Stories of democrats who worked with the russians in the 2016 campaign. President then turned his attention as i mentioned to Attorney GeneralJeff Sessions. This is important when you consider that this is the individual recused from an ongoing probe of potential obstruction among things and donald trump saying its too bad that sessions recused and then asked an intelligent question. The reporter asked donald trump to compare Jeff Sessions to the previous administrations Attorney General eric holder under obama and donald trump said this. I dont want to get into loyalty but i will tell you that i will say this. Holder protected president obama. Totally protected him. When you look at the things that they did, and Hold Proer Tekted the president. And i have Great Respect for that. Ill be honest. I have a little more on that in a moment. Trump also asked here in this very newsy interview whether he would order the justice
come to understand can be seen as a triangle with three points. Authoritarianism. You highlighted the quotes that are worrying on that front. The second is his desire to make as much money as he can out of the presidency. And the third and the one that may be we have not paid enough attention to is psychic neediness. That was on display in the interview. The need to present himself as somebody powerful. People need to come to me and his responsive to flattery and the comments about the president of china. How big a smile is on the president Of Xi Tonight and thinking the show on the tarmac, what dividends paid off in manipulating the president s ego. Ambassador sherman, you can build on the point david makes. And this is an interview with so much in it, one point when asked willing to make deals, he says, yes. The reporter follows up and says you would move to the center on some of these issues. He said, no, im being practical. I dont think im changing. And then he says, im always moving. Im moving in both directions. Which would seem to be maybe perhaps admission but, again, to davids point on the neediness, he says in the interview, ambassador, that he is knows the tax deal better than the greatest cpa with regard to congressmen and senators. I love them and they love me. Yeah. Its quite an interview as you say, ari. Building on davids point, this the other piece of this is a very transactional approach and another interview tomorrow in the New York Times with general mcmaster, the National Security adviser saying he is taken out of the comfort zone with the trump Foreign Policy and in general its all to the good. It is a very transactional Foreign Policy. He said that he eased up on trade with china because he thought hed get what he needed on north korea. He hasnt gotten what he needed on north korea and china. To always be in charge, always talking about the need for bilateral trade agreements, not multilateral trade agreements, even in another article talking about Angela Merkel said that, yes, he could have a bilateral trade deal with the europe and not understanding europe is made up of 28, soon to be 27 countries after brexit and the entire article is i think as you said part of the pragmatic realism that mcmaster also speaks about. That pragmatic realism can head in any direction as the need arises and as it shines a light on the president of the United States. And, natasha, on the russia probe, we saw a very canny president as i said in my introduction to this news, that is president who tweets a lot of things for reaction. Just today he was clearly
to the strategy to invoke alan him as an independent person and then falsely claim and easily rebuttal false claim that he doesnt know him . Well, he feels the need to get some kind of legitimacy for the argument that theres been no collusion and even if there was it wouldnt necessarily be against the law. Now, alan is not the most reliable person to make that kind of an analysis these days. Hes been making the living going on fox news to be a commentator and good to donald trump and one sided in the analysis and critiqued constantly by outside legal experts saying, actually, it really depends. If there was some kind of conspiracy to collude with the russians, thats been a crime. Hes been on conservative media and i invited him and talked to him about the russia probe. He has a view. Why does the president in your view and then, david, follow on this, say so falsely and so
easily provable falsely i dont know him . Because he wants to maybe distract from the fact that he has been talking to alan on a regular basis, perhaps. We dont really know how often they have spoken and make it seem like an outside observer with no stake in the game. So a fake third party validation. David . Well, theres a part of donald trump that is as you say canny and a part thats not. If donald trump is not going to fire bob mueller, then his next strategy is to rev up republican animosity to mueller, to make this a tribal badge, to discredit the investigation so that whatever it does find, even harmful, that you have prepared the minds of the supporters to reject whatever the facts are. That means he needs to join that message. Im not sure that his assurances that he believes mueller will be fair, i think that may be something where he is talking to himself. And patting himself on the back. And reassuring himself so great he is and beloved and everybody will like him and meets that psychic need. As for alans legal analysis, look. Hes a great advocate. If you have committed a serious crime and youre trying to persuade the jury not to convict you, youll do well with alan dershowitz. Hes a Courtroom Lawyer and what hes saying is untrue and saying things like if the president is acting in the course of the duties he cant obstruct justice. What about an order to burn the national archives, to cover up the misdeeds . Reports to the president of the United States s. That in the can he do that . And alan said thats an example of something the president cant do. I dont think his arguments are meant to be convincing but theyre reassuring to the president. Yeah. On the what i think you put well, the Noncanny Side back to the ambassador on the Foreign Policy. I dont mean to be doing president ial fan fiction and jumping around as much as he does in the interview but i have such great experts and wanted you more deeply on the asia points you raised and he talks about this with regard to china. He says, you know, he like it is president. He treated me better than anybodys ever been treated in the history of china. You know that. Theyre hurting us on trade. The only thing more important to Methane Trade is war. Okay . And it goes to the point david mentions is thats not very canny to blatantly admit whats most important to him very complex Foreign PolicySocio Economic political Military Relationship is how he was personally treated. Indeed. Its quite extraordinary. I think what we see is such grandiosity in the interview, your point earlier, ari, when you said that the president said
he could do anything he wanted to with the justice department, this sends a signal all over the world that he is an autocrat just like the autocrats all over the world. In our system, as you pointed out, he cannot do anything he wants to do with the justice department. Any time he wants to do it. And we are in a world where we have got the rise of autocrats, whether thats putin up for reelection in march and of course going to win either with 98 or 99 of the vote. Because he doesnt need even though his spokesman said were trying to meddle in the election, he doesnt need us meddling in the election. He has total control over it. The same is true for a number of leaders around the world and president xi has just put himself in the chinese constitution up with mao. So this is a guy filled with the grandiosity of what he thinks he accomplished in the world when the accomplishments in diplomacy and peace and security for the United States are not all that much. Well, i mean, thats heavy. A lot of heavy stuff. Natasha, ill go to you on a lighter point. The New York Times reporter talking about the immediate fallout of this, breaking news right now. He said as senior fairly senior Trump Adviser and he said, what interview . Today . Right. So that it was very clear in this interview that trump was not surrounded by aides and an impromptu meeting that mike schmidt encountered him having lunch and then going back to what Ambassador Sherman said. Trump made an astonishing admission in the interview which is that he was saying that mueller, he expected mueller to treat him fairly but he also said that the controversy is really revving up the base. And he said that in particular congressmen coming up to defend him and pointing out that this is a witch hunt. Thats a big indication that
trump may not move to fire mueller expecting the bis and certain members of congress to do the dirty work for him. I think you have you im going through it. You make a point, natasha. Well take a pause and joy reids coming on and lawrence is coming on. Its a party. I want to read the exact quote to understand what you just referenced. Donald trump says, the mueller investigation, quote, really angered the base and made the base stronger. My base is stronger than its ever been. Congress min, some of the congressmen unbelievable in pointing out what a witch hunt the whole thing is so i think its been proven theres no collusion as you mentioned. To look through all of this something that many compared to a potential watergate as only a thing of a muscle makes his Core Base Support stronger. A debatable proposition as is. And an ethically dubious one. An important point to pause on. Natasha, wendy, and david, thank you each of you. I appreciate it. Thank you. Coming up, joy reid is pouring over the transcript. Im watching her in the hallway at msnbc and see her doing it. Shes going to come back in and give us her breaking thoughts on what else she found in there. Later, Mitch Mcconnell admitting 2018 not looking so good for the gop. But i thought we were supposed to be talking about investing for retirement . Were absolutely doing that. But theres no law you cant make the most of today. What do you want to do . Id really like to run with the bulls. Wow. Yea. Hope youre fast. I am. Get a portfolio that works for you now and as your needs change. Investment Management Services from td ameritrade. Welcome back to our breaking coverage. Another excerpt in Donald Trumps surprise Interview Breaking tonight from the new
york times. He says there was collusion with the russians and the democrats, a lot of collusion. The New York Times reporter Michael Schmidt says dossier, going to so many other elements and podestas firm. Lets get to it with joy reid, host of am joy and National Correspondent and the Woman Holding down the anchor chair when this came across. I have so many questions and first on the collusion. Yeah. We wiped our plan out the window. Donald trump wanting to do and sort of a news editor that tries to scramble our plan and we are the highlight pen twins today. We have this going on. Just to go through it quickly, donald trump, im on page of 18 of the transcript and remarkable reading donald trump outside of the edited once they put it together New York Times, just reading the transcript and the number of directions his mind goes and i think of a bird in peanuts and friend of snoopy, no collusion, no collusion, and
coming back to it. I have counted 15 times, sometimes 2 or 3 times in 3 sentences and goes back to the election, whether at the fbi or whether hes, you know, i dont know, dedicating a ship, back to, i won the election because i amy just the master of the Electoral College and goes on and on and on and the Collusion Idea is democrats making excuses. The mind is almost as if hes stuck in time. And he cant get passed the night of the election and he keeps coming back to it over and over again. That goes to, again, i dont do a ton of emotional analysis. But it does seem to be a happy place for him. Yeah. And he says in here that he understood the Electoral College. That he understood where to go. He was going to maine five times and the way it works while he says Hillary Clinton was running like she was pursuing the popular vote. Thats ridiculous. Anybody who watched the campaign, he was going wherever
he thought he could get a big rally an make it back home by bedtime. The idea that this strategy all along was to do what he did and win the way he did, why were so many of the Campaign Team chatting with russians promising Hillary Clintons emails . I think it is clear what they thought would be the Winning Strategy was to prove that Hillary Clinton committed some crime that she hidden in the emails she didnt turn over when she turned over the State Department emails. They thought the emails were the key to the strategy not this whatever he is talking about with the elect trorl college. And then something we have not touched on at all and i think will get a lot of attention and seems to be revealing into how he sees his role in this world were all living in and speaking to Ambassador Sherman of the threats in china and north korea. He is the president of the United States and a man who like it or not overseeing the Largest Nuclear arsenal in the history of the world. Right. This is how he sees the path to reelection. Quote, were going to win
another four years, for a lot of reasons, but most importantly this is most important, because our countrys starting to do well. Another reason this im going to win another four years is because newspaper, tv, all forms of Media Will Tank, the president says tonight, if im not there because without me their ratings, talking about our ratings and others, are going down the news and print media, without me the New York Times will not be the failing the New York Times but the failed the New York Times and they have to let me win and eventually he says probably six months before the election, loving me saying please, please dont lose, donald trump. What does this tell us about how he sees himself and his role as president . Its remarkable. Donald trump, you know, came to prominence for most americans as real estate tycoon or the host of the apprentice, a tv show. As a tycoon, spent as much time trying to get page six and other
tabloids to put his name in the tabloid press, to tell people who he was dating, who he was marrying, to talk about his sex life, his love life, to make donald trump famous. Then he becomes a head of the apprentice. And he still seems to think hes in a tv show. Donald trump is one of the most least opaque, most transparent we have ever had as president and what he just said there is he believes himself to be the lead character in a television show. And that without this Television ShowsRatings America itself will tank. All of the Media Will Tank without donald trump as the star of his own tv show. That is not the job of the president of the United States. It is not a tv show. As you said, it is the person with the nuclear codes. And i dont think donald trump has yet understood the gravity of the office and he thinks its a show and people are watching the tv show rather than if people are watching more tv and more cable news and reading more the New York Times because
theyre terrified of donald trump they despise him and he alarms them and want to know what hell do next. We hear the term transaction a lot. A transactional way of thinking. He is presupposing a National Transaction where he is the product, the Media Content being sold. I mean, i think more than anything i have seen this year, this is the most direct statement he doesnt see himself as the chief executive officer. He actually in his own mind sees him as the content officer. Content officer and doesnt understand the server leader model of the president of the United States. He is the employee yeah. Of 326 million people. He is not a Television Product thats being sold by the New York Times and msnbc and cnn. This is not a show. And i dont think he understands the gravity of the role hes taken on. Being president is a burden, a responsibility. Amen. You are the you are the Servant Leader of the United States. You are not a product on tv. Right. If all you care about is money and people who d