many saying the process was unfair. Questions about a prosecutor who attacked the victim, and a
country wondering where we go from here. But at the heart of all of this is a family who lost their son. A Family Spending their first thanksgiving without their son at the table. Joining me now is Michael Browns mother, Leslie Mcspadden, i know what family attorney benjamin crump. Thank you for being here. Thanks for having me. Leslie, it has been almost 48 hours since the announcement. How are you feeling . Disappointed, let down. You were seen visibly sobbing and crying. But you wanted to be out there with the people. What went through your mind when you heard this prosecutor make this announcement . I know we had been talking for weeks if not months that we didnt expect much. When that moment happened, what happened to you in your mind . It made me feel like they didnt have any care or sympathy, compassion for my son at all. You know, the fact is that Darren Wilson spoke about the shooting. I want to play part of that to you. And i want your reaction. Is there anything you could have done differently that would have prevented that killing from taking place . No. Nothing . And youre absolutely convinced when you look through your heart and your mind, that if Michael Brown were white, this would have gone down in exactly the same way . Yes. No question. No question. He said nothing he would have done differently. As a mother, how do you react to that . That lets me know that he wasnt doing his job. He had another agenda. And like i said, he didnt do what he had to do. He did what he wanted to do. Thats what hes stating. He didnt give it a second thought. He wouldnt consider anything different. He think whats did he was right. Leslie, president obama spoke about the grace that you maintained, as well as michaels father. Listen to what he said earlier this week. First and foremost, we are a nation built on the rule of law. And so we need the accept that this decision was the grand jurys to make. There are americans who agree with it and there are americans who are deeply disappointed, even angry. Its an understandable reaction. But i join michaels parents in asking anyone who protest this decision to do so peacefully. Now, Michael Browns parents have lost more than anyone. We should be honoring their wishes. How do you feel with the
president of the United States quoting you and michaels father to the world . What does that do to you when you their president addressing this . It gave me more hope than i had at first for them to do what should have been done. Which was indict Darren Wilson. I mentioned theres been an eruption of anger from the community about the prosecutor, Bob Mcculloch. And how he hand the grand jury. What did you think about the whole process those three months . I really think that they took us through some heart breaking, agonizing pain, when Bob Mcculloch pretty much knew what he wasnt going to do. And the way that he did his job was almost insubordinated. Like you should have just stemmed aside and let someone do the job correctly. You know, i said the other day, ive never heard a prosecutor disparage a victim
the way mcculloch did. What did you want what would you want to say to him . I know michaels father said, peel dont know his son like you and he did. What would you want to say to him when you heard him saying these disparaging things about michael jr. . Thats a tough one, rev. I want to say a lot of things. But the proper thing would be to ask him, if you hold this seat, then why wont you do your job . No one should do your job for you. And weve been saying a lot of different people doing different peoples jobs since august 9th. I want to ask you about something else. Your husband right after the decision came down, he was seen shouting, burn this aexpletive down. Some say he had a hand in sparking the violence. I dont agree that. It was his raw emotion. He was upset. And to speak on and act on is two different things. And freedom of speech. You can say whatever you like. But remember what those people were saying august 9th. And it wasnt coming from the family. Its been a real, real rough week for you and the whole family. A lot of tension. What does this mean for you as a mother . I think that people, we had a, with other families. Youre going to face thanksgiving tomorrow with an empty seat. And the families getting together. What does this as a mother feel to you . Im just hurt. I dont even want to think about tomorrow being thanksgiving. Its just thursday. I dont even plan to celebrate because i cant. Attorney general eric holder. Let me go to you while leslie composes herself. Attorney general holder says this. During the investigation on whether there was civil rights violation, whats your hope . Whats the next legal step . Well, one of the things were hoping for after reading the transcript from Darren Wilson that was presented to the grand jury, he says certain things about the community in which michael and some of his family members lived in the canField Community. And that may be attributed to his state of mind, reverend sharpton. So that will be an interesting aspect of the case for the Justice Department now to look at. The Justice Department can move in how many areas here . They can move in several
areas. Obviously, the civil rights aspect is the one that is most common. And it goes to his mentality of, did he profile, did he do anything because of certain ethnicity or certain racial reasons. And he said what he thought about the community in the can Field Community in ferguson, and how others in the department thought about it. And it was just sad to think that he believed that michael fit a certain profile. And we didnt know that until we read his words. Let me ask you, ill come back to you, leslie. Michael described as having a demonic look. Like hulk hogan. Tell us about michael. What kind of person was michael jr. . Michael was a big kid. But no aggression. He would never provoke you to do anything to harm him, hurt him or anybody around him. I dont believe a word from Darren Wilson that my son. You knew him a few seconds. You didnt want to see anything but what you saw. What i think he saw was him looking at his own self. He wanted to kill his self that day. Your sons death has sparked a national movement, protesters coast to coast. What would he say about this . What do you think michael would say . Same thing he told his father. Everybody going to know my name. He said that. He did. I remember that it was said he had predicted the whole world was going to know his name. Yes, he did. Thats because he got off into making songs, making beats, things of that nature. So he felt like from there, he would inspire. God had another plan for him. But he didnt stop everybody from knowing his name. What do you hope comes out of this tragedy . Peace of mind. Ben crump, i want to thank you. Leslie, thank you for your time this evening. Well see you later in the show. And to remember your son. I want to say this though. That i think it is important that people understand that this is a mother. As we saw the father last night. You didnt ask to be in this public platform. And i think thats important. Yes, sir. And reverend sharpton, thank you for being there for the family and these other families today who are going to experience their first thanksgiving without their child. Well, thank you. And all we want to see is the truth come out. Well be right back. Sensitive bladder . Never miss a chance to dance. Introducing a revolution in bladder leak protection. New always discreet. Up to 40 thinner, for superior comfort. Absorbs 2 times more than you may need. For danceallyouwant protection. No wonder more women already prefer new always discreet pads over poise. New always discreet. Now bladder leaks can feel like no big deal. Because hey, pee happens. Visit alwaysdiscreet. Com for coupons and your free sample. Alright, so this tylenol arthritis lasts 8 hours, but aleve can last 12 hours. And aleve is proven to work better on pain than tylenol arthritis. So why am i still thinking about this . How are you . Aleve, proven better on pain. Coming up, new questions about the ferguson grand jury. Was it fair . Or was there a thumb on the scales of justice . And how did officer wilson justify the shooting . At that time, i gave myself another mental check. Can i shoot this guy . Legally can i . And the question i answered myself was, i have to. If i dont, he will kill me if he gets to me. Also, a blast of Winter Weather on the busiest travel day of the year. Millions affected. Flights grounded. Well have the very latest. Plus, reasons for hope. Mothers united in grief and fighting for change. And a new social Justice Movement across the country. And of course, a great day for two lucky turkeys. President obama taking executive action with the annual thanksgiving pardon. Chicken noodle soup. Because i make the best chicken noodle soup. For every way you make chicken noodle soup, make it delicious with swanson®. Was the ferguson grand jury process fair . Or was it stacked in favor of officer Darren Wilson . And against Michael Brown, jr. . The New York Times says, quote, the gentle questioning of officer wilson, and the sharp challenges prosecutors made to witnesses whose accounts seemed to contradict his narrative, have led some to question whether the process was as objective as the prosecutor claims. Heres what the prosecutor said
about witness testimony. When he announced the decision. Eyewitness accounts must always be challenged and compared against the physical evidence. Many witnesses to the shooting of Michael Brown made statements inconsistent with other statements they made, and also conflicting with the physical evidence. But the witnesses who were challenged most were the ones testifying against officer wilson. Like one who said Michael Brown jr. In h his hands in the air. The prosecutor told that witness, basically just about everything that you said on august 13, and much of what you said today, isnt consistent with the physical evidence. But we saw very different approach with officer wilson. For example, prosecutors asked about the moment he shot Michael Brown by asking, quote, you felt like your life was in jeopardy . And quote, use of deadly force was justified at that point in your opinion. The tone is striking. In fact, the questions seem tougher in that tv interview than they did in the grand jury. You say, he starts to run. Starts to come toward you. And . That at that time i gave myself another mental check. Can i shoot this guy . Legally can i . And the question that i answered myself was, i have to. If i dont, he will kill me if he gets to me. Even though hes 35, 40 feet away . Once hes coming that direction, if he hasnt stopped yet, when is he going to stop . Joining me now, former u. S. Attorney, kendall coffee and jim cavanagh. Thank you both for being here. Thank you. What do you make of the prosecutor asking, you felt like your life was in jeopardy. Does that strike you as odd . Well, i feel pretty clearly, that rather than a leaderless
grand jury investigation, this was a grand jury that was being led to a conclusion of innocence. Think of it. It is just the questions a defense lawyer would have asked officer wilson. Didnt you feel like your life was in jeopardy . Well, of course you know what the answer will be. Didnt you feel like in effect that the shooting was justified . Not only does that tell the witness to say hes innocent. It tells grand jury members there in the room that this prosecutor is signaling very clearly that the prosecution thinks that officer wilson is innocent. So in some of the most critical stages of this entire process, the prosecutors, rather than being neutral, were basically stepping over to the defense team. Jim, you question why prosecutors didnt wait until the end of the grand jury process to call officer wilson. What is important about that . Well, reverend, an
investigative grand jury process, ive been involved in many of those. You gather all the information. Your witnesses come in. Youre trying to put the case together. The target of the investigation, in other words, the investigation of who would get charges preferred against them if the grand jury returned a true bill. Normally would you bring it at the end based on a target letter that the United States attorney or the District Attorney would put out. You dont let the person sift the narrative and everybody has to see if it falls in place. In other words, the grand jurors would know everything. Then the person who would be possibly criminally the charged would come in. And then they would decide. So you can test his statement against all the other statements. In investigations, thats what we like to do. The target we like to get last, not first. So what happened here when the officer goes in, everybody is tested against his statement. If it doesnt match his statement, it is rejected as not true or right. Inconsistent witness statements is the norm never case. Certainly, to even bring up a witness who makes some fantastic claim that Michael Brown was shot in the head, shot in the ground. It is so fabulous. It would be so rejected. We would never have that person call it a trial or a grand jury. We would totally reject that. To present to the grand jury, i dont think thats a fair process. Heres an example of two different accounts. One from officer wilson. The other from darian johnson. It is about whether mike brown reached toward his waist band. Listen to this. When he stopped, he turn and faced me. As he does that, his right hand goes into his waist band myself immediate thought was, was there a weapon . His hands were never at his waist. He didnt have a belt. On it wouldnt stay in his waist. Even if he did have it there it wouldnt stay at his waist. Couldnt a prosecutor argue
the physical evidence doesnt support officer wilsons account . Exactly. And just as jim described. You put the target on at the end if they want to come in without immunity. Then you confront them. Youve had presumably a number of witnesses. A number of important pieces of information and the physical evidence. And you aggressively and intensively cross examine them. You dont put them that there to tell their story with the aid and the assistance of a couple of friendly questions from the prosecutor. Thats a great example of a key point that the officer was allowed to say basically unchallenged. That kind of failure to challenge the target, if he walks into a grand jury investigation, is something that never happens. Targets are aggressively relentlessly challenged by prosecutors who are serious about exploring a prosecution. Jim, officer wilson said he pursued Michael Brown to prevent brown from attack someone else. Quote. What would stop him from doing what he just did to me or to him or worse. Knowing he has already done to it one cop, he still posed a threat. Not only to me, to anybody else that confronted him. Does that make sense to you . Or should prosecutors have followed up . You know, you can assess that yourself. Is that really a believable statement . It is a statement the officer says that allows him to use deadly force, even when the guy is fleeing. Is this guy really an imminent danger to every other citizen . He was involved in a strong arm robbery. Stole the cigars and pushed the clerk. He is involved in an assault on the officer. He slam and punched the officer, probably the worst case. To fight over the gun. Lets take all that and say its true. He doesnt necessarily pose a great imminent threat to the public at large. It wouldnt be a situation where
you could shoot him in the back. But the officer seems to feel that is okay. That he pose this is great danger to the public at large. I dont think thats a valid argument. But i dont think it would come into a test of Excessive Force because he wasnt shot in the back. I think the Excessive Force come when he was shot in the front. In the first volley of shots at a great distance where he was shot probably in the upper arm, with an upward trajectory. That doesnt indicate he was walking forward. There are a number witnesses who talk about hands in front at different stages. Out here it may be incredulous whats going on and he gets shot with this volley and pauses and you know, then comes forward, staggering, stumbling or charging. Maybe to save his own life. If he is trying surrender and being shot stoex Excessive Force to me is not at the car. It is not when he is running away. It is when he is shot from a
distance he is and unarmed. Thats what the department of justice, and kendall can elabora elaborate. The department of justice civil rights division, the fbi as well, to put this together and see if this will really hold. Is it an Excessive Force case . Not can they prosecute, can they prevail. First, is it or is it not an Excessive Force case. Then they need to go from. There they will have all the evidence. Map it out. Put the stop watch on it. He only traveled 25 feet. Get that thing tightened down and get answers to the public. Im out of time, kendall. But suffice it to say, bottom line, this is v