Recent allegations, are you willing to have this do it . The Witness Testimony is before you. No witness who was there supports that i was there okay, im going to take that as a no. Did you watch dr. Fords testimony . I did not. I plan to. Thank you. I plan to, but i did not. I was preparing mine. At the end of the day, donald trump sent this out. Quote, judge kavanagh showed america exactly why i nominated him. His testimony was powerful, honest and riveting. Democrats Search And Destroy strategy is disgraceful and this process has been a total sham, an effort to delay and resist. The senate must vote. White house Deputy Press Secretary raj shaw added this. The president was thrilled with his testimony. He was strong. He was passionate. He was very convincing because he was telling the truth. The president stands firmly behind judge kavanagh. Judge kavanagh is the white
houses nominee for this open seat. Hes going to get confirmed. Let us bring in our lead off panel on a thursday night. Robert Costa National political reporter for the washington post, moderator on pbs and what a week its already been. Cynthia oxney, veteran of the Civil Rights Division at the justice department. Mimi rocca, former District Attorney of the Southern District of new york, now distinguished fellow at the Pace University school of law. Steve schmidt, the Bush White House, mccain president ial campaign and others. Robert costa, you are among the best connected reporters that we know. Take a minute. Tell us how the day played out and what are you hearing importantly tonight . It played out in two fronts politically within the Republican Party holding the majorities of congress and the white house. President trump disappointed in how this process played out with dr. Fords testimony. People inside of the white house, brian, tell me the president found her compelling. The testimony compelling. He thought kavanagh, the federal judge needed to come through with his testimony. He urged kavanagh in a phone call to make sure he was defiant in his testimony and by end of day the president decided to stand by the nominee and thought he did a strong job in his testimony and really pushing back against the democrats. But its still tbd in the u. S. Not. Where are senator collins, senator murkowski, they have decisions to make. Senator corker one of the possible swing votes, republican retiring said he would support kavanagh. It seems to be moving toward kavanagh, but a lot of votes still in the air. We hear this reporting, bob, those on the fence, the collins, murkowski, flake may vote. In both the Democratic Party and the Republican Party, all of the senators, the red state
senators, moderate republicans, that group within the chamber, they are really looking to each other. No one really wants to be out there as the isolated person taking a political stand thats very dramatic, perhaps lone vote in a way that breaks away from your party. So theyre looking to each other. A lot of Back Channel Discussions tonight where are people really going to go. Taking a political stand. Imagine that. Cynthia oxney, as dispassionately as you can, how did im out. You have the wrong girl. A good lawyer can argue both sides. You were with us all the way through the coverage. Starting with her, she was outstanding as a witness. She was raw. She made every effort to be fair. She worked very hard for instance, i remember one specific time when the question came up about who pushed her into the room, and she was concerned that somebody would think she was testifying judge kavanagh pushed her she
wasnt sure and she didnt want to put that on him. There were little moments like that i thought were very compelling and really enhanced her testimony. The other important thing about her was, which was brought out frankly by the prosecutor very effectively, although not on purpose, was that she knew judge kavanagh. There was no identification question. That was taken off the table effectively. I just thought she was an outstanding witness and i would have put her on the stand in any case and been just thrilled at the manner in which she testified. Now, about the dispassionate part about the judge, i thought a couple things. One i thought he clearly demonstrated he did not have the temperament to be a United States federal court judge. The screaming, the accusations, the politics were just
completely inappropriate. Independent of what happened, his demeanor was unhinged. It was a bit of a Temper Tantrum and it was inappropriate. That, number one. Number two, its very hard for him in my opinion to get away from the fact that seven ways from sunday he tried to dodge the question about whether or not he would have an fbi investigation and he denied it. He just wouldnt do it. The inescapable conclusion is he wont do it because he doesnt want anybody to know what this guy judge says. And i dont see how you get away from that. The other thing about his testimony, which is he tried to belittle about this discussion about his High School Year book. And i get that. And i think on some level he was pretty effective so let me put that in my dispassionate column. I think he was effective in neutralizing that. But upon reflection, things that he said, like for example, oh, and we said this girl whose
name i wont say because i think shes been through enough, alum us in, that didnt mean anything. That just meant we were friends. Thats a lie. Thats a lie. That was what they were doing and they were basically calling her easy or a slut or whatever the term was in the 80s. I went to high school in the 70s. Maybe in the 80s it was easy. Anyway, they were calling her a bad name. They had a poem about how easy she was. There were 14 of them that had their little ranata alum us in line. It was hurtful and mean and terrible. Instead of owning it and saying that was terrible and apologizing, he tried to tell us all that, oh, no, we were just being nice. We thought we were friends with her and that was our way of being sweet. What does he think we are, stupid . So, i was very offended by that. I was offended when he tried to say this Devils Triangle Business is a kwrtsz game. Its not a quarters game. I dont think we need to get into it but it aint no quarters game. So i think if you add his sort
of insulting our intelligence with his lies and you couple that with the lies about the memos of leahy, the lies about his role in the prior investigation prior confirmation, with the lies about judge kaszynski and his chambers and the sexual harassment, you really have a Credibility Problem with him. If youre looking at it fairly, you cant say, oh, i believe this woman, but i think he didnt do it. Right . Cant do that. So once you say, i believe this woman, then he did it because she knows he did it. And especially in light of the fact that he has a serious Credibility Problem. Frankly hes not told the truth. Mimi rocca, while this is not a court of law, in effect, if you were prosecuting this i would have to ask you to do it without a named witness. Mr. Mark judge last seen at a beach house on the eastern shore. Im going to play one of the exchanges. Well talk about it on the other
side. Mark seemed to urge brett on, at times telling him to stop. A couple of times i made eye contact with mark and thought he might try to help me. But he did not. During this assault, mark came over and jumped on the bed twice while brett was on top of me. Mimi, a question for the lawyer in you, how are we to process this, a known witness we know who this guy is and have a pretty reasonable idea where he is, and yet we cant have access to him . Its the ghost of mark judge was all over this hearing and no prosecutor would proceed without being able to at least talk to him, have a trained Investigator Talk to him, not some statement through a lawyer or on a piece of paper. I think hopefully what today
maybe proved to people is the importance of seeing witnesses in person and being able to evaluate their credibility. So, you know, he is an eyewitness. What we have right now is a very credible victim witness who i certainly believe and i think a lot of people in america, Around The World who saw her believe, and shes corroborated right now by her own prior statements, consistent statements, some of the things that kavanagh has put out there, the Calendar Entries and some of those actually corroborate her. There is this whole july 1st date that, you know, lists some of the very participants that shes talking about being at this party on july 1st. His calendar this is a calendar shes never seen before. How compelling is that . It talks about some of the very same participants going to, you know, a party on a Summer Weekend in the same year that were talking about. I mean, that already really kind of starts to look like some real
corroboration of already her testimony. And, you know, but you need to hear from mark judge. And the fact that they wont let that happen, as we all keep saying, but it really there is just no explanation for it other than they dont want to hear what he has to say. And one other point that i think gets us to that conclusion is not only dont they want to go talk to him, but i thought judge kavanagh was starting to do the sort of Coffee Boy Defense with mark judge. You know, well, hes got drinking problems. Hes got im sure he does and it sounds like he has problems. But i really felt like kavanagh was trying to say even if we go talk to mark judge, you cant trust what hes going to say because i think hes so afraid of what he might say if hes really questioned by a trained investigator. All right, steve schmidt, after a complex day, the question to you is rather simple. Do you feel better or worse about america than before this day started . Worse. This was a disgrace that we witnessed today. The United States senate, brian, the formerly known as the worlds greatest deliberative body and weve seen for 30 plus years a cycle of revenge and retribution in our judicial nominations that came to this moment today. And i think about kids who you would admonish playing with matches. And for purposes of the analogy, the United States senators are the kids. And today the kids playing with matches literally burn the house down. And so enormous damage was done today institution of the Supreme Court today, to the process, to the United States senate. I think the American People look at this and theyre shocked by it. To see the degeneracy of our politics, the cost of partisanship in our institutions. Look, i thought that dr. Ford was very credible, and i think
that Brett Kavanagh and it pains me to say it has a Credibility Problem. We have a we have in politics, we often say that the outcome is determined by the last big thing that happened as opposed to the first thing that happened. And we know this. This is the first thing at the beginning of the process that Brett Kavanagh said. He said, mr. President , thank you. Throughout this process i have witnessed firsthand your appreciation for the vital role of the american judiciary. No president has ever consulted more widely or talked with more people from more backgrounds to seek input about a Supreme Court nomination. Of course, that is selfevidently not true. He made an untruthful statement and a political statement with his first utterance as a new nominee for the court. Now the rage and the anger that
we saw from him today i think is appropriate for somebody who feels that they are falsely accused. But as you go through this, it makes no sense why someone who is falsely accused would not want to instigate a reopening of the fbi Background Investigation for the purposes of explicating him from the situation. The answers on drinking were not credible. And lastly, and i say this as somebody who worked with Brett Kavanagh in the Bush White House and has no ill will towards Brett Kavanagh, liked Brett Kavanagh, but in his statement, though he may be aggrieved, through his perspective justly aggrieved, it was a declaration of partisan war on the left, on the clintons, on conspiracy, a Declaration Of War against the Democratic Party. How can a Supreme Court justice function in a Lifetime Appointment that partisan, that convicted that one half of the country are his political enemies . How will he adjudicate cases fairly if you just look at the plain intent behind the words he spoke . We saw tremendous disrespect for senators like amy klobuchar. We saw profound anger. And i think that anger, even though he may view it as justified, is inherently disqualifying for someone who is going to have a Lifetime Appointment. And then lastly, hes in his early 50s. He could credibly serve on the Supreme Court to, lets say, 2058. He could be up there for 40 years. And for every second that hes up there, fair or not, it will raise a question about the
legitimacy of the court. We already have that with clarence thomas. Im not sure we need to have another compromised justice who is in his early 50s serving with a Lifetime Tenure with that cloud hanging over him. Trump is a symptom of the problems in the country, not a cause. And the reason we have President Trump is because the collapse of trust in very nearly every institution in the country and what we saw today was another chapter in the erosion of public trust and for good reason in our most vital institutions. I think this was a tragic day for the country. And for the two individuals we saw testifying. Been a momentous day. All of our guests have agreed to stay with us. We have to fit in a break. Obviously our discussion, a special one at that, continues right after this. vo people with Type 2 Diabetes are excited about the potential of
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important votes we dont yet know about. As we mentioned, senators flake, murkowski, collins, joe manchin met in private tonight after the hearing, after their meeting flake told reporters he is facing a tough choice. Its a close call. You leave with doubts whichever way. Thats the nature of this. Th